How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

The Saints are reported to be giving Bushrod a second round tender. Jermon bushrod started 14 games and all play off and the super bowl. He was a very athletic kid with all the right measurable to play LT. He ran a 4.92 at his pro day.

2007 Pro Day:
[B]AGILITY TESTS[/B]
Campus: 4.92 in the 40-yard dash … 1.61 10-yard dash … 2.82 20-yard dash … 4.72 20-yard shuttle … 30 1/2-inch vertical jump … 8-foot-6 broad jump … Bench pressed 225 pounds 22 times … 365-pound bench press … 545-pound squat &… 258-pound power clean … 34 1/2-inch arm length … 9 1/2-inch hands … Right-handed.

I guess someone who knows football needs to look at the tape and see if he could be a left tackle, but they won the super bowl with him. If he is a starting caliber LT, at 25, turning 26 in August, he would be a steel. Does anyone know if that would be a second this year or next.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

Great pickup after we draft Okung at #4.

We need to draft o-linemen early AND often and pick up any decent FAs. After last season's disaster, there is no such thing as too many linemen.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

I was thinking the same thing, but then I realized that the single reason why New Orleans lost to Dallas is because Demarcus Ware had a blast rushing on Bushrod's side, and considering we play dallas twice a year, thats why I wouldn't get him, RT on the other hand wouldn't be a bad idea, but then again if we use our second on a RT and our first (possibly on a QB) then we would have our next pick be our fourth rounder on a tackle, and theres no tackles projected in the 4th round that could start at LT.

In short, the answer is no.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

Meh, this draft is so lineman rich I don't see the need to give up a pick on a guy who's not anything special. He's definitely not a long term fix at LT either.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;668213]I was thinking the same thing, but then I realized that the single reason why New Orleans lost to Dallas is because Demarcus Ware had a blast rushing on Bushrod's side, and considering we play dallas twice a year, thats why I wouldn't get him, RT on the other hand wouldn't be a bad idea, but then again if we use our second on a RT and our first (possibly on a QB) then we would have our next pick be our fourth rounder on a tackle, and theres no tackles projected in the 4th round that could start at LT.

In short, the answer is no.[/quote]
Well, you may be right. I remember how big of a game he had, but I dont remember if it was all Bushrods fault. Again, he was good enough to win the superbowl. Breese was on of the least sacked QB's in the league.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=T.O.Killa;668216]Well, you may be right. I remember how big of a game he had, but I dont remember if it was all Bushrods fault. Again, he was good enough to win the superbowl. Breese was on of the least sacked QB's in the league.[/quote]

Brees also is a great QB who has pocket awareness and knows when to get rid of the ball, and also his line is just very good in general (Jahri Evans is an All pro Guard, Carl Nicks is going to be just like Evans, Stinchcomb's a great RT, and Goodwin is an above average center)

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

Maybe post-draft, if Bushrod has not signed his tender and we didn't get the linemen that we thought we might, then we might consider such a move.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Lotus;668229]Maybe post-draft, if Bushrod has not signed his tender and we didn't get the linemen that we thought we might, then we might consider such a move.[/quote]
Does that mean if we do it prior to draft we would have to give this years second rounder? I think if we could get him for next years second then it would work well for us.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;668220]Brees also is a great QB who has pocket awareness and knows when to get rid of the ball, and also his line is just very good in general (Jahri Evans is an All pro Guard,[B] Carl Nicks is going to be just like Evans[/B], Stinchcomb's a great RT, and Goodwin is an above average center)[/quote]

Thats a pretty lofty expectation to compare a very good player to the best in the game:
[quote]
Scouts and coaches think Jahri Evans of the New Orleans Saints may be the best guard in the NFL.[/quote]
[url=http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcsouth/post/_/id/7540/from-out-of-nowhere-evans-at-top-of-nfl]From out of nowhere, Evans at top of NFL - NFC South Blog - ESPN[/url]

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;668220]Brees also is a great QB who has pocket awareness and knows when to get rid of the ball, and also his line is just very good in general (Jahri Evans is an All pro Guard, Carl Nicks is going to be just like Evans, Stinchcomb's a great RT, and Goodwin is an above average center)[/quote]

The Saints line really didn't play all that well last year, I would say Brees and his ability to get the ball out quick was the main reason he wasn't sacked more.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=T.O.Killa;668211]The Saints are reported to be giving Bushrod a second round tender. Jermon bushrod started 14 games and all play off and the super bowl. He was a very athletic kid with all the right measurable to play LT. He ran a 4.92 at his pro day.[/quote]

Imo a current young starting RT like Bushrod is safer then drafting a [I]potential[/I] RT in the second round.

