Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

In the past, we've always started end of the year threads based around the idea that there are some players on the current roster who do not deserve to be back for performance reasons. This thread aims to look at the other side of that: players who have contracts beyond 2010 who should be kept on those contracts.

There will be a different time/thread to look at players on expiring contracts with four or more years of service,the following players:

[QUOTE]Rex Grossman
Santana Moss
Jammal Brown
Stephon Heyer
Vonnie Holliday
Phillip Daniels
Kedric Golston
Chris Wilson
Rocky McIntosh
HB Blades
Carlos Rogers
Phillip Buchanon
Reed Doughty[/QUOTE]Those 13 players have expiring contracts. I want to deal specifically with only the players who are under team control next year. Let's discuss those (not on the above list) who [U]should be brought back under their current deals[/U]. We'll deal with our unrestricted free agents at a later date.

Pick around 10 to 12 names that you'd like to see back in DC under their current contract.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

Hall
Orakpo
Landry
Williams
Armstrong
Torain
Banks
Fletcher (HOF In my book)
F.Davis (like to trade him though)
Cooley

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I would bring back the following 20 players on their current deals:

Kevin Barnes
LaRon Landry
London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
Lorenzo Alexander
Anthony Bryant
Jeremy Jarmon
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Adam Carriker
Graham Gano
Trent Williams
Kory Lichtensteiger
Will Montgomery
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Logan Paulsen
Anthony Armstrong
Brandon Banks
Clinton Portis
Keiland Williams

I don't want Ryan Torain guaranteed a roster spot next year, as I'd rather pay the extra $7 million to have a 30 year old Portis splitting time with a second year Keiland Williams. Torain doesn't seem to have a meaningful role on special teams, which would give him value as a third RB. But if you give him that third roster spot and let him play in front of Williams, it's poor roster management. The Shanahan's have had good success with rookies at the RB position, and I'd free up some roster spots to use on rookie runners. I know they really like Torain though.

There are guys like Rob Jackson, Perry Riley, Macho Harris, Erik Cook, and Terrence Austin who I want to see more of. I am not guaranteeing their roster spots here, but they'll get every chance to compete for a job.

Kemoeatu was not an easy inclusion on this list because he was a poor nose tackle except for a 3 game stretch in the middle of the season. But I still like his prospective value and he's only making a couple of million next year. Make no mistake, in a 3-4, Anthony Bryant is the starter at nose tackle, with Jarmon/Holliday, and Carriker on the ends. But we play a lot of 40 fronts, and Kemo gets great pressure for a guy as large as he is. That's valuable. Especially on a finesse team like the Redskins.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;772973]Hall
Orakpo
Landry
Williams
Armstrong
Torain
Banks
[B]Fletcher (HOF In my book)[/B]
F.Davis (like to trade him though)
Cooley[/quote]I agree with you that in a world of perfect knowledge, Fletcher is a hall of fame caliber linebacker. But the flawed methodology used by a lot of hall of fame voters relies heavily on pro bowls and all-pro votes. And, perhaps wrongly, Fletcher didn't collect a lot of those otherwise meaningless awards. So he won't get down to a hall of fame finalists list.

But this guy has had a fantastic career, and his consecutive starts streak is more impressive than that of any quarterback. And as far as pure effectiveness goes, he's more effective now than Brett Favre was at a similar point in his career.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I agree with your 20 except CP, I'm ready for him to go

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I'm kind of a pessimist when it comes to the current roster's desire to win games. I would be satisfied if they brought back:
Orakpo
Trent Williams
Fletcher
Banks
Armstrong
Cooley
Davis

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;772977]I agree with your 20 except CP, I'm ready for him to go[/quote]It's really a CP or Torain for the RB spot for the guy who doesn't play special teams. Can't afford to roster both.

