Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[URL="https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/06/02/washington-franchise-should-change-its-name-now/"]Washington franchise should change its name now[/URL]

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Yeah it was all over twitter due to their BLM Post... I've said this for a while but eventually they will cave in and change to warriors or something

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Also Florio is a bitch, he has hated the skins for years.. Dan must have banged his girl or something.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

I've tried 3 times now to get this question through but they won't approve it lol

"When someone says the word Redskins these days what’s your first thought? Racial slur or the football team in DC?"

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=MTK;1252493]I've tried 3 times now to get this question through but they won't approve it lol

"When someone says the word Redskins these days what’s your first thought? Racial slur or the football team in DC?"[/quote]

exactly, and they wont approve because they know their narrative is false

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

But a comment that said "Florio is right" gets approved

He's such a dweeb

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

I would even say racial slur isn't even in my top three answer choices but what do I know I am just an apologist

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=MTK;1252493]I've tried 3 times now to get this question through but they won't approve it lol

"When someone says the word Redskins these days what’s your first thought? Racial slur or the football team in DC?"[/quote]

Do native americans call themselves redskins? have they ever called themselves redskins?

I used to be mildly defending the name/indifferent .... now I think it should be changed.

I understand
- Dan Snyder and Wash Po found majority native americans dont find it offensive - theres a native american high school with "redskins" as their mascot
- our image of the chief is done with respect and honor, was designed by a native american and is nothing like the cleveland indians charicture.

But it was a term invented and used by the white man to refer to native americans. No its not the worst slur out there or in the history of time .. but it was a label originating and used by the white man.

Id put it up there with people referring to a black person as "blackie" back in the day. Yeah black people were called worse back then and "blackie" seems mild compared to it .... but its still a term originating from white men to label others, in a mildy dismissive term.

I just started playing Red Dead Redemption 2 and they used the words "redskins" and "blackies" and it had a dismissive context to the use, not one honoring them.

I vote to change the name, for what ever that is worth ... which is nada.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Ok,here we go again,first off Native Americans did refer to themselves as Redskins or Redmen as far back as the-1700's just as I and all Black persons once called ourselves-Negro which is the Spanish word for Black..it is the bastardization of the name that's insulting,now when the racist owner of the team[George Preston Marshall]moved the team here he kept the name for two reasons-he could in those days,he could care less.We have to remember that here was a man who refused to have an African American on his team until Morris Udall[Secretary Of The Interior]threatened to not let him use D.C.Stadium until he have a Black player..I'm getting long winded here but as a Black man if the team was called-The Washington Negroes-it wouldn't fly too well today,and Redskins shouldn't either!

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

I can totally see points on both sides, but with the vast majority of that one study (I don't know how expansive it was) saying that Native Americans aren't offended by it: what if they get offended if they "did" change it? I believe during the same study, many Native Americans said they took it something of honor and would be offended if they DID change the name.

ESPECIALLY now, this type of thing is incredibly challenging, but in the end, wouldn't it/shouldn't it be there voice that would decide something like this?

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

I think it be a great time for Dan to change the name. I actually like the name Washington Warriors much more.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Bunk. Just before camps open is the slowest news time of the year in football. Writers will write about anything. Florio using current climate as a catalyst.

Look gents, every May and June like clockwork, Florio of some other writer does an article on how the teams name is detrimental to the brand and should be changed. It happened lasts summer, it happened the summer before that. And I will bet you that this time next year it happens again.

But once July gets here, the articles stop and there are better things to discuss in football than this.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

If you go back 100 years when blatant racism against any minority was all over the place in print media and in Hollywood, the term redskin was rarely used to refer to Native Americans. I have never heard another human utter that term in my presence and I have been around many people long since passed that racial epithets were part of their daily language. For that reason I don't understand the furor over the name. I think they should complain about how they were portrayed in TV shows and movies. Until the last couple decades they were portrayed by white people with make up and made out to be savages of very little intelligence.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=mredskins;1252524]I think it be a great time for Dan to change the name. I actually like the name Washington Warriors much more.[/quote]

I don't want to have the same team name as another major sports team. If anything, find a Native American tribe that would like for or support the team using it, and use that name.

