Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

In perhaps the most damning comments from Snyder's 'inner circle' Sonny J. made some comments on the radio today that indicate that Vinny may be gone if things stay the way they are.. [url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2009/11/sonny_on_vinny_he_is_tied_to_t.html?wprss=dcsportsbog]D.C. Sports Bog - Sonny on Vinny: "He is tied to this thing"[/url]
[quote=D.C. Sports Bog]
"Sonny, on the pregame show yesterday with me, you said something that I've never heard you say as definitively as you said it yesterday," Sheehan began. "You in essence said that this whole mess is really on Vinny's watch, that Vinny Cerrato's been making the decisions ever since he got the title promotion, that the decisions have been his and basically his alone. Will you sort of describe that a little bit more this morning?"

"You know, I think Joe Gibbs and Dan Snyder felt that Vinny had earned the opportunity to lead this football team, and they gave him that," Jurgensen said. "And Gibbs agreed with Snyder. And they gave him the opportunity to make the decisions. And I think, from my understanding, it was his decision to bring in another set of eyes, it was his decision to have [Sherm Lewis] call the plays, and I think these have been his decisions. He's living and dying by the success of this football team. He's tied to it. And he realizes that. And I think he would tell you that. You know, it's got to be successful for him to be here and continue in this position."

Well, it hasn't been successful. And if Sonny's understanding of things is correct, a lot of Redskins fans are now very, very happy. Pollin followed up, asking Jurgensen to assume for a minute that the Redskins win two more games and finish 4-12, which is about the right over-under at this point. In that scenario, he asked, "Can you pretty much confidently say that he's gone?"

"Yeah, I would think so, I would think so," Jurgensen said, as many listeners heard the sounds of heavenly chimes and angels singing HTTR. "I like Vinny, I don't want to....This is what is going to happen, I think. I think it's obvious that we've fired six or seven coaches, we've given him an opportunity. That's not to say Vinny wouldn't be here, but they could give Vinny something else." [/quote]

Oh if it were to be so, that would make a brotha happy.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

The question is how could Snyder NOT make a move and get Vinny out of there?

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

I just dont see how Vinny can survive....if he does then the answer to the question Who is the worst Owner in the League would undoubtally go to Danny Boy

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

if it happens, party in the nation's capital!!!!!!:woot:

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

I really, really, really, don't get DS's infatuation with Vinny. I mean, the only success this team has had is when Vinny was subordinate to Gibbs. What is his fascination with this guy? Can someone please, please explain??? I am serious so please don't give me the "he's got pictures" response. For 10 years, more or less, Vinny has been intergral to this team and it has been mediocre, unfocused and, without Gibbs around, team turmoil. How does DS not see this is Vinny? Particularly after the smear campaign on GW.

Any way, if someone has a serious answer - I'd love to hear it.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

I would be a happy man if we could get Vinny out of here!!! DS please fire your butt boy!!! All good things must come to an end in this case all terrible things must get better at sometime.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

I don't care about who we fire and blame for this disaster. All that matter is that someone competent is finally put in full charge of football decisions. Vinny'y fault. Gibbs's fault, Snyder's fault...I dont care. What I do know is that whoever has been the top of the mountain, the driving force behind our basic direction, has done poorly. Someone else is needed. A true fresh set of eyes who also has termination power and roster manipulation power. Solely and without interference. Then we have to hope the guy is good at it.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;623020]I really, really, really, don't get DS's infatuation with Vinny. I mean, the only success this team has had is when Vinny was subordinate to Gibbs. What is his fascination with this guy? Can someone please, please explain??? I am serious so please don't give me the "he's got pictures" response. For 10 years, more or less, Vinny has been intergral to this team and it has been mediocre, unfocused and, without Gibbs around, team turmoil. How does DS not see this is Vinny? Particularly after the smear campaign on GW.

Any way, if someone has a serious answer - I'd love to hear it.[/quote]

Well, he was part of the original team that Howard Milstein put together when he was trying to buy the team from the Cooke family and was basically installed as the incoming GM. When Milstein's bid failed he was basically absorbed by the Snyder group in the same role. He had a good (on paper) pedigree from Notre Dame and SF 49ers. Apparently he really ingratiated himself to Snyder and wowed him with his accomplishments.