I presume most will choose Torain, based on youth, and his yard production from this season. Portis is WAY more expensive, up around $8 million for next year. But Torain also might not be a pro-back in my opinion. He has poor vision, and while I think he can get a lot better as a blocker, he's just not very good right now. He's the kind of player you want to get in the open field with the football because he doesn't waste movement, but he's more of a package player than an every down back. There's a designation for package players who don't contribute special teams, it's called "waived."

Portis is a fantastic blocker and a much better runner than Torain is. He's not nearly as good in the open field. And for $8 million, that a tough sell to keep a guy. But he can still, at age 30, be the lead back in our offensive attack. So I'd like to see him back for that reason. We're an above average offense with Clinton Portis. We're a below average offense with Ryan Torain. That, to me, is worth a $8 million price tag.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I also think a potentially shortened 2011 season benefits Portis, who will be healthy around playoff time, if we make it.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I'll also stay this: for as fantastic as Brian Orakpo is at rushing the passer, he's not a complete player with a really high football IQ. His contributions to the team can be mostly replaced. We just have one of the best young pass rushers in the game, and need to complement him with other top pass rushers in order to get the most out of him. If teams can just double team him because we have no other pass rushing threats, he's a liability out there at linebacker.

Most of Lorenzo Alexander's skill set translated very well to outside linebacker. His pass rushing skills did not. He's an interior pass rusher playing on the outside.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

Well, the Oline takes alot of the blame in pass protection, but after watching alot of games this year it's our RB's that have given up alot of sacks compared to the Oline missing assignments, and running out their routes to early.

I would like to see Portis back next year, and I really hope he can stay healthy for a few more years while Keiland Williams gets more adapt. I like Williams better as a runner becaue he has a quicker step then Torain does. Torain doesn't seem to be able to change direction very well, and once he changes direction it slows him down ALOT. He's more like a Brandon Jacobs type runner just smaller.

I would love to see Armstrong back next year. I still think we could use a bigger playmaker on the sides, but Armstrong has proven to be a great Possession WR this year for us, and besides the first game of the season, he has caught almost EVERYTHING thrown his way.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

Here's my line-up:

QB-upgrade needed John Beck
RB-Torrain, Keiland Williams, James Davis
FB-Sellers, Young
WR-Moss, Armstrong, Austin
TE-Cooley, Fred Davis (probably need to trade 1 of the 2) Paulsen
LT-Trent Williams--Stephon Heyer
LG/C-Lichtensteiger/Montgomery
RG-? upgrade needed
RT- upgrade needed

Defense-
ILBs-Fletcher, Riley, Blades, Henson
ROLB-Orakpo, Andre Carter, Rob Jackson, Chris Wilson (the fact that they don't ever play him and gave Rob Jackson more reps then Wilson makes me wonder)
LOLB-?? Alexander-upgrade needed--move a ROLB over LOLB??
NT-Bryant--depth or upgrade needed
RDE-upgrade needed
LDE-Carriker
CBs-Hall, Rogers, Buchanon, Barnes,Westbrook
FS-Landry, Barnes, Moore, Macho Harris
SS-Doughty, Horton, Moore, Barnes

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

Guys under contract to be gone next year are:

Carter
Cooley (tradeable?)
McNabb
Kemoeatu
Rabach
Haynesworth
Portis

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[QUOTE=GTripp0012;772974]I would bring back the following 20 players on their current deals:

Kevin Barnes
LaRon Landry
London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
Lorenzo Alexander
Anthony Bryant
Jeremy Jarmon
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Adam Carriker
Graham Gano
Trent Williams
Kory Lichtensteiger
Will Montgomery
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Logan Paulsen
Anthony Armstrong
Brandon Banks
Clinton Portis
Keiland Williams

Couple changes:
Guarentee stays:
Hall
Riley
Cook
Moore(just cause we zero at saftey outside of Landry, he would be depth)

Go:
Portis
Kemo
Gano

Trade:
McNabb
Albert
Cooley (if he couldnt be moved, bring him back, but its time to move on with the more athletic, faster Davis)

