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If Zorn Wins..........

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Old 04-09-2008, 06:34 PM   #1
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If Zorn Wins..........

in his first season does Gibbs get any of the credit?I still think Gibbs is one of the best coachs ever in the NFL( no secret) but after talking to some Skins fans at work they feel Gibbs was what was wrong I on they other hand feel Gibbs kept you guys alive an didn't get half the credit due him.
Taylor's death and the way it happen could have made any team tank and I think Gibbs was the glue, add in him knowing about his sick grandson and I say it had to be one of his best coaching years.......discuss.
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Old 04-09-2008, 06:39 PM   #2
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

I for one believe that Gibbs was holding them back. I believe that he was scared to take chances and always playing not to lose. With Zorn I really believe that we will open up a lot more and take advantage of our talent that we have on the team. Zorn, being from the Holmgren tree, will be what we need on this team. Zorn will win!!! Draft Albert if he is available!!
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Old 04-09-2008, 06:49 PM   #3
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

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Originally Posted by Giantone View Post
in his first season does Gibbs get any of the credit?I still think Gibbs is one of the best coachs ever in the NFL( no secret) but after talking to some Skins fans at work they feel Gibbs was what was wrong I on they other hand feel Gibbs kept you guys alive an didn't get half the credit due him.
Taylor's death and the way it happen could have made any team tank and I think Gibbs was the glue, add in him knowing about his sick grandson and I say it had to be one of his best coaching years.......discuss.
This is really a two part discussion, in my opinion. I think this team will suffer from the loss of Joe Gibbs as the leader of the football team. I think he did a tremendous job of rallying the team prior too and after Sean's death, and I think he had a uncanty ability to be lead a group of pro atheletes in a way most coaches wish they could, I think thats something Zorn will have to pick up on.....

At the same time, I am excited to (hopefully) see a different approach to playcalling, with hopefully more of a killer instict than we saw at some points during the season last year. I really think our offense will be much better this year under Zorn...its the defense I worry the most about.

Long story short though, Gibbs defintley deserves some credit for assembling this team, should Zorn have a real successful first season as head coach.
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Old 04-09-2008, 06:52 PM   #4
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

I think Gibbs did a fine job with this team. By the end of his tenure we had a pretty good roster and not enough can be said about his ability to motivate a team. If Zorn wins in his first season I believe Gibbs should be getting part of the credit because Zorn is pretty much inheriting Gibbs' roster, save for a few new draft picks. Having Gibbs had its' ups and downs, there were a few things Gibbs did wrong, and I didn't like some of the things he did but he had his good points too, i.e. he put together a nice roster and I think there was very few people who could have done the job he did after ST died.
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Old 04-09-2008, 06:52 PM   #5
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

the bottom line is Gibbs=GOD in DC. I am in the military and if he told me to kill I would no questions asked. But I do agree there were times when he was holding back, and trying to play the game that he used to play. We no longer have Riggins, Riggs, etc, and the smash mouth game of yesteryear doesn't exist anymore. However, he was and always will a symbol of professionalism and a true coach, one that is dedicated to his team and tradition.

Now on to Zorn....with no proven track record all we as fans can do is hope. Hope that the team will buy into a new philosophy, a new scheme (at least offensively), a new identity, and mostly a new coach. But if you look at the Holmgren/Walsh coaching tree a lot of really good coaches have come out that mold. I am eager to see more of an open attack. While it may not be the deep down field passes, the game will be more fun to watch from a fan perspective. Plus with a zone blocking scheme, Portis will have more opportunity to show his dominance. With Moss, and ARE they will not be relied upon to make the big catch, just the YAC, which is there style of game anyways.

After lots of thinking and deliberating I am eager to see what happens. Overall I believe that in time, the skins will be back to dominance, as long as we start drafting for the future, and preserve our sense of winning. NO MORE BIG NAMES AT THE FA. Work on building the team from the young and instill in them what it takes to win at the next level.
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Old 04-09-2008, 06:57 PM   #6
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

From a personnel standpoint, these are still Gibbs' guys, so if we win in the next three years, he should get a portion of the credit. Not as a coach though, just as the guy who built this current roster.
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:13 PM   #7
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

Gibbs went out and got some great talent for our roster. Also, I feel that Gibbs did a top-notch job mentally developing each and every person on the roster. Not a single team member was left out after the death of Sean Taylor. Everyone pulled together and got through it, feeding off of the perserverance that Joe Gibbs instills in each of his players. He got their heads ready for every game and every player knew they could win every game regardless of the final score. Every team has its player who messes up and sticks out as a trouble maker... except the Redskins.

