Bigger waste of money?
 

Gibbs or Brunell? Gibbs was brought in to win. After we lose to Baltimore, we are 1-4. Spurrier WOULD have a better record than this. We bring in an aging QB to win immediately, though we have a compenent, young, raw QB, and we are 1-4.

I would say Brunell since a coaches salary doesnt count against the cap

Should I just lock this thread now?

[QUOTE=ZackMills]Gibbs or Brunell? Gibbs was brought in to win. After we lose to Baltimore, we are 1-4. Spurrier WOULD have a better record than this. We bring in an aging QB to win immediately, though we have a compenent, young, raw QB, and we are 1-4.

I would say Brunell since a coaches salary doesnt count against the cap[/QUOTE]


Matty, please delete the post above.....thank you.

you guys all think Gibbs is God, so i guess I am speaking blasemely eh?

[QUOTE=ZackMills]you guys all think Gibbs is God, so i guess I am speaking blasemely eh?[/QUOTE]

Pretty much. :stop: That's why I've been saying it's Brunell.

In case anyone forgot, Spurrier QUIT, he didn't want to be here so I don't see how you can say he'd be doing a better job. Regardless of who we ended up hiring, Spurrier wasn't going to be here so it's a non-issue.

i think ive just accepted the fact that gibbs isnt what he used to be, and you guys have not. the playcalling is awful, challenges awful, we consistenly shoot ourselves in our foot. this is all poor coaching. we have talent, and dont utilize it.

[QUOTE=ZackMills]you guys all think Gibbs is God, so i guess I am speaking blasemely eh?[/QUOTE]

Zack your saying that a HOF coach is the reason why we're losing......and that hasn't been the case...it's the players

1-4

i really wish we would have got denny green. in fact, at the time gibbs was hired, i still kinda wanted him. the cards have the same record and we have twice the talent

It's all about execution right now and our severe lack of it, I can't blame all the problems on coaching alone, that's a cop out.

[QUOTE]Zack your saying that a HOF coach is the reason why we're losing......and that hasn't been the case...[/QUOTE]

have you seen any improvement in this team since week one?

[QUOTE=ZackMills]i really wish we would have got denny green. in fact, at the time gibbs was hired, i still kinda wanted him. the cards have the same record and we have twice the talent[/QUOTE]


Yeah but the Cards play in one of the weaker divisions in the NFL..

we have the eagles in our division. the giants are a weak 4-1 and the boys arent that good either

[QUOTE=ZackMills]you guys all think Gibbs is God, so i guess I am speaking blasemely eh?[/QUOTE]

Blasemely? LOL, yea, I guess you are.

Not sure if you're a skins fan or not, but I'm assuming you are - I think most of us fans had high expectations for this season with the hiring of Gibbs. While this season is lost, and we're left playing for pride, I think its important that they keep the personnel on offense intact, because Gibbs will get them back on track.

Right now he's being outcoached, our O-line is playing poorly, Portis isn't being able to run effectively (mostly the line's fault) and the play calling is relatively vanilla and predictable for most teams. I do not expect this to happen through the rest of this season and next year. We will get back on track (even if its in the last few games of the season) and we will be a team to reckon with next year.

[QUOTE=ZackMills]have you seen any improvement in this team since week one?[/QUOTE]

no, but I don't think you can blame that on Gibbs.....the players are the ones executing the plays not the coaches.


Brunell isn't getting it done. Simple and plain

Joe Gibbs did not fumble the ball that the Ravens ran in for a score. Joe Gibbs did not fall for a fake to Deion. That was an obvious fake I saw coming the second I saw Deion back there.

i understand his frustration. don't think that we're a 1-4 team back there. i mean who'd have thought that the defense would be the only thing keepin us in the game. heck, if spurrier hadn't quit and had gregg williams, we could maybe have won a game or 2 more. plus... portis def would fit in that system i think. oh well though.

