Who Can Lead This Team?
 

I'm speaking offensively. I think we have plenty of defensive vets and leaders.

I touched on it briefly in the gameday thread, but it seems like we don't have anyone on the offense who can lead this team. Grossman just doesn't seem to have that IT factor that QB needs to have. Romo goes ape s*** on his players, which I think is a bit overkill, but he has that leader quality. As have other QB's I have seen. I look at Cam Newton and I see that leader quality in him, even as a rookie.

But Grossman... Just doesn't seem to have that leader quality. I feel he's inconsistent and has the tendency to choke under pressure. And I don't think Beck has it either. I just feel at this point, we're trying to put a band aid on a gaping wound which is our QB position.

So this begs the question, who's shoulders can this offense trust and lean on?

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Well no one this season and honestly IDK about next year either because Rex will play good enough to make us a playoff contender IMO, yeah he's not great but he has his moments.. Lets just wash this game away and move on to STL

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

The running game leads this offense. Hightowe/Helu/Torain?

Every good Shanny team has a good running game which is the engine for his offense. But when you have an arrogant f*cking son who f*cking thinks Rex grossman needs the ball in his hands a majority of the time and effectively kills any running attack you have, you might as well forfeit the f*cking game before it starts.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Jonathan Crompton

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

I really hate seeing threads like this 3 games into the season.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Chico23231;841206]The running game leads this offense. Hightowe/Helu/Torain?

Every good Shanny team has a good running game which is the engine for his offense. But when you have an arrogant f*cking son who f*cking thinks Rex grossman needs the ball in his hands a majority of the time and effectively kills any running attack you have, you might as well forfeit the f*cking game before it starts.[/quote]

It was like we were running an entirely different offensive scheme. 3 TEs? I know they had them out there for Ware, but it seems like that completely changed the face of this team. I mean I think because we don't have a QB, we have to lean on the running game. Putting the game mostly in the hands of an inconsistent QB is dicey to begin with. We need to keep the ball out of his hands as much as possible. Just seems like we got totally 1 dimensional all of a sudden and became. Pass, pass, pass. I like aggressive play calling, but not when it's stupidly aggressive.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=GreekSkin;841211]I really hate seeing threads like this 3 games into the season.[/quote]

This has been a problem since last season as well. Everyone blamed McNabb and then saying we didn't have the right team built around him. Alright. We started Grossman last season, built a team a somewhat better team and still can't seem to get the offense running on all cylinders. You must have blinders on if you think that there isn't a flow problem with the Skins.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Tim Hightower- AWESOME block against that #43! Great catch on 3rd and 5 setting up his TD. Didn't run the ball well but when he was in, he made plays, as did Helu.

IMO if Hightower plays well, we'll have a great chance to win.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Good Point...who is the charismatic leader of the Offense?

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

I don't think this offense has one. I like Moss, I like Cooley, I like Davis, I like Hightower, but none of them really scream, "I'm gonna put this team on my back when they need me to". And I'll keep saying this all year long but Grossman looks like a one year stopgap until we get a franchise qb next offseason. Until then we're just gonna have to make do. Grossman started to look rattled in the 2 minute drill at the end of the game and how can you expect your fellow offensive players to feed off that? I'm starting to agree that this team is lacking that one elite offensive playmaker that you know wants the ball when the chips are down and the game is on the line.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Well... no one. We lack playmakers on the outside. As much as I like Santana he can't do what Dez Bryant did at the end of the game. The offense will do well here and there but when he get up against solid defenses we're going to have trouble putting the ball in the end zone.

