I'm Not Sticking By Gibbs
 

I'm not sticking by Gibbs for one simple reason - Mark Brunell.

As the Washington Post's Michael Wilbon pointed out in today's paper, Brunell has the lowest completion percentage of any full-time starter in the NFL and he has had the lowest third-down conversion rate in the league.

Moreover Wilbon has gone to opponents locker rooms after each game to ask a veteran defensive player with credentials to tell him about Brunell. And each week he's been told that Brunell is most of the problem, that their defensive game plan is to gang up on Portis until Brunell completes some passes downfield, that defensive coordinators are convinced Brunell can't do that any more with any consistency.

Yesterday he asked Packers safety Darren Sharper the same questions. Asked what the defensive game plan was against Brunell, Sharper said: "Knock him down. He doesn't want to get hit. The plan -- and you can see other teams doing the same thing on film -- is to not let him set his feet. Make him roll out. Hit him enough, and sooner or later it'll mess up his accuracy. He's not the same quarterback he used to be. Look, I played against him in Jacksonville, and he was a very, very accurate passer. But in the pocket now, his passes sail. He has to roll out now; maybe he sees his receivers better. I don't know if he's as comfortable in this offense or what. But he's not the same quarterback."

I'm sorry, but keeping Brunell in the game is killing us. I saw it by week 2, the fans were screaming it yesterday, Wilbon can see it, every analyst in the league sees it, and most everyone on this site can see it. Why can't Joe Gibbs?

I have so much love for Gibbs; he brought our city 3 Lombardi trophies and he's just a really likeable guy. I will always admire Joe Gibbs for what he has done and who he is, but that doesn't mean I'm going to always defer to him.

Gibbs is sticking by Brunell because Joe was the key man in sending away a 2nd rounder for him (we traded a second rounder to get Cooley who we would've been able to draft with our 3rd round pick that we gave to Jacksonville for Brunell), we paid an amazing $40 million for him, and he's a veteran. Does anyone think for a SECOND that if Ramsey had the lowest completion percentage in the league, the lowest 3rd down conversion rate in the league, failed to score 21 points in ANY game, and led us to a 2-5 record EVEN THOUGH we have the best defensive unit in the game that Gibbs wouldn't have benched him? I think not.

For that, I personally blame Gibbs for keeping Brunell in and sinking our season.

The Redskins are scoring fewer points per game (a pathetic 14) than any other team in the league. For that I blame Brunell and Gibbs.

Look, Gibbs would be the first to admit that the buck stops with him. He's gone so far as to say so repeatedly. He just thinks that the team is better off right now with Brunnell at the helm. I fully support Gibbs, but I disagree with his decision to stick with Brunnell. Is that a contradiction in terms? No. You can fully support someone even if you don't agree with everything they do. (Probably a lot of people voting in the presidential election, on either side, feel this way...)

[QUOTE=JWsleep]Look, Gibbs would be the first to admit that the buck stops with him. He's gone so far as to say so repeatedly. He just thinks that the team is better off right now with Brunnell at the helm. I fully support Gibbs, but I disagree with his decision to stick with Brunnell. Is that a contradiction in terms? No. You can fully support someone even if you don't agree with everything they do. (Probably a lot of people voting in the presidential election, on either side, feel this way...)[/QUOTE]

I totally agree.....

I have to ditto JW here. Gibbs has taken the blame in this one, but I don't agree with his decision to keep Brunell at the helm. One more loss and I think he will pull the plug and put Ramsey in there. Remember though, Ramsey probably would have thrown a couple picks when Brunell ate it for a sack yesterday.

I have no doubt that Gibbs will eventually turn this ship around, I just think he's slowing down the process by keeping Brunell in - for that, he's to share in the blame game.

Gibbs' hard-headedness is killing us right now. Why does he insist on sticking with Brunell, when it's so obvious to the whole world that Brunell is the major problem on the offense?

