I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

So we've got two big rumors at play here.

SC and I have researched this independently but in many ways our information does intersect So let's run through it:

Peyton Manning: Our own sources are telling us it's not an option. Which is what I've been saying. Where he ends up I don't know. I don't think it's so definitive that he won't return to Indy

Robert Griffin 3: Yes, we like him but all this talk of being enamored with him and looking to trade up to get him appears to only be a smokescreen. If he's there at 6, sure. But, as of right now, there's no interest in giving up picks to move up for him. At least, that's what I've heard. I actually am not even sure we'd take him if he's there at 6. But then, I thought the same about Landry

Mark Sanchez: Since I've brought him up before, let me just say that it looks less and less like an option, even if he's available

Matt Flynn: I haven't heard from anyone I trust that we're interested

Brian Hoyer: Patriots want to keep him, but we'd be interested for sure if he is available

Colt McCoy: Haven't heard his name mentioned even once to DC..which is why I keep saying he's the sleeper QB we're going to get

Ok, let's get to the real story here:

Andrew Luck/Sam Bradford: Well, these are the big guns. I'm hearing a lot more about a 3-way trade that gets us the #1 pick (Andrew Luck), gets the Colts #2
(RG3, plus picks) and gets the Rams #6 (plus picks and a player). I mean publically no one is talking about this at all, but I know of people inside the organization that are talking about it. Inside the Colts organization that is

SC is hearing a lot more about a 3-way trade that gets us Sam Bradford, the Rams #3 and picks and gets the Vikings #6, picks, and Orakpo. We've each heard variations of what the other has heard. On my end the Bradford talk has been a bit quiet in recent weeks as the Luck talk has heated up (incidentally who was it here that said Orton to the Colts? Because that's apparently very much a
possibility). Incidentally, no rumors I've heard involving Bradford coming to the Redskins include the Vikings. So if that happens, that's all SC.

Getting Luck would seem to be a bit more unattainable than getting Bradford, but it may not be. But bottom line: The Redskins are exhausting all possibilities to get either Luck or Bradford and expect to get one or the other. Also, they plan on adding two QBs this offseason (not Luck & Bradford, of course). And, I know you guys thought I was crazy when I brought it up this fall and when I didn't lock the thread someone else had started on the possibility, but we're shopping Orakpo in order to get our QB. Maybe other players as well, thought not Trent Williams. But especially Orakpo

And for those few of you who I have already talked to about this, it appears the # of picks may be a bit
less than originally mentioned for Luck. Actually considerably less, but it's still potentially a handful. But apparently nothing below our 2nd this year

And I realize the notion of being able to get Luck seems absurd but we wouldn't bring it up if we didn't think the sources suggesting it weren't reliable.

If you want to know if I think we'll actually land Luck or Bradford...I'd be surprised. (I don't even think we're drafting any QB in the first round for that matter). My own gut at this time says we're signing/trading for a veteran, and someone like Wilson or Keenum in the last rounds. I've heard Cousins is at the top of our 2nd tier, meaning after Luck/Bradford. So good prediction there Tripp. But Luck/Bradford are who I'm told is at the top of their board. ...And it's only January

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Oh the anticipation.. imagine Bradford and Blackmon. Or Luck alone

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Well at least we are going after the best of the best. To get either Luck or Bradford would be great.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

So we give picks to both the colts and the rams? Kinda sucks...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=mbedner3420;879683]So we give picks to both the colts and the rams? Kinda sucks...[/quote]

But we would have Luck!

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Yea interesting the new cap rules really made trades that used to seem ridiculous more plausible.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

I understand the thought process for the Skins, they need their guy. Recently, Kyle said that we need an explosive wideout. So I am interested to see how we can get that player and still do these deals.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

dislike bradford, we'll have to give up too much for luck but, he's a safe bet... for years, my tune is kind of changing on that note...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

I have this funny feeling that what SS is saying about not drafting a QB in the first round is actually going to happen. I can see the team drafting a defensive player (again) in the first round and having some half-a$$ed situation at QB going into next season. And once again, we'll be having the same discussions about getting a QB next offseason. Bleh.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=Ruhskins;879688]I have this funny feeling that what SS is saying about not drafting a QB in the first round is actually going to happen. I can see the team drafting a defensive player (again) in the first round and having some half-a$$ed situation at QB going into next season. And once again, we'll be having the same discussions about getting a QB next offseason. Bleh.[/quote]

I don't think that will happen because Shanny is on the hot seat. He can not go into the next season with a fiasco at qb like last year. That was an imbarassment for the franchise and him.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

This sentence makes me giddy..."The Redskins are exhausting all possibilities to get either Luck or Bradford and expect to get one or the other."

