Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/agent-mjd-wants-to-play-for-an-owner-who-respects-him-and-values-what-he-brings-to-a-team/2012/08/21/cfdb1042-ebe2-11e1-866f-60a00f604425_story.html]Agent: MJD ‘wants to play for an owner who respects him and values what he brings to a team’ - The Washington Post[/url]


MJD anyone?

Sure. If they'll take a 7th rounder for him. Even then, how could we afford him?

I assume you are being facetious.

Yeah I am, no way we can afford mjd

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

I would just like to say eff the Bears because my wife is a bears fan and eff the Lions because I live in Lions country.
And while we're at it, efff the whole Norris division.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;932595]I would just like to say eff the Bears because my wife is a bears fan and eff the Lions because I live in Lions country.
And while we're at it, efff the whole Norris division.[/quote]

The Caps were once part of the Norris division..................

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;932583][URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/agent-mjd-wants-to-play-for-an-owner-who-respects-him-and-values-what-he-brings-to-a-team/2012/08/21/cfdb1042-ebe2-11e1-866f-60a00f604425_story.html"]Agent: MJD ‘wants to play for an owner who respects him and values what he brings to a team’ - The Washington Post[/URL]


MJD anyone?[/quote]

He needs to suck up his pride and report.

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;932617]He needs to suck up his pride and report.[/QUOTE]

He is their best player by far but again I love how kahn is basically telling him goodbye

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

Still amazes me how pro owner fans are.

MJD was the Jags offense last year and let the NFL in rushing. If the Jags are too cheap to give him a deal, they should trade him. Unfortunately this is lose-lose situation for players like MJD (and Mike Wallace). Too bad the NFLPA couldn't work something out to allow players to be traded in situations like this.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

I love Jones-Drew. Absolutely love him. BUT...

You sign a contract extension in 09. It makes you one of the highest-paid RBs in the league. Negotiate something else in the first place or honor the contract.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=WestCoastSkinsFan;932635]I love Jones-Drew. Absolutely love him. BUT...

You sign a contract extension in 09. It makes you one of the highest-paid RBs in the league. Negotiate something else in the first place or honor the contract.[/quote]

When MJD signed his contract, he became one of the top 3 highest paid RBs in the league. The other two RBs were Steven Jackson and Larry Johnson. Another RB that was a top earner in 2009 was our own Clinton Portis. Right now Portis is about to retire, I don't know/think Johnson is employed, and Jackson is still playing ball but not at his 2009 level.

Last season, when MJD led the league in rushing, he was the 9th highest paid RB in the league behind CJ, Peterson, Jackson, DMC, DeAngelo Williams, Michael Turner, Arian Foster, and Reggie Bush. He might be 10th after Rice signed his contract.

If the Jags don't want to pay him, they should trade him.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Ruhskins;932633]Still amazes me how pro owner fans are.

MJD was the Jags offense last year and let the NFL in rushing. If the Jags are too cheap to give him a deal, they should trade him. Unfortunately this is lose-lose situation for players like MJD (and Mike Wallace). Too bad the NFLPA couldn't work something out to allow players to be traded in situations like this.[/quote]

I agree 100%. If we could afford MJD, I would take him in a heartbeat, but I now we can't and while the thought of a backfield of RGIII and MJD has me dancing in my living room for no reason at all; I will stay in reality and hope for a good season from Helu, Royster, Hightower, and Morris. (If he makes the team.)

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;932642]I agree 100%. If we could afford MJD, I would take him in a heartbeat, but I now we can't and while the thought of a backfield of RGIII and MJD has me dancing in my living room for no reason at all; I will stay in reality and hope for a good season from Helu, Royster, Hightower, and Morris. (If he makes the team.)[/quote]

Maybe Morris can become our own MJD.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Ruhskins;932643]Maybe Morris can become our own MJD.[/quote]

If any of our running backs can become anything close to MJD, I will a) shit a brick and b) invite everyone over to my house for an Alfred Morris appreciation party.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Ruhskins;932633]Still amazes me how pro owner fans are.

MJD was the Jags offense last year and let the NFL in rushing. If the Jags are too cheap to give him a deal, they should trade him. Unfortunately this is lose-lose situation for players like MJD (and Mike Wallace). Too bad the NFLPA couldn't work something out to allow players to be traded in situations like this.[/quote]


Like what, I mean he is under contract,correct?So eveytime a player has one good year ....he can go where ever he wants ,regardless of his contractual obligations,according to you...correct?

