Disconnect Between Players and Coaches

That Guy · 11-20-2006, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Cut the staff? You haven't joined the F Gibbs, Williams, and Saunders camp have you?

no, oops, hope it didn't come off that way. I meant cut back, like breaux etc. I think we've got too many people and i'm not sure if saunders is necessary, but he'll have 7 more games to show himself. (i still contend he's calling all these outside runs because they worked with 3 of the best pulling OL in KC, but we don't have a roaf, shields, and waters here - so he needs to adjust to what we've got, which is downhill running, more shotgun to protect the QB from dock and rabach in long passing situations, etc). All i know is gibbs offense worked much better than this one (which constantly abandons the runs and seems to suffer from bad playcalling often).

And for as great a quote as bugel may be, he hasn't made a single OL guy play better in 3 years, so i'm not sure he's really needed either.

maybe losing walker hurt our D too...

firstdown · 11-20-2006, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYCSkin

Lately I've been feeling like there is a growing rift between the Skins' players and coaches. I've always thought that Gibbs' was the right guy to turn this franchise around--but are these players starting to tune out this coaching staff? Are the coaches losing their vigor in coaxing max effort out of the players? If one of these are true, we are in trouble. I fear that it is much worse--that both are true.

What we have now is overpaid and underachieving players as well as overpaid and underachieving coaches. We are saddled with many of these players due to their bloated contracts and we are saddled with many of these coaches due to bloated loyalties. So if you're Dan Snyder, what do you do?

Give us an example of this growing rift between players and coaches your feeling is not being felt here. Are you making up problems that may exist for the sake of talking about a made up scenario.

The Zimmermans · 11-20-2006, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by That Guy

no, oops, hope it didn't come off that way. I meant cut back, like breaux etc. I think we've got too many people and i'm not sure if saunders is necessary, but he'll have 7 more games to show himself. (i still contend he's calling all these outside runs because they worked with 3 of the best pulling OL in KC, but we don't have a roaf, shields, and waters here - so he needs to adjust to what we've got, which is downhill running, more shotgun to protect the QB from dock and rabach in long passing situations, etc). All i know is gibbs offense worked much better than this one (which constantly abandons the runs and seems to suffer from bad playcalling often).

And for as great a quote as bugel may be, he hasn't made a single OL guy play better in 3 years, so i'm not sure he's really needed either.

maybe losing walker hurt our D too...

Do you truly feel that our offense is worse than it was last year?????

firstdown · 11-20-2006, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Zimmermans

Do you truly feel that our offense is worse than it was last year?????

I was thinking the same thing.

SouperMeister · 11-20-2006, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by firstdown

Give us an example of this growing rift between players and coaches your feeling is not being felt here. Are you making up problems that may exist for the sake of talking about a made up scenario.

Check out today's entry in Jason LaConfora's blog: Monday Morning H-Back - Redskins Insider

The Zimmermans · 11-20-2006, 04:10 PM

Pretty good entry. Little too much greg williams bashing, he's been great up until this season, we just took him for granted. The truth is, Williams doesnt have the defensive talent. And as far as blaming him for not making bad personnel decisions, there is a reason most D-coordinators are not given that power, because it's not their job to pick players, it's their job to coach them.

That Guy · 11-20-2006, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Zimmermans

Do you truly feel that our offense is worse than it was last year?????

I don't think it's really well suited that we keep calling all these outside runs, and it makes it harder to sustain drives... i mean, duckett is averaging 5.5 yards per carry (or something silly) and he's getting like 5 carries a game. last year we used that to take ToP. 3 and outs don't help us win, and throwing 34 passes in a rookie QB's first start is kinda questionable.

The Zimmermans · 11-20-2006, 04:17 PM

Duckett is not a guy that's gonna average over 4 yards per carry though, he doesnt have the speed for that. I like him a lot cause of his size, and I think he would compliment campbell well, but it will be tough to ride him if we are getting behind every game. We need to score on our opening drives nowadays to win, and running duckett up the gut will not lead to that unless we play the texans or titans

That Guy · 11-20-2006, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Zimmermans

Duckett is not a guy that's gonna average over 4 yards per carry though, he doesnt have the speed for that. I like him a lot cause of his size, and I think he would compliment campbell well, but it will be tough to ride him if we are getting behind every game. We need to score on our opening drives nowadays to win, and running duckett up the gut will not lead to that unless we play the texans or titans

yeah, but early in the game, we were ahead and calling very few runs. in the first half, we had 13 passes and 5 runs (with a rookie QB in his first start)... we weren't behind at that point.

we came out in the 3rd, 6 passes, 6 runs, TD, we're ahead.

then we went to 22 passes, 4 runs, though at that time, the clock was running down.

part of it iss that our running game isn't that good without portis, and campbell isn't good enough to open it up yet.

The Zimmermans · 11-20-2006, 04:50 PM

Do you think we would have won the game if we called more run plays???? All of our scoring was built on Jason's arm. How many first downs did we make on run plays that werent qb sneaks?