Several reasons, I think: 1) he personally went after Brunell in the off-season and it would be a tremendous embarrassment for him to pull his support from "his" guy, 2) the Skins (Snyder) paid Brunell a lot of money and can't afford to admit their mistake so soon after coughing up the bucks, 3) Gibbs is so enamored of playing proven vets that he can't see the forest for the trees.

I, for one, am mightily disappointed in Gibbs right now. His refusal to admit the obvious is costing the Skins their entire season. He should have made a change a couple of games ago, when there was still something left to salvage. If this were Spurrier being so pig-headed everyone would be all over him.

I can't believe Ramsey could play any worse than Brunell is playing. Maybe his strong arm and toughness is exactly what is needed to turn this thing around. All I know is that I don't want to have to suffer through one more game with Brunell because he just isn't getting the job done.

I would be willing to bet the house that many of the offensive players have lost all faith in their QB, but can't publicly say so. If you'll notice, hardly any of them are coming to Brunell's defense right now. Instead, they're noticeably quiet.

Bottom line is - Gibbs went after him and Gibbs is continuing to play him. So, Gibbs should take 99% of the blame for what is happening on offense. By the same token, Gibbs went after Gregg Williams and got him and that has proven to be a master stroke. So, I give Gibbs a lot of credit for how well the defense has performed. But, you really can't be a contender with only 1/3 of the team playing like champions.

Gibbs has really disappointed me these past 3 or 4 weeks and now the season is, for all intents and purposes, over.

[QUOTE=jbcjr14]I have to ditto JW here. Gibbs has taken the blame in this one, but I don't agree with his decision to keep Brunell at the helm. One more loss and I think he will pull the plug and put Ramsey in there. Remember though, Ramsey probably would have thrown a couple picks when Brunell ate it for a sack yesterday.[/QUOTE]
I agree with JW too.
I don't agree that Ramsey would have probably thrown picks instead of taking sacks....who knows, maybe he would use him arm to throw a strike and get the ball to a receiver even when he is well covered? To point is, no one knows what Ramsey would have done or will do (at least for this week), because Gibbs it being stubborn by sticking with Brunell. I respect Gibbs and support him, but that doesn't mean I agree with this decision.

Not a big fan of Brunnell but my guess is Gibbs doesn't think Ramsey can suceed with this offensive line since he is a statue so our only hope is that Brunell picks it up. I think Gibbs is probably lamenting jumping on Brunell so early when unbeknownst to anyone in the league the 49ers were gonna cut Garcia but this is what we're stuck with. A relatively mobile QB with a weak inaccurate arm and a granite statue with a strong arm who'll get sacked 7 times a game. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. I blame Gibss for this but I bet he does too. This will get fixed sooner or later. Probably later...as in adios ramsey and hello someone capable of moving around back there so we don't have to play geriatric Mark Brunell.

[QUOTE=SkinsRock]I agree with JW too.
I don't agree that Ramsey would have probably thrown picks instead of taking sacks....who knows, maybe he would use him arm to throw a strike and get the ball to a receiver even when he is well covered? To point is, no one knows what Ramsey would have done or will do (at least for this week), because Gibbs it being stubborn by sticking with Brunell. I respect Gibbs and support him, but that doesn't mean I agree with this decision.[/QUOTE]

I think Gibbs looks at it like it is his job to evaluate players and based on what he has seen he doesn't think Ramsey would help us any. I don't think Joe ever showed a stubborness to only do things his way and based all his decisions on his pride. In fact he seems the opposite to me. Looks to me like he jus doesn't have any faith in ramsey so why put him in?

This is a ridiculouc thread!!!! We have been in every game so far this year right to the end. The last 12 years this was not the case. With a few years in one system I would imagine you will start to see a turnaround. Was there one game we wern't totally into up untill the end? Can you say this about past years? This is where Gibbs makes a difference. If not Gibbs who would you replace him with? We seem to have now left the Colledge boys behind, so that might leave someone in the pro ranks. Slim picking boys so you should hope Gibbs remains for at least the 5 years he signed up for otherwise we are in serious trouble. Please explode this thread!!!!

I'm not sure the poll is very objective here so I went with other.

