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The case against Cowher

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Old 01-09-2008, 10:58 AM   #31
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Re: The case against Cowher

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Originally Posted by 724Skinsfan View Post
I''l be mildly surprised if Cowher is ever our head coach. Even a bit more surprised if Williams isn't offered the job. He could decline it, of course. #1 on my list is Williams.
#2 is Russ Grimm. I do like the security blanket idea of bringing in a former Skins player with a plenty of coaching experience in today's NFL. However, by bringing in Grimm are we destined to use his own legacy against him, too?
I'm suprised cause if Williams was the next hire, I figure that would have been part of the press conference yesterday. If his (Snyder's) mind is made up, why wait? I think it's obvious he's looking outside the team first.

Honestly, I'd be fine if they blew the team up and started over with Cowher or someone else. It's not like we're breaking up the 1989 49ers here. One playoff win in four years under Gibbs, etc? What chemistry, etc are people afraid of upsetting? The mediocrity, the losses, the barely scraping into the playoffs twice only to be bounced out just as fast? I will always love and respect Gibbs and his staff but it got old about 3 years ago seeing him and Bugle and Williams, etc with the constant "well we fought hard" and the "boys gave it their all", etc....same tired press conferences after the same tired losses, breakdowns on offense, defense....

I say blast em up and bring someone else in....although without a GM I don't think anyone will be successful here.
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:00 AM   #32
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Re: The case against Cowher

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Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
Just to make my opinion clear again, I want GW as head coach.

However, I do fear the Danny's courting Cowher. You use Marty as an example, but remember that Marty said he'd "never" work for Snyder, then lo & behold he's in skins gear.

Cowher might want total control, but that doesn't mean he can't be sold on the idea of working in the committee w/Dan & Vinny on personel.

While I agree w/most assessments here about the fo structure, players, cap & how Cowher wouldn't be a good fit, I think you have to at least concede that if the Danny has Cowher in mind, he'll do whatever he can to get him here. That scares me & I hope he thinks it through enough to realize that Gibbs has built a foundation that could easily crumble if you bring in the wrong guy, or for that matter bringing in anyone rather than hiring GW.
Oh, I agree w/ you that I think Dan S can talk a good game. Marty said he'd never come here and he did. I was making the point that his friend and mentor Marty S came here w/ and it couldn't work/didn't work b/c of lack of control. I've got to think Cowher would know this and use it as an example.

With all that, it would not be surprising to see Dan S lure Cowher here.
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:40 AM   #33
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Re: The case against Cowher

Why bring another coach in from retirement only to have him leave in 5 years or so...
Gregg Williams is 49y/o and has quite a few years ahead of him to coach (10+ potentially) With Cowher.... who knows!

How about a little analogy....

when you build a house...

you clear the lot of trees etc.... (Gibbs2.0)
escavate the grounds... (Gibbs2.0)
pour the footer... (Gibbs2.0)
pour the foundation... (Gibbs2.0)
begin framing...(Gibbs2.0)
build the roof to protect it all... (Gibbs2.0)
etc...etc.... etc....

If I was building a house and I was unable to finish it myself
I would make sure that the people I hire to finish the job for
me could do the job as good as I could or better than me and
I wouldn't settle for anything less. NEVER would I consider tearing it
all down only to start over.

That's insane!!!!
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:43 AM   #34
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Re: The case against Cowher

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Originally Posted by redsk1 View Post
Oh, I agree w/ you that I think Dan S can talk a good game. Marty said he'd never come here and he did. I was making the point that his friend and mentor Marty S came here w/ and it couldn't work/didn't work b/c of lack of control. I've got to think Cowher would know this and use it as an example.

With all that, it would not be surprising to see Dan S lure Cowher here.
True, you'd think Cowher would think it through & look at the Danny's track record & his involvement in decisions. Maybe that's enough to keep him at home this year. He could be swayed by the $ though, and that's what I fear. Just like players that are out to get paid, we don't want a coach that's primarily motivated to come here by the salary.

On a side note, if you're Bill Cowher & you really mean what you say about not coaching in 08, when do you say that publicly in front of a camera? I would think soon, unless of course there's a possibility that you could be talked into coaching in 08.
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:50 AM   #35
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Re: The case against Cowher

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Originally Posted by RFKRat View Post
I'm suprised cause if Williams was the next hire, I figure that would have been part of the press conference yesterday. If his (Snyder's) mind is made up, why wait? I think it's obvious he's looking outside the team first.

Honestly, I'd be fine if they blew the team up and started over with Cowher or someone else. It's not like we're breaking up the 1989 49ers here. One playoff win in four years under Gibbs, etc? What chemistry, etc are people afraid of upsetting? The mediocrity, the losses, the barely scraping into the playoffs twice only to be bounced out just as fast? I will always love and respect Gibbs and his staff but it got old about 3 years ago seeing him and Bugle and Williams, etc with the constant "well we fought hard" and the "boys gave it their all", etc....same tired press conferences after the same tired losses, breakdowns on offense, defense....

I say blast em up and bring someone else in....although without a GM I don't think anyone will be successful here.
There's a lot I could say to disagree w/all you've said, but to keep it short; if it "got old" in Gibbs II, keep in mind that he got the team to the playoffs in the last 4 years twice as much as the team managed to while he was gone from 93-04.
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:52 AM   #36
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Re: The case against Cowher

I wouldn't really mind if Bill Cowher were our head coach, the guy's accomplishments speak for themselves! GW was a head coach before guys lets not forget. I don't think it would be living in the past of we hired Cowher, I think marty was in it for the check when he was here. Somehow Cowher doesn't seem like that type of guy, I don't know how that would work with al saunders upstairs or if it would. Or how bout cowher for defensive coordinator and then GW for head coach?

