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Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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Old 02-08-2008, 12:40 PM   #61
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
I don't know if you specifically fall under this category, but I think it's pretty unbelievable that people make such a big stink about "We need a General Manager" "It's too much for the coach to handle both coaching and personnel moves" yet so many of these same people are upset because we're not giving control to first time coaches like Meeks and Spags or guys like Williams and Carroll.
There's that logic thing popping up again. I thought you were going to get that removed for the sake of 'continuity' on the board..

I think we're getting caught up in the media storm over this whole thing.. Marcellus Wiley on First Take this morning said that most of the players could care less at this point about what's going on. It won't affect them until March or so when they have to start the offseason regimen. The only ones who are really dialed in are free agents who don't know if they'll fit the new coach's system or not.

Like Snyder said at the outset, he's not interested in winning any more press conferences, he wants to win championships. If it takes him 6 weeks to get the guy who is going to accomplish that, then so be it.
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:45 PM   #62
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

SS - why is the FO structure stupid -


-danny wants a coach that will basically march to his beat and not complain about it (GW wanted to keep saunders, wanted some say on personnel, so he's gone, mora wanted knapp, and knew it wouldn't happen here).

-everyone wanted stability, so the first thing that happens is firing the head of our offense and defense and an attempt to change to a WCO and a 3-4 D... WTF??? granted our offense wasn't amazing, but it's hard to believe lds's rants on stability after that flash of what he really wanted to do. (though he did originally want to keep GW as the DC, it was beyond stupid to think that'd ever happen).

those are the two real issues. by feeling the need to dictate conditions to your coach to the degree that's been seen here, i'm not sure any grade A candidate would ever choose the skins and the best option.

also last year was vinny's first good year (FA/draft combined - no wasted money on archuletta, lloyd, etc) - but GW/saunders/gibbs had say. so as the head guy, this is his first real shot solo to not screw things up. there's really no clear track record, and you're not really sure if some things were based on danny's views (drafting ramsey, not trading ramsey for AO straight up, bad signings with huge contracts, etc).

more of a concern than an issue, but i actually think we'll do alright on the FA/draft thing. WR FAs and draftable DL guys are strengths this year, and that's what we need.
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:46 PM   #63
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
I don't know if you specifically fall under this category, but I think it's pretty unbelievable that people make such a big stink about "We need a General Manager" "It's too much for the coach to handle both coaching and personnel moves" yet so many of these same people are upset because we're not giving control to first time coaches like Meeks and Spags or guys like Williams and Carroll.

I am one who believes we need a GM, but I dont think its a must have to win. Some teams have had some success not having a GM, but overall the success rate of teams with good GM's are much higher than those that don't. I dont want the coach to have entire control over the roster, but I do think they should have control over the coaching staff. I dont have a problem with Vinny and Danny being in on some personel moves, but the current structure hasn't provided much in the ways of winning seasons, playoffs and definately not conference champs or superbowls. Until this organization wins consistantly, makes playoffs, conf championships and maybe superbowls, this owner and front office will hear the same crap year in and year out. those who think its bashing may be right, but win and it stops, simple as that.
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:56 PM   #64
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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Originally Posted by That Guy View Post
SS - why is the FO structure stupid -


-danny wants a coach that will basically march to his beat and not complain about it (GW wanted to keep saunders, wanted some say on personnel, so he's gone, mora wanted knapp, and knew it wouldn't happen here).

-everyone wanted stability, so the first thing that happens is firing the head of our offense and defense and an attempt to change to a WCO and a 3-4 D... WTF??? granted our offense wasn't amazing, but it's hard to believe lds's rants on stability after that flash of what he really wanted to do. (though he did originally want to keep GW as the DC, it was beyond stupid to think that'd ever happen).

those are the two real issues. by feeling the need to dictate conditions to your coach to the degree that's been seen here, i'm not sure any grade A candidate would ever choose the skins and the best option.

also last year was vinny's first good year (FA/draft combined - no wasted money on archuletta, lloyd, etc) - but GW/saunders/gibbs had say. so as the head guy, this is his first real shot solo to not screw things up. there's really no clear track record, and you're not really sure if some things were based on danny's views (drafting ramsey, not trading ramsey for AO straight up, bad signings with huge contracts, etc).

more of a concern than an issue, but i actually think we'll do alright on the FA/draft thing. WR FAs and draftable DL guys are strengths this year, and that's what we need.
Different, but I don't know about stupid

Some clarifications though:

-Williams wanted all control. By the way two of the last three coaches had complete control and the other got an open checkbook and could have had it if he wanted it.

-The part about DS wanted Williams to stay as DC, turns out that wasn't true

I think people assume that because Ryan ran a 3-4 in Baltimore he would do the same here. Not necessarily true. Ryan is a disciple of the 46 (just like his dad, just like williams), he likely would have run a 4-3 here.

The WCO is certainly a change and it remains to be seen how that will play out. Besides, as I've said in another thread "stability" should not be pigeonholed to just Williams and Saunders

But, as LTF says, this is just beating a dead horse. Let's just wait for the results. Wake me up when September ends
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:59 PM   #65
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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JLC said Williams would have kept Saunders for the sake of continuity for Campbell but he would have made him condense his playbook and simplify things more.
You made my point. Did JLC quote Williams as saying this or was it one of those rumore thing that have been going around?
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Old 02-08-2008, 01:02 PM   #66
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

Not losing respectability...lost it. Right or wrong the public image of the Redskins has plummeted since the day Joe Gibbs resigned.
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Old 02-08-2008, 01:41 PM   #67
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

He's totally lost all respectability IMO. This whole thing is a big mess and no coach with a spine is going to coach here. Imagine Joe Gibbs working with an owner who hires HIS assistants for him. Yeah right!! I think I've said this before but Snyder has no ability to feel the pulse of his own team. He totally fails 100% in carrying over the momentum from last year. An example of that is the qb situtation. I think eveyone here feels comfortable with JC as #1 going in with Collins #2 and bring back Al. We're real solid at Qb with that set-up. Right? Now we're probably going to lose Collins, change the offense AGAIN, the OC is gone which is going to mean a new back-up QB. Sorry but that's just not good smart ownership. It seems to me Snyder is more worried about getting along with his HC rather than doing what's best for the team. What if JC goes down again? Who is his backup and can he play at the level Collins did?

