Warpath  

Home | Forums | Salary Cap Info | Shop | Donate | Stay Connected




Go Back   Warpath > Redskins Forums > Redskins Locker Room


Seems like Cutler might be available.

Redskins Locker Room


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-19-2009, 01:58 PM   #241
The Starter
 
vallin21's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Vienna Va
Posts: 1,029
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redskingrove View Post
No, we can't afford him with our other pressing positional needs. Plus we are cap restrained with our high payroll.
The problem isn't that we cant afford him it's that QB isn't a need and we need to let JC have a final chance for ust to determine whether he's our QB of the future.
vallin21 is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisements
Old 03-19-2009, 02:28 PM   #242
Registered User
 
BigHairedAristocrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,917
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vallin21 View Post
The problem isn't that we cant afford him it's that QB isn't a need and we need to let JC have a final chance for ust to determine whether he's our QB of the future.
this will be campbells 5th nfl season and third as a full time starter. he played significantly his 2nd season. for the past 4 years hes improved in some areas while remaining stagnant in others. every year, theres a new excuse made for his lack of becoming the elite pro-bowl quarterback we thought he would be when we drafted him. do we really have to make him play out his entire contract before acknowledging that we made a mistake?... before we accept the fact he's just another trent dilfer?

at some point, when you make a bad decision, you have to cut your losses, get what you can for a player (ie trade him) and move on. committing to campbell another year only ensures we let campbell go without compensation and sets us back another year when it comes to finding a long term solution at quarterback.

sticking to jc another year is no different than mopping the decks on the titanic. weve invested too much him already. its time to "abandon ship"
BigHairedAristocrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:41 PM   #243
Living Legend
 
GTripp0012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
Age: 27
Posts: 15,994
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat View Post
this will be campbells 5th nfl season and third as a full time starter. he played significantly his 2nd season. for the past 4 years hes improved in some areas while remaining stagnant in others. every year, theres a new excuse made for his lack of becoming the elite pro-bowl quarterback we thought he would be when we drafted him. do we really have to make him play out his entire contract before acknowledging that we made a mistake?... before we accept the fact he's just another trent dilfer?

at some point, when you make a bad decision, you have to cut your losses, get what you can for a player (ie trade him) and move on. committing to campbell another year only ensures we let campbell go without compensation and sets us back another year when it comes to finding a long term solution at quarterback.

sticking to jc another year is no different than mopping the decks on the titanic. weve invested too much him already. its time to "abandon ship"
Just ran a very simple regression equation on Campbell using only his prior stats, and of course, assuming 16 starts.

Campbell 09 - 350/557, 3790 yds, 17 TDs, 9 INTs

Yards per Attempt = 6.8
Completion Pecentage = 62.8%

Sacks taken = 31
QB Rating = 86.2

This, of course, assumes the quality of offense around him is on par with the average offense he's had over the past 3 years, which is to say, very sucky.

Abandon ship!
__________________
according to a source with knowledge of the situation.
GTripp0012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:44 PM   #244
Playmaker
 
freddyg12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,540
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

wow, hadn't thought of that. If that's the case, the danny must love him!
freddyg12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:48 PM   #245
Living Legend
 
GTripp0012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
Age: 27
Posts: 15,994
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Before we say he's another Trent Dilfer, can I at least point out that Dilfer never, not once, ever had a season nearly as good as Campbell had last year at age 26?
__________________
according to a source with knowledge of the situation.
GTripp0012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:49 PM   #246
‎\m/
 
Mattyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Age: 42
Posts: 84,975
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Yeah I really don't get the comparison to Dilfer either.
__________________
Support The Warpath! | Warpath Shop
Mattyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:50 PM   #247
Playmaker
 
freddyg12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,540
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat View Post
this will be campbells 5th nfl season and third as a full time starter. he played significantly his 2nd season. for the past 4 years hes improved in some areas while remaining stagnant in others. every year, theres a new excuse made for his lack of becoming the elite pro-bowl quarterback we thought he would be when we drafted him. do we really have to make him play out his entire contract before acknowledging that we made a mistake?... before we accept the fact he's just another trent dilfer?

