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dmek25 03-15-2009 11:02 AM

taxes and health care
 
[URL="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29703278"][COLOR=#07519a]NYT: Obama open to healthcare tax[/COLOR][/URL]
boy, i hope they don't go thru with this. and if they do, does it include congress?

Schneed10 03-15-2009 11:17 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=dmek25;537040][URL="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29703278"][COLOR=#07519a]NYT: Obama open to healthcare tax[/COLOR][/URL]
boy, i hope they don't go thru with this. and if they do, does it include congress?[/quote]

dmek, how can you be for universal healthcare but not for this?

firstdown 03-15-2009 11:56 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=Schneed10;537043]dmek, how can you be for universal healthcare but not for this?[/quote]
Schneed these are two different things. This idea would tax the person who receivies health ins. from their employer as income. So if your employer provides you health insurance and it cost them $6,000 per year you will be taxed on that as income. Now, the business can write it off as an expense and the employer receives the benifit without having to pay taxes on this benefit. Universal Health Ins. is goverment run health Insurance and they tax businesses and individuals to pay for the program. This is just another way for Obama to raise taxes while they say they are not increasing taxes just saying you have to pay taxes for this benefit. There will be more so just sit back and hold on to your wallet.[IMG]http://www.thewarpath.net/images/icons/icon13.gif[/IMG]

70Chip 03-15-2009 02:46 PM

Re: taxes and health care
 
We wouldn't be in this mess if more people were like me. I haven't seen a doctor since 1992 and I feel fantastic. "No quack sawbones is going to apply their leaches to me."

Trample the Elderly 03-15-2009 08:14 PM

Re: taxes and health care
 
Health insurance is a racket. I stopped mine when I got into an auto accident and they wouldn't pay for my emergency room visit. That means I was paying a hundred dollars a month for squat.

Do what I do. If you really need to go to the doctor then find a good family doctor and pay him cash. Mine gives me a discount for cash.

If you've a serious injury go to the emergency room. What's money when you're bleeding to death or your skull's split open? If you don't have insurance they give you a discount too! This happened to me the last time an old lady got her foot stuck in the acclerator and broadsided me in a parking lot. As soon as they found out I had no insurance they gave me a 45% discount right off the top.

If you have kids then you'll have to find a different schtick.

If you really want to stick it to the man. Go to the hospital and tell them your name is (Jose Lorca Ramirez Gonzalez Canseco Cruz) when anything hurts or you just have a sniffle. Make sure you disguise your voice like the Taco Bell dog. Give them some dummy SSN from some dead person, pay for one, or just make one up. They don't fingerprint you! When they send you a bill (assuming you gave them the right address) tell them that that person moved back to their country of origin, or you're Jose Ramirez and you don't know Jose Canseco. Didn't he play for the As? There you go, free national health care courtesy of the U.S. tax payer.

Think it doesn't work? Millions of people do it everyday. Why do you think it cost so much now? I mean it's not like they've cured cancer or AIDS.

Disclaimer: I have never committed fraud and do not advocate that anyone does for any reason. I've always used my SSN and have never gone by anything other than my given name or hey you.

Schneed10 03-15-2009 09:31 PM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=firstdown;537048]Schneed these are two different things. This idea would tax the person who receivies health ins. from their employer as income. So if your employer provides you health insurance and it cost them $6,000 per year you will be taxed on that as income. Now, the business can write it off as an expense and the employer receives the benifit without having to pay taxes on this benefit. Universal Health Ins. is goverment run health Insurance and they tax businesses and individuals to pay for the program. This is just another way for Obama to raise taxes while they say they are not increasing taxes just saying you have to pay taxes for this benefit. There will be more so just sit back and hold on to your wallet.[IMG]http://www.thewarpath.net/images/icons/icon13.gif[/IMG][/quote]

Thanks, I'm well aware of the differences. But taxing employees on their health insurance and taxing to fund universal health care have one important thing in common: increased taxes.

I don't see how you can be for universal health care but at the same time against this. Unless you're completely oblivious to the funding source.

firstdown 03-16-2009 09:55 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=Schneed10;537139]Thanks, I'm well aware of the differences. But taxing employees on their health insurance and taxing to fund universal health care have one important thing in common: increased taxes.

