Another Briggs Thread-More Teams Entering the Bidding?

[SmootSmack]

I think we can still get a quality DE/DT at the #31 spot. Ideally if we're going to trade down and for a player that player would be a DB though, not a linebacker.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by riggoraider

Believe me... I do understand what you are saying... but...the hand writing is on the wall if we sign Briggs (and I am sure that this a done deal).

We are moving down to 31, which gives us no shot at one of the the top D-lineman in the draft this year. That speaks for itself to the fact that the coaching staff is not really worried about improvement at that position this year.

So you have to ask yourself...what was the next biggest concern on our team this past season?

The answer is a definite, intermediate and red-zone passing offense, therefore,I am sure that we are going to address that concern with a bigger receiver who can give our young QB more options in both situations.

Why are you so sure that this is a done deal with the Briggs thing?

Also, I kind of disagree that we have "no shot" at one of the top D-lineman with the 31st pick. Guys like Carriker, Spencer, Crowder, Harrell- all could be there. This is one of the deepest drafts for D-line that I can ever remember.

The red-zone passing issues probably had something to do with the QB. Brunell got benched mid-season for a guy who had never started a game before. Not exactly consistency from the most important position. Remember in '05, Sellers catching 7 TDs in the red zone? Cooley's productivity? Also, last season Portis led the NFC in rushing TDs when he got hurt. We are run first. We have blazing speed in ARE and Moss, really all we need in the WR department is a big possession receiver, and Cooley functions pretty well as that guy. Remember my comparisons it Saunders' offense in KC??

[riggoraider]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

The obvious flaw causing our inability to move the ball in short yardage situations is a running issue. The solution would be to get bigger up front at the Tight End position, and quicker at the interior line positions.

I hope you aren't suggesting we get a big guy and throw him goalline fades. The success rate of that play is in the 15-18% range. If we threw 4 straight goalline fades, theres a better than 50% chance we'd fail to score.

We certainly need to fix our short yardage problem, but you'd be crazy to start anywhere but the guys up front.

I am not talking "short yardage", as far, as 3 to 5 yards. The red-zone starts at the 20 yard line.We do OK from the 20 to the 20... hence the #4 rushing offense in the NFL .... Our problem starts when we get into the red-zone when our only, true, passing option is Cooley.

We can,also, help our backs out if we can get an receiver who can , effectively, catch the 15-20 yard passes across the middle of the field.

[riggoraider]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I think we can still get a quality DE/DT at the #31 spot. Ideally if we're going to trade down and for a player that player would be a DB though, not a linebacker.

I am 90% sure that we are going to get a receiver

[riggoraider]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Why are you so sure that this is a done deal with the Briggs thing?

Also, I kind of disagree that we have "no shot" at one of the top D-lineman with the 31st pick. Guys like Carriker, Spencer, Crowder, Harrell- all could be there. This is one of the deepest drafts for D-line that I can ever remember.

The red-zone passing issues probably had something to do with the QB. Brunell got benched mid-season for a guy who had never started a game before. Not exactly consistency from the most important position. Remember in '05, Sellers catching 7 TDs in the red zone? Cooley's productivity? Also, last season Portis led the NFC in rushing TDs when he got hurt. We are run first. We have blazing speed in ARE and Moss, really all we need in the WR department is a big possession receiver, and Cooley functions pretty well as that guy. Remember my comparisons it Saunders' offense in KC??

Carriker will not be there at 31 and the other guys will not beat out the players that we have now, therfore we may as well play what we have now and wait to next year, when we have plenty of draft picks, to get a better quality D-lineman than the 31st pick.

The "big possesion receiver" is my point and who we will probably go after with the 31st pick. Saunders' offense worked well in KC but we are trying to be better than a first round playoff losing team.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by riggoraider

I am not talking "short yardage", as far, as 3 to 5 yards. The red-zone starts at the 20 yard line.We do OK from the 20 to the 20... hence the #4 rushing offense in the NFL .... Our problem starts when we get into the red-zone when our only, true, passing option is Cooley.

We can,also, help our backs out if we can get an receiver who can , effectively, catch the 15-20 yard passes across the middle of the field.