2 New RBs are needed with K Williams being the 3rd down back. The knock on Torrain is he is injury prone and we need guys to stay on the field. Portis is done, too many injuries. We need speed and a weapon in the backfield, we have none with our 3 guys at this point. Kemo doesnt do enough, Id like to see his roster spot with a younger guy, Bryant would work...with an overall starting upgrade at NT. Bring in someone to compete with Gano, with Gano losing out would be good. Cooley is a good player, if we could get a 3rd for him id let him go and let the only viable draft of that year move up.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=GTripp0012;772984]I'll also stay this: for as fantastic as Brian Orakpo is at rushing the passer, he's not a complete player with a really high football IQ. His contributions to the team can be mostly replaced. We just have one of the best young pass rushers in the game, and need to complement him with other top pass rushers in order to get the most out of him. [B]If teams can just double team him because we have no other pass rushing threats, he's a liability out there at linebacker.[/B]

Most of Lorenzo Alexander's skill set translated very well to outside linebacker. His pass rushing skills did not. He's an interior pass rusher playing on the outside.[/quote]

The other strategy teams use against Brian Orakpo is to exercise the "The Brian Orakpo Rule" -- a little known passage in the NFL Rulebook which allows opponents of the Washington Redskins to hold Orakpo constantly and egregiously throughout the game, without penalty from the officials except in very rare cases.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

IFor the life of me I just cant understand why anyone woiuld think CP should be back. He's too old, and too injury prone.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

^I can't either. If he wasn't on the team next year I wouldn't even notice.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I would have liked to see him finish as the Redskins all time leading rusher, and if he was willing to take a serious pay cut I would want him back as a third down back. I know you say you cant have two RB who dont play teams but it can be done, Westbrook doesn't play team, Forsett doesn't, Ricky Williams doesnt...I am sure there are more examples. Looking at that list though not sure they are good examples as all those teams stink.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

In greatly reduced role and salary, I would welcome CP back. But if we can find a quality back to add to the Williams/Torain mix and CP is the odd man out, so be it.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=irish;773009]IFor the life of me I just cant understand why anyone woiuld think CP should be back. He's too old, and too injury prone.[/quote]

Me too. My problem is he not on the field with all the injuries. Picking up the blitz on 3rd is not the primary function of a RB.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=Chico23231;773005][QUOTE=GTripp0012;772974]I would bring back the following 20 players on their current deals:

Kevin Barnes
LaRon Landry
London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
Lorenzo Alexander
Anthony Bryant
Jeremy Jarmon
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Adam Carriker
Graham Gano
Trent Williams
Kory Lichtensteiger
Will Montgomery
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Logan Paulsen
Anthony Armstrong
Brandon Banks
Clinton Portis
Keiland Williams

Couple changes:
Guarentee stays:
Hall
Riley
Cook
Moore(just cause we zero at saftey outside of Landry, he would be depth)

Go:
Portis
Kemo
Gano

Trade:
McNabb
Albert
Cooley (if he couldnt be moved, bring him back, but its time to move on with the more athletic, faster Davis)

2 New RBs are needed with K Williams being the 3rd down back. The knock on Torrain is he is injury prone and we need guys to stay on the field. Portis is done, too many injuries. We need speed and a weapon in the backfield, we have none with our 3 guys at this point. Kemo doesnt do enough,[B] Id like to see his roster spot with a younger guy, Bryant would work[/B]...with an overall starting upgrade at NT. Bring in someone to compete with Gano, with Gano losing out would be good. Cooley is a good player, if we could get a 3rd for him id let him go and let the only viable draft of that year move up.[/quote]

everyone realizes that bryant is 29 right? its not like hes some young guy with a high ceiling or something. hes been better than kemo though, but hes not a the long term answer

