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Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Old 12-08-2006, 12:42 PM   #16
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
great post. I would agree but See T. Boswell's article from today's washpost, says Gibbs is open to hiring a gm.
I have this feeling that it will be more a ceremonial title than anything else. I mean I think the decisions will still go through Gibbs
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Old 12-08-2006, 12:44 PM   #17
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

By the way, Scott Pioli's wife's name...Dallas
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Old 12-08-2006, 01:11 PM   #18
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Let's see...
  • Giving up a 3rd round draft choice for Mark Brunell who was going to be cut by Jacksonville anyway...
  • Giving up Champ Bailey AND a 2nd round choice for Clinton Portis...
  • Giving up a 3rd and 4th round draft choice, plus a $10 million bonus for Brandon Lloyd who won't come anywhere near his career averages for catches...
  • Giving Randle El a $10 million signing bonus when we already had 3 capable kick returners in Thrash, Betts, and Cartwright...
  • Giving up a 3rd round choice for T.J. Duckett who won't get more than 50 carries for the season...
  • Trading up in the '06 draft for Rocky McIntosh, losing next year's 2nd round choice when he can't even unseat Warrick Holdman or any other of the incompetent buffoons we have playing on defense...
  • Adam Archuleta -- do we need an explanation about him?
  • The defense is old, needs to be completely overhauled and gutted, and we haven't nearly enough draft picks next year to address a third of the needs on that side of the field.
If Joe Gibbs 'the GM' cannot see what sort of a wreck this team's personnel shape is in, then perhaps we have overestimated him.
nascar is always an option and to me thats where it,s at now not the nfl..todays salary cap era and todays players don,t really mix to well with the way joe gibbs does things.(i,m not given up by any means).but a GM is necessary cause i would much rather see gibbs the coach take full control of playcaling with some new ideas to go along with his philosphy.
this team still today has too much baggage it needs to get rid of and in the front office and on the field.....
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Old 12-08-2006, 01:30 PM   #19
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Let's see...
  • Giving up a 3rd round draft choice for Mark Brunell who was going to be cut by Jacksonville anyway...
  • Giving up Champ Bailey AND a 2nd round choice for Clinton Portis...
  • Giving up a 3rd and 4th round draft choice, plus a $10 million bonus for Brandon Lloyd who won't come anywhere near his career averages for catches...
  • Giving Randle El a $10 million signing bonus when we already had 3 capable kick returners in Thrash, Betts, and Cartwright...
  • Giving up a 3rd round choice for T.J. Duckett who won't get more than 50 carries for the season...
  • Trading up in the '06 draft for Rocky McIntosh, losing next year's 2nd round choice when he can't even unseat Warrick Holdman or any other of the incompetent buffoons we have playing on defense...
  • Adam Archuleta -- do we need an explanation about him?
  • The defense is old, needs to be completely overhauled and gutted, and we haven't nearly enough draft picks next year to address a third of the needs on that side of the field.

If Joe Gibbs 'the GM' cannot see what sort of a wreck this team's personnel shape is in, then perhaps we have overestimated him.
Nice post. But, in fairness, there have been significant good moves also:

- Passing on Jevon Kearse to sign Marcus Washington AND Cornelius Griffin.

- Trading picks to move up and obtain Cooley (Would he have been available? It's a crap shoot - but given his ability, certainly worth what we traded).

- Sean Taylor over Kellen Winslow.

- No signings last year except Rabach who has been a solid, if not stellar, player.

- Finding Golston in the latter rounds.

While I agree that it seems the misses have far outnumbered the hits, the hits have been pretty solid. Without a team by team analysis, its kinda unfair to say "We suck" in the personnel dept. The "Patriot Model" has been successful b/c they have had solid personnel and good coaching - but what about the other 30 teams? What is their track record (and PLEASE don't cite me the Eagles - When they win a Superbowl, let's talk).

My own preference would be for Gibbs to step back further and become the Jack Kent Cooke part of a management triumvarite (Gibbs, when appropriate, would then turn to Danny and say - "I need a check" to which Danny says "Yes sir!"). A head coach and general manager would be appointed, they would duke it out over personnel and Gibbs would make the final call.