Why can't Santana do that? He's shown he can time and time again

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

I don't think leadership is our problem. We need sharper execution in the red zone.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841359]I don't think leadership is our problem. We need sharper execution in the red zone.[/quote]

I agree Matty. We just did not execute in the red zone and credit the Cowpukes D as they pretty much took Fred Davis out of the game.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;841357]Why can't Santana do that? He's shown he can time and time again[/quote]

Has Santana ever had a double digit TD year? He can't physically dominate someone like Bryant can. I love the guy but he should be in the slot and maybe start getting Paul or Hankerson on the outside.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;841444]Has Santana ever had a double digit TD year? He can't physically dominate someone like Bryant can. I love the guy but he should be in the slot and maybe start getting Paul or Hankerson on the outside.[/quote]

But Bryant didn't get a TD. And it's not about physical dominance really. Moss gets open as well as anyone in the league. That's why he scored that TD last week and got that huge catch at the end of the 1st half last night

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Moss is a GREAT WR imo, not dominant but he's so reliable and is always getting open! I love the guy one of my Fav Redskins ever

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;841450]Moss is a GREAT WR imo, not dominant but he's so reliable and is always getting open! I love the guy one of my Fav Redskins ever[/quote]

Cant argue with this^^^. I think most will agree, we are very fortunate to have Moss here.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;841444]Has Santana ever had a double digit TD year? He can't physically dominate someone like Bryant can. I love the guy but he should be in the slot and maybe start getting Paul or Hankerson on the outside.[/quote]Moss had 10 TDs for the Jets in 2003. He had 9 TDs for the Skins in 2005, and a team record 1,483 yards receiving. I attended both of his 3 TD games as a Skin - 2005 vs. the Giants and 2006 vs. the Jaguars. In Shanny's offense, Moss basically is a slot receiver, with Armstrong stretching the defense vertically.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;841202]Well no one this season and honestly IDK about next year either because[COLOR="Red"][SIZE="4"] Rex will play good enough to make us a playoff contender [/SIZE][/COLOR]IMO, yeah he's not great but he has his moments.. Lets just wash this game away and move on to STL[/quote]

And you base this on his debacle of a performance last night?

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

On offense.. I don't know... grossman is a role player more than a leader... we don't have an all pro center... so right now it needs to be Kyle Shanahan.. and if he can't, Mike... if anything our vets.. Cooley, moss, grossman, etc need to find a way to unify the group

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841359]I don't think leadership is our problem. We need sharper execution in the red zone.[/quote]


Yep, the game would have been one if we turned one or two of those frist half fgs into tds. The same could be said of the Cowboys as well, but we aren't talking about them.

We need leaders on offense. Rex is it at times, but not last night.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841359]I don't think leadership is our problem. We need sharper execution in the red zone.[/quote]


I'd have to disagree and agree. I do think leadership is a problem - you need your QB to be THE GUY. Look at all the elite teams in the league - New England, Green Bay, New Orleans, etc....all have great leaders as QBs. I think Rex is trying to be that guy, but I think he has a ways to go. But, I do agree that sharper execution in the red zone is a must, but play calling needs to be sharper as well....both have not been up to par.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Everyone has positive things to say about Rex and his "leadership" abilities.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841502]Everyone has positive things to say about Rex and his "leadership" abilities.[/quote]I've heard it said that the players like the way Rex takes charge in the huddle. Ultimately, it's the QBs job to be the offensive leader, so to answer your question, it will have to be Rex (for the time being).

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Rex Grossman and or John Beck is a placeholder.
They/he is just saving a seat on a bus until we get a franchise QB on the roster.
If Grossman gets a wild card, heck if he wins a wild card I still want to draft that franchise QB ASAP.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

We don't have a leadership gap; we have a talent gap. What will it take before you adjust to the reality that this is a team in the process of being rebuilt? Rex Grossman is not the QB that will lead us back to greatness. That player is not yet on the team. The one player on offense who can provide inspirational leadership through his performance is the QB. Again, he's not yet on the roster.

To rise to the level of the Gibbs I teams will take more time. Right now, the Redskins management is doing a very good job of building the foundation for greatness. We have a much improved team but we still need more pieces to be a perennial contender. Frankly, we need a couple of superstars on offense and the QB must be one of them.