With the 37th pick all the LT prospeect would be off the board and provided there isn't a run on OL we would be looking at the 6 or 7 rated OT.
These players like Vladimir Duccasse or Charles Brown or Veldheer may not even be ready to start.

But, on the other hand why are the saints willing to let him a young OT go?

Was Bushrod ability inflated by the quality of the other OL around him?

At the end of the day Bushrod would instantly be the best OT on our roster.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=T.O.Killa;668236]Does that mean if we do it prior to draft we would have to give this years second rounder? I think if we could get him for next years second then it would work well for us.[/quote]

I could be wrong but that is what I was thinking.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=30gut;668242]Imo a current young starting RT like Bushrod is safer then drafting a [I]potential[/I] RT in the second round.

With the 37th pick all the LT prospeect would be off the board and provided there isn't a run on OL we would be looking at the 6 or 7 rated OT.
These players like Vladimir Duccasse or Charles Brown or Veldheer may not even be ready to start.

But, on the other hand why are the saints willing to let him a young OT go?

Was Bushrod ability inflated by the quality of the other OL around him?

At the end of the day Bushrod would instantly be the best OT on our roster.[/quote]

Bushrod was a career backup until he was forced into action this year due to Jammal Brown going down with an injury. Now that Brown is healthy Bushrod is expendable. He did a decent job filling in at LT but was often exposed. He's a decent player, a good backup to have around.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

I read what Saints bloggers had to say about Bushrod and not one of them blaimed him for Ware's big day. They all said that any team would have helped out more against Ware. Again, not sure, but if our scouts think he can play LT and we can get him for next years second round draft pick, then it would be the best move in the world.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

If we did go after him, I definitely would put him at RT. If you can't let your LT lock up one on one consistently with the top pass rushers in this league, you've got a problem.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Mattyk;668261]If we did go after him, I definitely would put him at RT. If you can't let your LT lock up one on one consistently with the top pass rushers in this league, you've got a problem.[/quote]

I agree with your posts in this thread; Bushrod could even barely handle Freeney (with the foot injury) in the Super Bowl game.. I would prefer to spend the 2nd pick on Charles Brown or whoever else is available..

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Mattyk;668238]The Saints line really didn't play all that well last year, I would say Brees and his ability to get the ball out quick was the main reason he wasn't sacked more.[/quote]

yeah im not really sold on bushrod. the guy was a 6th or 7th round pick, got playing time b/c of injury and did a decent job. he is also a local kid to MD and i think he played at towson or somewhere close.

i wonder if people view him as being better than he is b/c he did better than expected for a plug-in a 6th or 7th round pick? or maybe also b/c the saints didnt face alot of adversity this year so, when your winning games, alot of criticism (man im having a rough day for spelling) is quieted.

quieted, is that even a word?

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

How 'bout we just pick the best tackle in the draft with our #4?

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=GridIron26;668265]I agree with your posts in this thread; Bushrod could even barely handle Freeney (with the foot injury) in the Super Bowl game.. I would prefer to spend the 2nd pick on Charles Brown or whoever else is available..[/quote]

In all fairness, getting beat by Freeney and Ware doesn't mean you are a bum. I seem to remember those guys beating Samuels at least once a game.

If I was to bet on it, I would think that the top pass rushers will make Brown, Okung, Davis and any other rookie look bad out of the gate.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;668280]In all fairness, getting beat by Freeney and Ware doesn't mean you are a bum. I seem to remember those guys beating Samuels at least once a game.