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

At 29 Bryant could be a good player for the next 2-3 seasons, I'll take that. It's not like he has a lot of wear and tear on him.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=Big C;773034][quote=Chico23231;773005]

everyone realizes that bryant is 29 right? its not like hes some young guy with a high ceiling or something. hes been better than kemo though, but hes not a the long term answer[/quote]

right, i like him as depth over Kemo. Ive stated all year NT should be top priority in the offseason, looks like finding a starting QB will now over take that. Our O-line and D-line both need 2 new starters for each coming into next year.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=Mattyk;773031]In greatly reduced role and salary, I would welcome CP back. But if we can find a quality back to add to the Williams/Torain mix and CP is the odd man out, so be it.[/quote]

In today's NFL there just isnt room on the roster for guys playing a greatly diminished role. This team has enough problems with depth without using a roster spot on an old injury prone RB that only comes in to block on passes. In addition to CP I'd like to see Sellers gone. Much like CP's reduced role Sellers just doesnt do enough to justify his spot on the roster. Except for Torrain I really think the Skins need to clean house at RB.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

You don't like Keiland either? I think he's pretty solid.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I don't think Williams has any appreciable offensive value.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

The need for talent is almost at every postilion, starters and back ups.
But there are several leftover players that that serve as ok back ups. but if they have to start for a long stretch they become a negative. It is time to replace that type of player.
It easier to identify them, then to identify who we keep of the young players.
Until we get talented quality replacements that is an improvement over our current player, we can not cut them just yet.

The most obvious players that start or play a significant amount that we most need to upgrade:

1) Philip Daniels (ancient)
2) Casey Rabach (no longer a mauler)
3) Phillip Buchanan (play is ok but getting old)
4) Vonnie Holiday (old, play is ok but need to get younger)
5) Kedrick Golsten (he will never be more than a good back up)
6) Derek Dockery (too slow for system and makes too many mental mistakes)
7) NT Kemo (plays ok at times, but need upgrade)
8) A Hicks (did not pan out)

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

need more RBs and WRs.Portis is worn out.should not trade Cooley.what happened to Marco Mitchell?he was the biggest of the WRs.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=skinsfan57;773089]need more RBs and WRs.Portis is worn out.should not trade Cooley.what happened to Marco Mitchell?he was the biggest of the WRs.[/quote]

He got cut and bounced around to Detroit and a couple of other teams. I don't think he had the physical tools to cut it or so many teams wouldn't have cut him after giving him a look.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=skinsfan57;773089]need more RBs and WRs.Portis is worn out.should not trade Cooley.what happened to Marco Mitchell?he was the biggest of the WRs.[/quote]

He will be resigned to the Redskins and split Super Bowl MVP honors next year with Marcus Mason.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

This is somewhat turning into a Clinton Portis thread but I'll agree that I won't mind if he's back next season. I know he's tight with Danny, so if he takes less money, and maybe a diminished role, I could see it and agree with it...but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if there's all new RB's here next year....and that's probably for the best. Torain and Williams have been good at times, but neither are anything special.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

Barry Sanders might be one of the few who could look special running the ball for our team this year. I think Torain has done a good job and Keiland hasn't looked bad either. They definitely deserve the chance to compete for the top 2 spots.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=irish;773055]In today's NFL there just isnt room on the roster for guys playing a greatly diminished role. This team has enough problems with depth without using a roster spot on an old injury prone RB that only comes in to block on passes. In addition to CP I'd like to see Sellers gone. Much like CP's reduced role Sellers just doesnt do enough to justify his spot on the roster. Except for Torrain I really think the Skins need to clean house at RB.[/quote]Can't call Portis injury prone and then defend Torain. Portis doesn't get hurt in warm-ups.

Portis can still run the ball. He can't break it and beat the safeties anymore (and really hasn't been able to for about four years). Neither can Torain. Portis is still a much better, more natural runner than Torain. And a better blocker. And pass receiver. Probably no more injury prone either.