I really think cowher would probably be a good fit for the skins, His offense's when it came to passing was decent, but yeah we gotta protect JC better, actually no matter who it is JC or TC we need to protect them better one's your qb of the future, and the other is a old guy nearing the end of his career. But guys other than Cowher lets not forget that their are alot of people out there that could be in line for this job. Remember Brian Billick is in the area and he is probably looking for a job, I really don't wanna see Pete leave USC but what if snyder persues him? Who else is in line for this job?
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:54 AM   #37
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Re: The case against Cowher

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Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
There's a lot I could say to disagree w/all you've said, but to keep it short; if it "got old" in Gibbs II, keep in mind that he got the team to the playoffs in the last 4 years twice as much as the team managed to while he was gone from 93-04.
Amen the only one who came close to success after Joe was Norv Turner!
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:02 PM   #38
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Re: The case against Cowher

Anything could happen of course, but I'm starting to sway to the side that says Cowher is not coming here.

1) At this point Cowher has been pretty unwavering in saying that he is taking 2 years off and will consider returning in 2009. Yes money talks, but that money is going to be there for him whether it's 2008 or 2009.

2) Cowher comes from the Marty coaching tree, so he would undoubtedly consult with Marty at some point in regard to Snyder and the Redskins job. Yes Marty and Snyder from all reports have patched things up since he left, but I'm sure Marty would have some valuable insight to offer Cowher.

3) If Cowher really wants 100% control, I just don't see Snyder backing off at this point. Ultimately that's what lead to Marty getting canned.

4) If Gibbs is in Snyder's ear regarding the next coach, you would have to think Gibbs would be in favor of as little change as possible so that means hiring from within, which means Gregg Williams.

Of course this could all be out the window in the blink of an eye. I admit that Gibbs leaving caught me off guard so how much do I really know? :cheeky-sm
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:11 PM   #39
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Re: The case against Cowher

Cowher would be another overpaid Marty. Have a great record during the season and choke in the playoffs and CONSERVATIVE play calling. No thanks!! I hope Snyder proves JLC and NFL executives who believe that he will hired as HC wrong. He has to hire GW or all this stuff I've learned from Joe Gibbs the last 4 years is just BS.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:56 PM   #40
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Re: The case against Cowher

Cowher is like Schottenheimer except that Marty is a hell of a lot smarter than Cowher is.

Hire Williams please. If you hire an outsider he'll break up the team and it will be back to 6-10. Then if we're lucky, we'll back to 9-7 by 2010.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:58 PM   #41
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Re: The case against Cowher

I'd like for us to stay in house but an outsider isn't necessarily the kiss of death. Look at the Steelers for example (though I think Tomlins is a bit overrated and that team is due for a slump next year)
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Old 01-09-2008, 01:05 PM   #42
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Re: The case against Cowher

I disagree that an outsider will definitely break up the team. To quote Norv Turner: "What we have works". Anybody coming in from the outside is going to evaluate the team and should see that there is a great mix of veteran and young talent. You don't tear something up "just because." If it's working, tweak it a little bit by bringing in a couple of guys that you trust. Our team definitely works right now as indicated by the close losses we had this year. Our team is not in disarray, open revolt or enduring any sort of mass free agent exodus. Whoever comes is going to have to "settle" for what he's already got. I'm sure Snyder will see to that or it will probably be a brief Spurrier-like existence next year.
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Old 01-09-2008, 01:10 PM   #43
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Re: The case against Cowher

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Originally Posted by 724Skinsfan View Post
I disagree that an outsider will definitely break up the team. To quote Norv Turner: "What we have works". Anybody coming in from the outside is going to evaluate the team and should see that there is a great mix of veteran and young talent. You don't tear something up "just because." If it's working, tweak it a little bit by bringing in a couple of guys that you trust. Our team definitely works right now as indicated by the close losses we had this year. Our team is not in disarray, open revolt or enduring any sort of mass free agent exodus. Whoever comes is going to have to "settle" for what he's already got. I'm sure Snyder will see to that or it will probably be a brief Spurrier-like existence next year.
In Norv's case it worked because of a similar style of offense and defense. If you bring Cowher he plays a 3-4 D and a more conservative O which would change things dramatically.
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Old 01-09-2008, 01:39 PM   #44
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Re: The case against Cowher

I may be in the minority here, but I don't think Cowher is a good head coach. At all. I would put him in the Norv range (though I'm not quite as down on Norv as everyone else around here is).

1) The players he won the super bowl with don't seem to like him. At all.

2) His analyst job with CBS has left me totally unimpressed regarding his football knowledge.

3) He has a certain arrogance about him, and I really think that he would make more changes to the group we have here than any other coach would.
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Old 01-09-2008, 01:54 PM   #45
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Re: The case against Cowher

Bottom line is coaching is over rated. The media makes such a big deal about coaching. Yes you need a good coach that the players respect but it ALWAYS comes down to players. The team with the best players wins the Super Bowl. Why did Norv Turner get a job in the first place? Because he coached Troy, Michael and Emmitt. It's not like he has some special play book or something. Why is Josh McDaniels being considered for jobs at 32 years old? Cause he calls plays for Tom Brady and Randy Moss. If Cowher comes here, is he so good that he is going to get us over the hump just cause he yells and screams and dials up the zone blitzes? No. Give the job to GW cause he has the players respect and they will play hard for him.
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