Bauman, Russell, Betts: Wasted Picks?

Ghost · 05-19-2004, 03:57 PM

You're always going to have your bad drafts, no matter how much research you do. Betts and Bauman are probably career back-ups. Russell is a blazer with poor route-running skills but those are the kind of risks you take with fifth rounders or whatever he was. You win some, you lose some. I think we had a good draft this year, despite its small size.

OaklandSkinz · 05-19-2004, 05:07 PM

i wouldn't say Betts is a bust, he is still capable of being a very good back-up running back..Bauman still needs some experience and could actually be a good back up when needes.. Now Russell, MAJOR BUST!! For a guy with his crazy speed, if only he could catch like a WIDE RECIEVER should be able to do!! DUH... Think he SHOULD think about what supermarket he'll rather bag groceries at... maybe too high of picks tho for all three..

Defensewins · 05-19-2004, 05:29 PM

You have to include Taylor Jacobs as a bust up to now. He did nothing last year. Betts has been a no show for two years now. Russell is not very good.
This problem of wasted picks started after Charlie Casserly was wrongly shown the door after the 1999 season.
Dan Snyder has even admitted that one of his first mistakes as an owner was when he fired Casserly and kept Norv Turner.
Snyder and Bag "O" Doughnuts Cerrato took over and have done a terrible job with any pick that is lower than a second round pick. Of all those lower picks only Fred Smoot, Darnerian McCants and Rock Cartwright are any good. All the rest have ranged from average to terrible. That is four drafts, 2000-2003 (not including this years).
The Redskins had 21 picks from 2000-2003 that were not 1st round picks, we only have three good players to show for those 21 picks. 3 out of 21, that is not very good. This is why our salary cap is tapped put and we still need 2-3 good d-lineman to round out our roster.

Mattyk · 05-19-2004, 05:32 PM

I can give Jacobs the benefit of the doubt for now. His freak injury really set him back and once he got healthy he was buried on the depth chart.

I think we could see big things from him this year.

Mattyk · 05-19-2004, 05:54 PM

Joe could probably add some insight here in regards to Jacobs. He was sharp in training camp last year and in minicamps thus far.

Bergman14 · 05-19-2004, 07:16 PM

Way before i wasnt saying that these were wasted picks as in they are busts, im saying they were stupid picks when there were areas of greater need

jdlea · 05-19-2004, 07:35 PM

Flat out...Ladell Betts is a bust. I've never seen a supposed power back never break a tackle in his NFL career...lol. I mean seriously, he does well to find space, but I've never once seen him break, a tackle or even so much as move a pile forward. He's wack.

Bauman...I don't really know.

Russel...I think he'll be out of the league after training camp

Jacobs had a terrible rookie campaign and I'll be surprised if he makes the team this year.

SmootSmack · 05-19-2004, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdlea

Jacobs had a terrible rookie campaign and I'll be surprised if he makes the team this year.

That's a really bold statement. You really think he's going to be cut?

jdlea · 05-19-2004, 08:06 PM

It wouldn't surprise me in the least. I don't really see that fire in him. Even when he was at Florida he didn't show me a whole lot of heart, I don't think Gibbs is going to like him. Really, you have to look at our receiving corps, we have Coles, Gardner, McCants, Thrash and maybe one more spot, but we're going to carry 4 TE/H-Back players, maybe a receiver will go since the H-Backs also play the slot...I think.

itvnetop · 05-19-2004, 09:55 PM

i don't think he's gonna be cut just for the simple fact we used a second last year on him... way too early to cut him imo.

