new drilling in the U.S
 

[URL="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36110038/ns/business-oil_and_energy"][SIZE=5]Obama to allow oil drilling off Virginia[/SIZE][/URL] Move is a reversal of a long-standing ban, but President Obama will also reject some new Alaskan sites.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

When I went to Santa Barbara in January it was so pretty expect for the oil rigs that cultured the view. It was so weird to see these huge ugly things in the middle of paradise.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

Nice. A common sense and centrist move. I like it.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

im trying to figure out how firstdown will hate this? too little, too late, too early, not enough, too much.....

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=dmek25;680226]im trying to figure out how firstdown will hate this? too little, too late, too early, not enough, too much.....[/quote]


It will get in the way of his fishing trips and the sound of the drilling will reach the mainland and his 3 year old daughter will no longer be able to sleep from 8pm to noon the next day. =) I am sure there is more.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=dmek25;680226]im trying to figure out how firstdown will hate this? too little, too late, too early, not enough, too much.....[/quote]

Virginia's governor was already going to do this, Obama is simply trying to take glory for something the Republicans were doing.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

More radical liberalism from Obama. Seriously, I think there's some common sense politics and economics at play here.

I think the president is willing to bend on a campaign promise to make America less oil dependent and hopefully garner some bi-partisan support on his energy policy. The left will see this as him caving in (folks are fuming this morning), and the right will hopefully see this as an olive branch. We'll need more oil in ten years whether we drill or not, so why not go for it.

Drill, baby, drill!!

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

Actually, this is linked to Obamacare and the socialist plot to overthrow the West. --

By limiting the enviromental protections currently in place, Obama allows for independent oil companies to wildcat and, thus, create more wealth in small companies and individuals. Once this new wealth has been "maldistributed" by these enterprising capitalists, they will have their incomes "corrected" by its redistribution through the cadillac tax imposed on the wealthy as part of the health care plan.

These new oil barons will object to the stripping of their new found wealth and will call for a change of government by joining the Tea Party movement. Obama will then hold them up as an example of all that is bad with capitalism by asserting that they only got their wealth through the government's actions.

Using this as a catalyst, Obama will then assert that all Republicans are neccessarily governed by self interest and that only the Democrats care for the "greater good". In furtherance of the "greater good", Obama will ban the Republican party after staging a burning of the Capitol and making it appear it was the work of the Tea Party as financed by the new oil barons.

Finally, Obama will then install himself as President for life and make the Democratic Ass the official State symbol.

It's soooo obvious!!!!

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

JR, you may want to be careful, I think I saw black helicopters and suv's circling downtown B'more. Trash the cell phone and run man!

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;680246]JR, you may want to be careful, I think I saw black helicopters and suv's circling downtown B'more. [B]Trash the cell phone[/B] and run man![/quote]

Didn't I see this in the Matrix? LOL.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

JR, that sounds like a great novel.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

They should have done this long time ago. Drill who cares. Now ten years from now when they don't find anything I will ROFLMAO!!!! Let the oil industry waste their time out there, it will result in lower gas prices for the near term, and become comedy material in a few years.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=Ruhskins;680247]Didn't I see this in the Matrix? LOL.[/quote]
I have personally seen JR go Superman on a drywall partition, I assume he can jump between buildings if called upon!

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;680243]Actually, this is linked to Obamacare and the socialist plot to overthrow the West. --

By limiting the enviromental protections currently in place, Obama allows for independent oil companies to wildcat and, thus, create more wealth in small companies and individuals. Once this new wealth has been "maldistributed" by these enterprising capitalists, they will have their incomes "corrected" by its redistribution through the cadillac tax imposed on the wealthy as part of the health care plan.

These new oil barons will object to the stripping of their new found wealth and will call for a change of government by joining the Tea Party movement. Obama will then hold them up as an example of all that is bad with capitalism by asserting that they only got their wealth through the government's actions.

Using this as a catalyst, Obama will then assert that all Republicans are neccessarily governed by self interest and that only the Democrats care for the "greater good". In furtherance of the "greater good", Obama will ban the Republican party after staging a burning of the Capitol and making it appear it was the work of the Tea Party as financed by the new oil barons.

Finally, Obama will then install himself as President for life and make the Democratic Ass the official State symbol.