The Franchise QB is the biggest piece of the puzzle that we lack at this time. There is nothing that can be done to make either Grossman or Beck much better than they are now. Deal with it. Some day we'll have the QB we need to lead us.

I'm pleased with where we are at this point. You should be, too. Be patient. After one or two more drafts and FA periods, we may be all the way back. In the meantime, I expect this team to continue to improve.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;841512][B]We don't have a leadership gap; we have a talent gap.[/B] What will it take before you adjust to the reality that this is a team in the process of being rebuilt? Rex Grossman is not the QB that will lead us back to greatness. That player is not yet on the team. The one player on offense who can provide inspirational leadership through his performance is the QB. Again, he's not yet on the roster.

To rise to the level of the Gibbs I teams will take more time. Right now, the Redskins management is doing a very good job of building the foundation for greatness. We have a much improved team but we still need more pieces to be a perennial contender. Frankly, we need a couple of superstars on offense and the QB must be one of them.

The Franchise QB is the biggest piece of the puzzle that we lack at this time. There is nothing that can be done to make either Grossman or Beck much better than they are now. Deal with it. Some day we'll have the QB we need to lead us.

I'm pleased with where we are at this point. You should be, too. Be patient. After one or two more drafts and FA periods, we may be all the way back. In the meantime, I expect this team to continue to improve.[/quote]

Yup, exactly.

We have closed the gap on talent a bit this year, but there's still work to do.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=DynamiteRave;841195]And I don't think Beck has it either.[/quote]

On what, specifically, are you basing this assessment? The guy hasn't played enough, and in critical situations, for you to haphazardly toss out a statement like that without any detail.

What I saw from Grossman this game was a mirror image of every mality he possesses creeping up in the same game. He fumbled twice. I know the stats say once, but let's be honest. He takes too long to come off his first read, and in the process throws an interception on a underthrown pass in to the belly of Sean Lee because he didn't have space for his necessary hitch step. When he's flushed out of the pocket he looks like an oscillating fan searching for pressure instead of maintaining focus, keeping his eyes down field, and making a clutch improvisational play. At one point, during the game deciding fumble scramble, he actually slows down and looks at the sideline. (And I'm making a play for a new nickname for Grossman, "Tyrannosaurus Rex", because of his short vestigial arms, and the fact that he should have been extinct ages ago)There are obviously many more deficiencies in his game, but I could be here all day listing them.

Regarding Beck, from what I've recognized, which clearly has its limitations, he keeps his head up, eyes down field, works through his progressions quickly, senses blitz (as opposed to looking for it), he can glide away from pressure, he's mobile outside of the pocket, he's decisive when confronted with the prospect of free running real estate, his ball is sharp and has volocity, and most importantly Kyle seem to call a different game when Beck is under center. Or atleast you see more opportunities to stretch the field. But if you need someone to throw INTs, lose you games by fumbling away the ball in clutch situations, I'm sure he'd be willing to do that too, if you asked nicely. The dude deserves a shot.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Rex is what we thought he was.

He's going to throw dumb picks at times, he's going to fumble, he's not a superstar. That said I wouldn't bail on him anytime soon. He's shown he can be a productive player in this offense. Not sure I agree with all the heat he's taking today. There's more than enough blame to go around for last night.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841532]Rex is what we thought he was.

He's going to throw dumb picks at times, he's going to fumble, he's not a superstar. That said I wouldn't bail on him anytime soon. He's shown he can be a productive player in this offense. Not sure I agree with all the heat he's taking today. There's more than enough blame to go around for last night.[/quote]

Just because you wouldn't "bail on him", doesn't mean we shouldn't. If this is an 8-8 season, which it seems like many people agree on, why not play Beck. We already know what we have in Grossman...a glorified backup.

And I agree there are plenty of other places to point the finger. But 2 redzone picks last week, another fumble, the "heat" is well placed.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Is Beck really the long term answer though?