I'll stick by Gibbs through thick and thin. I'd much rather be in this situation with Gibbs than Spurrier. Even though times are tough, I don't have that same sinking feeling that I had last year. The record might say 2-5, but the team is still battling and sticking together. Last year it seemed the team rolled over and gave up. That to me is a direct reflection of the Head Coach.

Gibbs will get this thing worked out, he's too smart and too determined not too. He's going to put in the time and effort to get things fixed. Nobody wants to bring DC a winner more than Gibbs. He didn't have to come back to the game, he's a Hall of Famer, 3 Super Bowl rings and nothing else to prove. But he did come back and part of the reason was he was getting sick of seeing the Redskins get kicked around. And now he has to deal with boo's at home calling for Ramsey and thousands of assistant coaches on the internet who somehow have more knowledge of the game than he does.

In this day and age of 'what have you done for me lately' I guess 3 Championships quickly loses it's luster, but I think we owe him our patience. As I pointed out in another thread Dick Vermiel has gone through very similar circumstances, he back back after a long layoff, his teams struggled in their first two seasons, but patience, dedication and hard work paid off.

If anybody wants off the Gibbs bandwagon fine, but don't come crawling back once he gets things turned around.

People have pointed out that last year under Spurrier, the Skins whad a better record at this point. True, but where did they go from there? Straight down! The point is, while it is frustrating as hell being 2-5, it feels different than if Spurrier, or anyone else for that matter, was the head coach. With Gibbs, combined with the way we have lost those 5 games (with the D keeping them close to the end), there is much less of a sense of panic. Odds are that he WILL somehow, some way get the ship turned around, and while in all likelyhood the Skins probably won't make the playoffs, there is a good chance that the season will end on an upswing....which will set the stage for the Skins being a formidable team next season. If you ask me, that's a hell of a lot better than starting 3-1, only to end up 5-11. IN GIBBS WE TRUST.

Matt, how long should we be happy to see Brunell at QB?

The only thing that keeping Brunell at QB will achieve is a high draft pick.

Ramsey is the future and it won't be any worse for him being starter.

two words:

Gibbs sucks

I went with Gibbs is Partly to Blame, Brunell is Partly to Blame. I mean we're talking about the starting QB and head coach. I would think for any team the head coach and starting QB would be at least partly responsible for the success, or lack thereof, of the team

Now keep in mind that saying Gibbs is partly to blame doesn't mean Gibbs should be fired, Gibbs sucks, or anything like that. It just means that he should be held at least partly accountable for the 5 losses. And one of the best things about Gibbs is that he knows it too and he's not going to say "Hey I've got three rings, it's not my fault" He's going to assume responsibility and lead this team back to where it belongs.

[QUOTE=CRT3]This is a ridiculouc thread!!!! We have been in every game so far this year right to the end. The last 12 years this was not the case. With a few years in one system I would imagine you will start to see a turnaround. Was there one game we wern't totally into up untill the end? Can you say this about past years? This is where Gibbs makes a difference. If not Gibbs who would you replace him with? We seem to have now left the Colledge boys behind, so that might leave someone in the pro ranks. Slim picking boys so you should hope Gibbs remains for at least the 5 years he signed up for otherwise we are in serious trouble. Please explode this thread!!!![/QUOTE]

Our defense has kept it close, our offense has not. Gibbs has said that he's let Williams coach the defense and the offense is "his thing." Considering that our defense is ranked #1 and our offense is ranked 26th, how is it that Gibbs has been doing his job?

To those who have posted that the most likely reason that Gibbs isn't playing Ramsey is because he doesn't think Ramsey can get the job done - I say baloney.

Remember, it was Gibbs who reassured Ramsey that he will play a major part on this team.

If, as you speculate, he doesn't think Ramsey is the man, why would he say otherwise in the pre-season?

Conversely, if Gibbs meant what he said about Ramsey, when does he put his money where his mouth is and let Ramsey play?

