Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

Been a while since I really studied the Redskins salary cap and contract situation. Seems more appropriate to do so this year given the ongoing penalty the team is absorbing from the NFL's decision to penalize for actions taken in the uncapped season.

Information shown here is sourced from the great Crazy Canuck's salary cap information housed here on The Warpath. A close study of the salary cap numbers can yield insight into possible offseason moves. It's certainly proven insightful in the past. I'll refine this as more information comes out.

[B]UPDATED - March 9, 2013[/B]

All figures presented in millions.

[B]2013 Redskins Cap Room (Overage) At Start: ($2.7)[/B]

[U]Moves Made to Date:[/U]
Released Jamaal Brown $0.2
Resigned Darrell Young ($1.0) temporary assumption
Resigned Logan Paulsen ($0.5)

[B]2013 Redskins Cap Room (Overage) Current: ($4.0)[/B]

[U]Roster Cuts or Restructures:[/U]
DeAngelo Hall $7.5
Santana Moss $3.7
Josh Wilson $3.2
[U]Adam Carriker $2.2[/U]
Maximum Cap Space Created through Cuts or Restructures: $16.6

[U]Priority Resignings/Replacements:[/U]
Fred Davis or similar TE: ($2.5)
Kory Lichtensteiger: ($2.5)
Lorenzo Alexander: ($1.8)
Nick Sundberg or similar LS: ($0.3)
Rob Jackson: ($1.6)
Sav Rocca or similar P: ($0.4)
[U]Tyler Polumbus: ($1.1)[/U]
Cap Space Required for Resignings/Replacements ($10.2)

Rookie Pool Impact ($0.5)

[B]Anticipated Cap Space Available for Free Agency: $1.9[/B]

Thanks Schneed. good information.

Certainly going to be more a quiet off season then Skins fans are used too.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;993031]Thanks Schneed. good information.

Certainly going to be more a quiet off season then Skins fans are used too.[/quote]

Yeah, at least compared to the splashy Vinny days. But I like it that way. I'd like to see our important free agents brought back, including Meriweather. And at the RT spot, which is the most troubling spot in my mind, try to get a player in the 2nd round of the draft or bring back Polumbus as a last resort.

We're on a good long-term track. I'd like to keep the financial future stable and secure, and just allow the team to come back healthier and continue to grow together. I don't need a free agent.

I wish the league execs would split the penalty one more time. I think if next years cap is flat as well they could get the nfloas signoff again, and shrink all the team portions this year and give the skins and boys the next 2 years to deal with it. but I haven't even heard of that as an option, so just wishful thinking.

the more realistic option is to move about 9million off by restructures, I would think TW and Garcon would both be good candidates for that. that would effectively split the penalty between this year and next, and allow us to get one good FA signing.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;993034]I wish the league execs would split the penalty one more time. I think if next years cap is flat as well they could get the nfloas signoff again, and shrink all the team portions this year and give the skins and boys the next 2 years to deal with it. but I haven't even heard of that as an option, so just wishful thinking.[/quote]

When they came up with the penalty, and this is just my conjecture here, but I think they said the penalty needs to hit over two years because of rules that were in place regarding how dead money could be handled. When you cut a player after June 1, you basically spread his dead cap money over two years. The $36 million was mostly comprised of Haynesworth dead money. I think the idea of the penalty was to force us to pay the piper for Haynesworth's deal like we would have under normal cap rules. So I think Mara and the other owners would probably want to stick to that logic.

