This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

Alright so I've always noticed how we always seem to lose games closely. So I went through the years from 2002-2011 (10 seasons) and I considered close losses to be by one possesion (aka a max of 8 points or less). So I counted the number of 8 point losses we've had over ten years compared to all the other teams in the NFL. The results I found were pretty interesting/Somewhat shocking/somewhat surprising:

The number 1 team who loses the most 'Close' games in the NFL since 02:

1. Redskins [B]60[/B] close losses the past 10 years; thats an average of 6 close losses a season.
2. (Tie) Detroit and Cleveland w/ 53 close losses.
3. Cincinnatti with 47

Teams with the fewest close losses:

1. New England with 19
2. Indy with 26
3. NY Giants 28

This tells me that we are a great team that can't seem to finish games. We know how to be competitive, but we just don't have that extra push from either our players or our coaches or both.

If you think about it, if we got half, 3/4, or all of those close loss games to wins, we'd be a playoff team most years.

Discuss!

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

that's the difference between good teams and bad teams, good teams find a way to win the close ones. that's all

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

Good research. It's dangerous because it gives us the continuous feeling of "we're thiiiis close" I think that mentality has changed a bit, but what do I know

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

Not sure if you proofread your post Cult' but, shouldn't it have read "we are NOT a great team"? Those other teams (DET, CIN, and CLE) are just as bad during that span.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

don't knitpick, cincinnatti should be 4

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

so close yet so far away

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=los panda;962861]that's the difference between good teams and bad teams, good teams find a way to win the close ones. that's all[/quote]

Pretty much. I'd rather be in the category with NE, NY, Indy. Teams that consistently make the playoffs and won a superbowl recently.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;962860]Alright so I've always noticed how we always seem to lose games closely. So I went through the years from 2002-2011 (10 seasons) and I considered close losses to be by one possesion (aka a max of 8 points or less). So I counted the number of 8 point losses we've had over ten years compared to all the other teams in the NFL. The results I found were pretty interesting/Somewhat shocking/somewhat surprising:

The number 1 team who loses the most 'Close' games in the NFL since 02:

1. Redskins [B]60[/B] close losses the past 10 years; thats an average of 6 close losses a season.
2. (Tie) Detroit and Cleveland w/ 53 close losses.
3. Cincinnatti with 47

Teams with the fewest close losses:

1. New England with 19
2. Indy with 26
3. NY Giants 28

This tells me that we are a great team that can't seem to finish games. We know how to be competitive, but we just don't have that extra push from either our players or our coaches or both.

If you think about it, if we got half, 3/4, or all of those close loss games to wins, we'd be a playoff team most years.

Discuss![/quote]

Man that is some good stuff. Its a total mentality thing of being able to finish games. wow, best stat of the year, great job. We gotta change the mentality, I hate to say it, but we still need to turn over some guys on the roster I think. Gotta be strong.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

not sure where to find this stat, but we seem younger than when shanny came to town.

i think the base is young and strong, and we have THE crown jewel, we just need some more solid pieces.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=SmootSmack;962865]Good research. It's dangerous because it gives us the continuous feeling of "we're thiiiis close"[B] I think that mentality has changed a bit[/B], but what do I know[/quote]

Changed to what?

Edit: and among whom? Coaches? Players?

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

so the average is what? 37 or so? meaning we're losing at least 2 more games a year than we should. that's kind of damning in a way.

losing close ones and taking penalties is at least partially coaching, though i think that some of those years our D was keeping us in games we had no business being in too.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

I have never doubted that we have lost more close games than we should have. I feel however that this stat prooves that we have never been that good.
Ultimately, you want to be a team that is rarely in a close game and knows how to win by more than a touchdown and PAT or 2 point conversion. When they do get into close games then you want them to win. If you are playing everyone close then you aren't a very good team. There have to be weeks when you separate yourself from the competition. When you have the weeks that you cannot separate then you find a way to win the close one. All this stat tells me is that the team is good enough to compete but lacks what it takes to be a true contender.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=The Goat;962906]Changed to what?