Gibbs can't have it both ways - one the one hand he's trying to placate and reassure Ramsey, while on the other hand he's not letting him play when the current QB is stinking up the joint. At some point, what Gibbs says has to match what he does and who he chooses to start.

And to those of you who say we shouldn't criticize because we don't see what goes on in practice and we can't know what Gibbs is thinking - I say that, frankly, I don't care what goes on in practice nor what is in Gibbs' head. I only care about what I see during game time. That is all that counts - not what happens in practice. And what we have all been seeing in every game from the start of this season is poor play by Brunell. Is he alone in playing poorly on offense? No. But he does stand alone in consistently, game in and game out, playing poorly.

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]
And now he has to deal with boo's at home calling for Ramsey and thousands of assistant coaches on the internet who somehow have more knowledge of the game than he does.

If anybody wants off the Gibbs bandwagon fine, but don't come crawling back once he gets things turned around.[/QUOTE]

1. Are you saying he shouldn't have to deal with calls for Ramsey?

2. Are you saying people calling for Ramsey shouldn't be because we don't have more football knowledge than Gibbs?

3. Just because we attack Gibbs' decision to keep Brunell in and blame him for losses doesn't mean that we can't enjoy a few wins.

4. I'm as entitled to my opinion as anyone else, whether that means I'm supporting or attacking Gibbs.

5. I seem to recall you said you thought we should bench Brunell if we didn't win this week. Have you changed your mind or are you arguing with Gibbs who has superior football knowledge.

Everyone, KEEP IT RESPECTFUL.

[QUOTE=LadyT]To those who have posted that the most likely reason that Gibbs isn't playing Ramsey is because he doesn't think Ramsey can get the job done - I say baloney.

Remember, it was Gibbs who reassured Ramsey that he will play a major part on this team.

If, as you speculate, he doesn't think Ramsey is the man, why would he say otherwise in the pre-season?

Conversely, if Gibbs meant what he said about Ramsey, when does he put his money where his mouth is and let Ramsey play?

Gibbs can't have it both ways - one the one hand he's trying to placate and reassure Ramsey, while on the other hand he's not letting him play when the current QB is stinking up the joint. At some point, what Gibbs says has to match what he does and who he chooses to start.

And to those of you who say we shouldn't criticize because we don't see what goes on in practice and we can't know what Gibbs is thinking - I say that, frankly, I don't care what goes on in practice nor what is in Gibbs' head. I only care about what I see during game time. That is all that counts - not what happens in practice. And what we have all been seeing in every game from the start of this season is poor play by Brunell. Is he alone in playing poorly on offense? No. But he does stand alone in consistently, game in and game out, playing poorly.[/QUOTE]

I don't think Gibbs was being hypocritical at all when he talked about Ramsey being a big part of the team. Gibbs didn't say it was now

"Patrick Ramsey has a terrific future, and I think [it's] with the Washington Redskins,'' Gibbs said. "We think we have an excellent young quarterback there, 24 years old. We're excited about that.

Of course, that was back in the spring so maybe his opinion has changed some since then.

Alright I give in, Gibbs stinks, he's in over his head and he should be canned, today if possible.

Let's promote Williams, bench Brunell and life will be just dandy. Problem solved, who needs a Hall of Fame coach anyway?

Like I said, if you're off the Gibbs bandwagon fine, no problem, I just don't want to hear about how great he is from the haters when things turn around.

How about this thought...
 

Maybe the fact that Gibbs is willing to stick with Brunell through thick and thin, is actually reassuring to Ramsey? So when his time does come, sooner or later, he will know that his coach will support him and will not replace him at the first sign of trouble. As pretty much everyone has agreed, putting Ramsey in is worth a shot, but Gibbs is sticking with his man, which proves that he will do it no matter who "his man" is. Ramsey knows that his time will come, and when it does, his coach will be behind him 100%.
I hope it is soon.

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Alright I give in, Gibbs stinks, he's in over his head and he should be canned, today if possible.

Let's promote Williams, bench Brunell and life will be just dandy. Problem solved, who needs a Hall of Fame coach anyway?

