Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Has anyone else here noticed the obvious disconnect between what Gibbs thinks it takes for a team to win and what the "experts" think it takes for a team to win.

Gibbs always sites:[list][*]Character [*]Mental Toughness [*]Team attitude [*]Smarts [*]Fight [*]Faith [/list]Experts always site:[list][*]Matchups [*]Records [*]Statistics [*]Specific Players [/list]In other words, experts look strictly at the tangables, Gibbs looks for the things that can't be readily measured. That is why I don't think some people will ever get why Gibbs is so successful, that is until they notice he is winning.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

I completely agree. What really makes me mad is that they seem to have forgotten his great reads during a game and his famous adjustments. It's more than just looking at those gameday pictures on the sidelines and saying wow that was so wide open on that last play. It's knowing what will be open five plays down the line. He is begining to layer his offense and that sets teams up for something unexpected. Last year he just didn't have them guessing, but this year I see a big change.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Well I went to bed watching Coach Gibbs on NFL Network and awaken to see the segment about the future of Lavar. It is clear to me, that the so-called critiques are cautiously discussing the 3-0 winning streak while adding the negative propaganda to create a division within the Redskin camp. This like all of the other silly schemes will not hide the fact that the Redskins played one of the most disciplined games in team history. 2 penalties for 10yds. is a testament to the prepardness of Coach Gibbs and his staff.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Gibbs is old school. In the old school things like character and toughness were deal makers. Because there was no free agency each team was much more coordinated and on the same page. Even the bad teams played together and knwe what they were suppose to do. They ahd all played together for longer and could be more cohesive. This made intangibles like toughness the characteristics that made the difference between winning and losing. Today in the new school free agency vastly reduces this amount of preparedness and chemistry. This has the result of making pure talent somewhat more important since a lack of it can't be hidden in preparedness. I think the characteristics that Gibbs desires are still important to winning but talent plays a bigger role now than it use to and I think Gibbs has faced that fact. This team has been by all accounts overrated talent-wise for some time. It is only now that Gibbs and Williams have worked together to increase the talent base while simultaneously ridding themselves of those who didn't have the toughnes and positive energy to help produce a winner. It shows in close wins. At least that's what I think.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

It's mostly about heart and smarts

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=FRPLG]Gibbs is old school. In the old school things like character and toughness were deal makers. Because there was no free agency each team was much more coordinated and on the same page. Even the bad teams played together and knwe what they were suppose to do. They ahd all played together for longer and could be more cohesive. This made intangibles like toughness the characteristics that made the difference between winning and losing. Today in the new school free agency vastly reduces this amount of preparedness and chemistry. This has the result of making pure talent somewhat more important since a lack of it can't be hidden in preparedness. I think the characteristics that Gibbs desires are still important to winning but talent plays a bigger role now than it use to and I think Gibbs has faced that fact. This team has been by all accounts overrated talent-wise for some time. It is only now that Gibbs and Williams have worked together to increase the talent base while simultaneously ridding themselves of those who didn't have the toughnes and positive energy to help produce a winner. It shows in close wins. At least that's what I think.[/QUOTE]

I have kind of seen things the opposite. I think with players changing over so fast it is now a coaches league - before you could stock pile players who were great. Now you have to coach w/ what you have- which is why I think Gibbs old school character, discipline and hard work will be hard to beat. But what I think makes him special is how he gets folks to [U]believe[/U].

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Free agency is actually something that I believe works in Gibbs' favor. I think by Gibbs just being purely "Old School" is a negative thing in the eyes of the media. The media wants to push whatever is new and fresh....the very presence of Gibbs in the NFL pisses the media off...and I think that is just awesome! No matter how much stock one puts in stats, individual players, contacts.....it always comes back to the basic things..play smart, put for 110% effort, fight for every yard gained. Those are the things old school coaches like Joe Gibbs or Mike Dikta like to focus on.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

guys, if the teams we faced had made all their field goals, we would be 0-3. thats why we shouldnt be making plans for detroit.