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

The more thought I put into this off-season, the less I want to see the "big" trade deal to get a QB. Any big trade scenario assumes we give up future picks to land a star right now. Unfortunately, that "star" will be walking into a very bad situation. He's got to learn an inflexible, unyielding, almost esoteric hybrid-system concocted by a washed-up legacy coach and his (even less inspiring) son as offensive coordinator. Mike is basically on his way out at this point and it would be monumentally irresponsible to put a young QB under Kyle's sole tutelage. In short, a risk-reward analysis here screams "don't let these guys mortgage the future!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Trading players is less risky, but disappointing still. If Orakpo wants to be traded at this point I think it indicates how players feel about the current regime i.e. the writing is on the wall this is NOT a winning regime. Re-watching games from last season it's clear Rak didn't give 100% consistently. Is he a lazy type? Hardly. One of the hardest working young players drafted in a long time IMO, but obviously discouraged about something. Mike's ego will trade away our best player(s) to keep his little post-Denver spite project going for another year or two.

Lil Danny was (of course) right to turn the franchise over to football professionals, but most unfortunately he turned things over to Mike Shanahan. My biggest hope right now is Danny doesn't forget the wisdom behind his first decision (to let go) as we endure Mike's failures. There will be a fresh, young Parcells, Belichick, or Gibbs type HC emerge in the next few years and I'm praying circumstances and fate place him at Redskins Park.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=The Goat;879692]The more thought I put into this off-season, the less I want to see the "big" trade deal to get a QB. Any big trade scenario assumes we give up future picks to land a star right now. Unfortunately, that "star" will be walking into a very bad situation. He's got to learn an inflexible, unyielding, almost esoteric hybrid-system concocted by a washed-up legacy coach and his (even less inspiring) son as offensive coordinator. Mike is basically on his way out at this point and it would be monumentally irresponsible to put a young QB under Kyle's sole tutelage. In short, a risk-reward analysis here screams "don't let these guys mortgage the future!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Trading players is less risky, but disappointing still. If Orakpo wants to be traded at this point I think it indicates how players feel about the current regime i.e. the writing is on the wall this is NOT a winning regime. Re-watching games from last season it's clear Rak didn't give 100% consistently. Is he a lazy type? Hardly. One of the hardest working young players drafted in a long time IMO, but obviously discouraged about something. Mike's ego will trade away our best player(s) to keep his little post-Denver spite project going for another year or two.

Lil Danny was (of course) right to turn the franchise over to football professionals, but most unfortunately he turned things over to Mike Shanahan. My biggest hope right now is Danny doesn't forget the wisdom behind his first decision (to let go) as we endure Mike's failures. There will be a fresh, young Parcells, Belichick, or Gibbs type HC emerge in the next few years and I'm praying circumstances and fate place him at Redskins Park.[/quote]

Some see the glass half empty, some see it half full. You pretty much see it full of sand.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

I don't like the idea of trading Orakpo. Don't like it at all.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=The Goat;879692]The more thought I put into this off-season, the less I want to see the "big" trade deal to get a QB. Any big trade scenario assumes we give up future picks to land a star right now. Unfortunately, that "star" will be walking into a very bad situation. He's got to learn an inflexible, unyielding, almost esoteric hybrid-system concocted by a washed-up legacy coach and his (even less inspiring) son as offensive coordinator. Mike is basically on his way out at this point and it would be monumentally irresponsible to put a young QB under Kyle's sole tutelage. In short, a risk-reward analysis here screams "don't let these guys mortgage the future!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Trading players is less risky, but disappointing still. If Orakpo wants to be traded at this point I think it indicates how players feel about the current regime i.e. the writing is on the wall this is NOT a winning regime. Re-watching games from last season it's clear Rak didn't give 100% consistently. Is he a lazy type? Hardly. One of the hardest working young players drafted in a long time IMO, but obviously discouraged about something. Mike's ego will trade away our best player(s) to keep his little post-Denver spite project going for another year or two.

Lil Danny was (of course) right to turn the franchise over to football professionals, but most unfortunately he turned things over to Mike Shanahan. My biggest hope right now is Danny doesn't forget the wisdom behind his first decision (to let go) as we endure Mike's failures. There will be a fresh, young Parcells, Belichick, or Gibbs type HC emerge in the next few years and I'm praying circumstances and fate place him at Redskins Park.[/quote]

Respectfully disagree with every word of this post.