Defensewins · 05-20-2004, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by offiss

I have to say jdlea, I really diagree on both Bett's and Jacob's, in his rookie year Bett's was breaking tackles every time he touched the ball, in fact he was drawing comparison's to S. Davis for his ability to step out of tackles without slowing down, he's been stuck under SS for 2 year's and had some unfortuanate injuries which have slowed him, he will be a very good back, unfortuantly he now has Portis in front of him, so eventually it will be for someone else, What was so terrible about Jacob's rookie year? You do know he had a freak injury? And aware of how much that can set a rookie back? Especially in SS's chaotic world of offense, and I will take all bet's that taylor makes the team this year, the kid is highly motivated and is one of the hardest worker's you will find, as well as he is all buisness, he is about succeeding in the NFL and doing whatever it takes to get there, I would be surprised if he wasen't the #2 reciever before the first 4 games are over, he's going to leave Gardner in the dust.

I have to say Offiss, I completely and respectfully disagree with you. Even despite his injury, Jacobs last season played in 4 regular season games. He caught a whopping 3 receptions. This despite playing in an offense geared to pass first and run second. This is not good for our top draft pick. The point of this thread was wasted picks and what pissed me off about this wasted pick is U of Florida has a reputation around the league that it's recievers that are drafted high do not do well, because of their chuck and duck system. The Redskins ignored this when they could have drafted safety Mike Doss or WR Anquan Boldin who had great rookie seasons. They did not need years to adjust, unlike Betts and Jacobs. Doss was in on 101 tackles and helped his team get one games from the Superbowl.
Our greatest draft need in 2003, like this year, is defense. But Snyder and Cerrato like to draft offensive skill players.
Regarding the injuries to Betts and Jacobs, I feel some players are more fragile than others. Some players get hurt all the time, like Trung Canidate and (during his redskins career) Ladell Betts. I don't care how much talent a guy has, if he only plays 6-9 games a year, it is not worth it.
Regardind Betts "breaking tackles evertime he touched the ball", I am not sure which L. Betts I watched, because he is good , but not that good.

Gmanc711 · 05-20-2004, 12:05 PM

Betts is too injury prone, and thats gonna kill his chanes of being a legitamete starter in the NFL. He could be a nice change of pace back, or a 3rd and 1 back, but the injurys are gonna prevent him from being a every down back.

Bauman is tough to say, he hasent really had a huge chance yet, but has played some nice Nickle and gotten a few picks, so he hasent been a waste. However, nothing great has come out either.

Russell - Wasted Pick. Nothing really more to say than that.

Jacobs - CUT??? CUT??? Are you freaking kidding me. First of all, you cant judge his rookie year in the slightest. He got KO'ed from Preseason until I think maybe the Dallas game, where he stepped in and got a few touches. Then wsent he hurt again?
In addition, wasent the whole buzz around our first mini-camp was that Taylor Jacobs looked awsome? I mean, I'm not saying that hes a Pro-Bowler or anything, but theres no way in hell this guy gets cut.

Defensewins · 05-20-2004, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gmanc711

......In addition, wasent the whole buzz around our first mini-camp was that Taylor Jacobs looked awsome? I mean, I'm not saying that hes a Pro-Bowler or anything, but theres no way in hell this guy gets cut.

Even Trung Canidate looks good every year in these non-contact, shorts and helmets work outs. Do not judge Jacobs to much from these non-contact practices. Let see how he does once the hitting starts. Will he stay healthy and look as confidant as he did this spring? I hope so....

lifetimeskin · 05-20-2004, 12:54 PM

Let me preface this by saying that my research is limited!

I your #2 draft pick is not starting, then it was a weak pick. There are 22 starting positions on offense and defense, and at best you can fill them up with 5-10 #1 picks. The skins have 5 (Ramsay, Gardner, Samuels, Arrington, Taylor) they have drafted, I am sure we have traded for others, like Springs, Upshaw, Wynn, (Candidate?). This is about 8-9 First Rounders on the team.

The skins have 5 (Jensen, Raymer, Smoot, Betts, Jacobs) players they drafted in the 2nd round. They have acquired 3 others (Griffin, Washington, Portis). For a total of 8 second rounders. That is a total of 17 players in the 1st and 2nd. Of those 17, 12-13 are starters. That would still leavel 9-10 open positions.