I liked what i saw out of the offence last game. but they need to be more physical on offence to play "Gibbs Football". we arent pounding the ball. the line (which has played great) still doesnt dominate on run plays.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=GoSkins!]Has anyone else here noticed the obvious disconnect between what Gibbs thinks it takes for a team to win and what the "experts" think it takes for a team to win.

Gibbs always sites:[list][*]Character [*]Mental Toughness [*]Team attitude [*]Smarts [*]Fight [*]Faith [/list]Experts always site:[list][*]Matchups [*]Records [*]Statistics [*]Specific Players [/list]In other words, experts look strictly at the tangables, Gibbs looks for the things that can't be readily measured. That is why I don't think some people will ever get why Gibbs is so successful, that is until they notice he is winning.[/QUOTE]
here here!

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Don't think the media will love Joe Gibbs if he is successful this season. It'll just be a totally different kinda spin. Something like,"Gibbs personel genius finds ways to win, no matter what situation." Hopefully it'll come to that. I wonder if Matty could dig up my post wishing for the return of Gibbs, way way way back. I've seen his magic before and trust him with all my Redskins soul. If I grew up near the some uninspired team in the early 80's to early 90's I might not even be a football fan. My total passion for watching all sports has waned in my years, but my love for the Redskins has not. I blame and thank Joe Gibbs.

IN GIBBS WE TRUST.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=FRPLG]Gibbs is old school. In the old school things like character and toughness were deal makers. Because there was no free agency each team was much more coordinated and on the same page. Even the bad teams played together and knwe what they were suppose to do. They ahd all played together for longer and could be more cohesive. This made intangibles like toughness the characteristics that made the difference between winning and losing. Today in the new school free agency vastly reduces this amount of preparedness and chemistry. This has the result of making pure talent somewhat more important since a lack of it can't be hidden in preparedness. I think the characteristics that Gibbs desires are still important to winning but talent plays a bigger role now than it use to and I think Gibbs has faced that fact. This team has been by all accounts overrated talent-wise for some time. It is only now that Gibbs and Williams have worked together to increase the talent base while simultaneously ridding themselves of those who didn't have the toughnes and positive energy to help produce a winner. It shows in close wins. At least that's what I think.[/QUOTE]

Good post F,
The media and many coach's/owners cannot understand why year after year, they suck! Forever, they Suck! Naturally, there are many reasons why this is so. The Skins are a good example of that. Radical changes every year. No core group of REDSKINS, no loyalty, no cohesion, no success. Dan was doing what he thought was right as he is a new school guy as well. He forgot what Gibbs says is the most important component-character! Joe is building an anomaly, a TEAM that will (pretty much) stick together year after year. Not without impact from free agency, but a TEAM of guys who would rather stay together-if possible. A team where the departure of a player or two is not a catastrophie. Where a player cannot hold the team for ransom because of his talent level to the team. Check out GW and his D. We all went hysterical with the departure of Champ, Fred, Pierce, etc. Greg said , NO PROBLEM. A team of men of character who would rather win another Super bowl than move on. IMO, that is much of the success in New England. These concepts are foreign in atheletes today, but Joe is making it work. It is just the beginning, and one cannot argue with the results that have already been seen. It's great! Joe knows!

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Gibbs has not showed the other Coaches his secret weapon.

Yep!
An Easy Button!
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Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

HAhahahahahahahah! Nice SBF.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=jamf]guys, if the teams we faced had made all their field goals, we would be 0-3. thats why we shouldnt be making plans for detroit.

I liked what i saw out of the offence last game. but they need to be more physical on offence to play "Gibbs Football". we arent pounding the ball. the line (which has played great) still doesnt dominate on run plays.[/QUOTE]

This seems like backwards thinking to me. If we are going to analyze every missed field goal by our opponents, then let's also analyze every field goal we've missed as well as the should be touchdowns we've had called back (i.e. Cooley vs. Chicago, Moss vs. Seattle.) The offense in my opinion is improving exponentially every game if you look at the end of last season/preseason/even vs. chicago. I'm by no means banking on Detroit, but I am feeling good about my team for the first time in a long time.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=TheMalcolmConnection]HAhahahahahahahah! Nice SBF.[/QUOTE]

hahaha!
Thanks I'm playing here all week.
Badump dump!