I think well be Ok on defense but the offense could be real messy.
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Old 02-08-2008, 01:46 PM   #68
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

I dont think he is loosing respectablility it is more the fact that he never had respectablility to begin with. He brought in Spurrier with that ridiculous run and gun offense, a slew of aging veterans like Deion Sanders, Jeff George,etc. We keep trading all of our draft picks for players like Lloyd and Duckett. The bad free agents signings continued with Brunell, Archuleta, Randle el (love el but he is overpaid for his production). The only respectable thing Snyder has done in his tenure of ownership was bringing Gibbs out of retirement. After Gibbs stepped down, what does snyder do? Fires the only stable element we had left, Greg Williams. Now we are hiring a bunch of cordinators without a coach and completly starting from scratch after a playoff campaign. It doesnt make sense. This team seems to once again be going in the wrong directions.
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Old 02-08-2008, 01:53 PM   #69
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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He's totally lost all respectability IMO. This whole thing is a big mess and no coach with a spine is going to coach here. Imagine Joe Gibbs working with an owner who hires HIS assistants for him. Yeah right!! I think I've said this before but Snyder has no ability to feel the pulse of his own team. He totally fails 100% in carrying over the momentum from last year. An example of that is the qb situtation. I think eveyone here feels comfortable with JC as #1 going in with Collins #2 and bring back Al. We're real solid at Qb with that set-up. Right? Now we're probably going to lose Collins, change the offense AGAIN, the OC is gone which is going to mean a new back-up QB. Sorry but that's just not good smart ownership. It seems to me Snyder is more worried about getting along with his HC rather than doing what's best for the team. What if JC goes down again? Who is his backup and can he play at the level Collins did?

I think well be Ok on defense but the offense could be real messy.
Yea this offense was really lighting things up.
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Old 02-08-2008, 02:04 PM   #70
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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Yea this offense was really lighting things up.
But why change everything on JC again? Putting a young QB in his 3rd offense in 4 years is just a REALLY REALLY stupid thing to do. Don't you think? Putting any Qb in this situation is stupid. And if he really wanted to get rid of Al then fine. But why not bring in someone who runs the same offense? Cam Cameron was out there before Balt. got him. Snyder just does some dumb shit.
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Old 02-08-2008, 02:11 PM   #71
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

One thing with all of this change in coaching staff is our new coach might not feel Campbell is the answer at QB. I know Zorn has been brought in to enhance Campbell but we still might need to draft or sign a veteran QB that the new coach will be able to stabilize the offense with.
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Old 02-08-2008, 02:35 PM   #72
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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But why change everything on JC again? Putting a young QB in his 3rd offense in 4 years is just a REALLY REALLY stupid thing to do. Don't you think? Putting any Qb in this situation is stupid. And if he really wanted to get rid of Al then fine. But why not bring in someone who runs the same offense? Cam Cameron was out there before Balt. got him. Snyder just does some dumb shit.
Or you could say keeping him in an offense that he's not exceeding in could also be seen as really really stupid.

Even if GW got the job he was going to make Saunders simplify things. That seems to tell me things weren't going all that well.

JC had his best season in college playing in a WC system. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Snyder and co. looked for JC's input when they went out and got Zorn.
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Old 02-08-2008, 02:39 PM   #73
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

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One thing with all of this change in coaching staff is our new coach might not feel Campbell is the answer at QB. I know Zorn has been brought in to enhance Campbell but we still might need to draft or sign a veteran QB that the new coach will be able to stabilize the offense with.
Good point. But my point is we were stable with JC and Collins as 1 and 2 in the Al's offense. Why blow that up? You can always draft a young guy to groom and I thought that was Palmer. But I guess they thought he wasn't good enough so they hung on to Brunell another year.
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Old 02-08-2008, 02:59 PM   #74
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

Unlike many Redskins fans, I don't think Dan Snyder is the anti-Christ. Dan seems to have certain redeeming qualities as a person (e.g., starting a fund for Taylor's daughter and giving players and staff access to his plane for personal reasons) and a coach (e.g., willingness to open up his pocketbook). Moreover, as an owner, I think Dan Snyder has learned a lot and come a long way since 2000.

However, Dan also often acts very childish. Sending ice cream to Mike Nolan, threatening to ruin Coles' career, poking fun at members of the press at dinners, etc. are not exactly signs of maturity. So, while Snyder is not Hitler and is not a horrible owner, he does things that make it very hard for people to give him credit.
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Old 02-08-2008, 03:13 PM   #75
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Re: Dan Snyder losing respectability?

What has Dan Snyder done football operations wise to deserve respect? After eight years of a failing grade (58-70 under Snyder) maybe Snyder has learned something and finally puts the pieces together to build a winner? Maybe.
Gibbs is gone so Snyder wants to go back to calling all the shots. Dan Snyder has a Jerry Jones ego but with out the football experience that Jones has to back it up.
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