I don't see how you can be for universal health care but at the same time against this. Unless you're completely oblivious to the funding source.[/quote]
The crowd for Universal Health care look at it as something great but taxing their current coverage is just money out of their pocket. If universal health insurance does ever get passed it will be real interesting to see how peoples views change as their taxes go up 7 to 9 grand per year.

Schneed10 03-16-2009 09:57 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=firstdown;537195]The crowd for Universal Health care look at it as something great but taxing their current coverage is just money out of their pocket. If universal health insurance does ever get passed it will be real interesting to see how peoples views change as their taxes go up 7 to 9 grand per year.[/quote]

Maybe that's the issue, maybe folks aren't understanding exactly how expensive it would be to cover everybody (unless you want shoddy coverage).

saden1 03-16-2009 11:28 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
Taxing private health benefits is retarded. Instead of dancing around and trying to be "creative" they aught tax everyone equally. I think Oprah said it best, "you get taxed, you get taxed, you get taxed, everyone gets taxed."

Schneed10 03-16-2009 11:34 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=saden1;537213]Taxing private health benefits is retarded. Instead of dancing around and trying to be "creative" they aught tax everyone equally. I think Oprah said it best, "you get taxed, you get taxed, you get taxed, everyone gets taxed."[/quote]

Man card, please. You're quoting Oprah.

If everyone is getting taxed equally for the healthcare portion of their taxes, aren't you simply eliminating all choice? I would no longer pay for my private insurance, neither would my employer, instead I'd get taxed for a universal plan which may or may not fit my needs. I don't see how that's better.

Secondly, there's a reason so many people go without health coverage right now, they can't afford it. Just because you're coming up with a universal plan doesn't mean it will be any less expensive than HMOs available now. If you're adding a level tax to everyone to cover it, the poor will not be able to afford it.

Schneed10 03-16-2009 11:37 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
It should be noted that the word "universal" does not mean universal coverage. It means it covers all citizens.

It absolutely does not mean all medical expenses would be covered. To make universal coverage remotely feasible from a financial perspective the coverage would have to be akin to what Medicaid HMOs currently provide (ie, terrible). You'd be hard pressed to get coverage for elective (non-emergency) surgeries.

FRPLG 03-16-2009 11:40 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=Schneed10;537220]You'd be hard pressed to get coverage for elective (non-emergency) surgeries.[/quote]

What kinds of surgeries are these?

firstdown 03-16-2009 11:40 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=Schneed10;537217]Man card, please. You're quoting Oprah.

If everyone is getting taxed equally for the healthcare portion of their taxes, aren't you simply eliminating all choice? I would no longer pay for my private insurance, neither would my employer, instead I'd get taxed for a universal plan which may or may not fit my needs. I don't see how that's better.

Secondly, there's a reason so many people go without health coverage right now, they can't afford it. Just because you're coming up with a universal plan doesn't mean it will be any less expensive than HMOs available now. If you're adding a level tax to everyone to cover it, the poor will not be able to afford it.[/quote]
I agree the quoting of Oprah. Well for any plan to get passed a heavy burden of the taxes will be on the employer then on the individual. This will cause the employer to cut back to make up the money in other ways. The poor will still get a free ride under any plan.

Schneed10 03-16-2009 11:44 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=FRPLG;537222]What kinds of surgeries are these?[/quote]

Angioplasties to clear a blocked artery. Pacemaker implants to regulate an irregular heartbeat. Gastric Bypass and Lapband surgeries for obesity. And many many more.

Some HMOs out there deny coverage for some of these types of procedures. Which is semi-retarded because many of them prevent more costly treatment down the road.

saden1 03-16-2009 11:47 AM

Re: taxes and health care
 
[quote=Schneed10;537217]Man card, please. You're quoting Oprah.

If everyone is getting taxed equally for the healthcare portion of their taxes, aren't you simply eliminating all choice? I would no longer pay for my private insurance, neither would my employer, instead I'd get taxed for a universal plan which may or may not fit my needs. I don't see how that's better.

Secondly, there's a reason so many people go without health coverage right now, they can't afford it. Just because you're coming up with a universal plan doesn't mean it will be any less expensive than HMOs available now. If you're adding a level tax to everyone to cover it, the poor will not be able to afford it.[/quote]

LOL, it's a play on "you get a car," plus I am comfortable with my masculinity.


I think going in the plan was to get everyone base insurance (prevention) and if people want more than can pay for it. The Japanese model, the one That Guy loves so much, might be worth looking into.


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