Edit: and among whom? Coaches? Players?[/quote]


Maybe he is referring to the sunshiny feeling and the whole "attitude" of Redskins park thing. He refers to it alot, so much so Im beginning to think all of our front office and players walk around with rainbow brite shirts and slap bracelets with the word "positive" on it.

He also might be saying that the thought we are this close has come and gone, and we now know with shanahan, no plan is THE plan. Maybe he did come here for a quick retirement fund BOOSTER!

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

This means absolutely nothing, btw. Look at the teams at the top, the best in the league over that span, and look at the teams on the bottom, the worst. Its a damning figure, not one to take and try to squeeze optimism out of. Anytime you are compared with the Clevelands and Detroits of the NFL, thats usually not a good thing, no matter how the shanahan apologists (or anyone) want to spin it.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

That's an irritating stat. It's also aggravating. To have 2 wiinning seasons during that time span is also annoying. Oftentimes you can find the reasons on the offensive side of the ball as being poor QB play or sight too many turnovers. On defense it could be allowing the opposing offense to convert on too many 3rd downs or allowing too much yardage.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

Honestly this stat has a glass half empty/glass half full kind of view to it.

It tells me that we are the most competitive team in the NFL, and consistently.

Btw, the difference between us and the Lions/Browns is 7 games. Thats practically a whole seasons worth of wins. You can interpret that in more than one way.

Also I may add in that Pittsburgh and Atlanta AND Cincinnati and Philly, both had ties in that 10 years. I did not count the ties as a loss nor towards this data (it wouldn't affect the Redskins from finishing at the top)

Detroit went winless in 08, and of all 16 games that they lost, only 5 of them were close.

Buffalo, who comes in just after us at number 5 is the only team in the past 10 years to not make the playoffs.

This stat shows whos franchise has been the most stable and consistently good team in the NFL in this time. New England is obvious, but after them, Indy, and New York Giants, the steelers, then the panthers. The panthers, while they haven't been that good in the past recent years, they were a tough team to beat in the early years.

This stat tells you to limit those close games, and you have a better chance of winning.

Look at the GB packers of 2010, they were the only team on my list who lost all their games by 8 points or less and won the super bowl.

I guess what may be misleading or deceiving about this stat is comparing two teams with similar close lose amounts, but different season results.

Example, The 09 Rams and the 2010 Packers. Both teams had 6 close losses. The packers however went 10-6 and won the super bowl. The Rams in 09 went 1-15.

Back to the redskins. This stat shows that we have been competitive over time, and we've had different players and different coaches but the same results. Maybe its not the team, maybe this is where the finger gets pointed at ownership, because thats been the only consistent in all this.

It may be ownership but that's a waist of argument because Dan isn't selling the team anytime soon.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

i would love to see our record if we only played 3 quarters every game for that same timespan in OP.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

It would be interesting to see a stat for most Punt/KO returned TD's called back. I know we are notorious for that as well.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

I think all this stat says is that for the past decade or so we have been largely a defensive minded team. Scores were lower because our defense was good and our offense stunk - because we had no QB.

There's a huge difference between losing 17 to 13 vs 33 to 29. In the high scoring game you feel like all you needed was one stop, or to be the last team to have the ball. When you lose 17 to 13 like we did for so many years, you felt like you were a star QB away from being competitive.

Which was completely true.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

When was the last time we blew someone out? I mean just thoroughly kicked their ass without hanging on to the edge of our seats at the end of a game? Having some of those would make me feel better about really being competitive.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=53Fan;963041]When was the last time we blew someone out? I mean just thoroughly kicked their ass without hanging on to the edge of our seats at the end of a game? Having some of those would make me feel better about really being competitive.[/quote]

Good point. That has not happened in a long time. The ability to string together a couple of good games where the outcome is not really in doubt is the mark of a team that is good. Always being "so close" is the mark of a team that is just not good. There is no mistaking us for one of the better teams in the league, and there is a reason for that. Its because we are not one, even with RG3.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=53Fan;963041]When was the last time we blew someone out? I mean just thoroughly kicked their ass without hanging on to the edge of our seats at the end of a game? Having some of those would make me feel better about really being competitive.[/quote]

Good question. Define blowout? By more than two TDs? By more than 3 TDs? Ill say when I went through this stat season by season, we beat Detroit one year 55-14. Another year we beat San Fran 52-7. We beat the rams a few years ago 33-16...is that a blowout in your opinion?

