F-35 video.
 

What an awesome piece of tech this bird is.
Cant wait for this thing thing to go operational.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ki86x1WKPmE&feature=player_embedded]F-35B Ship Suitability Testing - YouTube[/ame]

Re: F-35 video.
 

Yay! 200 Million dollars ea. Thank heavens we don't have budget issues!!!

Re: F-35 video.
 

LOVE it!

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;927475]Yay! 200 Million dollars ea. Thank heavens we don't have budget issues!!![/quote]

Amazing how there's always money for stuff like this eh?

Re: F-35 video.
 

Surprising we have it, with the dollars we throw at ridiculous giveaway programs such as benefits for...illegal aliens.....etc

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=Hog1;927501]Surprising we have it, with the dollars we throw at ridiculous giveaway programs such as benefits for...illegal aliens.....etc[/quote]

ugh...

typical mind numbing response. How bout we get rid of "ridiculous giveaway programs" that waste much money, and over the top 100's of million dollar jets. If we did both, rather than use one to justify the other, maybe we could get our budget where we could make sensible judgements on all accounts.

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;927531]ugh...

[B]typical mind numbing response[/B]. How bout we get rid of "ridiculous giveaway programs" that waste much money, and over the top 100's of million dollar jets. If we did both, rather than use one to justify the other, maybe we could get our budget where we could make sensible judgements on all accounts.[/quote]

What does one have to do with the other? Are you an advocate of overrunning this....overburdened country with endless reward programs for those that mass to our shores and borders.....illegally?
Perhaps your mind is .....still numb?
BTW, I could get behind some defense cuts as well...probably.

Re: F-35 video.
 

I think CRed's point was that both the endless reward programs and the 200 Million dollar jets should be cut.

Excessive defense spending and excessive entitlement programs are making it impossible to climb out of debt. Despite being deep in debt, we continue to spend like there is no tomorrow.

It's a sweet plane, no doubt ... but, really, where is the need? Keep the plans, run the prototype, keep testing to see if we can upgrade, and, if we get into a war where we need the next generation of fighter, then build (yes, yes ... I know there would be lag time). Right now, we have more than 3 times as many planes as the next largest air force (China) and more than twice as many aircraft as China & Russia (the 3rd largest air force) combined. [url=http://www.globalfirepower.com/aircraft-total.asp]Total Aircraft by Country[/url]

We already have the numbers and tech advantage by a large, large margin. Is now the time to be guilding the weaponry lily? Which makes you better prepared for a real, old style war? The hottest tech or the strongest economy? I would suggest the second.

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;927537]I think CRed's point was that both the endless reward programs and the 200 Million dollar jets should be cut.

Excessive defense spending and excessive entitlement programs are making it impossible to climb out of debt. Despite being deep in debt, we continue to spend like there is no tomorrow.

It's a sweet plane, no doubt ... but, really, where is the need? Keep the plans, run the prototype, keep testing to see if we can upgrade, and, if we get into a war where we need the next generation of fighter, then build (yes, yes ... I know there would be lag time). Right now, we have more than 3 times as many planes as the next largest air force (China) and more than twice as many aircraft as China & Russia (the 3rd largest air force) combined. [url=http://www.globalfirepower.com/aircraft-total.asp]Total Aircraft by Country[/url]

We already have the numbers and tech advantage by a large, large margin. Is now the time to be guilding the weaponry lily? Which makes you better prepared for a real, old style war? The hottest tech or the strongest economy? I would suggest the second.[/quote]

This.

I am not big on social spending either but, from JR's website:

Defense Spending
Data through 2011; shown in USD
US - $692,000,000,000
China - $100,000,000,000
UK - $73,746,170,000
Japan - $70,495,000,000
Russia - $56,000,000,000

So, if we accept that the UK and Japan would aid us in time of a war with either Russia or China, that puts our combined spending at nearly 6 times the combined spending of our two most likely enemies. But keep in mind that China/Russia have a large portion of their money tied up in protecting their shared border.