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Ruhskins;932633]Still amazes me how pro owner fans are.

MJD was the Jags offense last year and let the NFL in rushing. If the Jags are too cheap to give him a deal, they should trade him. Unfortunately this is lose-lose situation for players like MJD (and Mike Wallace). Too bad the NFLPA couldn't work something out to allow players to be traded in situations like this.[/quote]

Sometimes it's not about being too cheap, sometimes it's about budgeting and knowing the money that they bring in which is not as much as other teams since there was a rumor they woe be leaving because of fan attendance and lack of funds. Then there is paying all the bills and players and new players you budgeted for and now you have your star RB holding out for more money you might not have right now.


Or it could just be the new owner is setting a principal that he won't be bullied into a hold out that wants more money when he's already got a contract he should live up to first then get the big dollars.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Ruhskins;932633]Still amazes me how pro owner fans are.

MJD was the Jags offense last year and let the NFL in rushing. [B]If the Jags are too cheap to give him a deal, they should trade him.[/B] Unfortunately this is lose-lose situation for players like MJD (and Mike Wallace). Too bad the NFLPA couldn't work something out to allow players to be traded in situations like this.[/quote]

He already has a deal. I understand he's underpaid at 5 mil per year but not showing up is costing him money he'll never get back. Show up and try and work out a deal while you're in camp. Never understood why guys hold out who are under contract.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Giantone;932648]Like what, I mean he is under contract,correct?So eveytime a player has one good year ....he can go where ever he wants ,regardless of his contractual obligations,according to you...correct?[/quote]

well the flip side is players are asked to take pay cuts or are out right released when they under perform. i ynderstand why jones drew wants a new deal, i just don't like the holding out part. his teammates are counting on him and he's under contract.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Giantone;932648]Like what, I mean he is under contract,correct?So eveytime a player has one good year ....he can go where ever he wants ,regardless of his contractual obligations,according to you...correct?[/quote]

Contractual obligations when contracts arent guaranteed? Change players to owners and change one good year to one bad year and all of a sudden contractual obligations gets thrown out the window.

If the owners want to cut players that no longer are valued at the contract price, then why shouldnt the players ask for the same thing when the opposite happens?

Bottom line is MJD signed his contract a couple years back and is making like 5 million a year. Sorry but if anyone here was or is under contract at work and "held out " for more money, your bosses would laugh at u and say goodbye. He's a great player but He's not bigger than the jags organization, they can move on w out him. The NFL isn't The NBA, it's not a player league it's a TEAM league.

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Jags should just sit and say nothing. They shouldnt entertain any trade offers. MJD will break, he's not gonna sit out the entire year. They are in a rebuilding process anyways, not like they are pushing for the playoffs. eff MJD

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[quote=skinsfaninok;932680]Bottom line is MJD signed his contract a couple years back and is making like 5 million a year. Sorry but if anyone here was or is under contract at work and "held out " for more money, your bosses would laugh at u and say goodbye. He's a great player but He's not bigger than the jags organization, they can move on w out him. The NFL isn't The NBA, it's not a player league it's a TEAM league.[/quote]

Bottom line is owners can stop every holdout by guaranteeing contracts. They choose not to, which is fine. But they need to stop complaining about holdouts when they choose to allow them for the right to cut people "under contract".

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

I can appreciate the integrity of the players contract. If you sign a contract, you see it through. MJD signed a contract, so he should play that contract. Makes sense.

As for the "one-year" wonder argument. That if a player has one good year, he should hold out for a new contract. There's a bit more to that than what is on the surface. The answer for the most part is NO, that should not be allowed to happen (ala DeSean Jackson)

MJD led the league in rushing last season. But he also led the league in rushing attempts. And he also led his team in receptions. He averages over 8 receipts per game. And he averages over 21 rushes per game. That is almost 30 offensive touches per game, on a team that averaged a little over 60 offensive plays from scrimmage per game in 2011. Yeah, MJD LITERALLY represents 50% of the Jags total offense.

He gets more touches than any player in the league. That equates to more chances of injury than any other player in the league.

There was a new CBA signed last year. MJD's current contract was signed under the old CBA.

MJD wants to get paid..PERIOD. He wants (and based on what he brings to his team, probably deserves) GUARANTEED money. All the Jags have to do is sign him to an extension with an exceptable amount of guaranteed money, and MJD will play.