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[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1252531]I don't want to have the same team name as another major sports team. If anything, find a Native American tribe that would like for or support the team using it, and use that name.[/quote]

How about Cherokees? About a thousand or so live a couple hundred miles down the road from DC.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1252536]How about Cherokees? About a thousand or so live a couple hundred miles down the road from DC.[/quote]

Works for me. I am 100% fine with any tribe name. And it would be even more cool if they have history in the surrounding area.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1252531]I don't want to have the same team name as another major sports team. If anything, find a Native American tribe that would like for or support the team using it, and use that name.[/quote]

Rather go with warriors than Sioux or Navajo's....

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

plain and simple, fuck off

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Using a specific tribe name is not going to make the issue go away. Once the name Redskins falls other names like Chiefs, Indians, etc won't be far behind.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=MTK;1252606]Using a specific tribe name is not going to make the issue go away. Once the name Redskins falls other names like Chiefs, Indians, etc won't be far behind.[/quote]

You would need to get the tribes approval. Like the Seminole tribe is in agreement with FSU using the name. Not sure how an actual tribe name can be offensive to anyone, especially if they approved it. I mean are we actually trying to erase the memory of Native Americans?

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1252619]You would need to get the tribes approval. Like the Seminole tribe is in agreement with FSU using the name. Not sure how an actual tribe name can be offensive to anyone, especially if they approved it. I mean are we actually trying to erase the memory of Native Americans?[/quote]

Using the name or likeness of an indigenous person as a team mascot/name is what it boils down to for those on that side of the argument. It's not simply the word Redskins they have a problem with.

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[quote=sdskinsfan2001;1252619] I mean are we actually trying to erase the memory of Native Americans?[/quote]

Out of sight, out of mind.

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[quote=MTK;1252620]Using the name or likeness of an indigenous person as a team mascot/name is what it boils down to for those on that side of the argument. It's not simply the word Redskins they have a problem with.[/quote]

Well those people are absurd. That's fucking stupid. They would be offended if the team had approval from a tribe to use the name? Hell, the tribe can even pick the logo. Doesn't have to be an image of a human.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=MTK;1252606]Using a specific tribe name is not going to make the issue go away. Once the name Redskins falls other names like Chiefs, Indians, etc won't be far behind.[/quote]

Chiefs will probably stay along with Indians because those aren't deemed "racist" Redskins was apparently a term the White men used to identify natives as... For the record every native friend I have from Oklahoma likes the skins also.. But whatever, change the name fuck it

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Change it .. hell then I can close this chapter in my life .. once they change the name the identity of the team is gone .. so will the years of loyal fans .lets call them the Washington pc ‘s , the people that are offended by the name most likely don’t watch football .. it’s all political agenda crap ..I’m offended by a lot of crap mostly I’m offended by the people who are offended ! I’m offended that the nfl has a team in Chicago that the black murder rate is through the roof and they put that team on prime time ! If the nfl wants to get into politics then get into it !!! Tell the Chicago mayor either stop this genocide in your city or the Nfl will do away with your team ..I guess aethist will find the saints name offensive 😳.. and what about the browns ( is that really about the last name) hmmmm... did the cowboys not slaughter indians way back .. the native Americans should really have issues with that ..yea I know the redskins is a horrible horrible name .. how the hell could I have been so blind ...so all these years I’ve been a racist and did not know it ..I guess we all are for even pulling for team .. who can I sue for selling me stuff all these years with a rascist logo name on it ? Let’s face it .. the name is going to change .. sooner than later.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=Burgold;1252520]Ok,here we go again,first off Native Americans did refer to themselves as Redskins or Redmen as far back as the-1700's just as I and all Black persons once called ourselves-Negro which is the Spanish word for Black..it is the bastardization of the name that's insulting,now when the racist owner of the team[George Preston Marshall]moved the team here he kept the name for two reasons-he could in those days,he could care less.We have to remember that here was a man who refused to have an African American on his team until Morris Udall[Secretary Of The Interior]threatened to not let him use D.C.Stadium until he have a Black player..I'm getting long winded here but as a Black man if the team was called-The Washington Negroes-it wouldn't fly too well today,and Redskins shouldn't either![/quote]
The problem with modern-day black Americans is that you constantly compare the inhumane treatment of your ancestors to the struggles of other non-white groups. Newsflash, Native Americans didn't experience 300 years of slavery. In fact, many of them were actually slave owners. Not only that but many Native Americans fought for the South in the Civil War. Jim Crow laws weren't created for Native Americans, Latinos, Indians, Asians, or Middle Eastern people. They were created for black people. So please stop with all of these nonsensical comparisons with non-white people as if they in any way share in the struggles of black people. The term Redskin is not known to be a racial slur, nor do the fans of this team see it as a racial slur. The team name is not meant to be offensive or disrespectful to native Americans. If a small minority takes it as being offensive it's because they want to be offended. If that is the case they are free not to support the team. It's their right to protest the name if they so wish. As a black man, I believe the team name is 100% acceptable and should never be changed. And it definitely shouldn't be changed because of a bunch of SJWs are whining about it.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=httr198020;1252631]The problem with modern-day black Americans is that you constantly compare the inhumane treatment of your ancestors to the struggles of other non-white groups. Newsflash, Native Americans didn't experience 300 years of slavery. In fact, many of them were actually slave owners. Not only that but many Native Americans fought for the South in the Civil War. Jim Crow laws weren't created for Native Americans, Latinos, Indians, Asians, or Middle Eastern people. They were created for black people. So please stop with all of these nonsensical comparisons with non-white people as if they in any way share in the struggles of black people. The term Redskin is not known to be a racial slur, nor do the fans of this team see it as a racial slur. The team name is not meant to be offensive or disrespectful to native Americans. If a small minority takes it as being offensive it's because they want to be offended. If that is the case they are free not to support the team. It's their right to protest the name if they so wish. As a black man, I believe the team name is 100% acceptable and should never be changed. And it definitely shouldn't be changed because of a bunch of SJWs are whining about it.[/quote]