From my memory...the last time was when Steve Spurrier was the Redskins coach.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

Good teams blowout bad teams and have somewhat consistent decisive victories. We are not a good team, even with RG3 at the helm. I hope that with RG3's development and an influx of talent, this will change.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;962963]Honestly this stat has a glass half empty/glass half full kind of view to it.

It tells me that we are the most competitive team in the NFL, and consistently.

Btw, the difference between us and the Lions/Browns is 7 games. Thats practically a whole seasons worth of wins. You can interpret that in more than one way.

Also I may add in that Pittsburgh and Atlanta AND Cincinnati and Philly, both had ties in that 10 years. I did not count the ties as a loss nor towards this data (it wouldn't affect the Redskins from finishing at the top)

Detroit went winless in 08, and of all 16 games that they lost, only 5 of them were close.

Buffalo, who comes in just after us at number 5 is the only team in the past 10 years to not make the playoffs.

This stat shows whos franchise has been the most stable and consistently good team in the NFL in this time. New England is obvious, but after them, Indy, and New York Giants, the steelers, then the panthers. The panthers, while they haven't been that good in the past recent years, they were a tough team to beat in the early years.

This stat tells you to limit those close games, and you have a better chance of winning.

Look at the GB packers of 2010, they were the only team on my list who lost all their games by 8 points or less and won the super bowl.

I guess what may be misleading or deceiving about this stat is comparing two teams with similar close lose amounts, but different season results.

Example, The 09 Rams and the 2010 Packers. Both teams had 6 close losses. The packers however went 10-6 and won the super bowl. The Rams in 09 went 1-15.

Back to the redskins. This stat shows that we have been competitive over time, and we've had different players and different coaches but the same results. Maybe its not the team, maybe this is where the finger gets pointed at ownership, because thats been the only consistent in all this.[/quote]

This is some of the shittiest thinking I've ever seen on this site.

The reason the Patriots have the fewest close wins/losses is because they were blowing everyone away. Putting up consistent close games means nothing more than you were mediocre, it's the result of not being good enough to blow teams out.

We all know the Redskins have been mediocre to bad over the last 10 years, we can see that with our own eyes. The reason so many losses were close is because our defense was good and limited the scores put up by the other team. Also, opposing offenses saw how inept our own offense was, so when they had a lead they felt no need to remain aggressive. They played keep away and ran the clock out, knowing that QBs like Tony Banks, Danny Weurffel, Patrick Ramsey and Rex Grossman were nothing special and not likely to come from behind.

It's this simple: for a long time we had good defense but no QB. Now we finally have the QB, but no defense. The QB is the harder thing to put in place, so things are looking up. But ultimately if you want to win consistently you need both.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;962963]Honestly this stat has a glass half empty/glass half full kind of view to it.

It tells me that we are the most competitive team in the NFL, and consistently.

Btw, the difference between us and the Lions/Browns is 7 games. Thats practically a whole seasons worth of wins. You can interpret that in more than one way.

Also I may add in that Pittsburgh and Atlanta AND Cincinnati and Philly, both had ties in that 10 years. I did not count the ties as a loss nor towards this data (it wouldn't affect the Redskins from finishing at the top)

Detroit went winless in 08, and of all 16 games that they lost, only 5 of them were close.

Buffalo, who comes in just after us at number 5 is the only team in the past 10 years to not make the playoffs.

This stat shows whos franchise has been the most stable and consistently good team in the NFL in this time. New England is obvious, but after them, Indy, and New York Giants, the steelers, then the panthers. The panthers, while they haven't been that good in the past recent years, they were a tough team to beat in the early years.

This stat tells you to limit those close games, and you have a better chance of winning.