[quote=CRedskinsRule;993034]the more realistic option is to move about 9million off by restructures, I would think TW and Garcon would both be good candidates for that. that would effectively split the penalty between this year and next, and allow us to get one good FA signing.[/quote]

Agree, this is totally a possibility. I hope the new Redskins insiders are able to get as much contract news in February as JLC was always able to.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

How would restructures affect Trent and Pierre's bottom line as far as earnings? Because TW had his best season as a pro and proved he's a top flight LT, and Pierre's value to the team was obvious given our record with and without him in the starting lineup. They are both holding the cards as far as financial leverage goes.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

I would also add that no, it doesn't mean it will be a quiet offseason, since last year we were hit with the penalty and we still got Garcon and Morgan and all these other guys.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;993051]I would also add that no, it doesn't mean it will be a quiet offseason, since last year we were hit with the penalty and we still got Garcon and Morgan and all these other guys.[/quote]

Well, I believe last year we were able to roll over a substantial amount of unused cap from the previous year which mitigated it, and we were looking to be very well off if we hadn't had the penalty. This year, with the cap looking to stay flat, and all the contracts growing, even if just a little, leaves us in a much less appealing spot, as the OP shows.

I also don't think it's necessarily a bad thing. It forces us to focus mainly on internal development, and I think our team has several players who could step up a level this year.

From the perspective of grooming Dan Snyder for the long term ownership, I would like to think this forced austerity reinforces that big splurge spendings have consequences, so that he is less likely to go back to those ways whenever BA/MS leave.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=GMScud;993040]How would restructures affect Trent and Pierre's bottom line as far as earnings? Because TW had his best season as a pro and proved he's a top flight LT, and Pierre's value to the team was obvious given our record with and without him in the starting lineup. They are both holding the cards as far as financial leverage goes.[/quote]

Yeah they have no reason to agree to reduce the $ coming to them, and absolutely would not do so. Restructures would amount to moving base salary to guaranteed bonus - either way they still get their money.

New cap rules prevent this from being as effective at clearing space as it had been prior to the new CBA. But it can still clear some space.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;993051]I would also add that no, it doesn't mean it will be a quiet offseason, since last year we were hit with the penalty and we still got Garcon and Morgan and all these other guys.[/quote]

The key difference there was we were going into the offseason with something like $35 million in cap space before the penalty hit. This year, we have about $13 million in space without the penalty. Layer in the penalty and we're $5 million over.

As mentioned, there are ways to clear space to make room for a free agent or two. But it's highly unlikely to be a spending spree, especially given this regime's tendency to exercise financial discretion.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

so once again we get screwed,wonderful ,how awesome would it be if we had the 18 miilion cap room ,just a long time suffering and frustrated skins fan.havce to make a splash after next season ,need to take the next big step up.........

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

No way we cut Josh Wilson, best corner we have by far.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

With RGIII personality, it would not surprise me if restructures his contract. He is about the team.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;993106]With RGIII personality, it would not surprise me if restructures his contract. He is about the team.[/quote]

Restructures actually help the player, so I dont understand this comment.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=bigant;993096]so once again we get screwed,wonderful ,how awesome would it be if we had the 18 miilion cap room ,just a long time suffering and frustrated skins fan.havce to make a splash after next season ,need to take the next big step up.........[/quote]

I think it should be clear that had we played out the Hall/AH contracts the way they were written, we would be in this same shape, so it's not like it's all "blame the NFL". BA and MS tried a clever way to get out of some really bad contracts, and once the league could without repercussions they made the bills come due.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

Ahhhh my favorite thread of the year is back... feels like spring training.

Great work Schneed. Haven't had time to analyze but I'm sure you've covered the important decisions facing the Skins in 2013.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

Crazy Canuck and/or Schneed, does guaranteeing money on a players long term contract give some cap relief or discount off the cap? I thought there was some kind of deal like that.?.?

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

I can't figure out what is, or will happen. I keep looking at it this way.... I have a full glass of water, I pour out all the water to create $36 mill in space, the NFL cries foul and says I can't do that, so they take $18 mill (so fill your glass up half way with water), the second $18 mill will be taken this year (2013), the Redskins went out and picked up a few new pieces to the puzzle to the sum of $18 mill (now fill the glass the rest of the way to the top with water).