I believe, just from what I have seen, Zorn lacks the mental aspect of the game. He has the fundementals, and will bring a whole new aproach to how to play football. Not a bad thing by any means. If you add the fundementals he has, along with the perserverance, heart, and teamwork that Gibbs left behind, and finally add the player development and skill position assets that Zorn offers.... We have a great team. I do not think we can win any games in the next five years without attributing at least a little credit to Mr. Gibbs.

One more thing... Joe Gibbs is in that front office serving as an advisor to the team. He is in Dannys box, sitting next to his throne. As long as Gibbs is whispering in Danny's ear, it would not be fair to exclude Gibbs from any of the credit dished out for the Redskins.
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:14 PM   #8
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

If he loses, should Gibbs get any of the blame?

I honestly don't think he'll get much credit, but he definitely should.
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:18 PM   #9
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

I liked Gibbs every day but Sunday. For the most part I like the team he put together, but I think his coaching on Sundays left a lot to be desired. The defense is the only reason we won any games. I can only think of a handful of games where our offense put a game away instead of relying on the defense to close it out.

Gibbs has to get some credit for the players in DC, no doubt he improved the roster over what Spurrier had as far as talent goes. We also have to remember, Zorn has never been a coordinator no less a head coach. He'll figure it out but I see it being slow.
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:25 PM   #10
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

We can argue about Gibbs on a strategic level but what Gibbs proved this second time around is that he is one of the all time great leaders of men in this league. His leadership following the Taylor tragedy will be remembered, I believe, as much as his Superbowl victories a football generation ago.

What Gibbs instilled in and insisted on from his players was character and commitment to team, and if Zorn is successful I believe it will be because of that culture that has already been implemented.
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Old 04-09-2008, 09:17 PM   #11
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

I wholeheartedly agree with Gmanc. Gibbs was a tad bit too conservative in his playcalling, but he was the glue that kept the team together after it struggled in 2004 and 2006 and had to deal with Sean Taylor's death and a rash of injuries in 2007.

Given our lack of offseason movement, I would say Gibbs definitely built this house. What Zorn does with it is up to him.
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Old 04-09-2008, 09:19 PM   #12
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

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Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha View Post
I wholeheartedly agree with Gmanc. Gibbs was a tad bit too conservative in his playcalling, but he was the glue that kept the team together after it struggled in 2004 and 2006 and had to deal with Sean Taylor's death and a rash of injuries in 2007.

Given our lack of offseason movement, I would say Gibbs definitely built this house. What Zorn does with it is up to him.
It should be noted that in 2005 and 2007, both years when we made the playoffs...we were pretty much left for dead, which shows how Gibbs could rally a team and keep them together after they were basically left for dead....

In both cases, he carries some of the blame for getting to that point in both seasons, but nevertheless thats what I really admired Gibbs for.
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Old 04-09-2008, 09:39 PM   #13
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

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Originally Posted by Gmanc711 View Post
It should be noted that in 2005 and 2007, both years when we made the playoffs...we were pretty much left for dead, which shows how Gibbs could rally a team and keep them together after they were basically left for dead....

In both cases, he carries some of the blame for getting to that point in both seasons, but nevertheless thats what I really admired Gibbs for.
But don't forget in both those seasons he had bone head moves that cost us games..Also 1-2 in the playoffs don't count for success..
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Old 04-09-2008, 10:23 PM   #14
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

this was gibbs team, of course he gets some credit what kind of question is that?

dumb thread IMO.

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Old 04-10-2008, 02:32 AM   #15
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Re: If Zorn Wins..........

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Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
From a personnel standpoint, these are still Gibbs' guys, so if we win in the next three years, he should get a portion of the credit. Not as a coach though, just as the guy who built this current roster.
I agree, that he should get the credit of building the roster and the coaching staff.

On the opposite end, as a game day coach, I donít think he intentionally played the offense conservatively. I think it was more the players not playing up to their ability. He expected perfection in every play, so when we took the few shots down field it would count. His team would rarely put together a consistent game. We only have a few games where the offense played a complete game all 4 quarters. The SF blow out, the Dallas game in Washington in 2005 to name the few. When they won those games I saw him open the offense up more the following game. Unfortunately they would take a step backward and Gibbs would rein them back in with his conservative play calling. This offense had to be incredibly frustrating for Gibbs to be so close but just canít seem to get them to take that last step to consistency.
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