Who said Orakpo wanted to be traded? The Redskins shopping Orakpo and Orakpo wanting to be traded are two entirely different things...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;879694]I don't like the idea of trading Orakpo. Don't like it at all.[/quote]

I see trading Orakpo as a small step back for the defense and the addition of a Luck/Bradford as the possibility of a leap forward for the offense. It really seems that it is easier to find quality pass rushers than QBs.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;879694]I don't like the idea of trading Orakpo. Don't like it at all.[/quote]

If you don't have a QB you have nothing! I will drive Rak to the airport...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Smootsmack provided an excellent summary here.

My sense of all this is that the Shanahans recognize that they need to upgrade the QB position on the team and they are looking at various ways to achieve that end.

They seem to have focused attention on Luck and Bradford. That is good news because it shows they have "good taste in QBs" - - which might have been in doubt to some degree after the gushingly positive remarks about John Beck 6 months ago. But it is going to take a bit of doing for them to wrestle one of them away from the teams at the top of the draft. To their credit, they are looking at ways to get that done... This means that they are willing to consider parting with an excellent young talent - - Orakpo - - to get this done. And that ought to be a lesson for folks here; when a team wants to go after a prime player or a prime draft pick, it will not do to think about offering only your team's marginal players and/or some low round picks.

At the same time, they are looking at what they might do if all of the dancing that is going on behind the scenes now does not amount to anything real. That is good too because an upgrade at QB is essential so they have to have some plan in place just in case they do not get one of the guys they covet most.

In an different thread, I said that I would not be surprised to see them sign a good-but-not-great free agent along with a developmental QB in a later round. And by the way, going that route would not offend me even a little bit. I believe that with time to evolve their games, both Russell Wilson and Kellen Moore can play QB in the NFL...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=NM Redskin;879693]Some see the glass half empty, some see it half full. [B]You pretty much see if full of sand.[/B][/quote]

That's excellent...thanks for the chuckle NM! Admittedly I was never a fan of MS. I think of all SB winning coaches in the last two or three decades his are the luckiest, borne of perfect circumstances if you will, rather than his ability, talent, intelligence etc etc.

Also watching the playoffs makes it painfully obvious how bad this team is right now. We're years away from being competitive, assuming we find "the" coach after Mike's done stroking his ego with Danny's money and our beloved team.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

SC is this the news that was supposed to come within 72 hrs or was that something different?

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=The Goat;879699]That's excellent...thanks for the chuckle NM! Admittedly I was never a fan of MS. I think of all SB winning coaches in the last two or three decades his are the luckiest, borne of perfect circumstances if you will, rather than his ability, talent, intelligence etc etc.

Also watching the playoffs makes it painfully obvious how bad this team is right now. We're years away from being competitive, assuming we find "the" coach after Mike's done stroking his ego with Danny's money and our beloved team.[/quote]

Yeah I can see that MS hasn't done a lot to win over his detractors, especially with his handling of the QB position.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=mbedner3420;879700]SC is this the news that was supposed to come within 72 hrs or was that something different?[/quote]

I had heard that a deal was imminent - - but I heard that multiple times over the last week. I have given up on timing this out.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;879704]I had heard that a deal was imminent - - but I heard that multiple times over the last week. I have given up on timing this out.[/quote]

So teams can announce a trade before the new league year begins?

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=tryfuhl;879681]Oh the anticipation.. imagine Bradford and Blackmon. Or Luck alone[/quote]

Doubtful the Skins could get both Bradford and Blackmon - - but keep a good thought...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

At this point, I'd almost rather keep our picks and draft from there.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=celts32;879705]So teams can announce a trade before the new league year begins?[/quote]

Yeah, that is what confuses me...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

I agree. I don't think any trades can happen, even trading straight draft picks, before the league year begins

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;879694]I don't like the idea of trading Orakpo. Don't like it at all.[/quote]

thank u

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

If those scenerios get us Andrew Luck, I'm all for it.

I wouldn't mind Bradford here, but if it's going to take the #6 and Brian Orakpo, then I'm not a fan.

I dont mind if we need to trade Orakpo to get our QB...but giving up the 6th and Orakpo for Bradford seems to be a little much unless we're getting an additional pick somewhere....

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

And I heard that the Patriots are talking about a trade that sends Brady to the Redskins..

Man, no disrespect (at all), but how on earth do you know this? I mean, really??

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;879694]I don't like the idea of trading Orakpo. Don't like it at all.[/quote]
this

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

We need a QB more than we need Orakpo at this point. Love the guy but deuces.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=IrMitchell;879715]And I heard that the Patriots are talking about a trade that sends Brady to the Redskins..