If I was to bet on it, I would think that the top pass rushers will make Brown, Okung, Davis and any other rookie look bad out of the gate.[/quote]

True true.. However, that's why I added the foot injury part.. If Freeney was healthy, then maybe it would be different story for me.. I just don't believe we should spend our 2nd pick on a LT who already showed he can't handle all pass rushers, right when we have an opportunity to draft a T who have lot of potentials to stop all (or most) pass rushers..

Although I can't help but wonder why Saints are trying to shopping him around? Why wouldn't they want to keep him as back-up, just in case if Jammall Brown or RT (I don't remember who) goes down?

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=GridIron26;668282]True true.. However, that's why I added the foot injury part.. If Freeney was healthy, then maybe it would be different story for me.. I just don't believe we should spend our 2nd pick on a LT who already showed he can't handle all pass rushers, right when we have an opportunity to draft a T who have lot of potentials to stop all (or most) pass rushers..

Although I can't help but wonder why Saints are trying to shopping him around? Why wouldn't they want to keep him as back-up, just in case if Jammall Brown or RT (I don't remember who) goes down?[/quote]


I would rather keep the 2nd pick too.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Ruhskins;668276]How 'bout we just pick the best tackle in the draft with our #4?[/quote]

and draft some guys in the 5th or later and develop our own bushrods of the world.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

Saints could still match to keep him...but No on giving up our 2nd for him. He's nothing special and unless he's gotten significantly stronger since his combine, his upper body numbers aren't good for a starting NFL OL.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

I know I read it here somewhere but not sure who posted it from where.... but the article pretty much pointed out that M.Shanahan has had great success building his 1st ranked offensive lines through mid round draft choices. Perhaps it was the scheme, I don't know or the OL coach, but hopefully he can continue to do this. I'd say pass on throwing away a draft pick and usually I'm the one saying lets get him cause he's a proven player. Plus I think he came out of King George VA. if its the same LT I'm thinking of. He did have trouble with Ware but that could be solved with a couple of chip blocks by the RB or Ware getting beat when he makes that rush.

The team has a camp coming up prior to the draft so the coach's will know what they have in OL and what they don't. Like Levi, although he was not impressive he made a statement that was very telling just after he signed with us .... he said he has not utilized Bugels style of man-to-man since his college days. Which means what? was he more of a zone blocker? Levi might do better under Shanahan's zone blocking since his whole career he ran that scheme. I'm guessing.

I think if there is not outstanding LT available in FA I'd look to pick up a decent player to fill the RT spot. Draft a QB at #4, and pick up the LT in the second round. Look at a FS in the 4th round (unless we pick someone up in FA), and possibly OL the rest of the way and bring in a lot of UFA OL.

We have many holes to fill and I guess it depends on what the team decides to do? I'm not advocating it but if they were to try to the big splash again:

Peppers-DE/LB
Sproles-RB
Pashos(49ers OL)-OL

Then look to pick up a FS some of our problems would be solved. We needed LB, RB, FS, a whole mess of OL, and a more accurate QB. The QB could be addressed in the draft as well as OL and FS. I still think they will try to pick up a big named WR also. As most of you have said I could see Walter of the Texans since he knows the scheme or Bryant of Tampa since the K.Shanahan would be familiar with him or T.O. since M.Shanahan tried to pick him up once before, and even though I'd rather have the other two my spidey senses are telling me T.O. is on their list since it would give our young WR another year under their belt, T.O. could help McCardell coach them up for next year, and he most likely would be cheaper then the other two.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=SBXVII;668304]I know I read it here somewhere but not sure who posted it from where.... [B]but the article pretty much pointed out that M.Shanahan has had great success building his 1st ranked offensive lines through mid round draft choices.[/B] Perhaps it was the scheme, I don't know or the OL coach, but hopefully he can continue to do this. I'd say pass on throwing away a draft pick and usually I'm the one saying lets get him cause he's a proven player. Plus I think he came out of King George VA. if its the same LT I'm thinking of. He did have trouble with Ware but that could be solved with a couple of chip blocks by the RB or Ware getting beat when he makes that rush.[/quote]

:soapbox:

After having the piece of shit line we had in '09 and '08, I don't want to depend on JUST this to build the offensive line. Our franchise tackle (whom we picked up in the first round) is retiring, Randy Thomas should retire, Heyer is serviceable (although some people have a more negative opinion about him), and honestly, I don't know what to make of Rabach. The team seems to be ok with him, but I'm not sold on him.

