The Competition With the ES Board
 

The main reason that we are all NFL football fans is the we are all competitive by nature and, short of war, the NFL offers the ultimate competitive game.

This board is in a competition with the Extremeskins site for membership and is losing the battle. In order to first survive and then eventually turn that around, you need a turnaround strategy. Luckily, the ES mods have left an opening. It's their Achilles Heel. Within certain extreme limits, personal attacks are permitted and even encouraged, with mods participating, depending upon the opinion expressed.

The ES policy favors those espousing the currently popular opinion whatever it might be; and since the homers outnumber the realistic fans in all NFL cities, ES is a site favoring homers.

When it comes to their football team, the homers are manic. When winning, their hopes go unrealistically high. When losing, they sink into anger and harsh criticism. Their opinions will always conflict with those of the realistic fan. The case of Mark Brunell is instructive. To the homer, Mark Brunell went from being completely washed up in 2004 to an All-Pro in 2005. To the realist, Mark took too much blame from the homers in 2004 and is getting too much credit for the 2005 turnaround.

This natural conflict between the homers versus the realists presents the opportunity for this site to increase its membership by promoting a higher level debate between the two groups.

Threads that preach to the homer choir are boring. Their authors are seeking praise and usually get it. The debate threads are what people want to read and participate in because, as being football fans attests, we are competitors by nature.

On long-running internet debate boards there's a simple rule: argue the topic. Ridicule and other personal attacks are not only considered rude and gutless, they are seen as signals that the aggressor is devoid of sound, logical points.

It's too much to ask that posters turn the other cheek when attacked; but since our posts provide a written record, it's easy for moderators to nail the aggressor, the poster who took the first shot. I suggest a hardline policy on this board to do just that and do it fairly. The moderator's opinion on the topic should not influence his judgment either way.

A mod recently told me here that this board didn't want "controversy for the sake of controversy." Well, who decides when the original poster is creating controversy for controversy's sake...a moderator who disagrees with the poster's opinion?

A weak position by a discussion board on arrogant, personal attacks results in promoting the currently popular opinion and stifling the unpopular. It's a not-so-subtle form of censorship that degrades the debate. This is what they are doing over at Extremeskins...and this is the weakness that this board can exploit.

The LaVar debate, the Ramsey-Brunell debate, the Brunell-Campbell debate, the pros and cons of the major personnel moves...controversy...this is what Redskins fans want to read about and discuss. The number of responses and reviews on such threads are evidence of this. Give the fans what they want but do it better than they do over at the ES board. Do it by a rigid policy of stifling the personal attacks on people who post unpopular opinions.

In the ES board, you are facing a bigger opponent. Offering the same kind of posts with fewer participants isn't going to beat them. You need to do something very different.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

ugh.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Why do you think we're competing w/ ES? I couldn't care less about what they're doing.

This is not a business venture, it's a hobby.

Since you have some really good ideas :rolleyes: why don't you go start a board that will cater to people like you?

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

yawn....

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Oh yeah.......please let me know when this so called "competition" started. I've been here for 2 years and I never knew we were competing w/ ES.

If you're not happy w/ the warpath, then feel free to go to ES if it caters more to your likings. We have a good family of fans here that appreciate the site and that come here because they enjoy it. Not because we're trying to compete w/ other message boards.

This is one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen I must say.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

cpayne ain't a people person is he?

lol

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[QUOTE=Sammy Baugh Fan]cpayne ain't a people person is he?

lol[/QUOTE]


Nah...he just keeps it real.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[QUOTE=Sammy Baugh Fan]cpayne ain't a people person is he?

lol[/QUOTE]
I like people just fine. It's morons that I don't care for.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Ahhhh.. You don't "suffer fools very well" then is an old term that seems to fit.

peace

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Thanks for the suggestions Huddle.

I don't consider us to be in competition with ES, or with any of the other Skins sites either for that matter. If membership is what matters, hell I could just artificially inflate our membership total until we topped everyone.

Each site has their own flavor and appeal. I recommend that everyone check out all the Redskins sites and find one that best suits them. I frequent other Skins boards myself.

I understand what you're saying regarding cutting down on the personal attacks, but I think we are pretty tame in comparison to other sites. It's a very fine line to walk between being aggressive in weeding out the less desirables, and running the site with an iron fist.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

ive used both and by far,this site "keeps it real". well,most of the time

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=cpayne5]I like people just fine. It's morons that I don't care for.[/quote]

I understand your objection.