For most of the time he's been with the team, he's been the face to sign on to whatever Snyder wanted to do. Schottenheimer recognized this and booted him immediately. Spurrier was told he would be getting a different GM but Snyder brought in Vinny instead. Gibbs also recognized this but minimized him rather than fire him. I guess Gibbs & Snyder thought that he had learned from Gibbs (who was awful IMO in the personnel role in Gibbs 2.0) enough to run the whole show himself. I think it's obvious now that he is a total failure in that role.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;623020]I really, really, really, don't get DS's infatuation with Vinny. I mean, the only success this team has had is when Vinny was subordinate to Gibbs. What is his fascination with this guy? Can someone please, please explain??? I am serious so please don't give me the "he's got pictures" response. For 10 years, more or less, Vinny has been intergral to this team and it has been mediocre, unfocused and, without Gibbs around, team turmoil. How does DS not see this is Vinny? Particularly after the smear campaign on GW.

Any way, if someone has a serious answer - I'd love to hear it.[/quote]
I REALLY don't get it either. I am sure there are plenty of jobs he can be doing successfully that do not keep a 1.6 Billion dollar francise circling the drain?
Yo Vin....throw me the.........Billy Baroo

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;623020]I really, really, really, don't get DS's infatuation with Vinny. I mean, the only success this team has had is when Vinny was subordinate to Gibbs. What is his fascination with this guy? Can someone please, please explain??? I am serious so please don't give me the "he's got pictures" response. For 10 years, more or less, Vinny has been intergral to this team and it has been mediocre, unfocused and, without Gibbs around, team turmoil. How does DS not see this is Vinny? Particularly after the smear campaign on GW.

Any way, if someone has a serious answer - I'd love to hear it.[/quote]

The only person who will be able to answer that is DS himself.

Maybe behind closed doors he makes these moving and well thought presentations of the direction of the team. He is doing a good job of holding onto his job.

Just cant wait until he gets the boot!

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

Assuming that the team finishes 4-12, I don't see how Snyder rationalizes keeping Vinny. Drafting Davis, Thomas, and Kelly was a stroke of brilliance when we were weak on both lines, but especially vulnerable on the O-line. This team is built like a fantasy football team. Somebody give Snyder a clue that his next GM better have an extensive plan to rebuild our line, or we will become a perenniel neighbor of Detroit and St. Louis in the standings.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;623020]I really, really, really, don't get DS's infatuation with Vinny. I mean, the only success this team has had is when Vinny was subordinate to Gibbs. What is his fascination with this guy? Can someone please, please explain??? I am serious so please don't give me the "he's got pictures" response. For 10 years, more or less, Vinny has been intergral to this team and it has been mediocre, unfocused and, without Gibbs around, team turmoil. How does DS not see this is Vinny? Particularly after the smear campaign on GW.

Any way, if someone has a serious answer - I'd love to hear it.[/quote]

He's got pictures, seriously.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

He's got pics of Snyder doing coke w/ 3 strippers in a hotel room. I mean he's just about the most incompetent person I've ever seen in an important position. Forget about his record, I can tell that just by listening to him talk.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

Thanks for posting Paintrain and this is wonderful news! If DS does fire Vinny and goes about what everyone here is saying about getting the best money that can buy in regards to a GM he is finally getting at the root of the problem and we have hope.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

I along with everyone else here will party the min we hear that it has happen. HEis the problem. We might have other little problems but he is a big problem.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=warpaint;623044]The only person who will be able to answer that is DS himself.

[B]Maybe behind closed doors he makes these moving and well thought presentations of the direction of the team.[/B] He is doing a good job of holding onto his job.

Just cant wait until he gets the boot![/quote]

and this is where you lose me....honestly, have you listened to Vinny speak? Perhaps you were grasping for an answer to help a brother out but Vinny reminds me of the special ed kids. No offense to anyone who has a child like this but looking at him and listening to him when he tries to present a well thought out answer is comedic. I get the feeling everytime I watch him that DS felt sorry for him and gave him a job. How DS would ever let himself be fooled by this joker for sooo long is beyond me.

I could see Vinny over seeing the theme park, or district manager at McDonalds but not building an NFL team. LOL....and to those with jobs as theme park managers or district managers at McDonalds....he wouldn't compare to you. LOL. I just think he needs to find a manager job outside of football cause he sucks.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

SBXVII - I really can't see Vinny in those posts because they require actually long term planning which when looking at his team building methods don't really incorporate.

At Six Flags for example the GM has to prepare long term capital plan to set out where the entity will spend and build rides and so forth. I kind of liken this to how will the GM will plan not just this year but the next several years to building the Redskins.

Instead I see a GM who goes out and get a Mike Williams to patch the line, I see someone pushing to give away multiple picks to acquire a potential superstars WR in Brandon Llyod, overpaying way too many players to simply win the offseason free agency title, I see contiuous trading of draft picks to solve the lack of depth across the board. I can go on but you all already understand the moves and the result to the teams ability to compete. We are not one player away or even one draft away from turning the corner, we will need a couple of drafts to restock the team and that is if we get a new GM to run the show ASAP.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

While I want Vinny to get fired, and while I like Dan Steinberg, and while I believe that Sonny is indeed part of Snyder's inner circle, I did not believe when I finished this article any more than when I started it that Vinny might get fired at the of this season. Steinberg could have just written the following: "Sonny Jurgensen stated in a radio interview yesterday that, if the Redskins current downward spiral continues until the very end of this season and the team finishes with no more than four wins, Vinny Cerrato has a good chance of being fired."