With more touches than most players in the league, it only takes one hit to end a season or worse a career.

Again, I appreciate the integrity of a contract. You signed it, play it, see it through.

And for the first time I can recall, I am actually on the side of the player on this one.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;932680]Bottom line is MJD signed his contract a couple years back and is making like 5 million a year. Sorry but if anyone here was or is under contract at work and "held out " for more money, your bosses would laugh at u and say goodbye. He's a great player but He's not bigger than the jags organization, they can move on w out him. The NFL isn't The NBA, it's not a player league it's a TEAM league.[/quote]

Difference is, you and I work at a place where we are easily replaced and are not in the NFL. The Jags need MJD more than he needs them. You take care of your own, this just shows that the Jags will suck for a while. They could afford Laurent Robinson to a 30 million dollar contract, but can't afford Drew?

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;932689]I can appreciate the integrity of the players contract. If you sign a contract, you see it through. MJD signed a contract, so he should play that contract. Makes sense.
Again, I appreciate the integrity of a contract. You signed it, play it, see it through. [/quote]


SO why don't you have that same mentality with the owners? They sign a player to a contract but are allowed to cut them at anytime without owing them the full contract. That street goes both ways. Either players should be allowed to hold out, or owners need to guarantee their full contracts. Owners should not have all the leverage.

Not sure why the NFLPA didn't do more in the lockout to combat this. NBA contracts allow some of them to "opt out", which is really something I expected to see in the NFL.

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[quote=NC_Skins;932697]SO why don't you have that same mentality with the owners? They sign a player to a contract but are allowed to cut them at anytime without owning them the full contract. That street goes both ways. Either players should be allowed to hold out, or owners need to guarantee their full contracts. Owners should not have all the leverage.

Not sure why the NFLPA didn't do more in the lockout to combat this. NBA contracts allow some of them to "opt out", which is really something I expected to see in the NFL.[/quote]

Amazes me that more people don't follow that concept as well.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;932585]Yeah I am, no way we can afford mjd[/quote]

Cut Cooley, cut Grossman, restructure a couple of guys like Moss and J. Brown and it's done. Give Dan Snyder credit, he's worked cap miracles before.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

As far as MJD is concerned. I doubt you will EVER see Shanahan pay big money for a RB. It's been proven that his backs can be replaced and provide the same production. It's in part why he moved Portis to us for Bailey. Simply put. Not going to happen and never will. (on paying any back huge money)

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

Everytime someone says "cut Cooley" God kills a kitten and gives birth to a new rapper.
:-(

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=NC_Skins;932697]SO why don't you have that same mentality with the owners? They sign a player to a contract but are allowed to cut them at anytime without owing them the full contract. That street goes both ways. Either players should be allowed to hold out, or owners need to guarantee their full contracts. Owners should not have all the leverage.

Not sure why the NFLPA didn't do more in the lockout to combat this. NBA contracts allow some of them to "opt out", which is really something I expected to see in the NFL.[/quote]
We have to accept the fact that we will never see fully guaranteed contracts. The players and the NFLPA have accepted it.

That's why they meet in the middle. Where they can get a portion of that contract guaranteed..

And since we as fans don't necessarily get to see every little detail in a players contract, we have no way of knowing what they are owed.

All we here is what ESPN tells us. "Player A signed a 5 year deal with Team B worth 15 million". Thats all we get to see. Does that mean since the contract could be worth 15 million, that if the player is released he should get all 15?

We don't know how much of that 15 million is wrapped around incentives, or participation, or workout bonuses etc.

I agree with you in that common sense tells us that a contract is a contract is a contact and should be honored by both parties involved.

All I am saying is that a certain amount of a players contract should be guaranteed.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;932711]We have to accept the fact that we will never see fully guaranteed contracts. The players and the NFLPA have accepted it.

[B]That's why they meet in the middle. Where they can get a portion of that contract guaranteed..[/B]

And since we as fans don't necessarily get to see every little detail in a players contract, we have no way of knowing what they are owed.

All we here is what ESPN tells us. "Player A signed a 5 year deal with Team B worth 15 million". Thats all we get to see. Does that mean since the contract could be worth 15 million, that if the player is released he should get all 15?

We don't know how much of that 15 million is wrapped around incentives, or participation, or workout bonuses etc.