Like I said, if you're off the Gibbs bandwagon fine, no problem, I just don't want to hear about how great he is from the haters when things turn around.[/QUOTE]

Aside from yesterday's posts, which we all probably filled with hyperbole due to the loss, I don't think anyone is calling for Gibbs' head.

I personally believe that Gibbs will get this thing right, I just feel he's slowing down the turnaround process right now. I stick by my belief in Gibbs and my contention that he's to blame for our team's woes right now (for keeping Brunell in).

So, are you saying that anyone who attacks Gibbs has jumped off the bandwagon and can't support the 'Skins?

[QUOTE=ZackMills]Just remember I am the one who said that Gibbs isn't any good anymore, and in 3 years, when we are still 6-10 material, you'll wish you wouldn't have flamed me.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Len Pasquarelli]Three years from now, the guy who accepted the Redskins job as a Hall of Fame member will be viewed as just another ordinary Joe.[/QUOTE]

Well everybody, this is truly an honor. Acclaimed ESPN columnist Len Pasquarelli has decided to grace our message boards under the name ZackMills. :D

Seriously though, Zack how do you figure that he isn't good anymore so quickly? Did he have to start 7-0 for you to think otherwise?

[QUOTE=SkinsRock]Maybe the fact that Gibbs is willing to stick with Brunell through thick and thin, is actually reassuring to Ramsey? So when his time does come, sooner or later, he will know that his coach will support him and will not replace him at the first sign of trouble. As pretty much everyone has agreed, putting Ramsey in is worth a shot, but Gibbs is sticking with his man, which proves that he will do it no matter who "his man" is. Ramsey knows that his time will come, and when it does, his coach will be behind him 100%.
I hope it is soon.[/QUOTE]


Good point.

[QUOTE=SkinsRock]Maybe the fact that Gibbs is willing to stick with Brunell through thick and thin, is actually reassuring to Ramsey? So when his time does come, sooner or later, he will know that his coach will support him and will not replace him at the first sign of trouble. As pretty much everyone has agreed, putting Ramsey in is worth a shot, but Gibbs is sticking with his man, which proves that he will do it no matter who "his man" is. Ramsey knows that his time will come, and when it does, his coach will be behind him 100%.
I hope it is soon.[/QUOTE]
I said something similar earlier today. I think once Ramsey gets in there, it's going to be for the long run assuming he performs, and he'll know that Gibbs will stand by him and won't have a quick hook.

[QUOTE]Seriously though, Zack how do you figure that he isn't good anymore so quickly? Did he have to start 7-0 for you to think otherwise?[/QUOTE]

What are we complaining about week in week out...poor clock management, use of our TOs, Brunell is clearly an awful awful QB, defenses know what we are running on offense. IT IS CLEARLY POOR COACHING. we have an amazing defense. what are we taught, DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS. The 2002 ravens had an awful offense, and won the SUPER BOWL. we cant win a game. our offense, on paper, is not that bad. this "genius" was a genius 12 years ago. Today, his offense doesn't work, yet he still runs it. he's old, he won't change. he's stubborn. this situation is alot like penn state. we have a great defense, yet we still cant win because of a bad, predictable offense. we have a great, blue chip true freshmen on bench, yet we still game in, game out, play with our terrible senior QB.

I am sure that i am so angry because both teams are very similar and have potential, and both coach's primes have passed, and it just pisses me off.

[QUOTE=Ramseyfan]Aside from yesterday's posts, which we all probably filled with hyperbole due to the loss, I don't think anyone is calling for Gibbs' head.

I personally believe that Gibbs will get this thing right, I just feel he's slowing down the turnaround process right now. I stick by my belief in Gibbs and my contention that he's to blame for our team's woes right now (for keeping Brunell in).

So, are you saying that anyone who attacks Gibbs has jumped off the bandwagon and can't support the 'Skins?[/QUOTE]
Correct me if I'm wrong but the subject of this thread says 'I'm not sticking by Gibbs'. So if you're not sticking with him fine, just don't jump back on board when things turn for the better, that's all. If you're not going to stick with him through thick and thin than I don't want to hear how big of a Gibbs fan you are when he wins, that's all.