Picking up a LT in the top 10 of the draft is not throwing a pick away. Many football pundits typically put QB and LT as 1a and 1b in the positions that a team should pick in the top 10/top 5. I know all won't be lost if we pick up a QB at #4, but also all won't be lost if we pick up a franchise tackle at #4 as well.

I know that a team should consider a QB if there's a special talent and having the opportunity to take a franchise QB. But to me, it is not like Jason Campbell was putting up JaMarcus Russell's numbers last season (and NO, I'm not making an argument for Campbell so calm down JC haters). However, our offensive line was the JaMarcus Russell of offensive lines.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;668302]Saints could still match to keep him...but No on giving up our 2nd for him. He's nothing special and unless he's gotten significantly stronger since his combine, his upper body numbers aren't good for a starting NFL OL.[/quote]
I would assume he has gotten significantly stronger. He came from Towson for God sakes,and was a forth rounder. They saw some raw talent to pick him that high. Freeney and Ware are one and two best pass rushers in the league. I don't care if Freeney was playing with an amputated leg, he is a beast. When ever players like that play in a game like the super bowl they do well. thats why they are all pro's. All I am saying, is if he can play LT, we should take him.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Buster;668212]Great pickup after we draft Okung at #4.

We need to draft o-linemen early AND often and pick up any decent FAs. [B]After last season's disaster, there is no such thing as too many linemen.[/B][/quote]

And 2008. When it comes to oline men the more merrier

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Mattyk;668238]The Saints line really didn't play all that well last year, I would say Brees and his ability to get the ball out quick was the main reason he wasn't sacked more.[/quote]

Whats this? A QB making his O-Line look better then it really is? You don't say.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;668322]Whats this? A QB making his O-Line look better then it really is? You don't say.[/quote]

The top tier guys can do that. Trouble is there's only a handful of those guys. The rest of the league needs a good line.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;668322]Whats this? A QB making his O-Line look better then it really is? You don't say.[/quote]

Yes, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, and Peyton Manning will make their O-Line look better....any chance they are available next year?

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

the next tom brady, peyton manning or drew brees may be available.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=over the mountain;668345]the next tom brady, peyton manning or drew brees may be available.[/quote]

or the next Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf or Tim Couch. However, my point is that Bradford or Clausen are not going to make our o-line look good immediately.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=over the mountain;668345]the next tom brady, peyton manning or drew brees may be available.[/quote]

This. We will be extremely lucky if we can pick Bradford at 4 without trading any picks.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Ruhskins;668309]:soapbox:

After having the piece of shit line we had in '09 and '08, I don't want to depend on JUST this to build the offensive line. Our franchise tackle (whom we picked up in the first round) is retiring, Randy Thomas should retire, Heyer is serviceable (although some people have a more negative opinion about him), and honestly, I don't know what to make of Rabach. The team seems to be ok with him, but I'm not sold on him.

Picking up a LT in the top 10 of the draft is not throwing a pick away. Many football pundits typically put QB and LT as 1a and 1b in the positions that a team should pick in the top 10/top 5. I know all won't be lost if we pick up a QB at #4, but also all won't be lost if we pick up a franchise tackle at #4 as well.

I know that a team should consider a QB if there's a special talent and having the opportunity to take a franchise QB. But to me, it is not like Jason Campbell was putting up JaMarcus Russell's numbers last season (and NO, I'm not making an argument for Campbell so calm down JC haters). However, our offensive line was the JaMarcus Russell of offensive lines.[/quote]

I look at it this way.... Honestly Samuels is retiring, R.Thomas should be retiring (due to injury), Rabach is not a Center I want to rely on this coming year since he has not done very well since he's been here. He gets bowled over all the time. So we truly need a whole new OL. Keep in mind we can't do it all in one year. So some players will have to be FA and some will have to be mid to late rounders or settle with what we already have. If we are settling with Rabach this coming year, and hopefully the young guys we picked up the last two years look good as Guards then we basically need a LT and RT. If we can pick up just one in FA we can pick up the other in the draft. Then bring in a whole mess of late round or UFA OL.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;668349]This. We will be extremely lucky if we can pick Bradford at 4 without trading any picks.[/quote]

Not anymore...:) now PFT is reporting that if the draft was tomorrow the Rams would pick McCoy.

