Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

Hey Guys,

I'm curious as to if anyone knows about the speeding cameras in DC. I got two tickets on the same day for a total fine of 300 bucks (600 if I don't pay before my court date) and I'm curious about a few things when it comes to these cameras.

1) Have they been challenged in court? I know these same cameras have given tickets to parked cars for speeding, etc. I don't know how this works with the whole face your accuser, being able to know that the camera was calibrated/accurate, etc.
2) It says 0 points on my license, which is well and good. But are these tickets reported to the insurance company? It sounds like just a source of revenue for DC, but hopefully someone has a definitive answer.
3) What are your thoughts on these cameras. Seem a bit iffy to me, and apparently have been causing awful traffic/pile ups in DC when people slam on their brakes to avoid them.

Any input on these cameras would be appreciated before I send DC 300 bucks.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

From what I've heard, hard to challenge

watch the pedal man, it bit me big in the ass too

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

I don't drive my car in DC anymore for several reasons, one of them being those cameras. So whenever I have to drive through DC, I drive my wife's car.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

I used to hate those things. Now after time I appreciate them. They confirm that the US is a police state. For awhile I thought I was just paranoid. Most people could care less. Poor schmucks think they're free because some asshole on television says so.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

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Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

While they might not put points on your record all the ins. co. that I know of don't look at point they look at actual driving record. DC might be different but I don't think any area or state actually reporst tickets to ins. co's. Its up to the insurance co to pull your driving record and that will vary among companies. My main ins co only pulls current customers driving records when they feel there is a need like adding a young child or having claim issues. Its a cost issues. Think they millions of customers and at 7 to 10 dollars per driving record it would be a hugh cost to pull all of them each year.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

yeah they suck, my wife had a meeting in downtown DC for a week she got a ticket every morning she passed the camera. $1000 in fines $250 x 5. It was what are you going to do situations and it gives a hugh free pass the next time I F up.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=mredskins;675434]yeah they suck, my wife had a meeting in downtown DC for a week she got a ticket every morning she passed the camera. [B]$1000 in fines $250 x 5[/B]. It was what are you going to do situations and it gives a hugh free pass the next time I F up.[/quote]

way to show the system

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;675386]I used to hate those things. Now after time I appreciate them. They confirm that the US is a police state. [B]For awhile I thought I was just paranoid[/B]. Most people could care less. Poor schmucks think they're free because some asshole on television says so.[/quote]

You are.

Why not just leave then, you [I]are[/I] free to do that.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

Just to wonder, how is the calibration on them done and how often?

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675513]You are.

Why not just leave then, you [I]are[/I] free to do that.[/quote]
you better watch out or he will mace your ass

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675513]You are.

Why not just leave then, you [I]are[/I] free to do that.[/quote]

If I could get on a ship and go to the New World I would. If there was a freer country I would go. They're all the same now. What's the point? They're police cameras in Tokyo, Berlin, London, and in the US. Game over.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

It takes more than some traffic cameras to create a true police state.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=tryfuhl;675521]Just to wonder, how is the calibration on them done and how often?[/quote]
Thats something that you would ask in court but you also need to know how often it should be done and hope they are off.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675513]You are.

Why not just leave then, you [I]are[/I] free to do that.[/quote]

Is there a government that is not a police state at this point? The US is not the worst police state, but it certainly is one.

It always cracks me up driving on 95 seeing the highway advisory signs. Do I get why they are there? sure, but I laugh because people will deny what their dual purpose is. Bottomline when you read 1984, and Big Brother was watching, do you think that government insiders hadn't created a plausible reason as to how the monitors were for public safety? Yet in 1980, if you had shown stories of how quietly intrusive government has become, people would have scoffed and said that would never happen.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675561]It takes more than some traffic cameras to create a true police state.[/quote]

You're right. You also need a constant state of fear and perpetual war. You also need news / energy / newspaper conglomerates to tell the public how to think and feel. Throw in a sub par education system and I'd say if we're not there, we're damn close.

Tell me Matty. How many transactions can you make without a SSN these days?

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675561]It takes more than some traffic cameras to create a true police state.[/quote]

True, it also takes police having the right to stop you without a clear demonstration that you were breaking a law. Oh wait, listen to the Md delegates argue for the right to stop someone for reading their cellphone. The police officer only has to feel that the person was reading a text.

It also takes a government having the ability to listen in to private conversations - should i mention the "patriot" act

I am not implying we are a totalitarian society yet, or even in the next 20 years. But we certainly have given up a lot of individual freedoms that once were bastions of United States rights.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;675572]You're right. You also need a constant state of fear and perpetual war. You also need news / energy / newspaper conglomerates to tell the public how to think and feel. Throw in a sub par education system and I'd say if we're not there, we're damn close.

Tell me Matty. How many transactions can you make without a SSN these days?[/quote]

The federal government can't force you to use the SSN because it's not a national id. geez didn't you know that Trample? Yes i am being sarcastic, REAL ID is absolutely a form of a national ID.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;675572]You're right. You also need a constant state of fear and perpetual war. You also need news / energy / newspaper conglomerates to tell the public how to think and feel. Throw in a sub par education system and I'd say if we're not there, we're damn close.

