Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

[b]Positives:[/b]
-If he's that unhappy where he wants out, he's the kind of guy you definitely don't want on your team. If he doesn't want to be part of what's being built here, I'm in 100% support of letting a player go no matter how good he is.

-His toe has been a topic of concern since the day we found out about it. Perhaps part of the reason the team is being so accomodating with letting him go is they feel he's just not the same WR with the toe injury. Perhaps they feel he's not a true #1 WR anymore and they could improve the situation by moving on without him.

-The cap. Since he's expected to give back a part of all of his due bonus, that at least gives the team some wiggle room to pursue a replacement and long term this might actually benefit us, especially in 2006 when the cap is supposed to be a concern for the team.

[b]Negatives[/b]
-Coles always gave us 110% on the field. Nobody will ever question his toughness either. He seemed to be a 'core Redskin' until this bombshell.

-If he doesn't give back all of his bonus we're going to have to take a cap hit, just depends on how much.

-I'm not sure yet if this reflects more on the team or on Coles. Are things really that bad? Does Coles truly believe things aren't going to improve next year? Does he just have some philosophical differences with this staff when it comes to the offense and his role? Or is Coles just not the guy we thought he was. To be fair we never really know what goes on in these guys' heads. When the going gets tough Coles wants out? That's the last thing I thought I would ever have to say, but maybe it's true?

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

negative for me is that this sets a bad precendent.

Gibbs needs to make some sort of comment or somethign on this. It cant just happen without an explanation to the fans. Whens he going on a radio show again, I got some questions for him now

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

[QUOTE=SKINSnCANES]negative for me is that this sets a bad precendent.

Gibbs needs to make some sort of comment or somethign on this. It cant just happen without an explanation to the fans. Whens he going on a radio show again, I got some questions for him now[/QUOTE]

He'll address it I'm sure. How much he'll really say is the question.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Well, I guess we tack up Coles to another non Gibbs era mistake. Gibbs is going to make this more of his team then I thought. The burdon is even more so on his shoulders now. Ive got faith though, time to wait and see.

As for coles, heres a postive, hes going to injure his toe really bad in training camp for another team, have to get surgury, and end his career. No mercy at this point...bahh, damn you for making me have to curse you coles

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Positives: We get Williams from USC

Negatives: I have to get another authentic jersey reworked.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

I just posted a question in another thread askign who owns a coles jersey. I guess you are the first victim to come out speak.

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Atleast we won't have to wonder about his decision not to get surgery or the cleaning crew at Redskin park accidentally throwing away his prosthetic.

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Positive: I understand that Coles had a finger injury this past season, but didn't anyone else feel he was dropping an alarmingly high number of catchable balls? If he had been a few inches taller I would have sworn he was Gardner on some of those plays. Coles has been one of my favorite players over the past few seasons, but he is far from healthy and seemingly on the decline. He was supposed to stretch the field, but his toe hasn't allowed him to maintain the same speed that got us all so excited when he was brought here initially. I'll be sad to see him go, but I don't believe he would have been a #1 receiver on many other teams the way he played last season.

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For me, like I posted in the other thread, with many players being tough to resign and our top two WRs (at least?) asking for trades - this does not sit well. Do they think we don't have a shot at winning? That scares me.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

There's also a bunch of other guys that seem to think the team is headed in the right direction.

Pierce had a great comment on the end of the year when he said the team didn't play like a losing team.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

A lot of players can say the right things and not mean them. Actions speak louder than words, and until his name is on that contract let's not speculate 8)

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

This is just a thought I had.Maybe he was unhappy last season and the only reason he stayed was his toe injury. Toward the end of this season he took a cortisone shot in his toe which he said helped and elected not to operate.An operation would hurt him big time as a free agent. Now that his toe feels better he wants out because now can past other teams physicals and can run a fast 40.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

[QUOTE=CooleyAsCanBe]Positive: I understand that Coles had a finger injury this past season, but didn't anyone else feel he was dropping an alarmingly high number of catchable balls? If he had been a few inches taller I would have sworn he was Gardner on some of those plays. Coles has been one of my favorite players over the past few seasons, but he is far from healthy and seemingly on the decline. He was supposed to stretch the field, but his toe hasn't allowed him to maintain the same speed that got us all so excited when he was brought here initially. I'll be sad to see him go, but I don't believe he would have been a #1 receiver on many other teams the way he played last season.[/QUOTE]

welcome to the board.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Well, we have heard what Coles wants, and what Gibbs will let happen. What we don't know yet is what Snyder is going to do. I bet that Snyder brokers some kind of deal to get us a new receiving threat using Coles as the trade. I bet phones are going off all over the NFL over this development.

Here is a senario...
We agree to let Coles buy back his contract and he allows us to seek the trade and franchise him. This way, he can still seek the team he wants, but he is then obligated to make them provide some compensation for him.