Is he $8 million better? Probably not. But if you don't feel that Portis is worth even half his salary, you can release him and Torain and start over at the position. I think Portis is worth close to his salary. Not in excess of it, but close to it.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=bigmarley4;773096]He will be resigned to the Redskins and split Super Bowl MVP honors next year with Marcus Mason.[/quote]

Yeah and you forgot to mention how we all shit rainbow skittles after a Redskins win. That's in the same realm of likelihood.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=Beemnseven;773007]The other strategy teams use against Brian Orakpo is to exercise the "The Brian Orakpo Rule" -- a little known passage in the NFL Rulebook which allows opponents of the Washington Redskins to hold Orakpo constantly and egregiously throughout the game, without penalty from the officials except in very rare cases.[/quote]He still leads the NFL in times held with 10, so they're not missing any more holds on him than on other elite pass rushers. There have been some really egregious misses that have led to big plays for the opponent, but he draws the holds with the best of them.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=Beemnseven;773007]The other strategy teams use against Brian Orakpo is to exercise the "The Brian Orakpo Rule" -- a little known passage in the NFL Rulebook which allows opponents of the Washington Redskins to hold Orakpo constantly and egregiously throughout the game, without penalty from the officials except in very rare cases.[/quote]

How does Orakpo not get any calls when Ware, Allen and Harrison get every holding call??? It's bull shit, I swear sometimes I think the refs just hate us.. I know that sounds dumb and like I'm a crybaby but cmon

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

I know we want to totally rebuild, but I still think keeping some veterans around is better then having none..

Andre Carter
Santana Moss
Clinton Portis
Mike Sellers

I think those are some key players we need to keep around for a few more years, or untill they retire to help this team produce better players.

I think Terrence Austin could be the next S. Moss if he gets the right teaching etc. Or even Brandon Banks.

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;773151]How does Orakpo not get any calls when Ware, Allen and Harrison get every holding call??? It's bull shit, I swear sometimes I think the refs just hate us.. I know that sounds dumb and like I'm a crybaby but cmon[/quote]

It's because of ESPN....

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=GTripp0012;773144]Can't call Portis injury prone and then defend Torain. Portis doesn't get hurt in warm-ups.

Portis can still run the ball. He can't break it and beat the safeties anymore (and really hasn't been able to for about four years). Neither can Torain. Portis is still a much better, more natural runner than Torain. And a better blocker. And pass receiver. Probably no more injury prone either.

Is he $8 million better? Probably not. But if you don't feel that Portis is worth even half his salary, you can release him and Torain and start over at the position. I think Portis is worth close to his salary. Not in excess of it, but close to it.[/quote]

We're looking at opposite ends of the career spectrum.. Torain's is starting.. he doesn't have a lot of wear and tear.. but his career could end before it starts.. either way he's been able to play after his injuries

Portis' career has not been delayed but is likely to be shortened due to it

Portis will go the way of LJ and WP more so than anything else.. better blocker sure.. but Torain had more catches this year than Portis in his last two

natural or not, if you can't break it.. what's the big diff? Portis dives and lacks the burst that he once had

Portis hasn't avg'd above 4.3 since being here, Torain hit 4.7 this year.. so if neither can go next level take what you can get in avg.. I can see not saying Torain is the truth, but other than pass pro I don't see a reason to give Portis any sort of nod other than towards the unemployment line

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

We need to cut everybody besides:

London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
DeAngelo Hall
LaRon Landry
Reed Doughty
Trent Williams
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Anthony Armstrong
Santana Moss
Brandon Banks
Keiland Williams
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Lichtensteiger

Our Team officially is a joke these days.
This circus we call a franchise is making me sick.
Haynesworth/McNabb Trade+Benching?
We should pick up another talented player and just bench them too..
nobodys gonna wanna play here

Re: Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011
 

[quote=GTripp0012;773148][B]He still leads the NFL in times held with 10[/B], so they're not missing any more holds on him than on other elite pass rushers. There have been some really egregious misses that have led to big plays for the opponent, but he draws the holds with the best of them.[/quote]

Is that a real stat if so where can I find it?