Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[url=http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7489238/joe-paterno-ex-penn-state-nittany-lions-coach-dies-85-2-month-cancer-fight]Joe Paterno, ex-Penn State Nittany Lions coach, dies at 85 after 2-month cancer fight - ESPN[/url]

Wow, interesting timing. I always thought he wouldn't live long after leaving PSU, much like how an old man typically passes away quickly after his long-time wife dies, but obviously I couldn't imagine he would go out the way he did. His legacy has certainly changed over the last few months, but I guess this is still sort of sad.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

RIP Joe......
Not the ending I would have imagined.
My prayers will go out for he and his family....

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

R.I.P. Joe Paterno. Definitely not your typical storybook ending. Shame that his fall from grace happened like this, and this is how it ends. My thoughts go out to his family.

One of the saddest endings in history. RIP Joe

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

Died a disgrace to his family, Penn State, men in general and college football.

[QUOTE=firstdown;877623]Died a disgrace to his family, Penn State, men in general and college football.[/QUOTE]

That is a bit much.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

I"m not glad the guys dead, nor am I upset about it. I will not say "rest in peace" though because I believe Joe doesn't deserve any peace. If there is a hell, I hope he rots in it for eternity.

I think what's the biggest travesty (besides Sandusky's crime) is how the public just overlooks it and puts guys like this on pedestals all because he's some iconic football figure. I felt the same way about Ted Kennedy too, they put this man on a pedestal when he was in fact responsible for another person's death and had it covered up. NO amount of good deeds can wash away those crimes. I'm sorry. You may think I'm a dick, but I have a huge intolerance to people like this and to bullies.

Good riddance.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

RIP Joe Pa. Bad situation and I do think the stress of the scandal accelerated things. Nothing but prayers for the family. Legend

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=NC_Skins;877625]I"m not glad the guys dead, nor am I upset about it. I will not say "rest in peace" though because I believe Joe doesn't deserve any peace. If there is a hell, I hope he rots in it for eternity.

I think what's the biggest travesty (besides Sandusky's crime) is how the public just overlooks it and puts guys like this on pedestals all because he's some iconic football figure. I felt the same way about Ted Kennedy too, they put this man on a pedestal when he was in fact responsible for another person's death and had it covered up. NO amount of good deeds can wash away those crimes. I'm sorry. You may think I'm a dick, but I have a huge intolerance to people like this and to bullies.

Good riddance.[/quote]

hmmmm here we go. Where I dont think FD comment was over the line, I do think yours certainly are. I do understand your anger, but "rotting in eternity" is a bit much. I think you need to give it a rest on this day of pain for his family.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=Chico23231;877630]hmmmm here we go. Where I dont think FD comment was over the line, I do think yours certainly are. I do understand your anger, but "rotting in eternity" is a bit much. I think you need to give it a rest on this day of pain for his family.[/quote]

Yeah, tell that to the families of all those kids that got molested while he sat back and watch. If you want me to feel sympathy for this guy than you are mistaken and it shows a ton of your character and morality. In fact, if it were YOUR kids that got molested, you probably wouldn't be saying jack right about now. I've said I feel for his family and the loss they have suffered. They had nothing to do with it and for that, I'm sorry they lost a loved one. Joe on the other hand, can rot in hell for what he did (or didnt in this case) do.

..but guys, we should be nice because he was a legendary football coach. If this were some joe schmoe..meh....we'd bash him too.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

I can understand why someone would say "out of respect for the family" but I don't think they are on this site in the other sports section. I personally think he is just as guilty as the molestor for allowing it to keep happening. Carma is a bitch.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=NC_Skins;877631]Yeah, tell that to the families of all those kids that got molested while he sat back and watch. If you want me to feel sympathy for this guy than you are mistaken and it shows a ton of your character and morality. In fact, if it were YOUR kids that got molested, you probably wouldn't be saying jack right about now. I've said I feel for his family and the loss they have suffered. They had nothing to do with it and for that, I'm sorry they lost a loved one. Joe on the other hand, can rot in hell for what he did (or didnt in this case) do.