I'll be very surprised to just see him leave without getting anything for him. It just doesn't ever seem to work that way in the NFL. If he does, I would have to believe that the Skins think his injury will never allow him to be worth his salary.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

With the exception of 1 or 2 games last season, we were right there in every one. Thanks mostly to our defense, we SHOULD have beaten devision rivals such as Dallas and Philly. Despite a new staff and totally new system, we were simply victims of circumstance. ie: Injury bug, horrendous officiating and the 1 mistake that was Brunell. Hopefully this year these problems will be put behind us including any players
who model themselves after "TO".

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

[QUOTE=GoSkins!]Well, we have heard what Coles wants, and what Gibbs will let happen. What we don't know yet is what Snyder is going to do. I bet that Snyder brokers some kind of deal to get us a new receiving threat using Coles as the trade. I bet phones are going off all over the NFL over this development.

Here is a senario...
We agree to let Coles buy back his contract and he allows us to seek the trade and franchise him. This way, he can still seek the team he wants, but he is then obligated to make them provide some compensation for him.

I'll be very surprised to just see him leave without getting anything for him. It just doesn't ever seem to work that way in the NFL. If he does, I would have to believe that the Skins think his injury will never allow him to be worth his salary.[/QUOTE]

Is such a scenario even possible though? Will the NFL allow something like that? That's the real question.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

You can't slap the franchise tag on a player unless he is a free agent. If you grant a player his outright release from the contract, you also cannot slap the franchise tag on him. Franchising him is impossible.

Secondly, trading him will make his cap hit about $10 million this year, which is impossible to absorb. Coles won't give back the signing bonus unless he gets the opportunity to become a free agent, so we'll get no help on the cap hit.

A trade is, therefore, impossible.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

:vomit-smi

That's all I have to say.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

This sucks. Why are we getting nothing for Coles? Don't you think we could wrangel some sort of trade for him? We wouldn't get value, but maybe something. I hate to just let a guy like Coles go, especially w/the hit the salary cap will take.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

The hit would be even more outrageous if we trade him (I think.)

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

The Redskins are still a dysfunctional organization. Believe that!

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

[QUOTE=Daseal]For me, like I posted in the other thread, with many players being tough to resign and our top two WRs (at least?) asking for trades - this does not sit well. Do they think we don't have a shot at winning? That scares me.[/QUOTE]


I read Cole's apparent statement's, he say's his conversation's with Gibb's were over how he's being used, you mean he want's to catch the ball downfield and not at the line of scrimmage on screen after screen, and there is the problem these guy's are not being rewarded on offense for running, they run downfield and we throw a dump pass, and it's not like Gibb's say's we are encoorperating more downfield passing, he's say's we are throwing it downfield? What did I mis? That is what scares me.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

If Coles isn't happy as a skins player, that's a big deal for Gibbs. And my guess is Coles is going to return a lot of the bonus money to make the move "cap friendly" for the skins.

If we can lose a disgruntled player who's been injury prone without getting creamed on the cap, it's not such a bad thing. It all depends on the cap hit and who we can get to replace him. If it's a big cap hit and Coles is actually healthy down the road, it's not a good thing. If it's a managable cap hit and Coles isn't ever going to be the threat he was, than it's a good thing.

I always liked Coles because he's a tough guy, plays through pain, makes plays like that one after an INT last year, etc. But everyone agrees our WRs need a change. If this allows us to clean the slate and get our passing game going, it may be for the best. Plus, the post article said Coles has been disgruntled and longing for Spurrier's offense (sounds like Daseal!). If that's the case, maybe it's time for a change.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Gibbs said that we are going to open up the playbook next season. What this means, I don't know, but it obviously is worrying some people.

Do I hear "Statue of Liberty" play anyone? Maybe "Hook 'n' Lateral"

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[QUOTE=TheMalcolmConnection]The hit would be even more outrageous if we trade him (I think.)[/QUOTE]

close to $10M

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WTF? we traded a first rounder for two seasons out of this guy. I'm glad he's kept his mouth shut, but if we can't draft well OR make better decisions in FA then we are truely fucked.

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Most definitely. I hope our draft luck started with the drafting of Taylor last year and continues for years to come. I'd love to see someone be able to evaluate the talent like that and pick up a good WR. It's such a crap shoot with who will be the best playmaker. With the prospects it almost seems as though the choice will be who will be the most immediate playmaker.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

It is however possible to restructure Coles to a reasonable contract and trade him - in a way, we have some leverage. He's made his money, and he'll probably take a short contract/paycut to be dealt. If we sign him to a one year deal worth much less could we trade him away without a huge cap hit?

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It's all so complicated. lol

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This move by the Redskins to release Coles reflects very well on the organization. You have to be willing to make these decisions and not get attached to the potential of a player when the facts are clear that he has to go - for more than one reason: his drag the team down depression and unhappiness, and his injury that has kept him and may still keep him from playing like he used to be capable of, thus making him overpaid and blocking someone else from being able to develop.

I hope people don't think that Coles' judgment is anything other than a self-centered emotional take on what is going on. I wish Coles the best, but we need "all for one and one for all" guys on this team to be a winner. Coles had 90 catches but that wasn't what he wanted. He didn't have the patience to allow the team to develop offensively. He has his vision of the kind of longer passes he wants to catch - and I don't know if he is frustrated about the way his injuries have limited him and is looking to blame others for that problem.