Prohibiting posters from making gutless personal attacks from the safety of your keyboard would cramp your style...wouldn't it?

I can also understand why you and the others are unconcerned about the membership numbers. None of you are identified as contributors. You take but you don't pay for the privilege.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=Huddle]I understand your objection.

Prohibiting posters from making gutless personal attacks from the safety of your keyboard would cramp your style...wouldn't it?

I can also understand why you and the others are unconcerned about the membership numbers. None of you are identified as contributors. You take but you don't pay for the privilege.[/quote]

Actually, we pass the hat every so often here to help pay for the server costs and many, many people have been VERY generous.

When I upgraded the forum software a few weeks ago the "donator" status that used to show under members' names went away, I need to upgrade our paypal payments add-on to get that back.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=Mattyk72]Thanks for the suggestions Huddle.

I don't consider us to be in competition with ES, or with any of the other Skins sites either for that matter. If membership is what matters, hell I could just artificially inflate our membership total until we topped everyone.

Each site has their own flavor and appeal. I recommend that everyone check out all the Redskins sites and find one that best suits them. I frequent other Skins boards myself.

I understand what you're saying regarding cutting down on the personal attacks, but I think we are pretty tame in comparison to other sites. It's a very fine line to walk between being aggressive in weeding out the less desirables, and running the site with an iron fist.[/quote]

Okay, Matty.

You're right. Compared to ES, this place is pretty tame. But, coming from me, that's damning with faint praise.

In any case, I appreciate the respectful reply.

Take it easy.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Numbers are not always the most important thing to all site owners. I speak from expeirence as the current owner of [url]www.boastingrights.com[/url].

We can't buy new members but the folks that do post and play our pools are the folks we can hang out with and enjoy.

About 4 guys from here are members and can testify to the lack of activity in numbers and threads but it "is what it is" and it's the one and only place for soing what we do.

Be what you are and what you want to be and you will be and get the results you wish.

Good folks that care and give their opinions are one of the best things and the warpath is lucky to have you and other folks that care so much.

Keep the ideas coming man if for no other reason then it makes that vein on cpaynes nexk bulge out. lol!!!


peace
mike

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=Huddle]I understand your objection.

Prohibiting posters from making gutless personal attacks from the safety of your keyboard would cramp your style...wouldn't it?

I can also understand why you and the others are unconcerned about the membership numbers. None of you are identified as contributors. You take but you don't pay for the privilege.[/quote]

Huddle, I wouldn't worry about this stuff too much. Personally when someone attacks me or makes fun of what I post - it's no skin off my back. The same safety that allows people to attack another with anonimity (sp ?) here is also the same safe anonimity that allows me to also post my honest opinion. I try to steer anyway from attacking anyone on here and try to not engage in that behavior if someone attacks me. That doesn't excuse anyone's rude behavior on here, but taking things too seriously on any discussion board will eat at you.

And personally I have learned to consciously be aware when someone attacks me in any manner, and not let it affect me in a negative way. It doesn't mean I have to ignore it in all cases, I just choose to try to react to it differently from the way the attacker did.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[QUOTE=Huddle]I understand your objection.

Prohibiting posters from making gutless personal attacks from the safety of your keyboard would cramp your style...wouldn't it?

I can also understand why you and the others are unconcerned about the membership numbers. None of you are identified as contributors. You take but you don't pay for the privilege.[/QUOTE]

Did you just say Cpayne5 isn't a contributor? I know you couldn't have just said that. Cpayne5 is one our top contributors-he gives us monetary donations, he offers up his own server space, he compresses video and audio files for us. So don't go say that he doesn't pay for this privilege. He contributes greatly to it in many many ways.

This site prides itself on the quality its members, not the quantity. And Cpayne5 is one our top members. There is no question about that at all (Cpayne, the check's in the mail right) ;)

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Just a question Huddle...

What's with all the crusade? I mean talk about making controversy for sake of controversy. I don't think it's been stated or implied that this site is trying to "beat" ES. I frequent that site as well. Some of us just prefer this one because it's more of a family atmosphere and your voice is "heard". I would think that this, among other reasons, is why (and I'm not speaking for everyone here) we would prefer the membership stay with quality over quantity.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

i dont think huddle plays well with others:)

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Huddle would have just loved our original April Fool's plan...a mega-merger with Extremeskins. That would have solved all these problems.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

ahhhh "personal attacks" are back! Last year at this very time everyone was using the word personal attack.
DOn't personally attack me.
No you personal attacked me first.
O no you di'int.