I'm all for giving him a shot if Rex strings together a few really bad outings or we're simply out of contention, just saying it's premature to be thinking about a change already.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=fanarchist;841537]Just because you wouldn't "bail on him", doesn't mean we shouldn't. If this is an 8-8 season, which it seems like many people agree on, why not play Beck. We already know what we have in Grossman...a glorified backup.

And I agree there are plenty of other places to point the finger. But 2 redzone picks last week, another fumble, the "heat" is well placed.[/quote]

Because it's not all about the QB's development. The rest of the offense needs to develop its ability to make big plays. Putting Beck in might help his development but stunt the growth of other parts of our offense as a result.

Ultimately neither Rex nor Beck is the answer, and everyone (except those two) know it. That said, I think Rex's complete lack of conscience and memory probably helps develop the passing game more than we realize each week.

For example, right now, J.Campbell is allegedly a far superior QB according to those awful ESPN QBR stats. But they've won running McFadden into the ground and JC17 throwing short and sparingly. We've been there and done that, and I'm willing to bet when he DOES need to try and win a game with his arm, the team isn't going to be ready.

Think of Rex as simply a practice machine designed to give live game reps to our WRs, blockers and O-Line in the downfield vertical game, with some ball-hawk drills thrown in to spice it up, and you'll have a much calmer fan experience.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841543]Is Beck really the long term answer though?

I'm all for giving him a shot if Rex strings together a few really bad outings or we're simply out of contention, just saying it's premature to be thinking about a change already.[/quote]

How many more bad outings do you need to see from this guy? It's obvious that he hasn't corrected the problems that have plagued him his entire career. If you, like these stubborn coaches, want to ride the Rex train until the wheels fall off, be my guest, but I refuse to jump on board with a guy who is the epitome of perpetual disappointment. I prefer to test the road less traveled.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

if Grossman has a poor game at St Louis....bye week Shannys will make the switch

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=dgack;841544]Because it's not all about the QB's development. The rest of the offense needs to develop its ability to make big plays. Putting Beck in might help his development but stunt the growth of other parts of our offense as a result.

Ultimately neither Rex nor Beck is the answer, and everyone (except those two) know it. That said, I think Rex's complete lack of conscience and memory probably helps develop the passing game more than we realize each week.

For example, right now, J.Campbell is allegedly a far superior QB according to those awful ESPN QBR stats. But they've won running McFadden into the ground and JC17 throwing short and sparingly. We've been there and done that, and I'm willing to bet when he DOES need to try and win a game with his arm, the team isn't going to be ready.

Think of Rex as simply a practice machine designed to give live game reps to our WRs, blockers and O-Line in the downfield vertical game, with some ball-hawk drills thrown in to spice it up, and you'll have a much calmer fan experience.[/quote]

Thanks for your concern for my sense of calm. I actually made a similar statement to a friend last night. In the vein of Rex being an automaton on the field, and my follow up to that statement was, "but humaniods rarely make mistakes". If that were the case, and he were less erratic with the ball, ala Jason Campbell, we would probably be staring at a 3 in the win column.

The fact that you infatically claim to know how Beck will play without the evidentiary material to back it up is pretty shortsighted.

I don't want a machine out there. I wanted someone with enough cognitive ability to be able to adapt and adjust to the situation on the fly. Do I know, unequivocally, that Beck can do that. No. But the point is I know Rex can't.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=fanarchist;841546][B]How many more bad outings do you need to see from this guy?[/B] It's obvious that he hasn't corrected the problems that have plagued him his entire career. If you, like these stubborn coaches, want to ride the Rex train until the wheels fall off, be my guest, but I refuse to jump on board with a guy who is the epitome of perpetual disappointment. I prefer to test the road less traveled.[/quote]

More than 1.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

Tim Tebow

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=Mattyk;841556]More than 1.[/quote]

I guess "bad" is subjective.

Re: Who Can Lead This Team?
 

[quote=fanarchist;841559]I guess "bad" is subjective.[/quote]

Guess so.

Amazing we started 2-0 with such bad performances.