[B]..but guys, we should be nice because he was a legendary football coach. If this were some joe schmoe..meh....we'd bash him too[/B].[/quote]

Haven't you noticed that no one is bashing the janitor who failed to report Sandusky? That guy certainly was a Joe Schmoe. The whole point of this Scandal vis-a-vis Paterno was that in failing to take decisive action Paterno fell short of the moral standard and example he had set for himself and the university, even if he had obeyed the law. He was and should have been held to a higher standard. But where did that standard come from? Well, it come from the way he had lived his life, and to just pretend that he didn't have a profoundly positive impact on thousands of football players and hundreds of thousands of students is to completely miss why Paterno's involvement in this was a news story in the first place. So while the last two months aren't forgotten and forgiven just because he died, it's perverse to just blindly deny all the positive things he accomplished in his life. Anyway, human beings - including Paterno - are genuinely complex, and rarely the type of unambiguously good/evil characters we see in movies like Star Wars. Unless these people are named NC_Skins or Firstdown, in which case they are unambiguously irritating beings who have been sent to this world solely to annoy me with their insensitive and ill-considered posts.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=firstdown;877634]I can understand why someone would say "out of respect for the family" but I don't think they are on this site in the other sports section. I personally think he is just as guilty as the molestor for allowing it to keep happening. Carma is a bitch.[/quote]

Karma is spelled with a K you stupid idiot.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=firstdown;877634]I can understand why someone would say "out of respect for the family" but I don't think they are on this site in the other sports section. I personally think he is just as guilty as the molestor for allowing it to keep happening. [B]Carma[/B] is a bitch.[/quote]

Are you referring to the Chicago Area Radio Monitoring Association, Carbon Monitoring for Action, or the Combined Array for Research in Millimeter-wave Astronomy? Those chicago guys are dickheads.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=djnemo65;877636]Haven't you noticed that no one is bashing the janitor who failed to report Sandusky? That guy certainly was a Joe Schmoe. The whole point of this Scandal vis-a-vis Paterno was that in failing to take decisive action Paterno fell short of the moral standard and example he had set for himself and the university, even if he had obeyed the law. He was and should have been held to a higher standard. But where did that standard come from? Well, it come from the way he had lived his life, and to just pretend that he didn't have a profoundly positive impact on thousands of football players and hundreds of thousands of students is to completely miss why Paterno's involvement in this was a news story in the first place. So while the last two months aren't forgotten and forgiven just because he died, it's perverse to just blindly deny all the positive things he accomplished in his life. Anyway, human beings - including Paterno - are genuinely complex, and rarely the type of unambiguously good/evil characters we see in movies like Star Wars. Unless these people are named NC_Skins or Firstdown, in which case they are unambiguously irritating beings who have been sent to this world solely to annoy me with their insensitive and ill-considered posts.[/quote]Very well said. The main reason I said "it's sort of sad" in the initial post is for the exact reasons you pointed out. While he went out with a severely tarnished legend due to his inaction regarding the piece of garbage, Sandusky, it's hard to discount the fact that he gained that legendary status based on more than just wins.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=djnemo65;877636]Haven't you noticed that no one is bashing the janitor who failed to report Sandusky? That guy certainly was a Joe Schmoe. The whole point of this Scandal vis-a-vis Paterno was that in failing to take decisive action Paterno fell short of the moral standard and example he had set for himself and the university, even if he had obeyed the law. He was and should have been held to a higher standard. But where did that standard come from? Well, it come from the way he had lived his life, and to just pretend that he didn't have a profoundly positive impact on thousands of football players and hundreds of thousands of students is to completely miss why Paterno's involvement in this was a news story in the first place. So while the last two months aren't forgotten and forgiven just because he died, it's perverse to just blindly deny all the positive things he accomplished in his life. Anyway, human beings - including Paterno - are genuinely complex, and rarely the type of unambiguously good/evil characters we see in movies like Star Wars. Unless these people are named NC_Skins or Firstdown, in which case they are unambiguously irritating beings who have been sent to this world solely to annoy me with their insensitive and ill-considered posts.[/quote]

Poor baby, did I hurt your feelings? If you read other articles, you find that this isn't the first time that JoePa covered up something bad. I think I recall reading a article where he supposedly made this claim of rape by one of his football players go away without a proper investigation. You really think this child molestation is the first case of him covering up something bad?...lol

Again, the mere fact you put this asshole on a pedestal all because of his legend a football coach speaks about your morality and character. As for the others, when they die, I too will wish that they burn in hell just like I did with JoePa. This isn't only directed at JoePa, it's directed at ALL of them involved.