Man, no disrespect (at all), but how on earth do you know this? I mean, really??[/quote]

Sources, they work for respectable sports communities with reliable sources.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=Chico23231;879718]We need a QB more than we need Orakpo at this point. Love the guy but deuces.[/quote]

lol we're not going to get a QB for orakpo, nor a 1st round pick. and throwing him into a deal that we would already be sacrificng alot of picks and worth in picks...?

it wouldnt make sense even if they wanted to trade him...

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

*double

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Dont be stupid people.

Orakpos a good player, but his value doesn't even approach that of a franchise qb.

Bradford > orakpo and our 1st round pick.

Luck > our first and 2nd this year, 1st next year, orakpo, and Trent Williams.

We are not going to get a franchise qb without giving up ALOT.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

If you want verification on the Orakpo rumors, just look around at how any of the other Cerrato acquisitions have been treated by this administration. You move him in a trade, you let Landry walk in free agency, you let McIntosh walk in free agency, and Kevin Barnes may or may not get a spot on the 53 man, then voila: you've erased pretty much every Cerrato acquisition from the team. Mission accomplished: team rebuilt!

Here's why I'm skeptical of the Bradford rumors: if one of the only things Mike and Kyle Shanahan agree upon is that there are only 10 or so "franchise" quarterbacks in the world, is Bradford really one of those guys? If so, why has he looked so awful in the last two or three years? I have no definitive opinion on what Sam Bradford is at this point, but if you are a quarterback elitist -- and the Shanahans appear to be QB elitists -- you already know Bradford isn't one of those 10 guys. So it would seem like the type of guy that can truly value Sam Bradford is one who believes that pro bowl quarterback talent can come from a lot of places and just like Sean Payton took Drew Brees to the next level, you can come in and take Sam Bradford and make a pro bowler out of him.

The whole reason the Redskins ended up with Grossman and Beck last year is because system guys are all the same.

The Luck interest makes sense: if a lot of teams are sure of one thing in this draft, it is that Andrew Luck is one of the 10 guys in the world who can handle every facet of the quarterback position in the NFL. And it makes sense to exhaust every shot to get one of those guys. I don't think the Redskins and Colts and Rams will all be able to agree on compensation: there's just too many moving parts and too many people involved where just one guy can say no and throw the whole trade off. But I had heard wind of those two teams (Indy and St. Louis) talking even before they knew who had the first pick and who had the second pick (the potential compensation though (two firsts, two seconds) is something that I was just speculating on). This is the first I've ever heard of the REDSKINS being involved in those discussions. But if you're willing to speculate a bit, if the Rams and Colts are going to discuss Luck/Griffin, it would make sense for the Redskins to get involved in those discussion.

I still believe this is an extreme longshot, and the Colts kind of need to pay Manning's bonus for any of this to have a shot of happening. If Manning is released, Luck to the Colts is a foregone conclusion.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;879722]Dont be stupid people.

Orakpos a good player, but his value doesn't even approach that of a franchise qb.

Bradford > orakpo and our 1st round pick.

Luck > our first and 2nd this year, 1st next year, orakpo, and Trent Williams.

We are not going to get a franchise qb without giving up ALOT.[/quote]Can't our first round pick alone become a QB more skilled than Sam Bradford? You have the sixth pick in the draft: that's more valuable than Sam Bradford, even if you strip the value of the pick to simply taking the best QB available.

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Is it too crazy to think the Colts would like RG3 more than Luck? I dont think it is

Re: I See QB Rumors (2012 QB Thread: The Sixth Sense)
 

Thanks for sharing the intel Smoot. I believe all this info you've gathered is correct and most likely true. However, I would guess and say there is a 5% chance of it actually happening. It reminds me of this interview I saw with a NFL GM one time. He talked about how trades were talked about all the time with teams (hence why we hear all these rumors), but very few actually materialize.


Let's look at the #1 pick. Who outside of AJ Smith has traded the #1 pick away? The Chargers did it twice, and once swapped from 3 to 2. (for Leaf) Yeah, I'm quite positive teams will be talking crazy trades from now till the draft, but I seriously doubt any happen. Don't get me wrong, I'd be ecstatic to have Luck on this squad.


Couple things. SC, not sure why your sources keep telling you that "a deal is possibly hours away from being announced" because the league year doesn't begin until March 13th so no deal can be announced till then. Might want to remind your sources next time they tell you that.


Also, Sam Bradford is not worth the #6 pick in the draft this year. As I said before, picks prior aren't worth as much as picks now. Now, had Bradford blown up and had very good progression in those two years, I might would say yes, but as it stands now. Absolutely not. Having the same stats as Colt McCoy doesn't scream valuable to me, not to mention he got hurt as well.