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Old 03-03-2008, 11:30 PM   #91
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Another year of Moss and Cooley being our most dangerous receiving threats? I guess if they're prepared for another mediocre offense, yes -- but if we're going to wait for 2009 we might as well draft somebody and ride out the WR learning curve.

Or maybe we have someone already on the roster who will come out of nowhere and knock our socks off.
Well, that's the thing. I mean long-term are we better off keeping with the relative status quo (and maybe drafting a WR) and wait until 2009 to sign someone or should we go ahead and grab someone like Hackett now because there are no guarantees that we can sign a top-flight receiver in 2009?
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:41 PM   #92
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

Here's the question: Is wide receiver the ONLY thing that is keeping this offense from getting to the next level? If yes, then go get someone like Hackett or Bryant Johnson, and hope that they're the last piece of the puzzle.

If no, and it's more complicated than just adding a WR -- then stick it out, see what we've got with Randle El/Caldwell/McCardell/Mix and wait for 2009. Cause chances are there will be growing pains with a new offense and a new head coach anyway.
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Old 03-03-2008, 11:47 PM   #93
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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Here's the question: Is wide receiver the ONLY thing that is keeping this offense from getting to the next level? If yes, then go get someone like Hackett or Bryant Johnson, and hope that they're the last piece of the puzzle.

If no, and it's more complicated than just adding a WR -- then stick it out, see what we've got with Randle El/Caldwell/McCardell/Mix and wait for 2009. Cause chances are there will be growing pains with a new offense and a new head coach anyway.
It is worth considering that maybe with a stronger line (that has more depth) and a less conservative play calling, we can work with the WRs that we have. Once again, it is hard to disregard the need of a posession receiver that can help with short yardage situation and can provide Campbell with another big target in the redzone (besides Cooley).
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Old 03-04-2008, 12:07 AM   #94
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

Speaking of Cooley, can you imagine what he would be bringing in FA right now, so glad they locked him up!
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Old 03-04-2008, 12:13 AM   #95
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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Speaking of Cooley, can you imagine what he would be bringing in FA right now, so glad they locked him up!
We probably would have tagged him (although not sure if could've afforded that though)...or we'd be looking at Alge Crumpler in free agency.
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Old 03-04-2008, 12:36 AM   #96
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

I still can't believe that the average starter raked in $7-8 million per year, during Free Agency.
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Old 03-04-2008, 03:42 AM   #97
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

when johnson starts for the cards he's not very good. if he came here, there's a good chance he could end up as either a good #3 or a borderline #2. if he wants lots of cash (which reportedly, he does) then we should pass.

outside of CJ or roy or fitz (or maybe walker), there's not much going on at WR this offseason. and all those trade possibilities don't seem likely right now, so it's either bring in possible problem child walker, try to get a deal for hackett as depth, draft a guy, or do nothing.
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Old 03-04-2008, 03:43 AM   #98
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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We probably would have tagged him (although not sure if could've afforded that though)...or we'd be looking at Alge Crumpler in free agency.
who got paid almost nothing by the titans.
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Old 03-04-2008, 05:02 AM   #99
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

I'm not sure what kind of money is being offered to Johnson but I'm sure it's more than he's worth. I would have no problem paying big money for a true star but Johnson isn't really an upgrade over the crew we have now. He's a compliment of sorts, but an expensive compliment.

I previously advocated signing him before I saw the money players like Bernard Berrian were going to get. At this point I'd rather either pay top dollar for a true gamebreaker (which is not possible this year) or try and hit through the draft. Dropping 6-7 mil per on a guy who's only decent makes no sense, and is not a luxury we can afford right now.
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Old 03-04-2008, 07:50 AM   #100
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

Any chance Bryant Johnson is trying to use the Skins as leverage to squeeze out a few more dollars from the Bills? We still haven't had a confirmed visit by the Skins (though lack of information wouldn't really be a new thing).
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Old 03-04-2008, 07:50 AM   #101
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

I agree with not overpaying for a FA WR. There are a few solid WR's in the draft that are going to be available in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Mike Mayock believes, and I agree that there are no 1st round WR's available this year. Fortunately for us, we can get a good developmental guy that can be inserted into the number 2 spot when we go 3 wide. In our 2 WR packages we have the option of keeping ARE in the number 2 slot or putting Reche there if we get him resigned.