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[QUOTE=Shane]This move by the Redskins to release Coles reflects very well on the organization. You have to be willing to make these decisions and not get attached to the potential of a player when the facts are clear that he has to go - for more than one reason: his drag the team down depression and unhappiness, and his injury that has kept him and may still keep him from playing like he used to be capable of, thus making him overpaid and blocking someone else from being able to develop.

I hope people don't think that Coles' judgment is anything other than a self-centered emotional take on what is going on. I wish Coles the best, but we need "all for one and one for all" guys on this team to be a winner. Coles had 90 catches but that wasn't what he wanted. He didn't have the patience to allow the team to develop offensively. He has his vision of the kind of longer passes he wants to catch - and I don't know if he is frustrated about the way his injuries have limited him and is looking to blame others for that problem.[/QUOTE]

I agree, good post.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Well put Shane.

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Yeah you hit it on the head Shane...I'm sure the Pats and their fans loved Lawyer Milloy but they made the right move by cutting him. Its just so hard, I think, because no one saw it coming. If we had known for some time that LC was gonna be a cap casualty or something, it wouldve been one thing, but it came so suddenly and unexpectedly. I know I thought he would be in burgundy and gold for 10 more years, and its hard to think about him somewhere else. Its like getting broken up with and being forced to think about your girl messing with other dudes...lol.

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I think Coles is upset with the fact that we don't throw the ball down field. Even when the receivers run good routes, we dump it off to the short guy for minimum yardage. That to me shows major distrust by our coaching staff in what our receivers are capable of.
Imagine if your a Wideout for our team, u get scrutinized for dropping balls, not scoring, being on a team were the media says there is no deep passing threat. It seems the blame for this season have been put majorly on your shoulders. However it wasn't the wideouts fault, they were never given a chance to produce on routes that trully used their talents and had to deal with a qb who couldn't throw through a paper bag over 75% of the season. I know some of you may say 'they dropped alot of balls, but hell how many of you could catch knowing that the route your running has u getting hit by a corner, safety, linebacker, and in some cases athletic dend, how would you feel?
at the most only three of the wideouts go for passes during on play and most of their routes are only 10 yrds down field. Defenses aren't stupid they know were not going to throw it deep so it sets up a suicide mission for the wideouts

I feel that the receivers have been unfarely scutinized for this past season, the coaching staff offensively left those guys hanging out to dry with they're route selection and maybe the receivers don't have faith in the qb starting next season so they want to leave. Everyone else see's how bad our qb's are, except us? why is that? we need some drastic changes and soon. Gibbs need to give the players a chance to shine and give them the routes that use their talents wisely.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

[QUOTE=Daseal]It is however possible to restructure Coles to a reasonable contract and trade him - in a way, we have some leverage. He's made his money, and he'll probably take a short contract/paycut to be dealt. If we sign him to a one year deal worth much less could we trade him away without a huge cap hit?[/QUOTE]

That's what I was talking about earlier. We do have leverage: he is now under contract. We don't have to release him and I just don't believe Coles has it in him to give only 50%. I think he would (and has) threatened to not go out there and play through the pain, toe, finger injuries if he is forced to stay. BUT, I just don't think he could do it. He would have to play, that's his character.

If he wants out now, he needs to be accepting of a way that doesn't hurt the team both player wise and financially. That's fair and I'm sure he knows it. Stay tuned........

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

I do agree with half your point but about getting hit when you catch the ball... that's part of your job and I truly hope that isn't what ANY part of what Coles is upset about.

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Getting back to the positives and nagatives aspect of the Coles "situation":

[B]Negative[/B]: Warpath posters who believed that the Skins had one of the top three receiving crops in the whole NFL last year will need to go on Zoloft presecriptions this winter as Coles and Gardner are shown the door. Under the protective umbrella of Zoloft, these same Warpathers need not feer leaving their fantasy world and should be able to re-enter Earth as it actually exists.

[B]Positive[/B]: There is no longer the gamble associated with building the WR corps next year trying to figure out if Coles' toe will be healthy or not. If he is healthy, he'll play well for some other team; if his toe is not healthy, he will consume cap room for some other team. The Skins can now develop a plan without that area of uncertainty.


Oh by the way, before everyone falls all over themselves congragulating the Redskins' organization for resolving this problem, recall thgat Coles also cost the organization a first round pick that went to the Jets. Who did they get with that pick and who might the Sins have gotten with that pick?

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Know anyone I can get a prescription from, SC?

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Daseal:


Doctor Strangelove is no longer prescribing.

However, I believe that Doc Holiday did survive the gunfight at the OK Corral...

Re: Positives & Negatives: Coles' release
 

Resolving the problem? I wouldn't think it was really the Redskins choice to have him leave considering the potential he once had and still might have. However, I am glad to see that area of uncertainty clear up as well.