Great another "fire Gibbs", "the game has passed Gibb's by" post.....I'm not wasting my time here..

this thread is bullshit if the person who posted this actaully had a clue what they were talking about football they would have never posted it. Look for all you gibbs hater s hes a fantastic coach but god for bid he needs time, he needs his guys and bottom line right now he dosent have them. Brunell looked terrible and right now hes a major waste of money. But ramsey is the guy we should key on hes the future we have nothing else to lose we should put him in. I really wish people would learn there football and stop trashing gibbs

[QUOTE=jthor99]this thread is bullshit if the person who posted this actaully had a clue what they were talking about football they would have never posted it. Look for all you gibbs hater s hes a fantastic coach but god for bid he needs time, he needs his guys and bottom line right now he dosent have them. Brunell looked terrible and right now hes a major waste of money. But ramsey is the guy we should key on hes the future we have nothing else to lose we should put him in. I really wish people would learn there football and stop trashing gibbs[/QUOTE]

great post jthor99, thank you

[QUOTE=jthor99]this thread is bullshit if the person who posted this actaully had a clue what they were talking about football they would have never posted it. Look for all you gibbs hater s hes a fantastic coach but god for bid he needs time, he needs his guys and bottom line right now he dosent have them. Brunell looked terrible and right now hes a major waste of money. But ramsey is the guy we should key on hes the future we have nothing else to lose we should put him in. I really wish people would learn there football and stop trashing gibbs[/QUOTE]

I understand the frustration and agree with some of your comments, but even in the face of blasphemy (lol), let's keep it to respectful, even if strong, disagreements.

i love gibbs,but it was his idea to give a washed up qb a bunch of money which we didnt have to do when most every skin fan i know wanted ramsey to start anyway

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and it is okay to strongly disagree with what someone says, but allowing any comments/suggestions to be posted is important to this site.

IMO, Gibbs is our answer, will turn this thing around, and will bring us a Lombardi trophy, but the 1-4 start isn't encouraging and if his name were not Gibbs, a lot of people would be calling for his head (not just Snyder). Gibbs' coaching staff hasn't improved the offense, the O-line, the passing game, the run game, etc. Gibbs and Co. have produced four straight losses.

So, even though I STRONGLY disagree with the post, there is justification for frustration and lots of room for criticism. Vince Lombardi, who just so happens to be a HOF coach who coached here in D.C. after his first tour in Green Bay, wasn't successful. So, it's not crazy to broach the question of whether the game has passed Gibbs by.

After week 1, 2, or 3, it's out of left field to question Gibbs, but 30% through the season, it's not. Again, I STRONGLY disagree with the original post, but the poster doesn't deserved to be trashed.

just saw this thread, have no idea how it even got this far. Gibbs felt his system would be better run by a vet like Brunell, especially this season. as bad as the offense has picked up the Gibbs system, its a good bet Ramsey would have fared even worse. lest you forget preseason. Brunell is obviously the biggest waste of money cuz we paid longterm money (he's already 34) for being a shortterm solution. and a flawed one at that. Gibbs could coach from a wheelchair. and would. lay off the guy, just an uninformed post.

gibbs was 0-5 the 1st time around. hes doing better this time. 6th game coming up, this is where we start winning week after week.

Gibbs is not the problem. And there are few, if any, coaches who would be better than Gibbs. He's earned the right to go through some growing pains. He's proven in the past he can climb out of a hole and turn the Skins into winners. As has been said repeatedly here, he's a Hall of Fame coach and no amount of money is too much for him.

If he told Snyder "I want $5 million a year, your house, the keys to your mercedes, and I wanna bang your wife every Thursday" Well then that's what Joe Gibbs gets

Brunell on the other hand...sigh

It is amazing people are always bashing Snyder for getting rid of HC etc etc but he is a fan and fans apparently are calling for the head of the HOF coach in week 5 in his first year. Who can be right.

Brunell however is a big problem I hated this move origonally and we effectivly out bid ourselves chasing him . Had we waited him out maybe we might have lost out but equally we could have picked up after the Jags cut him for an awful lot less money. Also i hate to say it but i kind of wish we had gone for Warner but choices were made at the time.

at the time i woul d have never wanted warner... he's unafraid of throwing deep though, but i'm not sure his personality would have meshed as well with gibbs (which is probably the main reason brunell got the job)... you know, the whole gibbs loves god, warner has a deal with satan thing would have made things a bit difficult around here...

everyone thinks brunell is overpaid... way overpaid.

Other teams that have one win:
packers (playoffs)
titans (playoffs)
panthers (Super bowl)
chiefs (playoffs)
bengals (8-8)

we're not alone in the talented team doing crappy department, and all the above clubs have what are regarded as good coaches (playoffs, SBs, winning records etc)... sh*t happens, this year, once again, its happening to us, but there's still a light at the end of the tunnel and i don't have any doubt, but he has been a bit slow adjusting thusfar...

[QUOTE]gibbs was 0-5 the 1st time around. hes doing better this time. 6th game coming up, this is where we start winning week after week.[/QUOTE]

I really wish people would stop bringing that up. Just because we went 0-5 his first tenure doesnt mean were gonna do it again. Plus, that was when he was a rookie coach, he's not a rookie coach, he's a HOF coach, so why doesnt he hit the ground running if he's so great, a la Bill Parcells?

[QUOTE=ZackMills]I really wish people would stop bringing that up. Just because we went 0-5 his first tenure doesnt mean were gonna do it again. Plus, that was when he was a rookie coach, he's not a rookie coach, he's a HOF coach, so why doesnt he hit the ground running if he's so great, a la Bill Parcells?[/QUOTE]

i was annoyed by that too, but i guess people figure 12yrs out of the game kinda makes you a rookie again to all the new stuff thats happened in the NFL..

he's not great out the gate like parcells, cause unlike parcells he LEFT FOOTBALL FOR 12 YEARS!... parcells wasn't coaching for 2 years, but he never stopped watching teams and players and seeing what people were doing... he never left. he also inherited a club with some stability, even if they sucked...

Its not the coach that is causing the problems here. This team is 1-4 and has not lost a game by more than 7 points. They will turn it around, keep the faith. It's painful to watch a team beat itself, but there still is light at the end of the tunnel.

Ramseyfan:

Vince Lombardi coached one season in DC. He took over a team that had posted one winning record in the past 12 or 13 years and made them a .500 team in the first season. Then he came down with cancer and died.

To say that he was "not successful" or that maybe "the game had passed him by" is really a tenuous argument.

When Casey Stengel camae back from retirement to coach the Mets when they were created, his team lost 120 games in one year. No one - and I mean NO ONE - thought then or thinks today that it was Stengel's being behind the times that caused that. He did not have the players.

Joe Gibbs has a flawed team on the field. He inherited an even more flawed team but in a salary cap enforinment, you cannot fix everything in a single year. Now, if the team is still this flawed next year at this time, it will be perfectly appropriate to ask if Joe Gibbs is on top of football as it is played in 2005.

Dick Vermeil won a total of 9 games in his first two seasons back in the league. Does anyone question his coaching credentials now?

Gibbs will have success again as well. Unforunately it's gonna take some time and 5 games isn't a fair assessment.

[QUOTE=ZackMills]I really wish people would stop bringing that up. Just because we went 0-5 his first tenure doesnt mean were gonna do it again. Plus, that was when he was a rookie coach, he's not a rookie coach, he's a HOF coach, so why doesnt he hit the ground running if he's so great, a la Bill Parcells?[/QUOTE]

Here are some other slow starts by Gibbs:

1984: Started 0-2, Finished 11-5
1985: Started 1-3, Finished 10-6
1989: Started 1-2, Finished 10-6

So it wasn't only in his rookie year.

I don't understand how someone can question Gibbs and wish for Spurrier back when Spurrier was a complete disaster and all but admitted so by walking away.

At least Gibbs has a proven track record to look back on. He's been in these types of situations before and worked through them.

Well we quickly found out that Coach Gibbs does not walk on water. lol Changes are needed but it most definatly but it does not start with Coach Gibbs. Was Coach responsible for Brunell throwing 3 straight balls in the turf? Was Coach responsible for the punt return so elementary that I rembember doing the reverse (having 2 people back on punt returns) in high school?

Matty- I was thinking the same thing about Dick Vermeil. I can rembember the Rams going into there 3rd season with him. It sure did not look very pretty and they won the Super Bowl.

We all know now that this thing is not as easy as it looks.

Gibbs is not entirely at fault for this miserable start, but he is the one that wanted to sign and start Mark Brunell and the rest of the (offensive) off-season acquisitions. Brunell has looked horrible, and it is too much to blame on the system. On the other hand, in pre-season, everyone talked about how the offense was so "vanilla", and I'm sorry, but I don't see that much of a difference.
I have full confidence that Gibbs will turn this team around one way or another, but the blame has to be spread throughout the entire offense, including the offensive coaches and head coach.....Not to mention the awful special teams play. But to me, the biggest culprits have been the O-line and Brunell.

If I remember right one of the reasons for getting Brunell was to provide some depth at the QB situation and to allow Ramsey to learn by observing, instead of throwing him to the wolves and having his confidence shaken.

Well let's see now what Ramsey has learned