That was the best!!1!

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=BigSKINBauer]O no you di'int. [/quote]

I just imagine someone saying this with an attitude neck roll, but said better when said indirectly (he/she instead of you):

[I]O no he/she di'int.[/I]

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Huddle, as usual, you're making no sense to me. What makes you think we're in competition with ES? And how do you tell who wins the 'competition'? Do you count members?

I can only speak for myself, but I actually think a smaller number of posters on a site like this is better. We have a pretty intimate setting here where we've had the ability to get to know each other and our opinions because the board isn't flooded with 20,000 members writing posts every second. I wouldn't want anything to change.

And your whole argument is just wierd. You're basically saying the mods should try to direct the discussions on here towards anti-homerism? Because the whole appeal of these forums is an opportunity to state your opinion, no matter what it is. When the mods are participating in a Redskins discussion, they're rarely posting as mods. They're posting as regular members of the site, giving their opinion. I would want them to keep expressing their opinions however they see fit, because they're not just the Administrators, they're part of the community too. A good forum allows for the free expression of ideas and thoughts, and doesn't try to steer discussion in one direction or another. I can't imagine why we'd want to change that.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

In the end Huddle, it just comes across like you're getting tired of being told you're wrong by everyone. So instead you're asking the mods to direct site discussions more in line with the way you think. Instead, you could consider the very real possibility that you are almost always wrong.

My guess is you tried ExtremeSkins and you realized how much people disagree with you there. Then you tried this place and realized how much people disagree with you here. Could it be that you're just way off base with every post you write?

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

I used to visit other sites but they never really appealed to me. This is kinda like my home away form home.

The Warpath is the Cheers to my Norm!!!

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

I'm staying away from this thread. A lot of people appear to have hit their monthly cycle. Have some Tums, Midol and chill. :Smoker:

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=warriorzpath]I just imagine someone saying this with an attitude neck roll, but said better when said indirectly (he/she instead of you):

[I]O no he/she di'int.[/I][/quote]

Perfection.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

Once again, of all the people asking for others to argue the topic, YOU shouldn't be one of them. Its something you simply cannot do. You also make personal attacks, so i'm not sure why you continue to act like you're somehow above the fray or better than anyone else.

Its like your whole purpose here is to try and prove you're smarter than anyone else, but so far you've not only disproved that mightily, you've also come off as smug, condescending, arrogant, and totally out of touch with reality.

The site is most definately not in competition with ES, its completely different in that it offers a closer community (people know each other) and a much lower signal to noise ratio. Offering a fan site that's against fans is STUPID and its not a good way to keep a site running. There are plenty of realists here, and if you can't see that, you're welcome to start your own redskins site where instead of talking about the skins all you do is bitch constantly about pointless and trivial things, make some truly retarded statements (its not a personal attack, if you think it is, I'll repeat them all over again), and somehow act like your sh*t don't stink.

The world does NOT adapt to you. Your problems with reality should NOT become our problems, so please stop trying to pawn them off on us like its our fault you can't make any sort of logical arguement or admit when you're wrong.

("I can't be wrong, I'm too smart, its just the 6billion other people that are wrong.") Maybe your mom said you were special one too many times, but its time to grow up and get real.

Re: The Competition With the ES Board
 

[quote=Schneed10]Huddle, as usual, you're making no sense to me. What makes you think we're in competition with ES? And how do you tell who wins the 'competition'? Do you count members?

I can only speak for myself, but I actually think a smaller number of posters on a site like this is better. We have a pretty intimate setting here where we've had the ability to get to know each other and our opinions because the board isn't flooded with 20,000 members writing posts every second. I wouldn't want anything to change.

And your whole argument is just wierd. You're basically saying the mods should try to direct the discussions on here towards anti-homerism? Because the whole appeal of these forums is an opportunity to state your opinion, no matter what it is. When the mods are participating in a Redskins discussion, they're rarely posting as mods. They're posting as regular members of the site, giving their opinion. I would want them to keep expressing their opinions however they see fit, because they're not just the Administrators, they're part of the community too. A good forum allows for the free expression of ideas and thoughts, and doesn't try to steer discussion in one direction or another. I can't imagine why we'd want to change that.[/quote]INTIMATE?:grouphug: ,I never knew you felt that way.:embarrass .