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/03/report-rams-would-take-mccoy-if-draft-were-held-now/]Report: Rams would take McCoy, if draft were held now | ProFootballTalk.com[/url]

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=SBXVII;668353]I look at it this way.... Honestly Samuels is retiring, R.Thomas should be retiring (due to injury), Rabach is not a Center I want to rely on this coming year since he has not done very well since he's been here. He gets bowled over all the time. So we truly need a whole new OL. [/quote]

LEAVE RABACH ALONE!!!!!!!!!

I also want to take this time though to point out that if you don't like the idea of our lineman getting "bowled" over then prepare to hate most of our line. Shanahan loves the quick athletic types, but they work much better in the zone blocking scheme. Rabach did admirable in a power blocking scheme now he's going to a scheme thats tailor made for him. Prepare to love Rabach again like it's 2005.

[quote=SBXVII;668354]Not anymore...:) now PFT is reporting that if the draft was tomorrow the Rams would pick McCoy.

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/03/report-rams-would-take-mccoy-if-draft-were-held-now/]Report: Rams would take McCoy, if draft were held now | ProFootballTalk.com[/url][/quote]

Wait doesn't that make us lucky. Oh well guess I'll have to read the article.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=SBXVII;668353]I look at it this way.... Honestly Samuels is retiring, R.Thomas should be retiring (due to injury), Rabach is not a Center I want to rely on this coming year since he has not done very well since he's been here. He gets bowled over all the time. So we truly need a whole new OL. Keep in mind we can't do it all in one year. So some players will have to be FA and some will have to be mid to late rounders or settle with what we already have. If we are settling with Rabach this coming year, and hopefully the young guys we picked up the last two years look good as Guards then we basically need a LT and RT. If we can pick up just one in FA we can pick up the other in the draft. Then bring in a whole mess of late round or UFA OL.[/quote]

I'm just not sold in the talent at UFA at the tackle position. I mean, you can bring Tony Pashos, but I feel that we'd be patching up an important line position with an old guy. Once again, I get the whole "franchise QB" argument, I'm just not sold on this being a greater need than getting a franchise tackle.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Ruhskins;668348]or the next Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf or Tim Couch. However, my point is that Bradford or Clausen are not going to make our o-line look good immediately.[/quote]

i hear ya buddy but nobody is going to immediatley make our o line look good. not JC, not bradford, not clausen, not okung.

have we reached a deal with rabach? if not, he hits the FA wire in about 34 hours.

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Ruhskins;668357]I'm just not sold in the talent at UFA at the tackle position. I mean, you can bring Tony Pashos, but I feel that we'd be patching up an important line position with an old guy. Once again, I get the whole "franchise QB" argument, I'm just not sold on this being a greater need than getting a franchise tackle.[/quote]

If you're just looking at 2010 then a franchise tackle makes much more sense then a potential franchise QB. However when you look at 2010 onward the franchise QB makes so much sense it's not even funny. You think the Falcons and Thomas Dimitroff are loosing any sleep over the fact that they selected Ryan over Dorsey with their O-Line was in shambles?

Re: How About Jermon Bushrod for a Second Rounder
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;668360]If you're just looking at 2010 then a franchise tackle makes much more sense then a potential franchise QB. However when you look at 2010 onward the franchise QB makes so much sense it's not even funny. You think the Falcons and Thomas Dimitroff are loosing any sleep over the fact that they selected Ryan over Dorsey when their O-Line was in shambles?[/quote]

The Falcons also picked up Sam Baker later in the first round during that draft, he's now their starting Left Tackle with the pick that we traded to get Kelly, Thomas, and Davis.