I agree with you in that common sense tells us that a contract is a contract is a contact and should be honored by both parties involved.

All I am saying is that a certain amount of a players contract should be guaranteed.[/quote]


Is refusing to even negotiate an extension meeting in the middle though?

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;932712]Is refusing to even negotiate an extension meeting in the middle though?[/quote]
Not at all. Jags are playing hardball. MJD sticking to his guns. We have all seen this before.

Hold out lasts throughout training camp and preseason. The two parties get together the day after the final preseason game and they reach a compromise of some sort. And I think a lot of it will be the Jags waiving a majority if not all of the fines MJD has incurred wince his holdout started.

Same story, different team, different player, different year.

And some player on a team will pull this next year as well. Mark that down. And the outcome will mostly likely be the same.

MJD saw that contract extension that Forte landed with the Bears this year. Forte gets something in the neighborhood of 17 M GUARANTEED. That is what MJD is looking at. He does not have that type of guarantee.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;932689]I can appreciate the integrity of the players contract. If you sign a contract, you see it through. MJD signed a contract, so he should play that contract. Makes sense.

As for the "one-year" wonder argument. That if a player has one good year, he should hold out for a new contract. There's a bit more to that than what is on the surface. The answer for the most part is NO, that should not be allowed to happen (ala DeSean Jackson)

MJD led the league in rushing last season. But he also led the league in rushing attempts. And he also led his team in receptions. He averages over 8 receipts per game. And he averages over 21 rushes per game. That is almost 30 offensive touches per game, on a team that averaged a little over 60 offensive plays from scrimmage per game in 2011. Yeah, MJD LITERALLY represents 50% of the Jags total offense.

He gets more touches than any player in the league. That equates to more chances of injury than any other player in the league.

There was a new CBA signed last year. MJD's current contract was signed under the old CBA.

MJD wants to get paid..PERIOD. He wants (and based on what he brings to his team, probably deserves) GUARANTEED money. All the Jags have to do is sign him to an extension with an exceptable amount of guaranteed money, and MJD will play.

[B]With more touches than most players in the league, it only takes one hit to end a season or worse a career[/B].

Again, I appreciate the integrity of a contract. You signed it, play it, see it through.

And for the first time I can recall, I am actually on the side of the player on this one.[/quote]

I think the players have fueled this theory that football is their life long job and whenever football ends for them their life long job will be over. Lets as fans be a little more savey then that and realistic. We know the average number of yrs a football player plays is 10 yrs. That is not a life long career. The players themselves need to wake up and realize that football is not going to last for them and that they will need a secondary career to build around. Thats what college was for so they could get the education and knowledge of a job field they would eventually end up in after football.

[B]Owners:[/B] want to pay as little as possibe and get the most reward. Sign players to contracts and not have to worry about reworking contracts. and if players can't play for whatever reason... cut them.

^ the key here is the owner is still responsible for a portion of the contract even after the player has long gone. Heck does Randel El, Haynesworth, and a half a dozen other players ring a bell. I'm sure we are still paying on someone.

[B]Players: [/B]want the big $$$. A house, car, bling, partying, etc. etc. They want to rework their contracts when they have a good season.... would they be willing to rework them for lower salaries if they have a bad season? Their mind set is "I want to get paid cause football won't last forever and I could get injured and never play again." HELLO... um, thats why you took classes in college to get a job skill.

I'm on the fence. Always have been. Maybe leaning more towards the owners since the players agreed to the contracts, they signed saying they would take that money for each year. If they thought they were better then they were they should not have signed for so little money. Not everyone gets to start out in the penthouse, usually you have to start at the bottom and work your way up through the company which means you to probably took a job for less then what you thought you were worth and hopefully later got better pay. or you leave for another company that will, ie; Free Agency.

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[quote=EARTHQUAKE2689;932696]Difference is, you and I work at a place where we are easily replaced and are not in the NFL. [B]The Jags need MJD more than he needs them.[/B] You take care of your own, this just shows that the Jags will suck for a while. They could afford Laurent Robinson to a 30 million dollar contract, but can't afford Drew?[/quote]

i disagree a little bit. rb is such a replacable position. rashard jennings could probably give them 1,000 + yards and they easily make up the rest with Blackmon and Robinson in the passing game. plus, jones drew plays on a loser. the jags aren't going anywhere with or without him and the owner knows it....giving him the upper hand.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;932720]Not at all. Jags are playing hardball. MJD sticking to his guns. We have all seen this before.

