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What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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Old 11-20-2006, 08:58 AM   #16
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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Originally Posted by FRPLG View Post
I not convinced that Smoot is much better than we have and that Pierce would make much of a difference all by himself. I do think Pierce is clearly an upgrade over Marshall but lost in the sea of underwhelming talent at we have he'd probably look pretty average too. He isn't a super talent so it'd be hard for him to over come. Kinda like ST has to do in the secondary.
If everybody is playing uninspired, then you're right, no one man can turn them all around. but Pierce was the signal caller & was praised by the coaches for knowing the playbook & getting all the guys in position. Remember how many times he'd tap a d-tackle on the but to slide them to one side? he was always active before the snap, yet always ready. Compare that w/now, guys are standing around looking at each other & pointing here & there before the snap, but rarely seem to look like they're ready for the play. This D lacks on field leadership & passion. I'll throw in talent as well, but since GW got here, we've never had a really talented D.
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Old 11-20-2006, 09:00 AM   #17
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

I agree w/ alot of the posts. The D-line for whatever reason...age, injuries, talent, is pretty weak. No pass rush = big plays. Even our blitzes get picked up easily (something we can't do). Does anyone notice who gets tackles in our defense? It's usually the secondary and rarely the d line. That's not good. Alot of NFL people say its lack of talent and age. They might be right.
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Old 11-20-2006, 09:02 AM   #18
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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At this point I'd ask what "talents"? Who has shown any talent so far this year?
Nobody has but I think thats more because the coaching staff cant rework the schemes to fit what the players can do instead of trying to make players fit into schemes they just cant handle.

In the big picture I blame this on the front office and coaches. They selected these players and its obvious they made a bunch of wrong choices.
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Old 11-20-2006, 09:05 AM   #19
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

Seems to be a lack of heart and leadership but the bottom line, from where all the problems stem, is lack of talent.
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Old 11-20-2006, 09:57 AM   #20
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

maybe those huge contracts hurt the hustle of the D? or age...

i mean, washington is still a stud, but griffin's had a bad year, springs still isn't 100%, taylor's had a really bad year, rogers looks terrible, lemar's been bad, and everyone else is just filler.

time to put mcintosh in... andre lott got walking papers from SD, maybe we should bring him back? right now there's not much to do, but most of our starters on D are old and that might be starting to show.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:05 AM   #21
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

The problem all starts at MLB, Marshall is servicable at times, however, your MLB is the captain of the defense, or your "defensive QB" if you must, and Marshall is clearly not that. We need to sign or draft a distinguished MLB and go from there. Washington is a decent leader but he is OLB, and Holdman shows up once every three weeks. Once we get a good MLB (Posluszny) PSU, Then we can build a D-line.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:14 AM   #22
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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I not convinced that Smoot is much better than we have and that Pierce would make much of a difference all by himself. I do think Pierce is clearly an upgrade over Marshall but lost in the sea of underwhelming talent at we have he'd probably look pretty average too. He isn't a super talent so it'd be hard for him to over come. Kinda like ST has to do in the secondary.
Let me tell you:

1. Smoot is much better. He is at worst an adequate CB. He was actually a good CB most of the time.

2. Pierce would have made a huge difference. He is the QB of the defense, responsible for making the calls and audibles. He has greatly improved the Giants D. With him, Lemar could still be playing WLB, his natural position. So you get two positions upgraded.

3. We don't need Super Talent. What we need is competent players. We had them, we let them go.

4. Think about this: We spent our high draft picks to address areas of need:

Carlos Rogers when Smoot left
Rocky as a replacement for Lavar when Marshall could have just as easily played WLB if we had kept Pierce.

We could have used those picks to draft quality players for our D line. We might have a better defense than we had in GW's first year, if we had kept Smoot and Pierce and built the D line!
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:17 AM   #23
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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Smoot really wasn't that huge a loss I don't think. Yeah Rogers is struggling and has taken a huge step backward this year, but Smoot really isn't playing any better.
The part that bothers me is that we let smoot go and used a top ten pick to replace him.

The problem with the defence is team speed. Springs was once one of the fastest players in the league, But that was along time ago.
Rogers is quick but not fast.
Marshall isnt that fast, he gets caught up in traffic.
Holdman is too damn slow.
Carter is fast, well he should be but he sucks.
Wynn, daniels are too old and slow to put pressure.
Vincent and Fox are not speed burners.
Taylor has good speed, amazing speed if you consider his size.
Wright and Rumph are slow for cornerbacks.