Not saying that would happen, but, if Gibbs proposed it, Snyder would make it so.
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Old 12-08-2006, 01:38 PM   #20
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Originally Posted by TAFKAS View Post
I really don't think Gibbs would be so willing to cede control of picking players. It's what he wants to do
i dont know if coach gibbs would stop something that he thought would make the redskins better
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Old 12-08-2006, 02:00 PM   #21
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Let's see...
  • Giving up a 3rd round draft choice for Mark Brunell who was going to be cut by Jacksonville anyway...
  • Giving up Champ Bailey AND a 2nd round choice for Clinton Portis...
  • Giving up a 3rd and 4th round draft choice, plus a $10 million bonus for Brandon Lloyd who won't come anywhere near his career averages for catches...
  • Giving Randle El a $10 million signing bonus when we already had 3 capable kick returners in Thrash, Betts, and Cartwright...
  • Giving up a 3rd round choice for T.J. Duckett who won't get more than 50 carries for the season...
  • Trading up in the '06 draft for Rocky McIntosh, losing next year's 2nd round choice when he can't even unseat Warrick Holdman or any other of the incompetent buffoons we have playing on defense...
  • Adam Archuleta -- do we need an explanation about him?
  • The defense is old, needs to be completely overhauled and gutted, and we haven't nearly enough draft picks next year to address a third of the needs on that side of the field.

If Joe Gibbs 'the GM' cannot see what sort of a wreck this team's personnel shape is in, then perhaps we have overestimated him.

MB saved HOF Coach Gibbs life the night they first met. HOF Saved!

CP - In excess of 1500 yards each of his first two seasons, with a PO win last year.

BL aka. Jr., give me a break, it's LDS's money! His team!

ARE - See BL above.

Rocky - He's a rook! Give the FO and GW a break. GW spots the rooks.
(Exception: Goldston, due to injuries)

AA was displaced by a rook on his last team. I knew it when the FO signed him in error. NO GM running the B&G ranch, however, and again, it's LDS's money. OK, a mistake on this one, but I knew it then in FA. Now we all know it.

D needs to be healthy all year. Problem solved. With Goldston, Montgomery, Rogers, and ST, we have youth. Health is needed, not gutting.

How do you "overestimate" a three time SB Champion, HOF Coach?
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Old 12-08-2006, 03:38 PM   #22
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

I really think that if Gibbs thinks a GM can come in and help, he will do it.

He's always open to trying new things if he thinks it's for the better of the team.
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Old 12-08-2006, 03:47 PM   #23
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
I really think that if Gibbs thinks a GM can come in and help, he will do it.

He's always open to trying new things if he thinks it's for the better of the team.
I'm not so sure, I think he's trying to graduate to the front office when he gets done coaching. Maybe though, I just don't know.
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Old 12-08-2006, 03:49 PM   #24
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

Yes, there have been some good pickups via the draft and FA but there have been alot of very questionable moves where we overpay and hurt our team.

I really think Joe G's will think long and hard about bringing in a GM over the winter. As the article says, he'll do anything at this point.
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Old 12-08-2006, 04:14 PM   #25
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Originally Posted by Bill B View Post
I have not been able to find any information on the net other than Pioli's contract was set to expire after the 2006 draft.

Does anyone know if he signed a long term extension with the Patriots?