Hold out lasts throughout training camp and preseason. The two parties get together the day after the final preseason game and they reach a compromise of some sort. And I think a lot of it will be the Jags waiving a majority if not all of the fines MJD has incurred wince his holdout started.

Same story, different team, different player, different year.

And some player on a team will pull this next year as well. Mark that down. And the outcome will mostly likely be the same.

[B]MJD saw that contract extension that Forte landed with the Bears this year. Forte gets something in the neighborhood of 17 M GUARANTEED. That is what MJD is looking at. He does not have that type of guarantee.[/B][/quote]

The difference was Forte was making under a million dollars and Jones Drew is makng 5 million. I doubt Jones Drew will get 17 mil guaranteed with the mileage he's got on his body.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

MJD and the Jags owner need to sit down and work something out. I see no reason why they can't toss him a little bone.

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In MJD's case I understand both sides position.
But, right now the Jags have all the leverage, especially if they think Jennings can be serviceable.

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[quote=30gut;932737]In MJD's case I understand both sides position.
But, right now the Jags have all the leverage, especially if they think Jennings can be serviceable.[/quote]

Yes, Jones-Drew has literally been their entire offense for years...his workload has been the highest in the league, so he's earned the paycheck.

However, the team has run him into the ground and shortened his career, so it's a risk to pay him.



Come to the Redskins, Maurice. You won't have to make the annual London trip with us.

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=Monkeydad;932741]Yes, Jones-Drew has literally been their entire offense for years...his workload has been the highest in the league, so he's earned the paycheck.

However, the team has run him into the ground and shortened his career, so it's a risk to pay him.

Come to the Redskins, Maurice. You won't have to make the annual London trip with us.[/quote]IDK about him coming to the Redskins.

MJD is a beast, he's a great running back but the team around wasn't good enough to benefit form his production.
And I doubt the team is good enough to benefit from it right now as they groom Blaine Gabbert.
And by the time the passing offense is reading to carry the team MJD will be all used up.

From a franchise perspecitve it doesn't make sense to reward a player for past performance, especially when it likely will not benefit from there production going forward. (benefit in the case being playoff contention)

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If I were the Jags owner, and i know im not, but if I were, two things I would do.

1. Increase the rest of his contract a mil per year for the next two remaining years, so he would make 5.4 and 5.9 million per year through the 13-14 season.

2. Add one more guaranteed year at 4 mil for the yr onto the ass end of the contract
so he would make 4.0 mil the last year of his contract, in which he would be 31 years old. He would be quite the geriatric if he lasts that long, with his running style and the reliance the Jags lean on him for, but I will say I think that he deserves it. Even if he completely takes a step back THIS season, I find it hard to believe the Jags would cut him in the last year, when he is only set to make 4.4 million next year.

Throw him a bone, like Matty said, give him 1 mil a year more for the next two years, and then guarantee a 4th year at 4 mil. Seems lie a fair compromise, and both sides would be happy.

*It would keep him in the top 8 RB's average salary for this year (so far, barring any additional late signings or salary adjustments)
-

Re: Around the NFL Preseason week 3
 

[quote=30gut;932744]IDK about him coming to the Redskins.

MJD is a beast, he's a great running back but the team around wasn't good enough to benefit form his production.
And I doubt the team is good enough to benefit from it right now as they groom Blaine Gabbert.
And by the time the passing offense is reading to carry the team MJD will be all used up.

From a franchise perspecitve it doesn't make sense to reward a player for past performance, especially when it likely will not benefit from there production going forward. (benefit in the case being playoff contention)[/quote]

I don't know. I kinda like the thought of him coming here. What is more dangerous in the zone rushing scheme than a ridiculously shifty quick as lightning back that is built like a rock, yet is only 5 foot nothing?Add to it that he is a respectable pass protector. Thats not to say he's Clinton Portis, but he does very well for his size (better than any of our current backs I'm afraid, maybe even Hightower) and he would take A TON of pressure off of Griffith in his rookie campaign. He still has 3 or 4 good years left I say, plus, his workload would definitely be lower here, since we have a decent passing game with our QB and WR's. The only thing we AIN't got here is Jacksonvilles line, which I'm sorry to say is vastly superior to ours right now...............

But, it could work. Wouldn't cry a river if we cut cooley, moss, brown and someone else, restructured a contract, maybe two, and tried it.