It's soooo obvious!!!![/quote]

You forgot the part where Jack Bauer dives out of a Helicopter onto the white house lawn. Kicks major secret service butt, then has a major fist fight with Obama, who turnes out to be a Al Quaeda secret agent and blows himself up. Jack Bauer survives, it's a miracle.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;680274]You forgot the part where Jack Bauer dives out of a Helicopter onto the white house lawn. Kicks major secret service butt, then has a major fist fight with Obama, who turnes out to be a Al Quaeda secret agent and blows himself up. Jack Bauer survives, it's a miracle.[/quote]

JR doesn't like to talk about his own actions.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;680233]Virginia's governor was already going to do this, Obama is simply trying to take glory for something the Republicans were doing.[/quote]

I forgot state's rights trump federal law in some people's minds.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

I think its great but not sure why this is even news but I guess it confirms that Obama will let the plans move forward. On Sept of 2008 Bush lifted the ban on drilling and Va. has been moving foward with the plans to start drilling. Its good to know that Obam is backing this plan. [url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/12/AR2008111202866.html]Agency Begins Process to Allow Drilling off Va. Coast - washingtonpost.com[/url]

"The administration's decision to move forward comes four months after President Bush lifted an executive ban on offshore drilling. In September, the Democratic-controlled House and Senate decided not to renew a separate, congressional moratorium on offshore drilling that had been in place for more than two decades.

Randall Luthi, director of the Minerals Management Service, said there hasn't been oil or gas exploration off Virginia's coast since 1983. By moving forward now, the agency is fulfilling a request by Gov. Timothy M. Kaine (D) to open up waters 50 miles offshore for exploration, Luthi said.

In 2006, Kaine signed a bill supporting federal efforts to determine how much natural gas exists 50 or more miles off the Atlantic coast."

As for these being an eye sore if they are over 50 miles out you will never see them from shore. I fish a light house 8 miles off shore and only on a very clear day can you see it from shore. Also these oil rigs act as a natural reef and are great for fishing. I believe me and Saden had that debate back when Bush opened up Va for drilling in 2008. Not sure but it also sounds like Obama is opening up more areas for drilling which from what I've read is a good idea.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;680233]Virginia's governor was already going to do this, Obama is simply trying to take glory for something the Republicans were doing.[/quote]

Are you serious? You do know that Virginia Governor can't actually permit sea drilling right? Sure, he can write and grant whatever he wants but that doesn't mean there is any teeth behind it. Read the Constitution.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=12thMan;680251]JR, that sounds like a great novel.[/quote]


Sounds like Atlas Shrugged 2.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=firstdown;680290]I think its great but not sure why this is even news but I guess it confirms that Obama will let the plans move forward. On Sept of 2008 Bush lifted the ban on drilling and Va. has been moving foward with the plans to start drilling. Its good to know that Obam is backing this plan. [url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/12/AR2008111202866.html]Agency Begins Process to Allow Drilling off Va. Coast - washingtonpost.com[/url]

"The administration's decision to move forward comes four months after President Bush lifted an executive ban on offshore drilling. In September, the Democratic-controlled House and Senate decided not to renew a separate, congressional moratorium on offshore drilling that had been in place for more than two decades.

Randall Luthi, director of the Minerals Management Service, said there hasn't been oil or gas exploration off Virginia's coast since 1983. By moving forward now, the agency is fulfilling a request by Gov. Timothy M. Kaine (D) to open up waters 50 miles offshore for exploration, Luthi said.

In 2006, Kaine signed a bill supporting federal efforts to determine how much natural gas exists 50 or more miles off the Atlantic coast."

As for these being an eye sore if they are over 50 miles out you will never see them from shore. I fish a light house 8 miles off shore and only on a very clear day can you see it from shore. Also these oil rigs act as a natural reef and are great for fishing. I believe me and Saden had that debate back when Bush opened up Va for drilling in 2008. Not sure but it also sounds like Obama is opening up more areas for drilling which from what I've read is a good idea.[/quote]

The difference between what Bush did and what Obama is doing is that Bush's move was just a lift on an executive ban, it wasn't law; it had no legislative or federal authority. In other words, it was largely symbolic.