[QUOTE=ZackMills]What are we complaining about week in week out...poor clock management, use of our TOs, Brunell is clearly an awful awful QB, defenses know what we are running on offense. IT IS CLEARLY POOR COACHING. we have an amazing defense. what are we taught, DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS. The 2002 ravens had an awful offense, and won the SUPER BOWL. we cant win a game. our offense, on paper, is not that bad. this "genius" was a genius 12 years ago. Today, his offense doesn't work, yet he still runs it. he's old, he won't change. he's stubborn. this situation is alot like penn state. we have a great defense, yet we still cant win because of a bad, predictable offense. we have a great, blue chip true freshmen on bench, yet we still game in, game out, play with our terrible senior QB.

I am sure that i am so angry because both teams are very similar and have potential, and both coach's primes have passed, and it just pisses me off.[/QUOTE]
So after 7 games you have Gibbs figured out and you're ready to kick him to the curb?

No allowing him time to adjust, install his system, get his players, nothing?

So I guess you would have fired Vermeil after he went 5-11 in his first season back? I guess it's Super Bowl or bust?

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Correct me if I'm wrong but the subject of this thread says 'I'm not sticking by Gibbs'. So if you're not sticking with him fine, just don't jump back on board when things turn for the better, that's all. If you're not going to stick with him through thick and thin than I don't want to hear how big of a Gibbs fan you are when he wins, that's all.[/QUOTE]

Have I ever once said fire Gibbs? Nope. Have I ever once said I'm not going to support the 'Skins win or lose? Nope. Have I ever done anything to show I'm not a true Redskins fan? Nope. I have ALWAYS said Gibbs will turn the ship around. Find me one post or a portion of a post where I said Gibbs can't bring us wins. You won't find a post like that.

I have EVERY right to criticize Gibbs' decisions. Just because I'm not "sticking by Gibbs," meaning I'm not going to blindly concur with everything he says or does, doesn't mean I can't support later decisions. If he sticks with Brunell and wins, I'll admit I was wrong and Gibbs was right. I just don't see us winning until Gibbs changes QBs and I guess we'll see who's right and who is wrong. Right now, it's looking like I'm right.

[QUOTE=ZackMills]What are we complaining about week in week out...poor clock management, use of our TOs, Brunell is clearly an awful awful QB, defenses know what we are running on offense. IT IS CLEARLY POOR COACHING. we have an amazing defense. what are we taught, DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS. The 2002 ravens had an awful offense, and won the SUPER BOWL. we cant win a game. our offense, on paper, is not that bad. this "genius" was a genius 12 years ago. Today, his offense doesn't work, yet he still runs it. he's old, he won't change. he's stubborn. this situation is alot like penn state. we have a great defense, yet we still cant win because of a bad, predictable offense. we have a great, blue chip true freshmen on bench, yet we still game in, game out, play with our terrible senior QB.

I am sure that i am so angry because both teams are very similar and have potential, and both coach's primes have passed, and it just pisses me off.[/QUOTE]
Did Paterno retire and come back 12 years later? I don't really follow college ball, but I don't think he did. Plus, isn't he 15-20 years [I]older [/I] than Gibbs? Gibbs hasn't done it in 12 years, so of course he's rusty, but that doesn't mean he won't get it back. Whatever you do, what would happen if you quit and did something completely different, then went back 12 years later? It would take a while to get back into it. Gibbs has already shown progress in game management and will continue, but truthfully, I don't think he will really be back in top form until next season. This year is for him to get back into the swing...which is why he hired Williams for the D to carry the team this year. We just need to have patience....but that doesn't mean we as fans cannot criticize things we don't agree with (i.e. Brunell).

I am fully supportive of Gibbs.. That means I think he is the right man to set the direction for the team and the level of professionalism that his team has lacked for a long time.