Really?

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

I so hope this is the case! This would be the best Christmas present, well that and the Skins finally getting an O Line!

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As much as we would like to see Vinny gone, I'll have to see it happen to believe it.

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[quote=47FAN;623066]I along with everyone else here will party the min we hear that it has happen. [B] HEis the problem. We might have other little problems but he is a big problem[/B].[/quote]

as vinny is a big problem and i can't wait until he gets his walking papers. he is only one of many, it would be helpful to have a coaching staff with nuts, an o-line, a consistent defense, a franchise qb.

or how about a team that just knew how to play football for 60 minutes on ANY given game day like they actually gave a crap about there team/job. something i have not seen sinse the steelers game last season.

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[quote=SBXVII;623069]and this is where you lose me....honestly, [B]have you listened to Vinny speak?[/B] Perhaps you were grasping for an answer to help a brother out but Vinny reminds me of the special ed kids.[/quote]

He crushes up some valuim and spikes Danny's drink. Thats how he pulls it off, 10 YEARS HASN'T FAILED HIM YET.

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I smell a massive spin campaign that Dan is brewing. He didn't want to sign all of these high priced free agents and trade away all of these draft picks. Vinny did, and he was just listening to his VP.

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I've always thought the problem was Lil Danny Snyder, it's not all on Look-in-my-eyes Vinnie.

He's afflicted with small-man-syndrome.

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I honestly don't care whether it's Dan Snyder or Vinny Cerrato. I just want whichever one it is to change their ways, hire a friggin GM and let him take it from there with control and basically no input. Or hire a Bill Parcells type that will pick his GM and let the GM pick a coach and basically say, we are going to give this guy or couple of guys 3-4 years to shape a team that will contend for the Super Bowl every season and if they don't we will find the next best candidates.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=mooby;623122]I honestly don't care whether it's Dan Snyder or Vinny Cerrato. I just want whichever one it is to change their ways, hire a friggin GM and let him take it from there with control and basically no input. Or hire a Bill Parcells type that will pick his GM and let the GM pick a coach and basically say, [B]we are going to give this guy or couple of guys 3-4 years to shape a team that will contend for the Super Bowl every season and if they don't we will find the next best candidates[/B].[/quote]

we need to be more consistant than 3 to 4 years and in vinny's words he gave zorn a playoff team

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[quote=Longtimefan;623090]As much as we would like to see Vinny gone, I'll have to see it happen to believe it.[/quote]

My thoughts exactly.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

Vinny will leave for a year then Snyder will bring him back in 2011.

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Firing Vinny would be a big step in the right direction, but the question lingers: Who for GM? Also, who is our new coach going to be?

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;623148][B]Firing Vinny[/B] would be a big step in the right direction, but the question lingers: Who for GM? Also, who is our new coach going to be?[/quote]

I would wait until this actually happened (I'm skeptical, won't believe it until I see it.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

One Question ... who the hell is Vinny .. i mean really, what has this guy EVER to deserve this job .. we are border line Matt Millen terrority with this guy .. good bye VC good bye you little weasel

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I've come around to be in the fire vinny camp recently, though I don't think he can be blamed for most of the dysfunction. As Wilbon has said, if they'd listened to vinny a few times they might be in better shape.

I'm more of the opinion that vinny's relationship w/the danny is one that can't be conducive to an objective mgmt. structure. It seems by all accounts that they are too close for Vinny to actually 'run' the team as GM. Were the wr picks in 08 all his doing? Maybe the specific players were, but JLC made a good point that Snyder has for years been enammored w/ WRs. He even wanted marty to draft Moss rather than R. Gardner in 01.

In short, if Snyder is willing to give real control of the football operation to a gm, he's got to fire Vinny, even if vinny isn't really to blame for much of the current mess (though I know that's debatable).

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[quote=JoeRedskin;623020]I really, really, really, don't get DS's infatuation with Vinny. ...............................
Any way, if someone has a serious answer - I'd love to hear it.[/quote]


maybe they gay yo.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=freddyg12;623319]I've come around to be in the fire vinny camp recently, though I don't think he can be blamed for most of the dysfunction. As Wilbon has said, if they'd listened to vinny a few times they might be in better shape.