Today's move by Obama will, at some point, go to Congress for a vote and has specific perimeters on what regions are authorized for drilling.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

Not sure I like the move but at least it's better than drilling ANWR.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=saden1;680306]Are you serious? You do know that Virginia Governor can't actually permit sea drilling right? Sure, he can write and grant whatever he wants but that doesn't mean there is any teeth behind it. Read the Constitution.[/quote]

The reason the gov. was moving foward on this is because Bush lifted the ban back in 2008. Gov. Timothy Kain a Dem. backed the idea and started moving foward to start drilling a couple years back.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=12thMan;680310]The difference between what Bush did and what Obama is doing is that Bush's move was just a lift on an executive ban, it wasn't law; it had no legislative or federal authority. In other words, it was largely symbolic.

Today's move by Obama will, at some point, go to Congress for a vote and has specific perimeters on what regions are authorized for drilling.[/quote]
Well then what did this sentence mean.
"In September, the Democratic-controlled House and Senate decided not to renew a separate, congressional moratorium on offshore drilling that had been in place for more than two decades. "

Sounds like congress let the ban run out so it was allready open for drilling.

Saden this is what was in the article about Bush lifting the ban in 08. So it looks like congress let it run out all ready.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=12thMan;680239]More radical liberalism from Obama. Seriously, I think there's some common sense politics and economics at play here.

[B]I think the president is willing to bend on a campaign promise [/B]to make America less oil dependent and hopefully garner some bi-partisan support on his energy policy. The left will see this as him caving in (folks are fuming this morning), and the right will hopefully see this as an olive branch. We'll need more oil in ten years whether we drill or not, so why not go for it.

Drill, baby, drill!![/quote]

Noooo, really? :)

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=saden1;680306]Are you serious? You do know that Virginia Governor can't actually permit sea drilling right? Sure, he can write and grant whatever he wants but that doesn't mean there is any teeth behind it. Read the Constitution.[/quote]

No need to get all in a tizzy Mr. Saden. I was responding with my tongue in cheek guess on FD's response, but again, the Constitution, last I checked doesn't specifically mention off-shore drilling, and so an elastic clause/10th amendment debate is just too much for me this morning.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=firstdown;680314]The reason the gov. was moving foward on this is because Bush lifted the ban back in 2008. Gov. Timothy Kain a Dem. backed the idea and started moving foward to start drilling a couple years back.[/quote]

Like 12thMan Bush's lifting of the executive order ban was merely symbolic. There are federal laws on the books that need to be relaxed or reversed for anyone's to do any sort of ocean drilling. Congress has the power to do something. Not the president, not the governors, not anyone but congress.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;680318]No need to get all in a tizzy Mr. Saden. I was responding with my tongue in cheek guess on FD's response, but again, the Constitution, last I checked doesn't specifically mention off-shore drilling, and so an elastic clause/10th amendment debate is just too much for me this morning.[/quote]


It mentions who has admiralty and maritime jurisdiction and that's all the Constitution needs to do. It doesn't have to talk about fishing or drilling or anything else. Save your energy, no need to debate [URL="http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/constitution/article03/"]Section 2 of Article III[/URL].

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

I think it's a good move.

I could really care less who initiated it or all the particulars. I mean really, the fact that it's happening is all that really matters.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=saden1;680319]Like 12thMan Bush's lifting of the executive order ban was merely symbolic. There are federal laws on the books that need to be relaxed or reversed for anyone's to do any sort of ocean drilling. Congress has the power to do something. Not the president, not the governors, not anyone but congress.[/quote]

Well then what did this sentence mean.
"In September, the Democratic-controlled House and Senate decided not to renew a separate, congressional moratorium on offshore drilling that had been in place for more than two decades. "

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=firstdown;680316]Well then what did this sentence mean.
"In September, the Democratic-controlled House and Senate decided not to renew a separate, congressional moratorium on offshore drilling that had been in place for more than two decades. "

Sounds like congress let the ban run out so it was allready open for drilling.[/quote]

That statement is correct. Once the current moratorium expires, it won't be renewed but replaced with actual policy reversing the ban. I guess to put it more concretely, it's currently [I]not[/I] U.S. policy to drill offshore. Lots of talk, lots of orders, bans and reversals, but no legislation has actually been enacted to permit drilling specifying what regions will be tapped.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=Mattyk;680324]I think it's a good move.

I could really care less who initiated it or all the particulars. I mean really, the fact that it's happening is all that really matters.[/quote]

Well said. Not everything needs to be colored by the incessant and often ridiculous battle of partisan politics.