at some point, when you make a bad decision, you have to cut your losses, get what you can for a player (ie trade him) and move on. committing to campbell another year only ensures we let campbell go without compensation and sets us back another year when it comes to finding a long term solution at quarterback.

sticking to jc another year is no different than mopping the decks on the titanic. weve invested too much him already. its time to "abandon ship"
First off, I don't think Joe Gibbs looked at him as that, he just saw a kid of solid character & athletic ability that he could win with, as he had w/3 qb's in his first stint in DC.

Second, the excuses point to a much larger problem; everybody on the team has had to adjust to new systems under the danny. Let's face it, the skins haven't been a stable organization, and even under Gibbs, they brough in Saunders. Do you think Brunell adopted to Saunders offense well? I don't. At some point there has to be one system to build on, then judge the qb.

I believe the offense changed later in the year when Zorn started putting in more 4 wr sets w/an empty backfield. Even then, I don't think JC choked under pressure, I just think our O wasn't good enough to hang w/the big boys. He took a serious beating against Pitt.
freddyg12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:57 PM   #248
Living Legend
 
Ruhskins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 16,652
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat View Post
this will be campbells 5th nfl season and third as a full time starter. he played significantly his 2nd season. for the past 4 years hes improved in some areas while remaining stagnant in others. every year, theres a new excuse made for his lack of becoming the elite pro-bowl quarterback we thought he would be when we drafted him. do we really have to make him play out his entire contract before acknowledging that we made a mistake?... before we accept the fact he's just another trent dilfer?

at some point, when you make a bad decision, you have to cut your losses, get what you can for a player (ie trade him) and move on. committing to campbell another year only ensures we let campbell go without compensation and sets us back another year when it comes to finding a long term solution at quarterback.

sticking to jc another year is no different than mopping the decks on the titanic. weve invested too much him already. its time to "abandon ship"
So you think bringing in a brand new QB (with questionable character) to learn Zorn's offensive is the best option? I would agree with you if JC had been in the same system for the past three years, but he hasn't (yet still he did a good job last year).

It's funny that you mention that he's been in the league for 5 years, b/c if Gibbs had taken a risk with him, he'd be more developed as a QB right now, instead he went with Brunnel. Granted, Gibbs wanted to win right away and worked better with veteran QBs. It's funny though that a lot of people mention that the team needs to groom young players, and well Gibbs missed the opportunity to groom Campbell (make him a starter during his second season instead of the third).
__________________
R.I.P. #21

New words created on The Warpath:
Rewalsr - Somretimes - Fualt - Jersesy - Itiot - Composetory
Afeard - Storgn - Empliment - Gaissn - Saftys - Minnisota
Faviort - Hatter - Phsyched - Foof - Heloing - Brutual
Stroried - Agianst

"Give an opinion and move on. Your life doesn't depend on winning the internet." -FRPLG
Ruhskins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 02:57 PM   #249
‎\m/
 
Mattyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Age: 42
Posts: 84,975
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Personally I don't think 3 new offenses in 4 years is an excuse. The reality of it is it's tough to get comfortable as a young QB if you're always learning a new system every offseason.

I'd love to see an example of a QB who has gone through what JC has in regard to system changes and didn't struggle.
__________________
Support The Warpath! | Warpath Shop
Mattyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 03:02 PM   #250
Living Legend
 
GTripp0012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
Age: 27
Posts: 15,994
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
Personally I don't think 3 new offenses in 4 years is an excuse. The reality of it is it's tough to get comfortable as a young QB if you're always learning a new system every offseason.

I'd love to see an example of a QB who has gone through what JC has in regard to system changes and didn't struggle.
Campbell didn't.