If not is there any way the Redskins can get him?
I'm not sure signing Pioli would be a good thing. If a GM is gonna be brought in, i want one that has had experience with Gibbs and the way he works, so he understands the way Gibbs is trying to build his team, instead of some guy coming in and telling Gibbs how things are gonna be done.
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Old 12-08-2006, 05:02 PM   #26
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Let's see...
  • Giving up a 3rd round draft choice for Mark Brunell who was going to be cut by Jacksonville anyway...
  • Giving up Champ Bailey AND a 2nd round choice for Clinton Portis...
  • Giving up a 3rd and 4th round draft choice, plus a $10 million bonus for Brandon Lloyd who won't come anywhere near his career averages for catches...
  • Giving Randle El a $10 million signing bonus when we already had 3 capable kick returners in Thrash, Betts, and Cartwright...
  • Giving up a 3rd round choice for T.J. Duckett who won't get more than 50 carries for the season...
  • Trading up in the '06 draft for Rocky McIntosh, losing next year's 2nd round choice when he can't even unseat Warrick Holdman or any other of the incompetent buffoons we have playing on defense...
  • Adam Archuleta -- do we need an explanation about him?
  • The defense is old, needs to be completely overhauled and gutted, and we haven't nearly enough draft picks next year to address a third of the needs on that side of the field.
If Joe Gibbs 'the GM' cannot see what sort of a wreck this team's personnel shape is in, then perhaps we have overestimated him.
How about letting Ryan Clark and Walt Harris go.
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Old 12-08-2006, 05:21 PM   #27
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

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Originally Posted by 61cad View Post
How about letting Ryan Clark and Walt Harris go.
Clearly letting Ryan Clark go was a mistake for a lot of reasons. As for Walt, I don't think he counts as a mistake (there is a whole other thread on this topic). Just about everyone was ready to run him out on a rail last year and he was pretty craptacular at times. And on the other hand, how about the Coles for Moss trade? Anyone want to undo that one?

Again, the front office has had its hits and misses with the misses seeming to outnumber the hits in quantity and noticeability. I still think that we the FO (under Gibbs) has done some good things and that, while this year was clearly a step back, Gibbs did seem to learn from year one to year two. Maybe he will learn make a similar step forward next offseason.

As a final thought: Although this year's class of FA may be the worst since the Bruce Smith, et al. signings. It was still a different kind of bad in that all the guys signed to the expensive contracts were young guys. If they had panned out, we would of had good young talent in its prime for 3-4 years.
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Old 12-08-2006, 05:32 PM   #28
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

What if, after problems in player personnel since his return, the Redskins decide that a traditional general manager -- such as Bobby Beathard or Charley Casserly in the old days -- is needed? "I have no problems with any of that. I changed a lot last year," said Gibbs, who in essence fired himself after last season as the Redskins' play-caller and hired Al Saunders as associate head coach, handing over a task for which Gibbs was famous. "I'm not afraid of new ideas."
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Old 12-08-2006, 05:35 PM   #29
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

Getting Scott Pioli would basically be what the Redskins do on the free agent market, which would be go out, and get the best player available in their minds. That, as we all know doesn't work out. I'd rather see the Redskins go after some blue collar guy that does a consistently good job.
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Old 12-08-2006, 06:09 PM   #30
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Re: Is Scott Pioli available after the season?

I would think most on the board would agree the moves the FO have made under Gibbs 2 have been made so the Redskins can win now - handing over huge signing bonuses, trading away multiple draft picks, etc. and this is a sign of a team gunning for the super bowl trophy at all costs.

I believe this philiosphy is due to the fact (as Wilbon wrote in his column this week) that the coach is also the GM and therefore is mostly thinking about winning next week and is not worried about the long term future of the franchise with regard to draft picks, salary cap structure, etc.

I am not trying to run Gibbs the coach out of town - the guy is an amazing coach who knows what he is doing in this department and is second to none in my book.
But as far as having him the GM as well - I think this is similar to goverment with no checks and balances. We need these positions to be seperate so the long-term viability of on field success can be sustained.

Does anyone else get tired of the team having to rip apart the roster when all the salaries escalate in the 3rd/4th year and having to rebuild? What about all the dead cap space the team will have to contend with as well as releasing fees? To me this is why the Patriots have been able to field a team that wins over the course of the decade (not just one or two years. Pioli understands that huge bonuses should only be given to a select few and many parts are replaceable if you got a scouting department that can find young, hungry cheap talent in the draft.

Say what you want about the current regime and that things will turn around, but wait till the team has to renegotiate just to get under the cap, cut some other guys and again be the leaders in dead cap space.

Will the team ever learn you sustain long term success by biulding within through the draft and you plug an expensive free agent or two at most?
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