So here is where my problem lies.... we are not going to have to get $18 mill back under the CAP because the team is not giving away (or penalized) $18 mill in CAP space, so they must be having to pay $18 mill in cash (as a penalty) for getting below the CAP illegally (in the NFL's eyes). But why would the team have to shell $36 mill out? the players were due that money, the players recieved their money. The $36 mill was already shelled out to the players.

So the question I guess is will the Skins have their CAP space set $18 mill below everyone else who will be allowed close to $120 mill? are we not supposed to go over $90 mill as a penalty for this year?

What I'm guessing is happening is the Skins got below the CAP by $36 mill to help out in Free Agency, the NFL decided to make the Skins pay a monitary penalty for getting below the CAP by $36 mill. So not only did the Skins pay out $36 mill to the players to either restructure them or cut them the NFL is fining the team another $36 mill. So in reality the team will have payed out $76 mill for two players. The players got their money, and the NFL will get their money to proportionally hand out to all the other NFL owners to use on what? paying off salaries of their players? paying their electricity bill for their stadiums? to restructure their stadiums? etc. etc.?

I get the fine, I don't get how we pay it out? it's not going to effect us CAP wise I would presume, it's not going to effect us fans except for paying higher ticket prices or parking prices to pay off DS's little scam, I would guess it would hinder our team CAP wise if the NFL said that our CAP for this year will be $18 mill less then the rest of the league in order to make it more difficult to sign free agents. plus the team would have to find a way to get down to the $90 mill.

Woah what?

The team lost $36M in cap room over 2 years. There is no fine or penalty in addition to that.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Defensewins;993156]Crazy Canuck and/or Schneed, does guaranteeing money on a players long term contract give some cap relief or discount off the cap? I thought there was some kind of deal like that.?.?[/quote]

Yes that's generally how a restructure works. We push some money from this year to future years to give us cap relief. We have a few guys we could do this with but probably not as many as previous years.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Mattyk;993162]Woah what?

The team lost $36M in cap room over 2 years. There is no fine or penalty in addition to that.[/quote]

No what I'm basically saying is I'm not understanding how the Redskins are supposed to repay the penalty? CAP space? money?

I was simply trying to say that if the NFL took away $36 mill in CAP (space) then the most we should have been able to spend is $98 mill for this year. If the CAP is set at $120 mill minus our $18 mill penalty should put us at $98 mill. My math was bad in the other post. So while the other teams are able to spend up to $120 mill our penatly only would allow us to spend up to $98 mill for this year.

Otherwise.... the team got below last years CAP by $36 mill, paid those players their contract, cut Haynesworth and restructured Hall at a lower price and picked up two or three other players putting the team right back up to the CAP limit or close. I'm not saying $36 mill, or $18 for this year is chump change by any means. But here's my problem with what I figure is the answer..... DS gets fined, he's gotten rid of a player he does not want on the team, he's restructured another to a better contract, he's picked up more weapons, he's still able to restructure current players to get below the CAP for more players for this year, he raises ticket prices and parking fees and writes a check for $18 mill to the NFL. basically WE the FANS payed for that mistake by him raising fees. The team opporates as normal with CAP room/space and restructuring players in order to pick up more players.

It's like I tried the analogy approach earlier: if I have a glass of water I either don't like (Haynesworth) or don't want to drink all of (Hall) I can pour out the water and I have an empty glass to fill with something else (new players). The NFL cried foul and said no the team would take $18 mill (so fill the glass half way). Now the team only has a half a glass to fill with some form of liquid (players). But we all know the NFL is going to want to fill that second half of glass in 2013. Yet the team spent $18 mill bringing in Morgan, Garcon and whoever. So how is the other $18 mill going to get paid? Instead of having $36 mill under the CAP to play with the NFL took $18 so the team only had $18 mill to use, which by the way should not have been used since they are requesting our second half of the $36 mill this year.