I concur that Moss is a solid number one as long as a veteran QB is throwing to him. Our offense is going to go as Jason Campbell does. If Jason struggles, then the team will struggle, regardless of who is playing the WR positions. Case and point, Randy Moss in Oakland VS him in NE. In no way am I saying that our recievers are Randy Moss, but I am saying that the QB can make or break recievers. Sadly the reverse is also true, however I do not feel that our guys can hurt Campbell as much as Campbell may potentially hurt them.

I love Campbell and I want to see him develop, but right now he is light years away; and a new offensive system isn't helping matters much.
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Old 03-04-2008, 08:05 AM   #102
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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I agree with not overpaying for a FA WR. There are a few solid WR's in the draft that are going to be available in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Mike Mayock believes, and I agree that there are no 1st round WR's available this year. Fortunately for us, we can get a good developmental guy that can be inserted into the number 2 spot when we go 3 wide. In our 2 WR packages we have the option of keeping ARE in the number 2 slot or putting Reche there if we get him resigned.

I concur that Moss is a solid number one as long as a veteran QB is throwing to him. Our offense is going to go as Jason Campbell does. If Jason struggles, then the team will struggle, regardless of who is playing the WR positions. Case and point, Randy Moss in Oakland VS him in NE. In no way am I saying that our recievers are Randy Moss, but I am saying that the QB can make or break recievers. Sadly the reverse is also true, however I do not feel that our guys can hurt Campbell as much as Campbell may potentially hurt them.

I love Campbell and I want to see him develop, but right now he is light years away; and a new offensive system isn't helping matters much.
Light years away? Seriously? I agree that a new offense isn't a good thing for him, but I don't see "light years away."

To your point about Santana Moss and Jason Campbell. Admittedly, Campbell missed him on some deep shots early in the year, but Moss was injured in the Giants game week 3, he played horribly when he came back against Green Bay (a game that Jason played well in and receivers dropped multiple passes), and then had some OK games along with the 121 yard game in Dallas.

Yes, Moss played well at the end of the year (though he had exactly 1 100 yard game with Campbell and exactly 1 100 yard game with Collins), but that was also the first time he was fully healthy since the beginning of the season (in those games he had 89 yards against Philly and 82 yard against NYG).

I think if you fairly evaluate Campbell's performance last year, especially that three game stretch from Philadelphia to Tampa (Buffalo was a bad situation and he was hurt against Chicago) you see a guy on the verge not a guy who is "light years" away. Maybe you didn't mean to imply such a huge gap, but your language certainly suggests that he is years away from being a decent QB and that he somehow held back Moss (rather than Moss's injuries) last year.
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Old 03-04-2008, 08:38 AM   #103
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

If JC is light years away we're in big trouble.

With 20 starts under his belt he'd better be pretty close to turning the corner.
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Old 03-04-2008, 08:42 AM   #104
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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Light years away? Seriously? I agree that a new offense isn't a good thing for him, but I don't see "light years away."

To your point about Santana Moss and Jason Campbell. Admittedly, Campbell missed him on some deep shots early in the year, but Moss was injured in the Giants game week 3, he played horribly when he came back against Green Bay (a game that Jason played well in and receivers dropped multiple passes), and then had some OK games along with the 121 yard game in Dallas.

Yes, Moss played well at the end of the year (though he had exactly 1 100 yard game with Campbell and exactly 1 100 yard game with Collins), but that was also the first time he was fully healthy since the beginning of the season (in those games he had 89 yards against Philly and 82 yard against NYG).