Look at the GB packers of 2010, they were the only team on my list who lost all their games by 8 points or less and won the super bowl.

I guess what may be misleading or deceiving about this stat is comparing two teams with similar close lose amounts, but different season results.

Example, The 09 Rams and the 2010 Packers. Both teams had 6 close losses. The packers however went 10-6 and won the super bowl. The Rams in 09 went 1-15.

Back to the redskins. This stat shows that we have been competitive over time, and we've had different players and different coaches but the same results. Maybe its not the team, maybe this is where the finger gets pointed at ownership, because thats been the only consistent in all this.[/quote]

Cult, Cult, you really think we are the most competitive team in the league? Damn man, Im all for unbridled optimism, but if you aren't Dan Snyder in Cult Brennan's clothes, I just don't know what to say? Maybe "How's the weather up there in Fantasy Land?"

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=kct1975;963054]From my memory...the last time was when Steve Spurrier was the Redskins coach.[/quote]

Your memory is pretty hazy

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=Ruhskins;963070]Good teams blowout bad teams and have somewhat consistent decisive victories. We are not a good team, even with RG3 at the helm. I hope that with RG3's development and an influx of talent, this will change.[/quote]

Our team isn't defined yet. This season is far from over. We could just be a good team playing bad football. We just need to play good football. Despite what's happened so far this season, this Redskins team still has a chance to redefine itself and play better football down the stretch. I'm still optimistic about the Redskins chances of winning the division and making the playoffs. I know we can accomplish this.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;963052]Good question. Define blowout? By more than two TDs? By more than 3 TDs? Ill say when I went through this stat season by season, we beat Detroit one year 55-14. Another year we beat San Fran 52-7. We beat the rams a few years ago 33-16...is that a blowout in your opinion?[/quote]

For the Skins a blowout would be having 2 minutes left in the game and the fans don't even think about how we might be able to give the game away... Can't remember one of those.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

55-20. wow. i wonder if they beat the spread on that...

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;963052]Good question. Define blowout? By more than two TDs? By more than 3 TDs? Ill say when I went through this stat season by season, we beat Detroit one year 55-14. Another year we beat San Fran 52-7. We beat the rams a few years ago 33-16...is that a blowout in your opinion?[/quote]

Well hell Cult we've been to 5 SB's and won 3. I know we've had some blowouts. But how often in the last few years have we had 2-3-4 game winning streaks where the game was pretty much over with 4-5 minutes to go? If anything we've been competitive losers. That doesn't help a whole hell of a lot at the end of the year. And some of those scores were probably late scores that made the game look closer than they really were. I ain't here to kiss my sister. I want some frikking W's.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=Schneed10;963071]This is some of the shittiest thinking I've ever seen on this site.

The reason the Patriots have the fewest close wins/losses is because they were blowing everyone away. Putting up consistent close games means nothing more than you were mediocre, it's the result of not being good enough to blow teams out.

We all know the Redskins have been mediocre to bad over the last 10 years, we can see that with our own eyes. The reason so many losses were close is because our defense was good and limited the scores put up by the other team. Also, opposing offenses saw how inept our own offense was, so when they had a lead they felt no need to remain aggressive. They played keep away and ran the clock out, knowing that QBs like Tony Banks, Danny Weurffel, Patrick Ramsey and Rex Grossman were nothing special and not likely to come from behind.

It's this simple: for a long time we had good defense but no QB. Now we finally have the QB, but no defense. The QB is the harder thing to put in place, so things are looking up. But ultimately if you want to win consistently you need both.[/quote]

I can think of shittier thinking and shittier threads on this site. You fit in the glass half empty crowd. You don't think that with proper coaching we can't get over some of those close losses?