I think you have correctly identified the problem, but not the solution. Our red zone pass offense ranks 17th by this metric. As you can see, our red zone rush offense ranks 30th. Additionally, our 3rd and short offense ranks a pathetic 30th by the same measure. Even moreso, our power (run) success rating, described below:

Power Success: Percentage of runs on third or fourth down, two yards or less to go, that achieved a first down or touchdown. Also includes runs on first-and-goal or second-and-goal from the two-yard line or closer. This is the only statistic on this page that includes quarterbacks.

By this measurement, our power running game ranks 29th.

All these metrics bring us to the exact same conclusion. We lack the ability to run the ball in short yardage. While a tall target would give us passing options to try to throw around our running problems, statistics show that we have already attempted to compensate (and have been relatively successful). The only way to fix this issue is to combat it head on. Bring in powerful blocking TEs. Bring in quick centers and guards who fire off the ball and drive the defense back. Let's raise our ranking in the power running game. After all, isn't that what Redskins football is all about.

We have adequate personel to run our finesse offense already. Sometimes you need to line up and hit somebody in the mouth. We don't have the personel to do that right now.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by riggoraider

I am 90% sure that we are going to get a receiver

For some reason I just feel the urge to argue this. With all the money we have invested in Moss, ARE, and Lloyd, (next year at this time Cooley will have a big contract, too), why do we use our only pick on the 1st day on a wideout? This offense has been proven to work with nothing more than role players at the WR positions. A pass catching TE, a great O-line, and an excellent rushing attack with pass catching RBs made it tops in the league for 5 straight years. We already have the ingredients. It just took us a season to get familiar with the recipe. I have confidence in our O. We'll just have to use Cooley and maybe Thrash for the short yardage over the middle passing game (which mind you is only a small fraction of our total yardage). Cooley is better than a lot of the possession receivers in the league.

[GMScud]

I knew GTripp's two cents was coming! :thumb:

[riggoraider]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I think you have correctly identified the problem, but not the solution. Our red zone pass offense ranks 17th by this metric. As you can see, our red zone rush offense ranks 30th. Additionally, our 3rd and short offense ranks a pathetic 30th by the same measure. Even moreso, our power (run) success rating, described below:



By this measurement, our power running game ranks 29th.

All these metrics bring us to the exact same conclusion. We lack the ability to run the ball in short yardage. While a tall target would give us passing options to try to throw around our running problems, statistics show that we have already attempted to compensate (and have been relatively successful). The only way to fix this issue is to combat it head on. Bring in powerful blocking TEs. Bring in quick centers and guards who fire off the ball and drive the defense back. Let's raise our ranking in the power running game. After all, isn't that what Redskins football is all about.

We have adequate personel to run our finesse offense already. Sometimes you need to line up and hit somebody in the mouth. We don't have the personel to do that right now.

First, I would like to applaud you on your diction and the way you are able to carry on a, very, respectable debate as you have presented at the young age of 19. Your parents should be congratulated.

BUT...

"Redskins football" is about establishing the lead with ball control offense which includes utilizing all of their resources. Monk, Clark and Didier was just as big of contributors, if not more, than our "power runners".

AFTER we got the lead ,Riggins and other power runners were more of a importance.

edit: Name one power runner, besides Riggins, who had, stellar, careers in our Superbowl years. Even Riggins did not average a lot of yards for us but he did seal the game.

[riggoraider]

Originally Posted by GMScud

For some reason I just feel the urge to argue this. With all the money we have invested in Moss, ARE, and Lloyd, (next year at this time Cooley will have a big contract, too), why do we use our only pick on the 1st day on a wideout? This offense has been proven to work with nothing more than role players at the WR positions. A pass catching TE, a great O-line, and an excellent rushing attack with pass catching RBs made it tops in the league for 5 straight years. We already have the ingredients. It just took us a season to get familiar with the recipe. I have confidence in our O. We'll just have to use Cooley and maybe Thrash for the short yardage over the middle passing game (which mind you is only a small fraction of our total yardage). Cooley is better than a lot of the possession receivers in the league.

I understand what you are saying but money does not catch passes.

KC's offense consisted of a 1700 yard back, 3000+ yard passer and a 1200 yard pass catching tight end AND their receivers produced just as much as ours did last season.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by riggoraider

First, I would like to applaud you on your diction and the way you are able to carry on a, very, respectable debate as you have presented at the young age of 19. Your parents should be congratulated.

BUT...

"Redskins football" is about establishing the lead with ball control offense which includes utilizing all of their resources. Monk, Clark and Didier was just as big of contributors, if not more, than our "power runners".

