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John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Old 07-31-2008, 10:20 PM   #16
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

I know it's almost idiotic to suggest this... but is it possible that Jason Taylor is not as good as his numbers suggest? I'm NOT saying he will be a bust but it seems like people almost expect 15 sacks this year from him which i don't think is a given.

He played in an 'ok' division but nothing compared to the competitiveness and talent of the NFC east. I'd like to see him play in a down of football on a team other than the Miami Dolphins before I jump to the conclusion that we have created the greatest tandem of DE's in pro football history. Am I crazy?
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Old 08-01-2008, 06:50 AM   #17
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by Rajmahal33 View Post
I know it's almost idiotic to suggest this... but is it possible that Jason Taylor is not as good as his numbers suggest? I'm NOT saying he will be a bust but it seems like people almost expect 15 sacks this year from him which i don't think is a given.

He played in an 'ok' division but nothing compared to the competitiveness and talent of the NFC east. I'd like to see him play in a down of football on a team other than the Miami Dolphins before I jump to the conclusion that we have created the greatest tandem of DE's in pro football history. Am I crazy?
Our pass rush has to be better now than it was before.
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Old 08-01-2008, 07:26 AM   #18
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by That Guy View Post
... i just don't see how.
Ok, That Guy, here's how it works: One of the players on the Redskins Defense tackles the QB of the opposing team. The Redskins Defense then repeats this 59 more times.

Hope this helps.

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Old 08-01-2008, 07:55 AM   #19
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by Rajmahal33 View Post
I know it's almost idiotic to suggest this... but is it possible that Jason Taylor is not as good as his numbers suggest? I'm NOT saying he will be a bust but it seems like people almost expect 15 sacks this year from him which i don't think is a given.

He played in an 'ok' division but nothing compared to the competitiveness and talent of the NFC east. I'd like to see him play in a down of football on a team other than the Miami Dolphins before I jump to the conclusion that we have created the greatest tandem of DE's in pro football history. Am I crazy?
I think you are over thinking this.

Is Strahan any less of a player because he only played for the Giants?

Taylor logged 11 sacks last year on a team that won 1 game. Think about what he could do when he's surrounded by more talent.

I'm not expecting 15 sacks, but 10-12 is pretty reasonable I think.
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Old 08-01-2008, 08:01 AM   #20
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

It's not as easy to get sacks now as it use to be given the rule changes (ie QB can throw away, can't touch a QB high or low...). That being said, the Giants proved that pressures are just as important as sacks.
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Old 08-01-2008, 08:38 AM   #21
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Not really. Probably says more to our lack of doing anything over the years to get anything like Manley and Mann
Au contraire Naysayer,
My good friend Beem calls your "not really", and raises you a "most underrated DE tandem in NFL history".
What say you?


50 sacks for the year works out to 3.12 sacks per game. The last time the Redskins had at least 50 sacks was 1991. In fact, here's the whole list of season sack totals going back to 1982 and where we ranked in the league...

2007 -- 33 sacks, 16th
2006 -- 19 sacks, 32nd (yuck, worst ever in league history)
2005 -- 35, 20th
2004 -- 40, 9th
2003 -- 27, 27th
2002 -- 40, 9th
2001 -- 25, 29th
2000 -- 45, 8th
1999 -- 40, 14th
1998 -- 33, 26th
1997 -- 37, 21st
1996 -- 34, 17th
1995 -- 30, 20th
1994 -- 28, 21st
1993 -- 31, 23rd
1992 -- 39, 16th
1991 -- 50, 3rd
1990 -- 45, 4th
1989 -- 40, 10th
1988 -- 43, 7th

1987 -- 53, 4th *Strike shortened season
1986 -- 55, 5th
1985 -- 52, 9th
1984 -- 66, 2nd
1983 -- 51, 6th
1982 -- 32, 3rd
*Strike shortened season

Take note that from 1982 - 1991, otherwise known as "The Glory Years", Joe Gibbs' Redskins never finished worse than the top ten in the league in sack totals.

Dexter Manley and Charles Mann have to be the most underrated DE tandem in NFL history.
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:01 AM   #22
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajmahal33 View Post
I know it's almost idiotic to suggest this... but is it possible that Jason Taylor is not as good as his numbers suggest? I'm NOT saying he will be a bust but it seems like people almost expect 15 sacks this year from him which i don't think is a given.

He played in an 'ok' division but nothing compared to the competitiveness and talent of the NFC east. I'd like to see him play in a down of football on a team other than the Miami Dolphins before I jump to the conclusion that we have created the greatest tandem of DE's in pro football history. Am I crazy?
I'm not going to say you're crazy, but to think that a guy's numbers shouldn't mean as much because he plays in a "weaker division" is a little ludicrous. For starters, every team in the NFL has lineman who can play, to suggest otherwise is just wrong. Second, and most important, is: Who else was on that defense? Jason Taylor was the main focus of every line he played against, that will probably be the same here, but it may not. Jason is going to face more double teams and chips, but even if he doesn't get there all the time, he's going to occupy offensive lines meaning Andre Carter, who is a better pass rusher than anyone else on the Miami Dolphins last season, is probably goign to get there more often. Finally, this is the same division where Winston Justice gave up four sacks to Osi last year, so to suggest that the talent in the NFC East is that much better than every other division is just plain wrong.
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:53 AM   #23
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by Hog1 View Post
Au contraire Naysayer,
My good friend Beem calls your "not really", and raises you a "most underrated DE tandem in NFL history".
What say you?