It's a common sense move, kudos to Obama for that.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=12thMan;680326]That statement is correct. Once the current moratorium expires, it won't be renewed but replaced with actual policy reversing the ban. I guess to put it more concretely, it's currently [I]not[/I] U.S. policy to drill offshore. Lots of talk, lots of orders, bans and reversals, but no legislation has actually been enacted to permit drilling specifying what regions will be tapped.[/quote]

Why do you have to vote to reverse a ban if the ban is no longer law. So now they are going to vote to reverse a ban that is not a ban. My only point was that this ban is no longer a inforce so what was Obama actually giving the OK for. Read this its no longer ban and there is nothing to vote on.

[url=http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/green/Congress_Allows_Offshore_Oil_Drilling_Ban_to_Expire.html]Congress Allows Offshore Oil Drilling Ban to Expire | NBC San Diego[/url]

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=firstdown;680330]Why do you have to vote to reverse a ban if the ban is no longer law. So now they are going to vote to reverse a ban that is not a ban. My only point was that this ban is no longer a inforce so what was Obama actually giving the OK for. Read this its no longer ban and there is nothing to vote on.

[url=http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/green/Congress_Allows_Offshore_Oil_Drilling_Ban_to_Expire.html]Congress Allows Offshore Oil Drilling Ban to Expire | NBC San Diego[/url][/quote]


Sorry I'm not being clear. They're not voting to reverse anything, per se. Let me spin it another way (you're wearing me out, by the way). The ban (President's sig) simply states what you can't do (no drilling allowed), but it takes an act of Congress (law) to say what we can do (drilling allowed).

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

About time . . . . maybe we can get a new nuclear plant too. The governor needs to break up VEPCO. It's the worst damned monopoly ever.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=saden1;680322]It mentions who has admiralty and maritime jurisdiction and that's all the Constitution needs to do. It doesn't have to talk about fishing or drilling or anything else. Save your energy, no need to debate [URL="http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/constitution/article03/"]Section 2 of Article III[/URL].[/quote]

Um, you quoted the Judicial Branches authority over admiralty, as well as all other law.
[quote][B]The judicial Power[/B] shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority;--to all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public ministers and Consuls;--to all Cases of admiralty and maritime Jurisdiction[/quote]

Last I checked Judicial!=Legislative!=Executive.
If you read through [URL="http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/constitution/article01/"]Article I[/URL]
[quote] Section 8.

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow Money on the credit of the United States;

To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States;

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

To establish Post Offices and post Roads;

To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;

To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations;

To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

To provide and maintain a Navy;

To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of Particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards and other needful Buildings;--And

To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof. [I]elastic clause[/I][/quote]
You will find no such explicit mention. Having said that, still no need to get in a tizzy, since Lord Obama is willing to bend some for this lowly need.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=12thMan;680333]Sorry I'm not being clear. They're not voting to reverse anything, per se. Let me spin it another way (you're wearing me out, by the way). The ban (President's sig) simply states what you can't do (no drilling allowed), but it takes an act of Congress (law) to say what we can do (drilling allowed).[/quote]

No they don't. So what your saying is that they now have to pass laws to tell us what we can do? Your wearing me out. If their is no ban to stop them from selling the rights to allow drilling then there is no reason to pass a law saying they can. It a given that they can because there is no ban on doing so.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=firstdown;680369]No they don't. So what your saying is that they now have to pass laws to tell us what we can do? Your wearing me out. If their is no ban to stop them from selling the rights to allow drilling then there is no reason to pass a law saying they can. It a given that they can because there is no ban on doing so.[/quote]

FD, most people really just want to ignore this part:
[quote]The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people. [/quote]

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;680343]About time . . . . maybe we can get a new nuclear plant too. The governor needs to break up VEPCO. It's the worst damned monopoly ever.[/quote]

Waht's that VEPCO?

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;680373]Waht's that VEPCO?[/quote]

Dominion VA Power. They're all over the South now with different names. It's the same company and it's a monopoly in VA. Strange that no Rep or Dem governor has ever broken it up? I mean competion is a good thing in a capitialist society . . . up . . I forgot.

Re: new drilling in the U.S
 

We have Duke Energy and Piedmont Natural Gas (highway robbery).