By looking at our drafts for the 1st and 2nd rounds the last five years, and what player's we've been able to retain, I would say that out of a standard possible 10 players drafted, we have been able to retain 3 top notch players (Arrington, Samuels, and Jensen), the jury is still out on four of them (Ramsay, Smoot, Jacobs, and Taylor), with 2 seemingly servicable players (Betts and Gardner). The only player we haven't retained is Champ.

If out of the the bottom 6 we get 4 more top notch players, I think we have done extremely well in the draft...I think that is a possiblity with Ramsay, Smoot, Jacbos and Taylor....

Sorry for the long writeup!

BrudLee · 05-20-2004, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lifetimeskin

Let me preface this by saying that my research is limited!

I your #2 draft pick is not starting, then it was a weak pick. There are 22 starting positions on offense and defense, and at best you can fill them up with 5-10 #1 picks. The skins have 5 (Ramsay, Gardner, Samuels, Arrington, Taylor) they have drafted, I am sure we have traded for others, like Springs, Upshaw, Wynn, (Candidate?). This is about 8-9 First Rounders on the team.

The skins have 5 (Jensen, Raymer, Smoot, Betts, Jacobs) players they drafted in the 2nd round. They have acquired 3 others (Griffin, Washington, Portis). For a total of 8 second rounders. That is a total of 17 players in the 1st and 2nd. Of those 17, 12-13 are starters. That would still leavel 9-10 open positions.

By looking at our drafts for the 1st and 2nd rounds the last five years, and what player's we've been able to retain, I would say that out of a standard possible 10 players drafted, we have been able to retain 3 top notch players (Arrington, Samuels, and Jensen), the jury is still out on four of them (Ramsay, Smoot, Jacobs, and Taylor), with 2 seemingly servicable players (Betts and Gardner). The only player we haven't retained is Champ.

If out of the the bottom 6 we get 4 more top notch players, I think we have done extremely well in the draft...I think that is a possiblity with Ramsay, Smoot, Jacbos and Taylor....

Sorry for the long writeup!

It would appear that the voice of reason uses a fancy font!

He's absolutely right. We can't expect to have all of our top draft picks, plus all of our free agent acquisitions, plus the players we've traded for all start. It would be a thirty man lineup. Players like Jacobs and Betts may be quality players, but who are they going to knock out of the lineup? As for the idea that we should have addressed defensive line needs, examination of the 2002 draft doesn't show any starters drafted after Betts, much less Bauman and Russell.

05-19-2004, 05:29 PM	#18
Defensewins Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 2,760	You have to include Taylor Jacobs as a bust up to now. He did nothing last year. Betts has been a no show for two years now. Russell is not very good. This problem of wasted picks started after Charlie Casserly was wrongly shown the door after the 1999 season. Dan Snyder has even admitted that one of his first mistakes as an owner was when he fired Casserly and kept Norv Turner. Snyder and Bag "O" Doughnuts Cerrato took over and have done a terrible job with any pick that is lower than a second round pick. Of all those lower picks only Fred Smoot, Darnerian McCants and Rock Cartwright are any good. All the rest have ranged from average to terrible. That is four drafts, 2000-2003 (not including this years). The Redskins had 21 picks from 2000-2003 that were not 1st round picks, we only have three good players to show for those 21 picks. 3 out of 21, that is not very good. This is why our salary cap is tapped put and we still need 2-3 good d-lineman to round out our roster. Last edited by Defensewins; 05-19-2004 at 05:34 PM.