Excuse me if you have a problem with me hating child molestation, obviously you are ok with it as long as the person does other good deeds.

[quote=djnemo65;877636]haven't you noticed that no one is bashing the janitor who failed to report sandusky? That guy certainly was a joe schmoe. The whole point of this scandal vis-a-vis paterno was that in failing to take decisive action paterno fell short of the moral standard and example he had set for himself and the university, even if he had obeyed the law. He was and should have been held to a higher standard. But where did that standard come from? Well, it come from the way he had lived his life, and to just pretend that he didn't have a profoundly positive impact on thousands of football players and hundreds of thousands of students is to completely miss why paterno's involvement in this was a news story in the first place. So while the last two months aren't forgotten and forgiven just because he died, it's perverse to just blindly deny all the positive things he accomplished in his life. Anyway, human beings - including paterno - are genuinely complex, and rarely the type of unambiguously good/evil characters we see in movies like star wars. Unless these people are named nc_skins or firstdown, in which case they are unambiguously irritating beings who have been sent to this world solely to annoy me with their insensitive and ill-considered posts.[/quote]

outstanding post!

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=NC_Skins;877643]Poor baby, did I hurt your feelings? If you read other articles, you find that this isn't the first time that JoePa covered up something bad. I think I recall reading a article where he supposedly made this claim of rape by one of his football players go away without a proper investigation. You really think this child molestation is the first case of him covering up something bad?...lol

Again, the mere fact you put this asshole on a pedestal all because of his legend a football coach speaks about your morality and character. As for the others, when they die, I too will wish that they burn in hell just like I did with JoePa. This isn't only directed at JoePa, it's directed at ALL of them involved.

Excuse me if you have a problem with me hating child molestation, obviously you are ok with it as long as the person does other good deeds.[/quote]

You don't know what you're talking about and you're not worth my time. Have a nice life.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=ArtMonkDrillz;877641]Very well said. The main reason I said "it's sort of sad" in the initial post is for the exact reasons you pointed out. While he went out with a severely tarnished legend due to his inaction regarding the piece of garbage, Sandusky, it's hard to discount the fact that he gained that legendary status based on more than just wins.[/quote]


Doesn't that speak volumes of you though? Ok, this guy did a lot of good in his life, but still allowed child molestation to go on? Would you be saying this if it were your kids? I want a answer to that.


Really? Are you people that pathetic in your morality?...lol

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=djnemo65;877645]You don't know what you're talking about and you're not worth my time. Have a nice life.[/quote]

..and you've never been sexually molested as a kid. (retracted...I've cooled down)

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

alright guys let's cool it

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

I dont know what your deal is, NC Skins. You get so worked up about this Penn St thing it's like you take everything surrounding it personally.

Back off on the profanity, and let's try to be a little more mature when expressing a difference of opinion.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=GMScud;877651]I dont know what your deal is, NC Skins. You get so worked up about this Penn St thing it's like you take everything surrounding it personally.

Back off on the profanity, and let's try to be a little more mature when expressing a difference of opinion.[/quote]


Stop and think. Why would a person get so worked up about a case involving child molestation unless...*gasp*...he was molested himself? None of you know my history or my childhood, so when people are highly visible about something, chances are because it hits home with them on a personal level. As a victim, to see people sit back and celebrating some asshole all because he was a good football coach and donated money for a library doesn't cut it with me.

Not a single one of you have answered my question. Would you be wishing him "peace" if it were your kid or even you that he allowed to be molested?


edit: Also, I was attacked first for my opinion, so how about you say that to them.

The funny thing about all of this is Joe has taken more hits then Jerry S. People like lawyers go for deep pockets when they convicted.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=mredskins;877655]The funny thing about all of this is Joe has taken more hits then Jerry S. People like lawyers go for deep pockets when they convicted.[/quote]

I'm hoping they put that man in general population come prison time.

RIP Joe pa.. sad way of ending a great life and career

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;877656]I'm hoping they put that man in general population come prison time.[/QUOTE]

I think you should just let this all go and worry about the things that you can change. This and your past seem to make you just a bitter person. In the end your angry and bitterness are just destorying your quailty of life.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=NC_Skins;877652]Stop and think. Why would a person get so worked up about a case involving child molestation unless...*gasp*...he was molested himself? None of you know my history or my childhood, so when people are highly visible about something, chances are because it hits home with them on a personal level. As a victim, to see people sit back and celebrating some asshole all because he was a good football coach and donated money for a library doesn't cut it with me.