In another example its not like a team that goes over the CAP and get penalized, they take away draft picks, or fine the team a specific amount or both. However that does not effect their CAP status. By saying the Skins will have to pay $18 mill and it effect their CAP status then I would presume that the team now must get below some imaginary number ($18 mill) below whatever the CAP is for this year possibly $120 mill.

I hope someone understands what I'm not getting. lol.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=SBXVII;993189]No what I'm basically saying is I'm not understanding how the Redskins are supposed to repay the penalty? CAP space? money?

I was simply trying to say that if the NFL took away $36 mill in CAP (space) then the most we should have been able to spend is $98 mill for this year. If the CAP is set at $120 mill minus our $18 mill penalty should put us at $98 mill. My math was bad in the other post. So while the other teams are able to spend up to $120 mill our penatly only would allow us to spend up to $98 mill for this year.

[/quote]


Your math is still bad. $120 mil - $18 mil = $102 mil.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

My long arse story short if the NFL said we are being penalized the $36 mill, and the team is over the CAP now or right at it, after the NFL already took $18 mill last year, I would presume then that the team is going to have to get $18 mill below whatever the CAP is to repay the second $18 mill.

I'll try another analogy: Beer Pong...lol. lets say I have 36 red solo cups on a table with 36 ping pong balls inside. I'm not happy with the ping pong balls so I throw all of them away. Now you come along and say "you can't do that". So you take 18 of my red solo cups away from me and plan to take away the other 18 later. But I go out and fill those cups with 18 ping pong balls..... how do you get paid the other 18 cups? One would presume I would have to give you those cups. Mean while all the other owners have 36 cups plus now my cups added to their stash?

I know I'm being an idiot about this somehow. and it probably has been answered 1000000 times.

What I'm worried about is we fans not accounting for the $18 mill penalty, not minusing it from the over all CAP for this year per team and then seeing how far over our penalty we are and how much we have to reduce salaries or get below?

For some reason I just keep forseeing the team being well over what they need to be since they owe the $18 mill. What was last years CAP? what is the Skins CAP right now? and what does the team need to do to get below or repay the $18 this year? The OP showed us how we could get $19 below the CAP but is that for the penalty or after the penalty?

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

From what I remember about the cap penalty, we could split up that money however we wanted over the two years. Were we able to pay more than 18M last year or were we right up against the cap then too?

I could be wrong on this, but I thought we could do 20 then 16 if we wanted, etc.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Daseal;993197]From what I remember about the cap penalty, we could split up that money however we wanted over the two years. Were we able to pay more than 18M last year or were we right up against the cap then too?

I could be wrong on this, but I thought we could do 20 then 16 if we wanted, etc.[/quote]

I suppose we could have done that, but i think our initial response was to try to push it all (or most of it) into 2013, while we tried to overturn it, but the league mandated the 18/18 split.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

I am confused by the confusion. Seems pretty clear to me. Our cap last year was 18M less than whatever the league wide "Cap Number" was determined by formula. Same again this year (which appears to make it 102M).

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

SBXVII,

Don't take this the wrong way, but you are way overthinking this.

[quote]From the Warpath Salary Page(my edits in italics):
[I]Currently assigned player totals[/I]
$107,741
Salary Cap [I](assumed) [/I]
$120,600
Cap [I]Penalty[/I]
$(18,000)

[I]Projected Cap Shortage[/I]
$(5,141)[/quote]

So 107,741+18 = 125,741 projected redskins assigned expenses
120,600 = projected cap allowed number
therefore the Skins are 5,141M over right now


The 18Mill is just a number on a spreadsheet. DS didn't pay it out of his pocket per se. In fact you could say since his available cap is less he may have less cash outlay so his need to raise prices might be less. Personally I don't the two have any connection, but it seemed like you were looking at it like a pass the penalty onto the fans type deal, and that's not right at all.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[IMG]http://imgur.com/UmpOi.gif[/IMG]

Holy F

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=SBXVII;993194]My long arse story short if the NFL said we are being penalized the $36 mill, and the team is over the CAP now or right at it, after the NFL already took $18 mill last year, I would presume then that the team is going to have to get $18 mill below whatever the CAP is to repay the second $18 mill.