Tell me Matty. [B]How many transactions can you make without a SSN these days[/B]?[/quote]

Damn you got me, SSN = police state.

I refuse to give mine out all the time.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;675575]True, it also takes police having the right to stop you without a clear demonstration that you were breaking a law. Oh wait, listen to the Md delegates argue for the right to stop someone for reading their cellphone. The police officer only has to feel that the person was reading a text.

It also takes a government having the ability to listen in to private conversations - should i mention the "patriot" act

I am not implying we are a totalitarian society yet, or even in the next 20 years. But we certainly have given up a lot of individual freedoms that once were bastions of United States rights.[/quote]

We've certainly moved in that direction thanks to 9/11 and the early 2000's fear mongering.

I miss the terror alerts.

We're still not in the ballpark with communist China though, let's be real.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675609]We've certainly moved in that direction thanks to 9/11 and the early 2000's fear mongering.

I miss the terror alerts.

We're still not in the ballpark with communist China though, let's be real.[/quote]

No we are not. But I certainly am making the slippery slope argument, even it may take several years or a few decades but it is certainly head that way. and I forgot, I gotta go on a plane tomorrow, don't get me started on the airport stuff.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Mattyk;675561]It takes more than some traffic cameras to create a true police state.[/quote]

indeed

but give them an inch...

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

We used to make fun of the USSR back in the old days. They had a KGB agent on every corner watching everyone. These days we have cameras on the corners and yet people still feel free.

Forcing people to buy health insurance from the government or get fined or imprisoned is totalitarian. There is no way around it. You can paint rosy pictures all you want. The English used to force opium on the Chinese. How long do y'all think it will be before they force us on soma? I don't want the government putting my records online.

Why wasn't anyone sent to prison after 9/11? You can't tell me that wasn't criminal negligence.

One day not long ago, I woke up and felt like a stranger in my own country. I'm not upset. It's just business. It was never mine to begin with. I'm just here with a red pill in one hand and a blue pill in the other.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

In Seattle they capture video of you not just a picture or two and they show it to you if you decided to go to court to challenge the ticket. Out here your best bet is to just pay the fine.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[url=http://www.lectlaw.com/def/d080.htm]Legal Definition of Due Process[/url] This link might not be helpful in your case ... but, you can argue that were denied your right to dur process . 1) on 3-01-10 a camera took a picture of your car , but you did not receive the tickett until 3-17-10 . Because you did not receive notice early enough , you could not show that you were not at the scene of " violation " , nor were you given time to interview witness/s that would / could help you build a case , defence that 1) you were not at the scene , or that the camera may have not been working properly . I read a few years ago that an Attorney in < NY I believe > won 100 % of the cases against these cameras ? [url=http://www.highwayrobbery.net/]Home - Fighting Red Light Camera Tickets[/url] [url=http://hubpages.com/hub/How-To-Beat-Traffic-Camera-Tickets]How To Beat Traffic Camera Tickets[/url] good luck

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

if you received the tickets in the mail, just don't respond. Can't prove you got them.. I live in AZ and these cameras are everywhere. got 3 tickets in one day. never paid a single one.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

Can anyone else chime in on this, I got confirmation that just paying the fines will hike up my insurance rates (from both the City of DC and my insurance company.) But what's cheaper, paying the fines and increased rates, or two days off work to fight this, and if I lose having the fines double + court costs.

To me, the whole guilty until proven innocent aspect of these tickets bothers me. That coupled with the fact that the cameras accuracy is questionable, at best. Tickets are given to an individual, not a vehicle.

I know the MN supreme court ruled these types of tickets unconstitutional, but that doesn't help me. I don't think ignoring them is an issue in DC.

Any more advice would be helpful.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

You're just going to be happier paying the fine. I just had something similar happen over an expired registration. Basically the odds of me saving money were 33% considering I could go and lose, pay court costs AND ticket or have him MAYBE drop the ticket and if I'm lucky just dismiss it.

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;675762]We used to make fun of the USSR back in the old days. They had a KGB agent on every corner watching everyone. These days we have cameras on the corners and yet people still feel free.

.[/quote]

how's life in the UK?

Re: Legality/Accuracy of DC speeding cameras:
 

[quote=Daseal;678144]Can anyone else chime in on this, I got confirmation that just paying the fines will hike up my insurance rates (from both the City of DC and my insurance company.) But what's cheaper, paying the fines and increased rates, or two days off work to fight this, and if I lose having the fines double + court costs.

To me, the whole guilty until proven innocent aspect of these tickets bothers me. That coupled with the fact that the cameras accuracy is questionable, at best. Tickets are given to an individual, not a vehicle.

I know the MN supreme court ruled these types of tickets unconstitutional, but that doesn't help me. I don't think ignoring them is an issue in DC.

Any more advice would be helpful.[/quote]

wasn't the MN case about red lights? my friend got one and then mentioned it later on about the case.. unless there was a more recent one

doesn't mean that their argument isn't valid, since I don't know the details of it