AFTER we got the lead ,Riggins and other power runners were more of a importance.

edit: Name one power runner, besides Riggins, who had, stellar, careers in our Superbowl years. Even Riggins did not average a lot of yards for us but he did seal the game.

Thank you for your kind words.

I think we have the resources with Moss, Cooley, and Randle El to convert 3rd downs and score a good percentage of the time with the passing game. If we want to achieve balance in that short yardage game, I believe we will have to shore up some up front run blocking issues. I believe most if not all of our offensive issues--of which there aren't all that many--are blocking related.

I think if we want our offense to improve beyond the natural progression of Campbell, we have our work cut out for us over the next few months. To clarify, I don't think we need any runner besides Betts or Portis to improve this. I feel they are adequate. I would start by bringing in some skilled blocking TEs and if that doesn't work, then start looking at the interior of our offensive line as being inadequate.

I don't see a great improvement in our short yardage offense in the cards for next season, to be completely honest.

[Oakland Red]

Unless we draft a game changing player like Calvin Johnson, we need to draft for the defense, in my view, given the way it broke down last year.

Our offense will improve greatly from the opportunity for Jason Campbell to get his timing down with his receivers, something that wasn't possible last year.

Also, we will go into the year with the Gibbs/Saunders hybrid offense that was working at the end of the year, instead of being completely unsure of our identity as we were when we changed everything to Saunders system at the beginning of the year.

We also have the fact that the players had much needed time off this year, and that Gibbs, showing real leadership in listening to his players, allowed them to work out on their own for a couple of months.

Our secondary has been solidified with free agency and players returning from injury. We have an excellent new defensive quarterback in Fletcher. With Washington, McIntosh, and Marshall we have a lot of talent, but I think Briggs would add a lot. I can see McIntosh and Marshall as able backups and McIntosh getting a lot of playing time in a rotation.

Unless there is a game breaking player, I would draft for the defensive line. A major impact player at a position of non-need still gives you more overall strength, and you can trade or adjust your roster later. Without such a player, like Calvin Johnson, I would draft for the line. We need to get younger there. Still we have the emerging Carter, who was coming on at the end last year, Cornelius Griffin, Golston, Salavea, Daniels, Wynn - all good players. We do need youth there though.

I think Brandon Lloyd is still a talented player who came out here into a confused situation with our offense and perhaps was a little overwhelmed by things with the expecations and so forth. SF is a very laid back place. Hopefully, he will come on strong this year, but I would start ARE, (who I think is a game breaking player), given his experience and status as a team leader - and he will have a chance to get his timing with Campbell from the beginning. We will have a situation where the offense, from the start of the year, will be something the players relate to and have a strong sense of identity with.

Finally, I think that the Redskins' system of bringing players in who are really good people, who will work together cooperatively, through tough times and good times, will pay its dividends.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I think you have correctly identified the problem, but not the solution. Our red zone pass offense ranks 17th by this metric. As you can see, our red zone rush offense ranks 30th. Additionally, our 3rd and short offense ranks a pathetic 30th by the same measure. Even moreso, our power (run) success rating, described below:



By this measurement, our power running game ranks 29th.

All these metrics bring us to the exact same conclusion. We lack the ability to run the ball in short yardage. While a tall target would give us passing options to try to throw around our running problems, statistics show that we have already attempted to compensate (and have been relatively successful). The only way to fix this issue is to combat it head on. Bring in powerful blocking TEs. Bring in quick centers and guards who fire off the ball and drive the defense back. Let's raise our ranking in the power running game. After all, isn't that what Redskins football is all about.

We have adequate personel to run our finesse offense already. Sometimes you need to line up and hit somebody in the mouth. We don't have the personel to do that right now.

that's al saunders horizontal/WR reverse running game though. the year before, sellers and cooley and our running game did MUCH better (as did our offense in general). of course, we also played the rams and 49ers, which helps.

btw, if bowe (WR) is there at 31, he'd be a great value. I thin we'd probably go 2nd tier DE myself, but for whoever's thinking WR, bowe is probably the 2nd best WR in the draft and he might be there cause he ran a slow 40.

[Mattyk]

You've gotta give Rosenhaus credit, Briggs has been a headline for a week now and it's only going to end with his client getting a nice payday from somebody. Let's just hope it's not from us.

[diehardskin2982]

I really hope someone else gets him... why trade ur future for a malcontent who benefited from the system