I'm more of the opinion that vinny's relationship w/the danny is one that can't be conducive to an objective mgmt. structure. It seems by all accounts that they are too close for Vinny to actually 'run' the team as GM. Were the wr picks in 08 all his doing? Maybe the specific players were, but JLC made a good point that Snyder has for years been enammored w/ WRs. He even wanted marty to draft Moss rather than R. Gardner in 01.

In short, if Snyder is willing to give real control of the football operation to a gm, he's got to fire Vinny, even if vinny isn't really to blame for much of the current mess (though I know that's debatable).[/quote]

I think it has been Vinny's call the past two years and all signs point to that (minus the QB pursuit in the offseason). Since you really can't change owners, then the next logical thing would be for Vinny to go.

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[quote=Ruhskins;623323]I think it has been Vinny's call the past two years and all signs point to that (minus the QB pursuit in the offseason). Since you really can't change owners, [B]then the next logical thing would be for Vinny to go[/B].[/quote]

Agreed on that.

On paper it's suppossedly been vinny's call, it's just about impossible for us to know how much influence Snyder has had on his decisions. If it's true that they are friends, or at least racquetball partners, then I don't see how they could not discuss draft strategy & personell a lot.

In fairness to Vinny his drafting the last 2 years might turn out to be alright. The jury is still out on Davis, Kelly & Thomas, but you need 3 years to really assess those guys. If they turn out to be decent, I think you can say vinny's draft record the last 2 years is at least avg. He did get Horton & Mitchell in the 7th, though his one o line pick, Rinehart, is not looking too good. I know the o line wasn't addressed nearly enough, but at the same time this team had several holes to fill when he took over in 08.

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The clock is ticking......(tick, tick, tick). The count down has started.....8 games down 8 to go. tick, tick, tick. ;)

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=freddyg12;623327]Agreed on that.

On paper it's suppossedly been vinny's call, it's just about impossible for us to know how much influence Snyder has had on his decisions. If it's true that they are friends, or at least racquetball partners, then I don't see how they could not discuss draft strategy & personell a lot.

In fairness to Vinny his drafting the last 2 years might turn out to be alright. The jury is still out on Davis, Kelly & Thomas, but you need 3 years to really assess those guys. If they turn out to be decent, I think you can say vinny's draft record the last 2 years is at least avg. He did get Horton & Mitchell in the 7th, though his one o line pick, Rinehart, is not looking too good. I know the o line wasn't addressed nearly enough, but at the same time this team had several holes to fill when he took over in 08.[/quote]

I think some of the folks that have better access to information than your average fan (i.e. Smootsmack) have said that it has been pretty much Vinny's call on a lot of things, except for salary negotiation. While I do think that Vinny has made some pretty good draft picks (i.e. Orakpo, Horton, Mitchell, etc., etc.) he has completely overlooked the the offensive line. I mean he has built the defensive line (Orakpo, Jarmon, AH), but he should've had a similar approach to the o-line.

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=Ruhskins;623332]I think some of the folks that have better access to information than your average fan (i.e. Smootsmack) have said that it has been pretty much Vinny's call on a lot of things, except for salary negotiation. While I do think that Vinny has made some pretty good draft picks (i.e. Orakpo, Horton, Mitchell, etc., etc.) he has completely overlooked the the offensive line. I mean he has built the defensive line (Orakpo, Jarmon, AH), but he should've had a similar approach to the o-line.[/quote]

Yeah, taking Thomas, Kelly and Davis when we only needed 1 WR was a kick in the nuts. He could have taken Thomas and 2 linemen (Marko in the later rounds was a steal). WRs can be found at every turn. Look at Chris Chambers. He's signed by the Chefs and suits up a few days later and has 70 yards and 2 TDs.

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If - - I said IF - - Vinny has to take a fall for the disastrous 2009 season, I suspect he will be given another "title" in the Danny Snyder Cosmos of Companies AND that he will have a radio show 5 days a week on ESPN 980 in Washington. :towel:

For those of you who do not live in the area and cannot hear that program - - count yourselves as most fortunate. In terms of being a good radio program host, Vinny makes a great bartender. Listening to his show makes your ears bleed. :banghead:

Re: Sonny indicates our prayers may be answered
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;623450]If - - I said IF - - Vinny has to take a fall for the disastrous 2009 season, I suspect he will be given another "title" in the Danny Snyder Cosmos of Companies AND that he will have a radio show 5 days a week on ESPN 980 in Washington. :towel:

For those of you who do not live in the area and cannot hear that program - - count yourselves as most fortunate. In terms of being a good radio program host, Vinny makes a great bartender. Listening to his show makes your ears bleed. :banghead:[/quote]

Better to have Vinny on a radio show that we can ignore than to have him in the front office.