I think if you fairly evaluate Campbell's performance last year, especially that three game stretch from Philadelphia to Tampa (Buffalo was a bad situation and he was hurt against Chicago) you see a guy on the verge not a guy who is "light years" away. Maybe you didn't mean to imply such a huge gap, but your language certainly suggests that he is years away from being a decent QB and that he somehow held back Moss (rather than Moss's injuries) last year.
He brought up his completion percentage to 60%, but he stiil threw 12 TD's and 11 INT's. His QB rating was only 77. He needs to get through his progressions quicker, get rid of the ball quicker, deliver the deep ball more accurately, stop forcing the ball in the redzone and learn a new offense this offseason. That is a task, hence the words "light years away". It was a bit of an exaggeration, but so were the words "on the verge" IMO. How about we compromise and say "still developing with promise".

Moss was injured a couple of times and had the worst game of his life @ Green Bay. However, Todd Collins, a career backup had over a 100 QB rating through 4 games with the same corps of WR's. Todd Collins by no means has all of the physical tools that Campbell does, but he is more seasoned. Collins is nowhere near being one of the better QB's in the league, but right now he has a leg up on our beloved Campbell.

The bottom line is I want Campbell to succeed and be of the same caliber as Peyton, Rothlisberger, McNabb or Brady. Simply put it is going to take more time.
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Old 03-04-2008, 09:28 AM   #105
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Re: Bryant Johnson Scheduled to Visit Redskins

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He brought up his completion percentage to 60%, but he stiil threw 12 TD's and 11 INT's. His QB rating was only 77. He needs to get through his progressions quicker, get rid of the ball quicker, deliver the deep ball more accurately, stop forcing the ball in the redzone and learn a new offense this offseason. That is a task, hence the words "light years away". It was a bit of an exaggeration, but so were the words "on the verge" IMO. How about we compromise and say "still developing with promise".

Moss was injured a couple of times and had the worst game of his life @ Green Bay. However, Todd Collins, a career backup had over a 100 QB rating through 4 games with the same corps of WR's. Todd Collins by no means has all of the physical tools that Campbell does, but he is more seasoned. Collins is nowhere near being one of the better QB's in the league, but right now he has a leg up on our beloved Campbell.

The bottom line is I want Campbell to succeed and be of the same caliber as Peyton, Rothlisberger, McNabb or Brady. Simply put it is going to take more time.
Good points, but I still think if you look at the three game stretch from Philly to TB you see a QB really close to being very good. You will likely bring up the costly INTs at Dallas and at Tampa that ended those games, but that is the hurdle he needs to cross. Winning games in the fourth quarter is the toughest thing to do and one of the last real progressions for NFL QBs. We saw what happened to Todd Collins when the ball was in his hand and he had to go win a game sans a running game during the Playoffs. He ended up looking a lot like Campbell did. Campbell has some development left, certainly, but I think you aren't really giving him enough credit for the development he showed from 2006 to 2007 and then during the course of 2007. I am concerned about the new offense (you saw how Phillip Rivers struggled this year, even though the offense was more or less the same but with Norv calling the plays). I guess we are actually pretty close in our opinions, but with a different tone to similar points.

Campbell

Philly 23-34, 67.6%, 215 yards, 3 tds, 0 ints
Dallas 33-54, 61.1%, 348 yards, 2 tds, 1 int
Tampa 30-49, 61.2%, 301 yards, 1 td, 2 ints

86-137, 62.7%, 864 yards, 6 tds, 3 ints

Collins

NYG 8-25, 32%, 166 yards, 0 tds, 0 ints
Min 22-29, 75.9%, 254 yards, 2 tds, 0 ints
Dal 22-31, 71.0%, 244 yards, 1 td, 0 ints

52-85, 61.2%, 664 yards, 3 tds, 0 ints

Obviously the game against the Giants was very windy and difficult conditions. If I substituted the Seattle game the numbers look like:

73-110, 66.4%, 764, 5 tds, 2 ints

I'm not detracting from what Collins was able to do, but I think by comparing Collins performance to Campbells and saying it demonstrates the huge progress that still remains for Jason, you aren't giving proper credit to what Jason was doing in the three games prior to his injury (not counting Buffalo, because obviously that was a very unique situation). You also don't consider how much better the defense performed at the end of the year and the fact that Collins was never put in a position where he had to go out in the fourth quarter and win a game (or try to carry a team that was unable to run the football).

Personally, I think Jason demonstrated that he is closer than you suggest, but obviously the new offense will be a great challenge.
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