50 sacks for the year works out to 3.12 sacks per game. The last time the Redskins had at least 50 sacks was 1991. In fact, here's the whole list of season sack totals going back to 1982 and where we ranked in the league...

2007 -- 33 sacks, 16th
2006 -- 19 sacks, 32nd (yuck, worst ever in league history)
2005 -- 35, 20th
2004 -- 40, 9th
2003 -- 27, 27th
2002 -- 40, 9th
2001 -- 25, 29th
2000 -- 45, 8th
1999 -- 40, 14th
1998 -- 33, 26th
1997 -- 37, 21st
1996 -- 34, 17th
1995 -- 30, 20th
1994 -- 28, 21st
1993 -- 31, 23rd
1992 -- 39, 16th
1991 -- 50, 3rd
1990 -- 45, 4th
1989 -- 40, 10th
1988 -- 43, 7th

1987 -- 53, 4th *Strike shortened season
1986 -- 55, 5th
1985 -- 52, 9th
1984 -- 66, 2nd
1983 -- 51, 6th
1982 -- 32, 3rd
*Strike shortened season

Take note that from 1982 - 1991, otherwise known as "The Glory Years", Joe Gibbs' Redskins never finished worse than the top ten in the league in sack totals.

Dexter Manley and Charles Mann have to be the most underrated DE tandem in NFL history.
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I hear you Hog1, but you can't forget about Dave Butz. That guy was a monster and always held up double or triple teams. Heck, he would still make plays while being double and trippled teamed!!

Now, don't get me wrong. I miss manley and mann. I miss hearing Manley saying things like, "I'm gonna ring his clock!" Or "Mike Ditka is some sort of bumb!" And then he would apologize for it later saying he meant no offense by it!

I'm just saying that you got to factor Butz into those sack totals.
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:54 AM   #24
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hog1 View Post
Au contraire Naysayer,
My good friend Beem calls your "not really", and raises you a "most underrated DE tandem in NFL history".
What say you?


50 sacks for the year works out to 3.12 sacks per game. The last time the Redskins had at least 50 sacks was 1991. In fact, here's the whole list of season sack totals going back to 1982 and where we ranked in the league...

2007 -- 33 sacks, 16th
2006 -- 19 sacks, 32nd (yuck, worst ever in league history)
2005 -- 35, 20th
2004 -- 40, 9th
2003 -- 27, 27th
2002 -- 40, 9th
2001 -- 25, 29th
2000 -- 45, 8th
1999 -- 40, 14th
1998 -- 33, 26th
1997 -- 37, 21st
1996 -- 34, 17th
1995 -- 30, 20th
1994 -- 28, 21st
1993 -- 31, 23rd
1992 -- 39, 16th
1991 -- 50, 3rd
1990 -- 45, 4th
1989 -- 40, 10th
1988 -- 43, 7th

1987 -- 53, 4th *Strike shortened season
1986 -- 55, 5th
1985 -- 52, 9th
1984 -- 66, 2nd
1983 -- 51, 6th
1982 -- 32, 3rd
*Strike shortened season

Take note that from 1982 - 1991, otherwise known as "The Glory Years", Joe Gibbs' Redskins never finished worse than the top ten in the league in sack totals.

Dexter Manley and Charles Mann have to be the most underrated DE tandem in NFL history.
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Never said that Mann and Manley weren't awesome. Just saying that the Redskins (and I know Beem would agree here) that they haven't exactly taken strong measures until now to restore that greatness on the ends.
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Old 08-01-2008, 10:01 AM   #25
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by Miller101 View Post
I hear you Hog1, but you can't forget about Dave Butz. That guy was a monster and always held up double or triple teams. Heck, he would still make plays while being double and trippled teamed!!

Now, don't get me wrong. I miss manley and mann. I miss hearing Manley saying things like, "I'm gonna ring his clock!" Or "Mike Ditka is some sort of bumb!" And then he would apologize for it later saying he meant no offense by it!

I'm just saying that you got to factor Butz into those sack totals.
NO DOUBT, they did not do it alone. It was a wicked Swarming D through those years
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Old 08-01-2008, 10:06 AM   #26
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Never said that Mann and Manley weren't awesome. Just saying that the Redskins (and I know Beem would agree here) that they haven't exactly taken strong measures until now to restore that greatness on the ends.
I believe the actual response was "Not really"?

However, I would agree with you that we have not done ............enough since, to bring back that type of dominance.
HTTR, and kick the Colt's pre-season, meaningless, no starters in the game ass's!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 08-01-2008, 10:07 AM   #27
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Re: John Clayton Addresses The Skins

For God sakes let the season start.
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