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=53Fan;963137]Well hell Cult we've been to 5 SB's and won 3. I know we've had some blowouts. But how often in the last few years have we had 2-3-4 game winning streaks where the game was pretty much over with 4-5 minutes to go? If anything we've been competitive losers. That doesn't help a whole hell of a lot at the end of the year. And some of those scores were probably late scores that made the game look closer than they really were. I ain't here to kiss my sister. I want some frikking W's.[/quote]

I'm not doing this since the dawn of the redskins. This stat I've done for the past ten years. No one cares about blowouts or close games in our Super Bowl years because we were winning then. Translation; when you when everyone's happy and no one gives a .... When your losing, people want to see why. Here's a why. We can't finish or complete games and were the worst in the league at that. And I'll kiss your sister for you if she's attractive.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;963171]We can't finish or complete games and were the worst in the league at that. [/quote]

Thats the difference between being an NFL coach, a good coach, and a great coach.

A good one wins more than he loses, a great one wins the majority of close games.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=Bishop Hammer;962900]Pretty much. I'd rather be in the category with NE, NY, Indy. Teams that consistently make the playoffs and won a superbowl recently.[/quote]

I'd say if you look at all three of those teams they were not much until they found a franchise QB.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

Me and a friend of mine who is a big Skins fan like me have been watching the Skins together for just about that same time frame, 10 years and we always say this team "takes years off your life". We are always close and lose, therefore making us go gray! I'm 43 years old but I am probably 63 in Skins years! I've lost 20 years of my life watching this team break my heart in the 4th QTR.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

There really is not a lot of blow outs in the NFL. Most games are relatively close.

This article does a good job explaining it. Basically good teams find a way to win in the NFL; it is not the margin of victory that determines they are good but the victory itself.

[url=http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/statistical-tour-de-douche-history-the-nfl-elite/7529/]Statistical tour de douche: history of the NFL elite[/url]

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;962963]Honestly this stat has a glass half empty/glass half full kind of view to it.

It tells me that we are the most competitive team in the NFL, and consistently.

Btw, the difference between us and the Lions/Browns is 7 games. Thats practically a whole seasons worth of wins. You can interpret that in more than one way.

Also I may add in that Pittsburgh and Atlanta AND Cincinnati and Philly, both had ties in that 10 years. I did not count the ties as a loss nor towards this data (it wouldn't affect the Redskins from finishing at the top)

Detroit went winless in 08, and of all 16 games that they lost, only 5 of them were close.

Buffalo, who comes in just after us at number 5 is the only team in the past 10 years to not make the playoffs.

This stat shows whos franchise has been the most stable and consistently good team in the NFL in this time. New England is obvious, but after them, Indy, and New York Giants, the steelers, then the panthers. The panthers, while they haven't been that good in the past recent years, they were a tough team to beat in the early years.

This stat tells you to limit those close games, and you have a better chance of winning.

Look at the GB packers of 2010, they were the only team on my list who lost all their games by 8 points or less and won the super bowl.

I guess what may be misleading or deceiving about this stat is comparing two teams with similar close lose amounts, but different season results.

Example, The 09 Rams and the 2010 Packers. Both teams had 6 close losses. The packers however went 10-6 and won the super bowl. The Rams in 09 went 1-15.

Back to the redskins. This stat shows that we have been competitive over time, and we've had different players and different coaches but the same results. Maybe its not the team, maybe this is where the finger gets pointed at ownership, because thats been the only consistent in all this.[/quote]

I would say finding ways to win games on a consistent basis makes you "competitive".

Not losing close ones all the time.

Re: This Skins Stat Says A Lot About Us
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;963171]I'm not doing this since the dawn of the redskins. This stat I've done for the past ten years. No one cares about blowouts or close games in our Super Bowl years because we were winning then. Translation; when you when everyone's happy and no one gives a .... When your losing, people want to see why. Here's a why. We can't finish or complete games and were the worst in the league at that. And I'll kiss your sister for you if she's attractive.[/quote]

So we're the worse at finishing or completing games? It's pretty hard for me to find a positive in that. I guess it's better than getting blown out all the time but as mredskin just wrote...there aren't that many blowouts anyway. Good teams find ways to win...bad teams don't. It's as simple as that. We get a lead but know in our hearts it's not over because we have a history of allowing teams to come back and beat us. I appreciate your optimism and I would honestly be the last person to ask about my sister. Personally I would rather kiss my Jack Russell.