I'll try another analogy: Beer Pong...lol. lets say I have 36 red solo cups on a table with 36 ping pong balls inside. I'm not happy with the ping pong balls so I throw all of them away. Now you come along and say "you can't do that". So you take 18 of my red solo cups away from me and plan to take away the other 18 later. But I go out and fill those cups with 18 ping pong balls..... how do you get paid the other 18 cups? One would presume I would have to give you those cups. Mean while all the other owners have 36 cups plus now my cups added to their stash?

I know I'm being an idiot about this somehow. and it probably has been answered 1000000 times.

What I'm worried about is we fans not accounting for the $18 mill penalty, not minusing it from the over all CAP for this year per team and then seeing how far over our penalty we are and how much we have to reduce salaries or get below?

For some reason I just keep forseeing the team being well over what they need to be since they owe the $18 mill. What was last years CAP? what is the Skins CAP right now? and what does the team need to do to get below or repay the $18 this year? The OP showed us how we could get $19 below the CAP but is that for the penalty or after the penalty?[/quote]

You're way over thinking this.

You have $20 to spend this week, and $20 to spend next week. I come along and take $10 from you this week and next. How much do you have to spend each week?

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Mattyk;993236]You're way over thinking this.

You have $20 to spend this week, and $20 to spend next week. I come along and take $10 from you this week and next. How much do you have to spend each week?[/quote]

Exactly. It's simple.

It's not a fine, it's a penalty. We don't have to pay anything. Our cap space got reduced, so we can pay our players by $36 million less than we otherwise would have. The rest of the league gets a piece of that $36 million added to their cap, so they get more space, offsetting our loss in space.

So the players on a league-wide basis are kept whole.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

Yes, if anything, the players get jipped out of potential earnings due to us not spedning as much as we could. Its not a fine, just a limit on what we CAN spend on all player salaries.

If you want to know who benefits, and who pays for it, well, ultimately the players take it on the chin in this situation. It took 36 million dollars away from the pot that they could have earned over a two year period.

Here is an easy way to look at it - Its like the NFL gave us an NFL credit card with a 12000 dollar limit. They then found out about our pornography and unpaid 1-900 phone call addiction which negatively impacted our credit score. So they THEN came back, after the credit card was issued, and right before Christmas, and lowered our credit limit to 10,200 dollars, thus inhibiting our right to spend 12,000 dollars on telephone blowjobs like your 31 other pervert friends.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Mechanix544;993282]Yes, if anything, the players get jipped out of potential earnings due to us not spedning as much as we could. Its not a fine, just a limit on what we CAN spend on all player salaries.

If you want to know who benefits, and who pays for it, well, ultimately the players take it on the chin in this situation. It took 36 million dollars away from the pot that they could have earned over a two year period.

Here is an easy way to look at it - Its like the NFL gave us an NFL credit card with a 12000 dollar limit. They then found out about our pornography and unpaid 1-900 phone call addiction which negatively impacted our credit score. So they THEN came back, after the credit card was issued, and right before Christmas, and lowered our credit limit to 10,200 dollars, thus inhibiting our right to spend 12,000 dollars on telephone blowjobs like your 31 other pervert friends.[/quote]

No the players are kept whole. They took the $36 million they told us not to spend, and spread it around to the other teams in the league, allowing them each to spend a little more to make up for it.

That's why the players agreed to go along with this BS in the first place.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Mechanix544;993282]Yes, if anything, the players get jipped out of potential earnings due to us not spedning as much as we could. Its not a fine, just a limit on what we CAN spend on all player salaries.

If you want to know who benefits, and who pays for it, well, ultimately the players take it on the chin in this situation. It took 36 million dollars away from the pot that they could have earned over a two year period.

