Hogskin, generally speaking I agree with you here though I wouldn't necessarily say those who disagree with us and think Snyder has done a poor job are fairweather fans...if that's what you were saying

Defense, I think Bill Belichick is a very big reason for the Patriots' success the past couple of years. Now, we have someone better than Belichick

Memphis, personally I sided with Marty on the D. Green situation. Green got by for years on his speed and maybe I'm a bit bias because I don't like Green the person. As a player I loved him, as a person not so much. But regardless, the problem was that what he did to Green, publicly dressing him down during training camp is just something you don't do in Redskins World. No matter if he thought he deserved it or not. Schottenheimer seemingly made his bold move when he cut Centers in the spring time but then he seemed to get power hungry after that and started alienating the wrong people.

We probably shouldn't forget just how young Danny boy is. I think he's getting better at this, though it's been chaos around here until Gibbs came back.

The big knock on Snyder is that he meddles and undercuts his coaches. That just isn't going to happen with Gibbs, so things will surely get better, and not just because Gibbs is far and away the best coach Snyder's had. Plus, as they win, Danny will be happy, and learn to let the coaches coach, and to let them handle the players, etc.

Anyway, Danny is what, like 40? How old was JKC when he got it together? How old was Roony when the Steelers got their act together? The kid is learning. And no one can doubt that he loves the skins.

Deon, George, Bruce Smith, the coaching changes, are all him trying [U][B]too hard [/B] [/U] to make it happen right away. Hey, if I were a young billionaire, I'd probably do the same things. Now he lucked into Gibbs, and Gibbs will show him how to build a winning franchise, from top to bottom. And that is good for all of us, fair weather fans, warpathers, whatever! :twocents:

[QUOTE=smootsmack]Defense, I think Bill Belichick is a very big reason for the Patriots' success the past couple of years. Now, we have someone better than Belichick.[/QUOTE]
Somehow, the fact that the Patriots are coached by Bill Belichick seems to go unnoticed whenever people discuss how ingenious the Patriots' salary cap management has been over the past few years. Thank you, smootsmack, for pointing out that the Patriots' success over that time had a little something to do with the guy patrolling the sidelines. Suppose the Redskins had been coached by Belichick all this time-- how would Dan Snyder's cap management be viewed now? Yes, Snyder has been petulant and impatient with his coaches-- [i]because none of them were good enough.[/i] But his approach to cap management might be viewed a little differently if any of those coaches were even nearly as skilled as Belichick or Gibbs. There might be a few more trophies in that case at Redskins Park to account for all that "wild spending".

Smack, yes, I think my post was a bit harsh - I apologize, Defense!! The reason I mentioned "fairweather" was just that I was getting so much negativity and pessimism about Snyder, even after the hiring of Gibbs. I figured that "when" this team proves itself to be wildly successful, there will be a 180-degree shift in the attitude about Snyder and the team. Really a poor comment on my part.

Joe I think it all boils down to Danny not hiring a GM. I think a lot of the bad moves would have been avoided if he had a solid football guy in place. I have never been a fan of Cerrato, I think he is a yes man that Danny put in place to give his moves some legitimacy. I loved it when Jerry Jones meddled in Dallas because it was sure to bring down the franchise and lo and behold it did. So when Snyder became JJ X 2 it really bummed me out, because I know that he has the best intentions but for four years he just would not admit that he wasn't the best man for the job.

It's his money, but it really is our team. We buy the merchandise, we fill the seats, we cheer the Skins on win or lose, we're in here debating Redskins football a month and a half before training camp. The only thing I have to go by is what Snyder has done so far, and the only positive thing that he's done so far is to bring back Joe Gibbs. It's been said that we didn't have the proper coach on the sidelines, how on earth could we ever find out? Five coaches in five years, with a different excuse for getting rid of each one. That says it all to me, because there has been one constant throughout. Now I don't blame the young guy for trying, I blame him for continuing to try it on his own terms. My complaint is that he is not a GM and we still do not have one. I trust Gibbs, but it is awfully difficult for one man to succeed in the NFL doing both jobs.

[QUOTE=memphisskin]It's his money, but it really is our team. We buy the merchandise, we fill the seats, we cheer the Skins on win or lose, we're in here debating Redskins football a month and a half before training camp./QUOTE]

Well, actually, it IS his team. He paid big bucks for that. He has paid for the right to operate it any way he sees fit. We, in turn, have the right to support it or not, buy the merchandise or not, and even to criticize his decisions and ridicule him if we like. But we do not get the right to call the shots. And so far, even with all of these "negative" moves, he is operating the most profitable franchise in the league. All that says is that he IS getting support for his team. I agree completely with you that I wish he had gotten a GM to make the decisions he has been bungling - MAINLY hiring head coaches - remember it was a GM (Beathard) who hired Joe Gibbs the first time around. I still think his worst mistake was hiring the wrong coaches. Yeah, you can point to some free agents he should not have hired. But that happens to even the best GM's. They just don't get all the bad press when they blunder. He has also made some very good free agent moves. And his most recent move was a REAL GEM!!! Signing Joe Gibbs.

I also agree that Champ didn't have that great a year last year.... there were too many times that he got turned around and got beat. I think he knew he was going to be gone long before the season was over...

One thing I never understood is what was Champ's dissatisfaction with the Skins? He was one of the fan's favorite players. Assume it was the same thing as always... money.

When I met champ, coming out to the team bus after the Dolphins game and asked for his autograph he said no and gave me an attitude. It was really surprising, I didnt think he would act like that to a fan in the teams bus area. Becuase the only peopel that had passes to that were family members of the team. I ended up getting his autograph becuase i went back up to him later and said he was my favority player, even then I only think he did it becuase he was with his girlfriend. He looked really mad that he had to sign my program.