05-20-2004, 12:54 PM	#29
lifetimeskin Camp Scrub Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Maryland Age: 47 Posts: 84	Let me preface this by saying that my research is limited! I your #2 draft pick is not starting, then it was a weak pick. There are 22 starting positions on offense and defense, and at best you can fill them up with 5-10 #1 picks. The skins have 5 (Ramsay, Gardner, Samuels, Arrington, Taylor) they have drafted, I am sure we have traded for others, like Springs, Upshaw, Wynn, (Candidate?). This is about 8-9 First Rounders on the team. The skins have 5 (Jensen, Raymer, Smoot, Betts, Jacobs) players they drafted in the 2nd round. They have acquired 3 others (Griffin, Washington, Portis). For a total of 8 second rounders. That is a total of 17 players in the 1st and 2nd. Of those 17, 12-13 are starters. That would still leavel 9-10 open positions. By looking at our drafts for the 1st and 2nd rounds the last five years, and what player's we've been able to retain, I would say that out of a standard possible 10 players drafted, we have been able to retain 3 top notch players (Arrington, Samuels, and Jensen), the jury is still out on four of them (Ramsay, Smoot, Jacobs, and Taylor), with 2 seemingly servicable players (Betts and Gardner). The only player we haven't retained is Champ. If out of the the bottom 6 we get 4 more top notch players, I think we have done extremely well in the draft...I think that is a possiblity with Ramsay, Smoot, Jacbos and Taylor.... Sorry for the long writeup! __________________ ---lifetime skin

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05-19-2004, 03:57 PM	#16
Ghost Special Teams Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 298	You're always going to have your bad drafts, no matter how much research you do. Betts and Bauman are probably career back-ups. Russell is a blazer with poor route-running skills but those are the kind of risks you take with fifth rounders or whatever he was. You win some, you lose some. I think we had a good draft this year, despite its small size.

05-19-2004, 05:07 PM	#17
OaklandSkinz Camp Scrub Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 19	i wouldn't say Betts is a bust, he is still capable of being a very good back-up running back..Bauman still needs some experience and could actually be a good back up when needes.. Now Russell, MAJOR BUST!! For a guy with his crazy speed, if only he could catch like a WIDE RECIEVER should be able to do!! DUH... Think he SHOULD think about what supermarket he'll rather bag groceries at... maybe too high of picks tho for all three..

05-19-2004, 05:32 PM	#19
Mattyk ‎\m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 40 Posts: 73,199	I can give Jacobs the benefit of the doubt for now. His freak injury really set him back and once he got healthy he was buried on the depth chart. I think we could see big things from him this year.

05-19-2004, 05:54 PM	#20
Mattyk ‎\m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Age: 40 Posts: 73,199	Joe could probably add some insight here in regards to Jacobs. He was sharp in training camp last year and in minicamps thus far.

05-19-2004, 07:16 PM	#21
Bergman14 Special Teams Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Winston-Salem Age: 30 Posts: 138	Way before i wasnt saying that these were wasted picks as in they are busts, im saying they were stupid picks when there were areas of greater need

05-19-2004, 09:55 PM	#25
itvnetop Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Los Angeles, CA Age: 36 Posts: 2,719	i don't think he's gonna be cut just for the simple fact we used a second last year on him... way too early to cut him imo.

05-20-2004, 12:05 PM	#27
Gmanc711 Thank You, Sean. Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Gaithersburg, MD Age: 27 Posts: 7,380	Betts is too injury prone, and thats gonna kill his chanes of being a legitamete starter in the NFL. He could be a nice change of pace back, or a 3rd and 1 back, but the injurys are gonna prevent him from being a every down back. Bauman is tough to say, he hasent really had a huge chance yet, but has played some nice Nickle and gotten a few picks, so he hasent been a waste. However, nothing great has come out either. Russell - Wasted Pick. Nothing really more to say than that. Jacobs - CUT??? CUT??? Are you freaking kidding me. First of all, you cant judge his rookie year in the slightest. He got KO'ed from Preseason until I think maybe the Dallas game, where he stepped in and got a few touches. Then wsent he hurt again? In addition, wasent the whole buzz around our first mini-camp was that Taylor Jacobs looked awsome? I mean, I'm not saying that hes a Pro-Bowler or anything, but theres no way in hell this guy gets cut.

Bauman, Russell, Betts: Wasted Picks?

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