/End thread

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=httr198020;1252631]The problem with modern-day black Americans is that you constantly compare the inhumane treatment of your ancestors to the struggles of other non-white groups. Newsflash, Native Americans didn't experience 300 years of slavery. In fact, many of them were actually slave owners. Not only that but many Native Americans fought for the South in the Civil War. Jim Crow laws weren't created for Native Americans, Latinos, Indians, Asians, or Middle Eastern people. They were created for black people. So please stop with all of these nonsensical comparisons with non-white people as if they in any way share in the struggles of black people. The term Redskin is not known to be a racial slur, nor do the fans of this team see it as a racial slur. The team name is not meant to be offensive or disrespectful to native Americans. If a small minority takes it as being offensive it's because they want to be offended. If that is the case they are free not to support the team. It's their right to protest the name if they so wish. As a black man, I believe the team name is 100% acceptable and should never be changed. And it definitely shouldn't be changed because of a bunch of SJWs are whining about it.[/quote]

I think you need to substitute the word black for liberal. I have seen many a liberal compare the plight of a minority group to that of the inhumane treatment that black people suffered in this country for centuries.

The best recent popular example was the gay wedding cake issue in Colorado.
On another forum I no longer go to with a huge left leaning and a lot of off topic discussion, many compared the refusal to bake a gay cake with banning blacks from establishments in the Jim Crow south. Any discrimination against gays was often compared to how blacks were treated in the past. The absurdity of that is a person who is black cannot pass themselves off as being white, but a gay person can pass themselves off as being straight to avoid discrimination if need be.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

The Washington Post recently published an article which claimed that “the majority of Native Americans still aren’t offended by the name of Washington Redskins.” The article comes amid ongoing debate over whether the name of the US capital’s football team is racist.

Upon reading the poll’s findings, we quickly learn that the publication conducted this survey via phone with 500 “self-identified” Native Americans. The Post also profiled 12 of the participants who had various opinions on the mascot debate – with an emphasis on those who approve of the Washington Redskins. Curiously, the Post conducted this same survey in 2016.
Even if groups of self-identified Native Americans don’t find the term offensive, “redskins” is still racist on its face. Of the 12 profiled by WaPo, there was at least one authentic Native pointing to the fact that Natives often use the term “skins” to describe one another. This is similar to black communities reclaiming the n-word, but, likewise, not every Native person uses this word.



Should a team representing the capital of the United States really be embracing a racial slur? Washington DC is the historic gathering place for calls to action and protest centre of policy in America. The dictionary defines the term “redskins” as a racial slur, which should shut down any debate. Several Native organizations and tribes have petitioned the Washington Redskins to change their name.


Growing up on the Northern Cheyenne reservation in Montana, I wasn’t removed from my culture and community. Being rooted in heritage meant my education started with elders passing on oral history, including language used to dehumanize our ancestors. My tribe doesn’t identify as “redskins”. This is a derogatory term coined by colonialists often historically used interchangeably with “savages”.