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=Cooley 350Z]If we are going to analyze every missed field goal by our opponents, then let's also analyze every field goal we've missed as well [/QUOTE]

Exactly. Good teams make the plays when they need them most. Moss against Dallas this year, Novak...

Remember that it was Riggins on 4th down breaking free and running into history that started the Gibbs legend. What if Miami stuffed him?

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Everyone is making a big deal out of LaVar. Fact is we are playing great D without him. We did last year, and so far this year we are too. I know we could probably be that much better with LaVar on the field, trust I would LOVE to have #56 crushing people. Williams knows more about defence and player personal in the tip of his little finger that all of us do combined. In the Washington Post this morning, Greg said LaVar is progressing and will PROBABLY see more playing time this weekend. We all have to understand that the coaches have not been able to view LaVAr on the field the last two seasons. They may be going on what they see from previous game film. We all know LaVar is a stud and should be playing, but its very clear he isn't going to touch the field until Williams and Gibbs feel he's not going to give up a big play and is ALWAYS going to be where he is supposed to be. prediction, Skins 27-14.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=jamf]guys, if the teams we faced had made all their field goals, we would be 0-3. thats why we shouldnt be making plans for detroit.

I liked what i saw out of the offence last game. but they need to be more physical on offence to play "Gibbs Football". we arent pounding the ball. the line (which has played great) still doesnt dominate on run plays.[/QUOTE]


I agree completly. But I also think we are heading in the right direction. Luck made us 3-0. But the discipline, lack of penalaties, and consistent improvement will get us some more wins as well.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

If they get their missed field goals can we at least have some of the phantom call taken back and one or two turnovers we gave up negated.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

I know it's come to a couple missed field goals, but it all balances out when you think of the way most of the games were called/played. There IS a certain amount of luck that comes into it, but unless it's ONE crucial call for one side or another, it all balances itself out in the end.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=TheMalcolmConnection]...... it all balances itself out in the end.[/QUOTE]


Although that certainly WASN'T what we were saying last season.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Because of crucial calls going only for one team or another...

On a couple of occassions, even with crappy officating, I WAS like, "Wow, we really were just outplayed."

Because anybody can say, "Well, if our offense would have scored more points, those penalties wouldn't have mattered."

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

had he made that field goal, and we lost last week, it wouldnt hvae been because of penalties. We only had two. It would have been becuase we played conservtively and didnt score.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

To quote the Football Coach of the Dallas Cowboys

"You are what your record says you are"

Even if you hate parcells, you have to admit that he is right. It doesn't matter how. The Skins are 3-0. Undefeated. Looking Good. Unbeaten. Case Closed.

There will always be some bounces and luck and missed field goals in any Football game, but they generally even out.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=5RINGS]To quote the Football Coach of the Dallas Cowboys

"You are what your record says you are"

Even if you hate parcells, you have to admit that he is right. It doesn't matter how. The Skins are 3-0. Undefeated. Looking Good. Unbeaten. Case Closed.

There will always be some bounces and luck and missed field goals in any Football game, but they generally even out.[/QUOTE]


Great post 5RINGS (you don't know how hard it is for me to compliment a Cowboys fan ;) ).

I've always respected Parcells. He tells it like it is.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

I loved the quote from Pacells last year about his QBs, something about how he knows he needs a qb but its not like he can just run out to the store and buy one.

Something of that context.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Many fans and media alike sometimes have difficulty adopting JG"s philosophy because they see how intrenched he is in the older style of winning. They have a hard time buying into the " Core Redskins " concept because in the age of free agency they know how difficult it is to keep a team together for extended periods of time the way it was before. NFL coaches now have to make their program come together much faster in order to offset the turnover on teams from one year to the next. There's just not as much time to mold teams into cohesion the way it was in JG first tenure.

However I do see signs of progress, and if we are fortunate enough to be able to keep a "Core Group" together, keep winning games, the perception will change.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

I think winning right now, even though I don't feel confident with the wins we have (far too close) it's giving our squad some much needed confidence. When was the last time we won 3 games in a row?