Not a single one of you have answered my question. Would you be wishing him "peace" if it were your kid or even you that he allowed to be molested?


edit: Also, I was attacked first for my opinion, so how about you say that to them.[/quote]

I'm sorry if you were a victim as a child. That's nothing short of terrible.

However, nobody "attacked" you in this thread. They disagreed with you. Djnemo said you were irritating, but I wouldn't say that's being attacked. Telling someone to "f*ck off and die" and calling them a POS however is a different story.

Maybe it's best you just leave this thread alone. We all know how you feel. Kind of a waste of energy on your part to keep this up.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=mredskins;877660]I think you should just let this all go and worry about the things that you can change. This and your past seem to make you just a bitter person. In the end your angry and bitterness are just destorying your quailty of life.[/quote]

My life is just fine and so is the quality of my life. I lack nothing, I can love and trust people with no problems. My anger doesn't stem from what happened, it stems from being picked on as a kid and I decided that would never happen again. If you notice, I get really angry about bullies. I despise them. I don't dwell on it though, I rant, say my piece and move on.

However, when I share my feelings towards a man that allowed this type of stuff to go on, it shouldn't be met with "OMG HES A LEGENDARY COACH SO ITS OK BECAUSE HE DID A LOT OF GOOD STUFF."

It's not ok. It's insulting to the victims (both in this case and others) to glorify him, but we don't care about the victims because they really don't concern us since it's not us or our loved ones.

Try looking at the whole picture instead of trying to adjust my life. I may appear to be a "angry" dude, but the reality is I"m not.

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;877665]My life is just fine and so is the quality of my life. I lack nothing, I can love and trust people with no problems. My anger doesn't stem from what happened, it stems from being picked on as a kid and I decided that would never happen again. If you notice, I get really angry about bullies. I despise them. I don't dwell on it though, I rant, say my piece and move on.

However, when I share my feelings towards a man that allowed this type of stuff to go on, it shouldn't be met with "OMG HES A LEGENDARY COACH SO ITS OK BECAUSE HE DID A LOT OF GOOD STUFF."

It's not ok. It's insulting to the victims (both in this case and others) to glorify him, but we don't care about the victims because they really don't concern us since it's not us or our loved ones.

Try looking at the whole picture instead of trying to adjust my life. I may appear to be a "angry" dude, but the reality is I"m not.[/QUOTE]

I understand what u are saying in fact I agree, he was not such a great man as made out to be, I say he was a great coach obviously but not a human especially after knowing what those kids went through. Also if you were abused as a kid I'm sorry for u man, and I hope who ever did it gets or got what they deserved

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=GMScud;877664]However, nobody "attacked" you in this thread. They disagreed with you. Djnemo said you were irritating, but I wouldn't say that's being attacked. Telling someone to "f*ck off and die" and calling them a POS however is a different story..[/quote]


I perceived it as an attack because I voiced my opinion on the matter and was "insensitive". So I'm being "insensitive" to a man who enabled child molestation, but they aren't being "insensitive" to the victims or people who have suffered? Hypocritical and insulting. I told him to **** off and die because he said I didn't know what I was talking about. Imagine telling those same families and victims that. Yeah guys, you don't know what you are talking about.

As I said, it's insulting to the victims and people who have gone through this type of stuff to glorify a man that sit back and enabled. It really is a slap in the face to them.

I'm done with this.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;877667]I understand what u are saying in fact I agree, he was not such a great man as made out to be, I say he was a great coach obviously but not a human especially after knowing what those kids went through. Also if you were abused as a kid I'm sorry for u man, and I hope who ever did it gets or got what they deserved[/quote]


It's ok man and I thank you. I don't know what to categorize it as. Abuse? I think he took advantage of a kid that had no clue about sexuality or what was right/wrong. Nobody even knows what went on, and I'm sure that guy (neighbor down the street) is going about his life as normal. I'm sure its the same in a ton of cases. They never get reported. In fact, I think only 2 people in my life I've told prior to telling you guys.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=NC_Skins;877669]It's ok man and I thank you. I don't know what to categorize it as. Abuse? I think he took advantage of a kid that had no clue about sexuality or what was right/wrong. Nobody even knows what went on, and I'm sure that guy (neighbor down the street) is going about his life as normal. I'm sure its the same in a ton of cases. They never get reported. In fact, I think only 2 people in my life I've told prior to telling you guys.[/quote]

Fair enough, I'm sorry for coming off that way. I just felt like you had clearly made your views on the subject known in the other thread and that it wasn't necessary for you to hijack the RIP thread to make the exact same points.