We don’t need polls to ascertain that racial slurs are offensive. We don’t even need to compare them to “the n-word” to illustrate they’re plain wrong. What is the point of polls on the topic? They discredit work Indigenous activists have done championing for change and progression. Polls also erase Native voices who continue speaking out using the hashtag #NotYourMascot. Washington DC is supposed to be a progressive and tolerant city, yet this issue comes up for rigorous debate every few years.

While other organizations in the United States have listened to Native activists and gotten rid of offensive mascot names, a sports team representing our nation’s capitol proudly flies racism. Hiding behind “self-identified” Native Americans urging nations deeply rooted in community to get over it represents everything that is Washington DC. Not just in the era of Trump, either. We still have a lot of work to do.

[url]https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/washington-redskins-name-controversy-native-americans-racism-white-people-a9058881.html[/url]

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

This name thing has been going on a long time ... a long time ..whatever they change it to unless it’s total away from a persons ethnic or race or whatever it Won’t work ..warriors etc promotes violence .. you get the idea ..I’ve pulled for the Redskins my whole life If they change name I’m done because if won’t be the team I love ... if it’s that easy why not all of us just pick another damn team 😀.. I get it if you live in DC it’s your home however I don’t have that connection.. Washington congressionals, Washington Monuments, Washington freedom, that’s what I’m afraid of .. the name is going to be changed I hope they can somehow keep the Native American legacy in the name .. I’m not sure . Question for you .. if the redskins were to move to another city like the browns did and changed the name (ravens) would you follow them ? Unless the team keeps the identity with a mild tweak ( just drop the redskins ) just be known as Washington put the feather on helmet and let each individual decide if they want to use the nickname ...

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Just the viewpoint from an educated Brit with a mixed race family. Don't shoot me down, these are just musings, and as I'm a) not an American and b) I picked the Skins when the sport became popular in the UK, I have less of a vested interest.

I can't help thinking this is a minority of parties stirring the pot up every year or so. I mean, if you want to get into semantics and imagery, maybe the retort is "well rename/image the Patriots then too?". I mean you can easily argue that their name and logo (especially the old one) implied that only white men can be patriots. I don't believe that was the intent but it's a valid argument.

Having spent nearly a day next to a blue collar native American on a Greyhound bus discussing it among a few topics, I got the distinct impression he felt that most NA's would suggest they have far more/bigger issues than the naming of one sports team. If I recall, and it was quite a while ago, he said that maybe if there was a mass protest or the like then they should change it, but he would rather the effort go into improving job opportunities etc. than changing a brand name.

Unlike Rocnrik, I'd still follow the team, but I can see both sides of the coin. It can be construed as derogatory in a historical context, but it can also be construed as celebrating a people that should be proud of their heritage that was all but destroyed. If they did change the name, I'd have no issue as long as the new name carried that same message of pride in a culture rich in heritage.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

Change it to Skins....its what we call em anyway. It goes from racist to all encompassing.

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

I call them that anyways... just keep logo drop the nickname and let folks call them whatever .. hopefully in the near future we can call them Winners!!

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[quote=punch it in;1252684]Change it to Skins....its what we call em anyway. It goes from racist to all encompassing.[/quote]

Works for me. :-)

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

As long as they keep the name Redskins its not going to matter what logo is used, its going to be a problem. I wouldn't be surprised if Goodell and the league pressure the Skins to change the name within the next few years. Hopefully when they change the name its not something stupid like the River Dogs.

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I think the name and logo will both need to go.

Hey Irish you owe me $100 from our bet a few years back lol

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If I'm Snyder and I'm forced to change, I'm changing name to:

Washington Manifest Destiny

Logo is a wagon. Alternate, a train.

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[quote=MTK;1252854]I think the name and logo will both need to go.

Hey Irish you owe me $100 from our bet a few years back lol[/quote]

I thought we had 5 years on that bet. Time cant be going that fast I hope.

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[quote=irish;1252856]I thought we had 5 years on that bet. Time cant be going that fast I hope.[/quote]

Believe it or not we made the bet in 2013

Don't worry about it, just funny that it's been that long

Re: Skins getting heat again over name issue
 

[quote=MTK;1252858]Believe it or not we made the bet in 2013

Don't worry about it, just funny that it's been that long[/quote]

Really, 2013!? I thought it was in 2017. Wow.