We dont have guys that can fly around the ball or use their catchup speed when they make a mistake.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:25 AM   #24
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

Yes we let Smoot go and replaced him with a top ten pick. Clearly the coaching staff felt Smoot wasn't the player that we think he is and that Rogers would be a better option. I think the problem wasn't letting Smoot go but Rogers simply not being the player that everyone thought he could be. So far.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:26 AM   #25
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

Good post, Gmanc. I completely agree that the troubles start with the D-line. Then it's a chain reaction. No push with the D-line means our LBs get hit by linemen. Only Washington is good enough to deal with this, and Lamar especially cannot. That forces us to blitz too much, and makes our blitzes predictable and ineffective. That exposes our weakened pass D, where we lost Clark and got perhaps the biggest bust in FA history. CBs can only do so much--Rogers hasn't been good, but I agree that no one could have stopped that pass to Galloway--we blitzed, what 8-9 guys and got NO pressure. Once the blitz failed, the play was done.

So, give more time to the rooks on the d line, get demetric in, get back Killings (didn't we cut someone else who had some sacks? Boschetti?). Draft on the d-line, FA for an MLB? And then light a god damn fire under everyone's ass--if you aren't giving the effort, if you are missing tackles and blowing assignments, then you should sit and give someone else a try. I though we had these old school coaches, but it seems they aren't motivating these guys. The poor tackling makes me sick. WTF????
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:37 AM   #26
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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Good post, Gmanc. I completely agree that the troubles start with the D-line. Then it's a chain reaction. No push with the D-line means our LBs get hit by linemen. Only Washington is good enough to deal with this, and Lamar especially cannot. That forces us to blitz too much, and makes our blitzes predictable and ineffective. That exposes our weakened pass D, where we lost Clark and got perhaps the biggest bust in FA history. CBs can only do so much--Rogers hasn't been good, but I agree that no one could have stopped that pass to Galloway--we blitzed, what 8-9 guys and got NO pressure. Once the blitz failed, the play was done.

So, give more time to the rooks on the d line, get demetric in, get back Killings (didn't we cut someone else who had some sacks? Boschetti?). Draft on the d-line, FA for an MLB? And then light a god damn fire under everyone's ass--if you aren't giving the effort, if you are missing tackles and blowing assignments, then you should sit and give someone else a try. I though we had these old school coaches, but it seems they aren't motivating these guys. The poor tackling makes me sick. WTF????
I agree 100% about the coaches not motivating these players. In fact it seems as if these coaches (namely Gibbs) are more concerned about making things comfortable for these players, whether its the all white unis the players wanted, the short easy mini camp, the lack of playing time in preseason for starters, it just seems that player motivation is out and player comfort is of utmost important. The record show that this coddling of players is not working.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:37 AM   #27
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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The part that bothers me is that we let smoot go and used a top ten pick to replace him.
Well I can understand that. I just think that we're making Smoot out to be better than he is because we lost him. We tend to do that with a lot of players. I don't think we'd be markedly better if Smoot was playing corner for us right now. Slightly maybe, but a huge upgrade I don't think so.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:46 AM   #28
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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SECONDARY!!!!!!!!!! Rogers BLOWS!! He plays like he is afraid of the ball, afarid to tackle, afraid of being tackled....

Seriously, he needs to go! I've been saying that since Pre-season!
Rogers would look a hell of a lot better if the D-line could get some pressure and the safties gave some support. It's true that he isn't playing like a top 10 pick but he isn't that bad - I'd say he's about average compared with the rest of the D.

It all starts with the d-line though. Just look at our top tacklers - they are all in the secondary - that tells you all that you need to know about the pressure that the front 7 is generating.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:50 AM   #29
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

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As for Pierce, yeah that hurt us more. But he wasn't here last year either and we seemed to be ok. I think among the several problems we have on D, it all starts with a weak interior line. Griff and the Samoan probably overachieved the past couple of years and now they're running on fumes.
Pierce was the unquestioned leader on defense, he brought a huge chip on his shoulder to each and every game and played with extreme intensity. I honestly think Pierce's loss was the biggest F-up this organization has made since 2000.
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:53 AM   #30
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Re: What the hell is wrong with our Defense?

Rogers is sad, I watched him all game, he didn't make one play, besides when he pass interfeared with galloway in the endzone, which turned out to be a fluke TD anyone. I don't think he was even trying, half ass tackle attempts, jogging down the field while galloway highsteps into the endzone. He made me sick. wouldn't surpise me if he was out of the league in a few seasons. Sorry, had to get that off my back.
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