Edit: quoted the wrong post

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=djnemo65;877672]Fair enough, I'm sorry for coming off that way. I just felt like you had clearly made your views on the subject known in the other thread and that it wasn't necessary for you to hijack the RIP thread to make the exact same points.

Edit: quoted the wrong post[/quote]

You are correct and i apologize for the outburst. It just irks me that the victims are overlooked in all this while we celebrate this man's life(or what I perceive as celebrating). I should have listened to my inner self saying "DONT DO IT" when seeing this thread. :argue:

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=NC_Skins;877674]You are correct and i apologize for the outburst. It just irks me that[B] the victims are overlooked in all this while we celebrate this man's life(or what I perceive as celebrating).[/B] I should have listened to my inner self saying "DONT DO IT" when seeing this thread. :argue:[/quote]

Where are the victims being overlooked though? The Paterno family has been outspoken about the fact that the victims in this crime need to come first and foremost. Joe Pa also admitted in a recent interview that he mishandled the situation.

IMO it's totally fine to acknowledge all the great things Paterno did in his life. Like or not, the guy had a far reaching positive impact on thousands of student athletes and their families. Yes he made a terrible, terrible mistake in the way he handled the Sandusky situation, which Paterno himself acknowledged. I don't think he should rot in hell, though. Sandusky should.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=GMScud;877678]Where are the victims being overlooked though? The Paterno family has been outspoken about the fact that the victims in this crime need to come first and foremost. Joe Pa also admitted in a recent interview that he mishandled the situation.

IMO it's totally fine to acknowledge all the great things Paterno did in his life. Like or not, the guy had a far reaching positive impact on thousands of student athletes and their families. Yes he made a terrible, terrible mistake in the way he handled the Sandusky situation, which Paterno himself acknowledged. I don't think he should rot in hell, though. Sandusky should.[/quote]

This. RIP Joe Pa, you made some mistakes that shall always haunt your legacy. Hopefully in the end, people remember the thousands of lives you positively affected, the millions you donated, and that this serves a lesson to all those in a posiition of power/authority that you hold the well being of others in the palm of your hands and that responsibility should never be taken lightly.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=djnemo65;877636][B]Haven't you noticed that no one is bashing the janitor who failed to report Sandusky?[/B] [/quote]

[quote]"Jim was a temporary employee at the Lasch Building, working there for approximately 8 months. No report was ever made by Jim Calhoun. [B] Jim presently suffers from dementia, resides in a nursing home, and is incompetent to testify.[/B] Victim 8's identity is unknown."[/quote]

One of the few things I was able to read in the grand jury report, mainly because it was on the last page and I figured I might as well peak at that part before closing the report.

Obviously it doesn't excuse him completely but it does indicate that there's more to the janitors story.

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

[quote=GMScud;877678]Where are the victims being overlooked though? The Paterno family has been outspoken about the fact that the victims in this crime need to come first and foremost. Joe Pa also admitted in a recent interview that he mishandled the situation.

IMO it's totally fine to acknowledge all the great things Paterno did in his life. Like or not, the guy had a far reaching positive impact on thousands of student athletes and their families. Yes he made a terrible, terrible mistake in the way he handled the Sandusky situation, which Paterno himself acknowledged. I don't think he should rot in hell, though. Sandusky should.[/quote]


To your point GM, excellent post BTW.

[url=http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/7492873/rick-reilly-paterno-true-legacy]Rick Reilly - Paterno's True Legacy - ESPN[/url]

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

To NC's point.

[url=http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/01/22/1057341/-F**k-Joe-Paterno-%28Updated]Daily Kos: F**k Joe Paterno (Final Important Update, please read <3)[/url]

Re: Joe Paterno dies at age 85
 

The main thing I get from this are that humans simply have an extremely difficult time in taking their hands off the scale of justice and letting the weights on the scale figure it out. They are, in short, unfit to put themselves into the judgment seat. And this is for both sides. Joe Paterno's legacy will be forever "gray", not black nor white.