That Guy · 11-20-2006, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Zimmermans

Do you think we would have won the game if we called more run plays???? All of our scoring was built on Jason's arm. How many first downs did we make on run plays that werent qb sneaks?

2, but you can't run for first downs on 3rd and ten very often, which happens, especially if you don't run

. an we can't know cause you can't go back and see. they were keying on the run anyways.

GTripp0012 · 11-20-2006, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Zimmermans

Do you truly feel that our offense is worse than it was last year?????

That Guy has made the point that Gibbs' offense maximized our talent potential offensively so we could spend more of our focus and efforts on D.

This year the complexity is different. We allocated more money/resources to our offense and brought in Saunders to maximize that. His playcalling has on the whole, improved the offense over last year, cut turnovers, moves the ball, etc. But his situational playcalling is killing us (theres a HUGE discrepency between our yards rating and our points rating), and I think whether or not we are better than last year depends on if you expected our offense to shoot up the charts or not based on the acquistions of two WRs.

I believe that Saunders is not really a big problem in the grand scheme of things, although I as a fan prefer Gibbs' system. But give Saunders some credit, out of 10 games played, we've been right with the opponents' offense at least into the 2nd half 8 times.

It's gotten to the point were we no longer need a dominant D to win. Just a respectable one.

C'mon Gregg Williams, get it done.

Sheriff Gonna Getcha · 11-20-2006, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

It's gotten to the point were we no longer need a dominant D to win. Just a respectable one.

C'mon Gregg Williams, get it done.

Seriously. Before the season I would have choked if someone told me that we'd be the 16th ranked D. Now, I'd kill for the 16th ranked D.

GTripp0012 · 11-20-2006, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Zimmermans

Pretty good entry. Little too much greg williams bashing, he's been great up until this season, we just took him for granted. The truth is, Williams doesnt have the defensive talent. And as far as blaming him for not making bad personnel decisions, there is a reason most D-coordinators are not given that power, because it's not their job to pick players, it's their job to coach them.

No, he doesn't have great talent, but 30th?!?! 30th!?!?!?

Try something different, anything different. Don't try to be top 5 with this team. Strive to be top 25. Then top 20. Forget perfection.

illdefined · 11-20-2006, 05:06 PM

you wonder why our scoring offense is so low? because most of our net yards are given to us by 'bend don't break' defenses. and thats exactly what they do.

of all the yards Betts and Mark have racked up, how many of those passes have been TDs? how many Brunell TD passes have been in the endzone and not YAC'ed in? i know, thats not a stat. but its a serious clue to why we've had endzone troubles. Brunell's horizontal game couldn't break through defenses as the field got shorter and that's why all of Brunell's 'productivity' has been utterly moot.

11-20-2006, 04:10 PM	#21
The Zimmermans Impact Rookie Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Woodley Park, Washington DC Age: 28 Posts: 937	Re: Disconnect Between Players and Coaches Pretty good entry. Little too much greg williams bashing, he's been great up until this season, we just took him for granted. The truth is, Williams doesnt have the defensive talent. And as far as blaming him for not making bad personnel decisions, there is a reason most D-coordinators are not given that power, because it's not their job to pick players, it's their job to coach them. __________________ Dan Snyder is a Cancer, Joe Gibbs is the Cure

11-20-2006, 04:17 PM	#23
The Zimmermans Impact Rookie Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Woodley Park, Washington DC Age: 28 Posts: 937	Re: Disconnect Between Players and Coaches Duckett is not a guy that's gonna average over 4 yards per carry though, he doesnt have the speed for that. I like him a lot cause of his size, and I think he would compliment campbell well, but it will be tough to ride him if we are getting behind every game. We need to score on our opening drives nowadays to win, and running duckett up the gut will not lead to that unless we play the texans or titans __________________ Dan Snyder is a Cancer, Joe Gibbs is the Cure

11-20-2006, 04:50 PM	#25
The Zimmermans Impact Rookie Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Woodley Park, Washington DC Age: 28 Posts: 937	Re: Disconnect Between Players and Coaches Do you think we would have won the game if we called more run plays???? All of our scoring was built on Jason's arm. How many first downs did we make on run plays that werent qb sneaks? __________________ Dan Snyder is a Cancer, Joe Gibbs is the Cure

11-20-2006, 05:06 PM	#30
illdefined Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: nyc Age: 37 Posts: 2,631	Re: Disconnect Between Players and Coaches you wonder why our scoring offense is so low? because most of our net yards are given to us by 'bend don't break' defenses. and thats exactly what they do. of all the yards Betts and Mark have racked up, how many of those passes have been TDs? how many Brunell TD passes have been in the endzone and not YAC'ed in? i know, thats not a stat. but its a serious clue to why we've had endzone troubles. Brunell's horizontal game couldn't break through defenses as the field got shorter and that's why all of Brunell's 'productivity' has been utterly moot. __________________ a fan. not a cheerleader.

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