I do think it's time to start opening up the offense a bit. We need to put more points up to be a real threat. I love our defense to death, but they can be a lot more effective if we're up by 10 or more.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=5RINGS]To quote the Football Coach of the Dallas Cowboys

"[b]You are what your record says you are[/b]"

Even if you hate parcells, you have to admit that he is right. It doesn't matter how. The Skins are 3-0. Undefeated. Looking Good. Unbeaten. Case Closed.

There will always be some bounces and luck and missed field goals in any Football game, but they generally even out.[/QUOTE]

[b]He's right[/b]! By the way .................Bill, We, the loyal Warpath members would appreciate it if you would look elsewhere for inspiration. It truly is discomforting to see you surfing Joe's mail for that............elusive edge!
The only thing wrong with boards is all the Damn double agents

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=Kope]I have kind of seen things the opposite. I think with players changing over so fast it is now a coaches league - before you could stock pile players who were great. Now you have to coach w/ what you have- which is why I think Gibbs old school character, discipline and hard work will be hard to beat. But what I think makes him special is how he gets folks to [u]believe[/u].[/QUOTE]

i believe,wer'e gonna kick in some horse teeth.........what a upset...it's good to believe your gonna win against a team your not supposed to,i haven't felt like this in a long time....it's great except i cant fickin sleep.............

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Kick off is 11 hrs away. Hope I can sleep between now and then. The media will be singing a different tune if we can find a way to win in Denver. I mean Denver has bad beer... 4-0!!!

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

i'm hoping we can take at least one of the next two, though 5-0 sounds a lot better than 4-1 ;)

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=skinsguy]Free agency is actually something that I believe works in Gibbs' favor. I think by Gibbs just being purely "Old School" is a negative thing in the eyes of the media. The media wants to push whatever is new and fresh....the very presence of Gibbs in the NFL pisses the media off...and I think that is just awesome! No matter how much stock one puts in stats, individual players, contacts.....it always comes back to the basic things..play smart, put for 110% effort, fight for every yard gained. Those are the things old school coaches like Joe Gibbs or Mike Dikta like to focus on.[/QUOTE]

I read somewhere that the Redskins had 26 free agents in the 1982-83 Supebowl season. The most to play in any Superbowl at that time. So Joe Gibbs has adjusted pretty well so far.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

I absolutely agree. Gibbs builds a true team mentaility by building on the intangibles. The first thing he started talking about when he got the job was the 'Redskin family' and he tries to build that atmosphere. I remember Mark Schlereth talking about the skins a few years ago and he said that when Gibbs was there there were players with 'character' there. After he left there were just a bunch of 'characters'.

Yes indeed I've said it for years the media never gives him the credit he deserves.

They're way to busy sucking up to Bill Parcells. News Flash: Gibbs has one more Super Bowl ring then Parcells. I hate to say it but I believe some of it has to do with his openess about his faith.

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

[QUOTE=Sammy Baugh Fan]Gibbs has not showed the other Coaches his secret weapon.

Yep!
An Easy Button!
[IMG]http://gfx.dvlabs.com/klipmart/campaigns/sta001/images/easybutton_lg_top.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]


:laughing- he put it to good use in that Cowboy game didn't he........

Re: Why the media doesn't believe in Gibbs
 

Gibbs believes in blue collar, lunch paid kinda guys, players that work as a team towards a common goal (winning) and players that leave their egos aside. He doesn't tolerate stupid mistakes. They avoid coaches/players with a strong faith like the plague (not politically correct) .

This is in sharp contrast to what the media likes---the flashy, trashy, big mouth players with a ME FIRST attitude........their is no I in team, but there is an ME.....
they don't like teams that work together and sacrifice for the good of the team.....

Not just in football, look at the NBA playoffs........the media cheered for the flashier teams.....the Heat and the Suns........but they got the team first, no ego Spurs/Detroit in the NBA finals.......the media was yawning before the finals started and yet it went down to 7 games and that game 7 was a classic.........