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Patten released

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Old 03-23-2007, 04:32 AM   #31
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Re: Patten released

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Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
I still wonder if we could have gotten by with Patten last year rather than having to spend a 3rd and a 4th for Lloyd.
He was hurt the whole season. He wasn't an option.
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Old 03-23-2007, 04:58 AM   #32
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Re: Patten released

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Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
I still wonder if we could have gotten by with Patten last year rather than having to spend a 3rd and a 4th for Lloyd.
The funny thing was that James Thrash did way better than either of them in far fewer oppertunities.

You can't make the Lloyd deal look good no matter how you spin it. We overvalued him three times last year. First, we sent picks for a receiver whose identical quality can be found on the waiver wire at any point. Second, we gave Lloyd a big money deal even though we had him under a test contract. Third, we gave him playing time that Randle El and Thrash deserved early last season.

Patten was an apparently good signing when we made it happen in that he had No. 1 receiver potential based on his prior stats in NE. But for whatever reason, he was horrible here in the first half of 2005, and injured in the second. Obviously, he didn't see a lot of passes with Moss having the year he was, but he saw fewer passes the few prior years in NE and did way better. It was just the classic case of a skill position player hitting the wall, and unfortunately for us, it happened the year we signed him. It sucks, but hey, what can you do?

Lloyd was a 4th round pick who hasn't done crap to prove that he deserved to go any higher. Yet, due to some gross talent evaluation by Al Saunders [who probably shouldn't be evaluating talent, at least let Gibbs do it], he's getting paid bazillions, while Freddie Mitchell rots in receiver hell some where (I know FredEx has character issues and would not be a good fit here, but I'm trying to find a crappy comparision for Lloyd that can be found on the waiver wire).

But teams that have No. 1 targets like Moss, and in our case, a compliment that is Cooley, should probably refrain from investing in more receivers. It becomes impossible to keep them all happy.

Patten was never going to get another chance here. He was more than expendable.

Good signing to get him here, but his time was up.
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Old 03-23-2007, 09:58 AM   #33
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Re: Patten released

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Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
The funny thing was that James Thrash did way better than either of them in far fewer oppertunities.

You can't make the Lloyd deal look good no matter how you spin it. We overvalued him three times last year. First, we sent picks for a receiver whose identical quality can be found on the waiver wire at any point. Second, we gave Lloyd a big money deal even though we had him under a test contract. Third, we gave him playing time that Randle El and Thrash deserved early last season.

Patten was an apparently good signing when we made it happen in that he had No. 1 receiver potential based on his prior stats in NE. But for whatever reason, he was horrible here in the first half of 2005, and injured in the second. Obviously, he didn't see a lot of passes with Moss having the year he was, but he saw fewer passes the few prior years in NE and did way better. It was just the classic case of a skill position player hitting the wall, and unfortunately for us, it happened the year we signed him. It sucks, but hey, what can you do?

Lloyd was a 4th round pick who hasn't done crap to prove that he deserved to go any higher. Yet, due to some gross talent evaluation by Al Saunders [who probably shouldn't be evaluating talent, at least let Gibbs do it], he's getting paid bazillions, while Freddie Mitchell rots in receiver hell some where (I know FredEx has character issues and would not be a good fit here, but I'm trying to find a crappy comparision for Lloyd that can be found on the waiver wire).

But teams that have No. 1 targets like Moss, and in our case, a compliment that is Cooley, should probably refrain from investing in more receivers. It becomes impossible to keep them all happy.

Patten was never going to get another chance here. He was more than expendable.

Good signing to get him here, but his time was up.
I agree w/all of this post & found it to be very insightful, except the part about Patten not playing well in early 05. He had 22 catches - not a lot- but commanded respect from corners & helped open up the offense. We missed him when he was hurt that year.

Good points about Loyd, but I don't know if we can blame Al S. I would like to know whose idea it was to bring him in though. Let's hope since he's here that he starts making some big plays & keeps his mouth shut.
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Old 03-23-2007, 10:50 AM   #34
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Re: Patten released

I don't know that it is all Lloyd fault... many time I saw him wide open in games and they just didn't throw the ball to him. maybe next season will be better
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Old 03-23-2007, 02:03 PM   #35
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Re: Patten released

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I don't know that it is all Lloyd fault... many time I saw him wide open in games and they just didn't throw the ball to him. maybe next season will be better
I'm not saying Lloyd isn't capable of running/catching, I'm asking why Brandon Lloyd is getting 4.5 million a year to drop passes when players of his caliber like Freddie Mitchell can't even find work.

For the record, I really don't like Freddie Mitchell, he's just the first name that came to mind.

But theres a big discrepancy between 4.5 mil a year, and league minimum. Lloyd must be the luckiest guy in the league, and probably the most blantently overpaid, measured in bang for your buck.

The Archuleta deal was defensible, at least. Expensive and ended up being very costly, but you can at least defend spending on a guy that while playing in St. Louis the prior season, only allowed 5 yards a play on plays where he was involved (this is spectacular for a safety). Now, we ended up purchasing damaged goods, so the signing ended up screwing us big time, but the point is that the Arch signing was defensible.

Paying 30 million over 7 years AND giving up two draft picks to get a guy whose quality can be found in most urban areas is completely indefensible. That's the point. I'm not saying Brandon Lloyd can't run and catch the ball when he's open (sometimes). I'm saying that he doesn't bring anything of value to the table over say, Freddie Mitchell (who I presume would gladly play for league min). So for him to be getting more than the league minimum is simple overvaluation. For him to be getting paid like a top receiver in this league is simple stupidity.