Here is an easy way to look at it - Its like the NFL gave us an NFL credit card with a 12000 dollar limit. They then found out about our pornography and unpaid 1-900 phone call addiction which negatively impacted our credit score. So they THEN came back, after the credit card was issued, and right before Christmas, and lowered our credit limit to 10,200 dollars, thus inhibiting our right to spend 12,000 dollars on telephone blowjobs like your 31 other pervert friends.[/quote]

First of all, i think your analogy is crude and inappropriate for this site. Its certainly not the type of thing i want to read when i come here, especially when im at work.

Secondly, the 36 million didnt disappear. the cap dollars the league took away from the skins and the other 3 penalized teams was evenly distributed among the entire league. The only reason the Union supported the penalty, was because the league told them the penalty was the only way they'd allow the cap to stay "flat" as opposed to decreasing, which woul dhave made the union look bad.

You see, the current union leadership told the players that the cap would continue to go up by something like 10% a year, like it had been in previous years. However, under the new CBA, the cap isnt going up and isnt expected ot any time soon. If the had gone DOWN, in the first year after the new CBA was signed, the union would have faced a mutiny. The penalties against the 4 teams allowed the owners to be vindictive against teams that refused to illegally collude against the players, and it allowed the union (who was supposed to represent the players interests) to save face against their constituents.

Ultimately, the players are the ones getting screwed by all of this. The league has deceived them time and time again and its own union is weak and doesnt represent their interests.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

Bottom line ,does anybody know who we are looking at in free agency with the little amount of money we have left? hopefully somebody that can help us i hope......... Dam losing that money stills stinks thou......

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

still think those penalties are bullshit... oh well.. onward mostly with the team we have and some draft picks.. have no choice but to be content with it... and even if I had a choice, i'm happy with continuing to improve from within our division champion 10-6 squad.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=Schneed10;993285]No the players are kept whole. They took the $36 million they told us not to spend, and spread it around to the other teams in the league, allowing them each to spend a little more to make up for it.

That's why the players agreed to go along with this BS in the first place.[/quote]

There is a salary cap but not a salary floor. Didn't some of the cheapskate owners stay well under the salary cap last season?

Dan Snyder and Jerry Jones would have spent right up to their cap numbers to get better players. Some of the other owners would not and, I think, did not.

The players got screwed, afterall.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;993359]There is a salary cap but not a salary floor. Didn't some of the cheapskate owners stay well under the salary cap last season?

Dan Snyder and Jerry Jones would have spent right up to their cap numbers to get better players. Some of the other owners would not and, I think, did not.

The players got screwed, afterall.[/quote]

No there still is a floor. But if a team isn't going to spend to the cap anyways then what does adding space to their limit matter? So yeah the players most likely lost out on some money overall.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=BigHairedAristocrat;993333]The league has deceived them time and time again and its own union is weak and doesnt represent their interests.[/quote]

Their union is indeed weak. Actually more accurately they are "fake tough". But I think they're made weak by their members. They signed a crap deal for them because the players didn't really have the guts to force a true work stoppage into the season. Now they're stuck with it for 10 years. Think how pissed they're going to be in 5-6 years when the cap hasn't really gone up any.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=bigant;993338]Bottom line ,does anybody know who we are looking at in free agency with the little amount of money we have left? hopefully somebody that can help us i hope......... Dam losing that money stills stinks thou......[/quote]

I'd like to see them go after Jairus Byrd, but I haven't heard that they are. They can always open up some cap room for a least one big signing.

Re: Redskins 2013 Salary Cap Status
 

[quote=FRPLG;993369]Their union is indeed weak. Actually more accurately they are "fake tough". But I think they're made weak by their members. They signed a crap deal for them because the players didn't really have the guts to force a true work stoppage into the season. Now they're stuck with it for 10 years. Think how pissed they're going to be in 5-6 years when the cap hasn't really gone up any.[/quote]

Demaurice Smith came in talking a big game, didn't back it up at all. The deals Upshaw made seem like hitting the lottery in comparison.