Re: F-35 video.
 

But...but...we have to have to be able to fight 6 un-winnable wars all at once.

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=Mattyk;927492]Amazing how there's always money for stuff like this eh?[/quote]


[IMG]http://r0.sgsr.us/imgs/250/b5729.gif[/IMG]

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;927537]I think CRed's point was that both the endless reward programs and the 200 Million dollar jets should be cut.

Excessive defense spending and excessive entitlement programs are making it impossible to climb out of debt. Despite being deep in debt, we continue to spend like there is no tomorrow.

It's a sweet plane, no doubt ... but, really, where is the need? Keep the plans, run the prototype, keep testing to see if we can upgrade, and, if we get into a war where we need the next generation of fighter, then build (yes, yes ... I know there would be lag time). Right now, we have more than 3 times as many planes as the next largest air force (China) and more than twice as many aircraft as China & Russia (the 3rd largest air force) combined. [URL="http://www.globalfirepower.com/aircraft-total.asp"]Total Aircraft by Country[/URL]

We already have the numbers and tech advantage by a large, large margin. Is now the time to be guilding the weaponry lily? Which makes you better prepared for a real, old style war? [B]The hottest tech or the strongest economy? I would suggest the second.[/B][/quote]

Yea....I got it Joe, but thanx for the....insight nonetheless. FWIW, I would choose the second as well.
BUT, my original....mind numbing point. Absurd, irresponsible social spending and Military spending (although possibly over the top) are incomparable. One actually gains you something and the other digs and ever deepening hole.

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=Hog1;927671]Yea....I got it Joe, but thanx for the....insight nonetheless. FWIW, I would choose the second as well.
BUT, my original....mind numbing point. Absurd, irresponsible social spending and Military spending (although possibly over the top) are incomparable. [B]One actually gains you something and the other digs and ever deepening hole.[/B][/quote]

Neither gains you anything, and both put you deeper in holes. If a bully can beat you up with a set of brass knuckles, the fact that they are diamond studded doesn't add to the deterrent. We have jet fighters, which if we had maintained production instead of randomly saying they are at the end of their design span, would give plenty of deterrent for the value. Adding a one size fit all fighter, doesn't suddenly make our stick stronger, but it makes our economy less sound.

Another question I have, is although we hope not to lose any, certainly we could expect to lose some, if we got into a real dog fight of a war, how many of these would we be expected to manufacture, and at what cost to our economy?

Social spending in and of itself is not wrong, just as there is necessary defense spending, but a 200million fighter is as over the top, as a social net protecting illegal aliens. (i might fall into the statue of liberty's camp and say that a social system which protects the weakest among us, is better than a designer fighter jet)

[quote]

The New Colossus

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
[B]"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
[/B]I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
Emma Lazarus, 1883
[/quote]

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote]With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"[/quote]

You know ... instead of the huddled masses and wretched refuse, couldn't we ask for everyone else's rich, smart and well-dressed masses?

Re: F-35 video.
 

[quote=Hog1;927671]Yea....I got it Joe, but thanx for the....insight nonetheless. FWIW, I would choose the second as well.
BUT, my original....mind numbing point. Absurd, irresponsible social spending and Military spending (although possibly over the top) are incomparable. One actually gains you something and the other digs and ever deepening hole.[/quote]

We are, as usual, probably closer in agreement than what seems to be coming across. Absurd spending, whether defense or social digs a hole. The hole is slightly different, one is made of - to use CRed's analysis - diamond studded brass knuckles and the other is made of a burgeoning dependent population.

I understand your point in that, absurd, irresponsible social spending essentially begets more absurd, irresponsible social spending. Meanwhile, absurd, irresponsible defense spending gets you a bunch of diamond studded brass knuckles.

The only point I make is that absurd, irresponsible spending - whether defense or social - is wrong and the F-35 is simply not a necessary expense.