Bottom line: we are paying WAY too much at the receiver position considering we really don't have an overload of talent there. Patten was a necessary cut.

I'll try to stop ranting about Lloyd, but to the FO's credit, they didn't make any stupid moves this year for me to vent on.
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Old 03-23-2007, 02:57 PM   #36
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Re: Patten released

As far as a 4th receiver, Thrash will do just fine. And if one of the younger guys picks up the pace (Espy), then so be it. But there was no reason to keep Patten around when he's of no value to the organization based on the last 2 years.

And as said before, no one's gonna want to spend anything on a guy who was bound to be released anyways...
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Old 03-23-2007, 03:52 PM   #37
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Re: Patten released

GTripp:

If you are looking for an example of a wide receiver who isn't getting paid nearly what Lloyd is getting and who has the same ability to drop passes and be a malcontent, remember an old Warpath favorite ----- Rod Gardner.


BTW, FredEx is supposedly trying to latch on with the Toronto Argonauts in the CFL. Hope he kept that floor length fur coat he had. He'll need it for late season games in Saskatchawan and Winnipeg and Edmonton.
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Old 03-23-2007, 04:09 PM   #38
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Re: Patten released

My kingdom for a BIG receiver!
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Old 03-23-2007, 04:09 PM   #39
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Re: Patten released

And he won't have to buy gloves either. Those oven mitts looked WARM.
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Old 03-23-2007, 04:31 PM   #40
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Re: Patten released

Surprisingly, I'm not ready to throw Lloyd off the train just yet. Any receiver should be given the benefit of the doubt when Gramps has to heave it for all he's worth on 10-yard curl pattern.

I'd give Lloyd one more season, and if he doesn't offer a good option as a complimentary role opposite Santana Moss, then as a real estate agent, I will personally offer my services to help ship his ass outta town.
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Old 03-23-2007, 05:16 PM   #41
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Re: Patten released

I'm not holding out much hope for Lloyd, mainly because of his attitude.

What bugs me about him is those quotes from last year where he basically said he didn't see himself as being a problem and he didn't feel he needed to change anything.
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Old 03-23-2007, 08:07 PM   #42
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Re: Patten released

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Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
I'm not holding out much hope for Lloyd, mainly because of his attitude.

What bugs me about him is those quotes from last year where he basically said he didn't see himself as being a problem and he didn't feel he needed to change anything.

I think Lloyd needs to learn what, and what not to say. If he does speak, he needs to learn both how, and when. The references made about the San Fran media in his rap lyrics in my opinion are totally out of line. Regardless of his disdain for the media, they are in position to make or break his career form the standpoint of publicy. He's a Redskin, and I want to see him be successful, but I would also like to see him do something about his attitude.
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Old 03-23-2007, 08:15 PM   #43
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Re: Patten released

Unfortunate but I guess it had to be done. I liked the guy but there was no room for him to play.

I liked his comment to Gibbs when they traded for Lloyd..."You going to play the best?...As long long as you're going to play the best then I'll be alright."

Good guy.
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Old 03-24-2007, 07:44 PM   #44
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Re: Patten released

Great guy, just couldnt stay healthy.
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Old 03-24-2007, 10:10 PM   #45
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Re: Patten released

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Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
The funny thing was that James Thrash did way better than either of them in far fewer oppertunities.

You can't make the Lloyd deal look good no matter how you spin it. We overvalued him three times last year. First, we sent picks for a receiver whose identical quality can be found on the waiver wire at any point. Second, we gave Lloyd a big money deal even though we had him under a test contract. Third, we gave him playing time that Randle El and Thrash deserved early last season.

Patten was an apparently good signing when we made it happen in that he had No. 1 receiver potential based on his prior stats in NE. But for whatever reason, he was horrible here in the first half of 2005, and injured in the second. Obviously, he didn't see a lot of passes with Moss having the year he was, but he saw fewer passes the few prior years in NE and did way better. It was just the classic case of a skill position player hitting the wall, and unfortunately for us, it happened the year we signed him. It sucks, but hey, what can you do?

Lloyd was a 4th round pick who hasn't done crap to prove that he deserved to go any higher. Yet, due to some gross talent evaluation by Al Saunders [who probably shouldn't be evaluating talent, at least let Gibbs do it], he's getting paid bazillions, while Freddie Mitchell rots in receiver hell some where (I know FredEx has character issues and would not be a good fit here, but I'm trying to find a crappy comparision for Lloyd that can be found on the waiver wire).

But teams that have No. 1 targets like Moss, and in our case, a compliment that is Cooley, should probably refrain from investing in more receivers. It becomes impossible to keep them all happy.

Patten was never going to get another chance here. He was more than expendable.

Good signing to get him here, but his time was up.
I'm not sure Al had much to do with signing Lloyd. I'm sure he had some input. I think it was a group effort. It's Snyder who does the contracts so I would blame Danny for paying him so much. Not sure who's dumb idea it was to give up a 3rd and a 4th. Probably the same person who gave up a 3rd for Brunell when he was going to get cut anyway. That person is Gibbs so he's to blame. The buck stops with him. The guy should be coaching and not making personel moves.

Bottom line is they blew it. Now the question is can he pick up his play and his attitude? I think he gets one more year to prove himself.
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