That being said, I don't know what he is waiting for to make a QB change. Maybe once the team is either destined to finish below .500 or is out of logical playoff contention (which is getting strikingly close) he will insert Ramsey to see what he can do. While I don't think Ramsey is 'the answer' and will magically make things happen, he cannot do any worse than Brunell..

For all the people who want to point out Ramsey from the Giants game, let's be factual about the impact that Brunell has had on the team so far. He has accounted for, directly or indirectly (teams scoring immediately after a Brunell turnover) for 41 points scored against the Redskins. 41 points scored against us are a result of his play. No team can be successful with those numbers. None of Ramsey's 3 INT led to a Giants score.

Ramseyfan is on the money with this one, I have said it for a while Brunell is the hold up on offense, I also said exactly what RF posted that Wilpon was saying, defenses are flooding the running lanes because they know Brunell can't get the ball downfield, and even if he hit's a pass here or there he can't sustain a drive, I also agree that Gibb's is having trouble admitting his mistake on brunell, I also think Gibb's is underestimating himself as far as his ability to get this team up to speed, he pretty much has done that exept for Brunell, and so long as he has Brunell in there he will not get the offense running like a well oiled machine, reason? You can't get continuity in the passing game if you can't complete a pass, I don't care how much time you spend playing together, gibb's will eventually make the change, and we will win but we are throwing this season away because of his stubbornness right now, Gibb's has alway's been pretty loyal to his starters but he never would have tolerated this kind of play by a QB in his first go round, especially when he has a QB of Ramsey's caliber waiting in the wing's.

I also like the quote about Brunell not wanting to get hit and his happy feet, sound's and look's like a guy hanging around for a paycheck, not a guy fighting his gut's out, unless he's fighting his gut's out not to get hit! :smashfrea

98 points (those scored by the Brunell led offense) - 42 points (those points scored off of Brunell)= 56 net points, or 8 points per game. WAY TO GO MARK!

this is funny we do this every year listen to ourselves it takes time to build solid teams years not months and were getting better every week the reason the redskins have stunk the last 12 years is we lack patience can you name one team in the history of the nfl that has turned over its coaching staff and most of its roster every year and been a consistent winner we need to just ride out this transition untill the skins get comfortable and to qoute lombardi winning becomes habit instead of losing

[QUOTE=Ramseyfan]98 points (those scored by the Brunell led offense) - 42 points (those points scored off of Brunell)= 56 net points, or 8 points per game. WAY TO GO MARK![/QUOTE]

Thanks, you articulated my point better than I had.. He has led us to a net touchdown and two point conversion per game. I highly doubt that Ramsey would do that poorly..

[QUOTE=redskinsskickazz]this is funny we do this every year listen to ourselves it takes time to build solid teams years not months and were getting better every week the reason the redskins have stunk the last 12 years is we lack patience can you name one team in the history of the nfl that has turned over its coaching staff and most of its roster every year and been a consistent winner we need to just ride out this transition untill the skins get comfortable and to qoute lombardi winning becomes habit instead of losing[/QUOTE]

In a few years Brunell will be wearing depends and crapping his panties every few hours. If it takes years to turn teams around, isn't it time to get impatient with Brunell and throw Ramsey in the mix?

this is my take on why i think gibbs is sticking with brunnell i think brunnells skills have faded some since he was younger but i dont think there gone personally i think his biggest problem is an utter lack of confidence and that is something that can return with time in the system i also believe that ramsey has the same problem right now and gibbs believes that brunnell being a veteran is the most likely to get in a groove and start moving this offense i could be wrong but if brunnell stays the starter i think we will see a signifigant improvement the second half of the season (not that he could be much worse) my point is that brunnell was once one of the best passers in the leauge and seven games in a brand new system with an offensive coaching staff that has been out of the leauge for so long is not enough time to say with any certainty that he can no longer play in the nfl.

[QUOTE=Ramseyfan]In a few years Brunell will be wearing depends and crapping his panties every few hours. If it takes years to turn teams around, isn't it time to get impatient with Brunell and throw Ramsey in the mix?[/QUOTE]


Good point! :lol: