Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3839736]Defensive end Julius Peppers ready to leave Carolina Panthers - ESPN[/url]

Of course we don't want a thread for every free agent who says he wants out, but in this case Peppers is one of those game changer/play maker/physical freaks that can change our defense. If the Panthers allow him to test the market he jumps Haynesworth (motivation questions once he gets his $) and Gross (position change and $ questions) to the top of the Redskins board.

I know the big "need" for a DT but drafting a DT (which this draft lacks an elite group) can be done in the 2nd (assuming trade) or 3rd round. There's no-one in this draft that rivals what Peppers can bring to the table for us.

Assuming Taylor doesn't return, which at $8 million is a virtual certainty, Peppers is a perfect compliment to Carter. He already plays the opposite end, is strong against the run and can drop down to DT in a pinch.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

I personally would not spend money on a 29 yr old Peppers. We have greater needs on both lines, which is why I would sign Haynesworth (or at least make an offer). Remeber Pepper was bad in 07, and 08 was a contract year so I'm kinda heisitant to give money to him, Haynesworth made the pro bowl in both 07 and 08 with no chance of FA or a trade.

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I would jettison JT today if we were committed to going after Peppers. Then if a stud DT is available when our first pick comes up, it would be tempting to make our DL dominant. I would argue that the biggest reason Baltimore returned to an elite D was the drafting of Haloti Ngata at #12 overall. I believe JT is much better suited to being a 3-4 pass rushing OLB given his advanced age and lack of bulk. He is a poor fit for what Blache wants to do.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[quote=vallin21;521100]I personally would not spend money on a 29 yr old Peppers. We have greater needs on both lines, which is why I would sign Haynesworth (or at least make an offer). Remeber Pepper was bad in 07, and 08 was a contract year so I'm kinda heisitant to give money to him, Haynesworth made the pro bowl in both 07 and 08 with no chance of FA or a trade.[/quote]

both years were contract years for haynesworth he was franchised this year. this guy has stubblefeild written all over him.

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[quote=RedskinMike;521105]both years were contract years for haynesworth he was franchised this year. this guy has stubblefeild written all over him.[/quote]

EXACTLY! I can't see him sustaining his level once he gets paid. He was average prior to '07 and made more headlines for head stomping Gurode than his play until he was in a contract year.

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This illustrates the insanity of the relationship between the Redskins and the fans. People get all bent when the team spends money on these big name free agents, but at the same time the fans are always pushing for these type of signings.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

Absolutely not. Peppers is old and some years seems to lack motivation, he's also reportedly looking for Dwight Freeney + money. If we go after a big name, how about the 27 year old Karlos Dansby -- either way I dont think we can afford any of them.

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Anyone watch Peppers get shut down by Mike Gandy in the Divisional Playoffs? The announcers kept talking about how great/wonderful/dangerous/god-like Peppers was and I kept watching Gandy handle him.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[quote=RedskinMike;521105]both years were contract years for haynesworth he was franchised this year. this guy has stubblefeild written all over him.[/quote]

I would still make an offer to Haynesworth whether he's the next Stubblefield or not, the guy is 26 and has much more upside and talent before Stubblefield came to DC, but I'm not going to debate that.

Bottom Line is that I [B]wouldn't[/B] give a 29 yr old Peppers a new contract. DE is not a pressing need.

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no way would i take the risk with haynesworth. the money is way to high with a lot of character issues, though i feel d tackle is our biggest need on defense

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

I think is funny how people are willing to go with Haynesworth (including me at one point) despite all the character issues he has. Peppers has had consistent good years, save for last year when he did not produce much. You can say that he had a contract year this year, but before last year he was having similar numbers to this year.

Now, I do not think we should go after Peppers, I think we should go after Gross. At DT, we can go after someone like Rocky Bernard, who quietly had a good year in a crappy team with a crappy defense.

Initially I was all about us getting Haynesworth, but the more I think about it, the more it looks like he would be a bust.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

I don't know about Peppers he is a Freak athlete, but hasn't put up GREAT numbers since he was on HGH!! But he would be better than Taylor and Carter!!! I say make arun at him and release Taylor.

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no to peppers and haynesworth both.

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[quote=SC Skins Fan;521111]Anyone watch Peppers get shut down by Mike Gandy in the Divisional Playoffs? The announcers kept talking about how great/wonderful/dangerous/god-like Peppers was and I kept watching Gandy handle him.[/quote]

And Gandy is a 3rd round pick with an under achieving history as a LT tackle who's on his 3rd team in 8 years. Either Mr. Grimm did a hell of job coaching him (my opinion) or Peppers is just average.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;521111]Anyone watch Peppers get shut down by Mike Gandy in the Divisional Playoffs? The announcers kept talking about how great/wonderful/dangerous/god-like Peppers was and I kept watching Gandy handle him.[/quote]I think that might just be more the nature of line play than a flaw in Peppers game.

People around here act like if we had a talented DL, we'd never face a well thrown pass all season, but even a talented DL can go missing for weeks, sometimes months at a time.

So I would say buyer beware on Peppers, because he's not going to fix a bad defense by himself. He'll improve your pass rush for sure though.

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I'd say no to both. Lets build through the draft and sign some FA's who are not ready to get the biggest payday of their career.

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[quote=GTripp0012;521158]I think that might just be more the nature of line play than a flaw in Peppers game.

People around here act like if we had a talented DL, we'd never face a well thrown pass all season, but even a talented DL can go missing for weeks, sometimes months at a time.

So I would say buyer beware on Peppers, because he's not going to fix a bad defense by himself. He'll improve your pass rush for sure though.[/quote]

Are you saying our top 5 defense is bad? With the kind of pass rush these guys (haynesworth peppers) could potentially bring our D would be the best in the leage. We probly have the best depth at corner in the league, Solid Linebackers and are maybe a player away from a real solid D-line. If these guy produce for us like they've done for their current teams we'd have the best D in the NFL.

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[quote=SFREDSKIN;521157]And Gandy is a 3rd round pick with an under achieving history as a LT tackle who's on his 3rd team in 8 years. Either Mr. Grimm did a hell of job coaching him (my opinion) or Peppers is just average.[/quote]

Everyone gets shut down now and then.

Peppers has posted double digit sacks in 5 of his 7 seasons. That's not average play.

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The other thing is has anyone looked at the baseball markets? No one is going to get paid anywhere near what they want.

All the money this year will be spent by teams trying to reach the salary floor.

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[quote=horse;521160]Are you saying our top 5 defense is bad? With the kind of pass rush these guys (haynesworth peppers) could potentially bring our D would be the best in the leage. We probly have the best depth at corner in the league, Solid Linebackers and are maybe a player away from a real solid D-line. If these guy produce for us like they've done for their current teams we'd have the best D in the NFL.[/quote]No, I'm not saying anything about our defense. Are you trying to claim that we're one of the five best?

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[quote=RedskinMike;521105]both years were contract years for haynesworth he was franchised this year. this guy has stubblefeild written all over him.[/quote]

If Haynesworth=Stubblefeild then Peppers=Dan Wilkinson

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[quote=Mattyk72;521161]Everyone gets shut down now and then.

Peppers has posted double digit sacks in 5 of his 7 seasons. That's not average play.[/quote]

Are you going to risk giving him a Dana Stubblefield fat contract and risk watching him do nothing? Haven't we learned? I say pass no matter how talented he is, we have too may needs to blow our money on a player who is on the cusp of of maybe the down side of his career.

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Hell Yes Go after Peppers, look at the teams in the NFC that made the playoffs..Pressure is the key to the defense... Resign Hall..Add (starting OT) ,DT,OLB and a RB aka keegan Herring with a change of pace in the draft ......

[B]Cuts[/B]
J.Taylor, S.Springs, M.Washington,P.Daniels, Fabini, P.kendall [COLOR=darkred]Cap Savings $24 Million[/COLOR]

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;521165]Are you going to risk giving him a Dana Stubblefield fat contract and risk watching him do nothing? Haven't we learned? I say pass no matter how talented he is, we have too may needs to blow our money on a player who is on the cusp of of maybe the down side of his career.[/quote]

Not every stud d-lineman free agent is the next Dana Stubblefield.

For the record I'm not an advocate of signing him. But saying he's an average player because he got shut down in one game doesn't make any sense.

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[quote=Mattyk72;521169]Not every stud d-lineman free agent is the next Dana Stubblefield.

For the record I'm not an advocate of signing him. But saying he's an average player because he got shut down in one game doesn't make any sense.[/quote]

I didn't say he was average, I said "or maybe he's average"? I've seen lots of games were he disappears, especially the big ones and I've seem have some great games. It's a crapshoot.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;521171][B]I didn't say he was average, I said "or maybe he's average"? [/B]I've seen lots of games were he disappears, especially the big ones and I've seem have some great games. It's a crapshoot.[/quote]

ok so you suggest that maybe he's average, semantics.

Either way the guy isn't average, or maybe average.

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[quote=Meks;521156]no to peppers and haynesworth both.[/quote]

I second that.

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Peppers wants to play in a 3-4 defense..we can't assume he will automatically play here. He basically is leaving Carolina bc he feels he will be a better player in a 3-4, like demarcus ware..and last time i checked we don't run a 3-4

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29 year old Peppers? No thanks. 1 or 2 years is all that you might get out of him and to do that, The Little Danny would have to pay him a ton of money.
For once, let's try and build through the draft and get some young players that can contribute for the next 4 -8 years instead of these high priced 1 year flops we keep getting.

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1-2 years is he going to retire early??

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[quote=MdBluefinCrab;521181]29 year old Peppers? No thanks. 1 or 2 years is all that you might get out of him and to do that, The Little Danny would have to pay him a ton of money.
For once, let's try and build through the draft and get some young players that can contribute for the next 4 -8 years instead of these high priced 1 year flops we keep getting.[/quote]

People are so polarized on this site. I am not hell bent on signing Peppers since I think we have more glaring need (O LINE) but he would not be a bad signing. He is a proven pro bowler who had an off year. 29 years old is not super young but its also not 35.

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What is it with people wanting out of Carolina? First Jenkins and now Peppers. I'd certainly take a look at him and you know we will cause that's how Dan and Vinny operate. I think he can help us and he's better than anyone we have so why not??

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[quote=skinsfan69;521191]What is it with people wanting out of Carolina? First Jenkins and now Peppers. I'd certainly take a look at him and you know we will cause that's how Dan and Vinny operate. I think he can help us and he's better than anyone we have so why not??[/quote]

Jerry Richardson doesn't have the reputation as being one of the best owners in the league. Also John Fox can wear on people because of his abrasive style.

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I'm w/ 53Fan and the cohort who says this is opportunity we should pass on. Build through the draft or through smart FA pick-ups for value type players. No massive paydays for 29 yr old guys who may be coming to the end of their heyday.

I do agree that DE is likely a need for us. On the one hand if we cut JT and resigned him for far less money then he can have right end while Evans and AC swap on the left side (IMO AC is better suited for strong side end than Taylor ever was). More than likely though, as Paintrain has said, JT is out of DC next year and we are down to AC and Evans... unless Blache sees serious potential in Jackson or Wilson we need to go get a legit end. It's times like these I wish we could "develop" diamonds in the rough to address needs instead of constantly needing to draft/sign yet another question mark.

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[quote=53Fan;521159]I'd say no to both. Lets build through the draft and sign some FA's who are not ready to get the biggest payday of their career.[/quote]

I heard that...

I'd like Peppers and he'd obviously be a major upgrade in a department that we need but the residual costs would be way too high. Also he'd probably come here and mail it in like the various other FA's that we've signed in the past.

Re: Peppers says he wants to explore free agency
 

[quote=Paintrain;521099][url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3839736]Defensive end Julius Peppers ready to leave Carolina Panthers - ESPN[/url]

Of course we don't want a thread for every free agent who says he wants out, but in this case Peppers is one of those game changer/play maker/physical freaks that can change our defense. If the Panthers allow him to test the market he jumps Haynesworth (motivation questions once he gets his $) and Gross (position change and $ questions) to the top of the Redskins board.

I know the big "need" for a DT but drafting a DT (which this draft lacks an elite group) can be done in the 2nd (assuming trade) or 3rd round. There's no-one in this draft that rivals what Peppers can bring to the table for us.

Assuming Taylor doesn't return, which at $8 million is a virtual certainty, Peppers is a perfect compliment to Carter. He already plays the opposite end, is strong against the run and can drop down to DT in a pinch.[/quote]

We'll pay him way more than he ever made in Carolina and he'll never deliver the same production. Haven't we learned our lesson?

Ravens, Patriots, Steelers, Ravens, Titans, Giants, Rascal - teams that draft well, develop talent and know when to let players go. These teams find good free agents and get great production out of them. The Skins get great free agents and get average production out of them.

Going after Peppers would be a bad move.

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[quote=The Goat;521199]I'm w/ 53Fan and the cohort who says this is opportunity we should pass on. [B]Build through the draft[/B] or through smart FA pick-ups for value type players. No massive paydays for 29 yr old guys who may be coming to the end of their heyday.

I do agree that DE is likely a need for us. On the one hand if we cut JT and resigned him for far less money then he can have right end while Evans and AC swap on the left side (IMO AC is better suited for strong side end than Taylor ever was). More than likely though, as Paintrain has said, JT is out of DC next year and we are down to AC and Evans... unless Blache sees serious potential in Jackson or Wilson we need to go get a legit end. It's times like these I wish we could "develop" diamonds in the rough to address needs instead of constantly needing to draft/sign yet another question mark.[/quote]

We do need to make sure there is some type of improvement in our D-Line, so we need to make sure we have a player who is ready to play and contribute to the defensive line (in my opinion that would be Bernard the DT from Seattle). No offense but I'm tired of people who blurt out "let's build through the draft" (although you did add the whole part about free agency Goat, so I'm not talking about you in particular) and don't realize that building through the draft means drafting a kid that MAY contribute immediately, but will most likely take two or three years to really contribute. That's what happened last year when we drafted Davis, Kelly, and Thomas...we built through the draft.

Both Haynesworth and Peppers may command a lot of money, if I had to pick one out of those two, it would be Peppers. In my opinion though, I would go after Gross (as I've said it a million times), and draft a DE to develop. I think the teams needs to find out what will happen to Jason Taylor (retirement, restructure, or release from the team) before they would even think about going after Peppers though. I really hope they go after Gross instead.

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[quote=Ruhskins;521211]We do need to make sure there is some type of improvement in our D-Line, so we need to make sure we have a player who is ready to play and contribute to the defensive line (in my opinion that would be Bernard the DT from Seattle). No offense but I'm tired of people who blurt out "let's build through the draft" (although you did add the whole part about free agency Goat, so I'm not talking about you in particular) and don't realize that building through the draft means drafting a kid that MAY contribute immediately, but will most likely take two or three years to really contribute. That's what happened last year when we drafted Davis, Kelly, and Thomas...we built through the draft.

[B]Both Haynesworth and Peppers may command a lot of money, if I had to pick one out of those two, it would be Peppers. [/B] In my opinion though, I would go after Gross (as I've said it a million times), and draft a DE to develop. I think the teams needs to find out what will happen to Jason Taylor (retirement, restructure, or release from the team) before they would even think about going after Peppers though. I really hope they go after Gross instead.[/quote]

Why would you sign a 29 yr old Peppers? He's a talented guy but DE is not a big of a need as DT. If you look at the good defenses in the playoffs they have at least one stud at DT (Docket AZ, Brunkly, Laws in Philly, Ngata in B-More). If you get a 26 yr old Haynesworth who made 2 pro bowls you have to [B]at least [/B]go after him. Some of you guys are saying he has character issues over an incident in 06 for stomping on a guy, Come on, players have done far worse, and this was a one time offense. I remember we had ST do some things that made us scratch our head [B]but[/B] he grew up and learned from his mistakes and became our best defensive player since D Green. I would have no problem breaking the bank for a 26 yr Haynesworth in his prime.

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[quote=Ruhskins;521211]We do need to make sure there is some type of improvement in our D-Line, so we need to make sure we have a player who is ready to play and contribute to the defensive line (in my opinion that would be Bernard the DT from Seattle). No offense but I'm tired of people who blurt out "let's build through the draft" (although you did add the whole part about free agency Goat, so I'm not talking about you in particular) and don't realize that building through the draft means drafting a kid that MAY contribute immediately, but will most likely take two or three years to really contribute. That's what happened last year when we drafted Davis, Kelly, and Thomas...we built through the draft.

Both Haynesworth and Peppers may command a lot of money, if I had to pick one out of those two, it would be Peppers. [B]In my opinion though, I would go after Gross (as I've said it a million times), and draft a DE to develop.[/B] I think the teams needs to find out what will happen to Jason Taylor (retirement, restructure, or release from the team) before they would even think about going after Peppers though. I really hope they go after Gross instead.[/quote]

I keep hearing that the '09 draft is chalk full of talented DT prospects (i wouldn't know cause honestly, and I know i'm in the minority here, college ball bores the hell out of me) but haven't heard much on DE draft prospects. Any insight there? I'm just thinking that if Griff is booted we have to get a stud in there pronto, but even if he gets another year in DC it's probably time to develop a stud anyway. Soooo... basically we need to address DE (if JT goes) and DT no matter what? Oh yeah, OLB too. Ooh, don't forget about CB if JLC is right about Los getting the boot. Oh wait, we still have an offense to deal with, damn!

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[quote=vallin21;521217]Why would you sign a 29 yr old Peppers? He's a talented guy but DE is not a big of a need as DT. If you look at the good defenses in the playoffs they have at least one stud at DT (Docket AZ, Brunkly, Laws in Philly, Ngata in B-More). If you get a 26 yr old Haynesworth who made 2 pro bowls you have to [B]at least [/B]go after him. Some of you guys are saying he has character issues over an incident in 06 for stomping on a guy, Come on, players have done far worse, and this was a one time offense. I remember we had ST do some things that made us scratch our head [B]but[/B] he grew up and learned from his mistakes and became our best defensive player since D Green. I would have no problem breaking the bank for a 26 yr Haynesworth in his prime.[/quote]

I looked at Haynesworth stats and he has been pretty inconsistent, whereas Peppers (save for last year) he has had consistently good years. I would not mind Haynesworth, I just feel that he has the potential to be a bust.