I mean, that was my one example

The notion that Jason Campbell isn't a franchise QB is kind of absurd. We won't know for sure until we get him some protection and develop some weapons and then see if his production reaches pro-bowl levels. Within reason, that could be in 2009, but no Quarterback since Tim Couch has ever busted out of the NFL while playing as well as Campbell did last season, and with Couch, there was a mitigating circumstance (his elbow developed chronic issues right at the time he hit the market).
__________________
according to a source with knowledge of the situation.
GTripp0012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 03:03 PM   #251
Living Legend
 
Ruhskins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 16,652
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
Personally I don't think 3 new offenses in 4 years is an excuse. The reality of it is it's tough to get comfortable as a young QB if you're always learning a new system every offseason.

I'd love to see an example of a QB who has gone through what JC has in regard to system changes and didn't struggle.
Folks underestimate the importance of having continuity in an offense. If you look at the likes of Manning, Brady, McNabb, Eli, they've had the same coach and the same offense year after year. One criticism that I have of the FO/Ownership (which very few people mention) is that they have not created some type of continuity in offense.
__________________
R.I.P. #21

New words created on The Warpath:
Rewalsr - Somretimes - Fualt - Jersesy - Itiot - Composetory
Afeard - Storgn - Empliment - Gaissn - Saftys - Minnisota
Faviort - Hatter - Phsyched - Foof - Heloing - Brutual
Stroried - Agianst

"Give an opinion and move on. Your life doesn't depend on winning the internet." -FRPLG
Ruhskins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 03:05 PM   #252
Impact Rookie
 
SOUL-SKINS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 876
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
Before we say he's another Trent Dilfer, can I at least point out that Dilfer never, not once, ever had a season nearly as good as Campbell had last year at age 26?


YEAR TEAM G CMP ATT PCT YDS AVG TD LNG INT RAT
Dilfer best year
1997 TAM 16 217 386 56.2 2555 6.6 21 59 11 82.8

Campbells best year
2008 WAS 16 315 506 62.3 3245 6.4 13 67 6 84.3

Dilfer had alot less attempts w/ 8 more td's but has 5 more picks.
I'd say its pretty close which is sad if you think about it.
__________________
TODD COLLINS WILL ALWAYS HOLD A SPECIAL PLACE IN MY HEART
SOUL-SKINS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 03:12 PM   #253
Living Legend
 
GTripp0012's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Evanston, IL
Age: 27
Posts: 15,994
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SOUL-SKINS View Post
YEAR TEAM G CMP ATT PCT YDS AVG TD LNG INT RAT
Dilfer best year
1997 TAM 16 217 386 56.2 2555 6.6 21 59 11 82.8

Campbells best year
2008 WAS 16 315 506 62.3 3245 6.4 13 67 6 84.3

Dilfer had alot less attempts w/ 8 more td's but has 5 more picks.
I'd say its pretty close which is sad if you think about it.
From 1997:

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Football analysis and NFL stats for the Moneyball era - Authors of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

Some dude from Jacksonville had a better year than either Brett Favre or John Elway. Well, I'll be.

By either metric, Dilfer's best year was a little bit worse than Gus Frerotte's year in 1997. He won ten games, but he also fumbled six times, and only lost one of them. Either way, Campbell's year was still pretty far above that sort of level of mediocre. Well, not far above, but clear enough for there to be little argument.

EDIT: For some fun trivial facts, check the last two players on that list.
__________________
according to a source with knowledge of the situation.
GTripp0012 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 03:15 PM   #254
The Starter
 
vallin21's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Vienna Va
Posts: 1,029
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat View Post
this will be campbells 5th nfl season and third as a full time starter. he played significantly his 2nd season. for the past 4 years hes improved in some areas while remaining stagnant in others. every year, theres a new excuse made for his lack of becoming the elite pro-bowl quarterback we thought he would be when we drafted him. do we really have to make him play out his entire contract before acknowledging that we made a mistake?... before we accept the fact he's just another trent dilfer?

at some point, when you make a bad decision, you have to cut your losses, get what you can for a player (ie trade him) and move on. committing to campbell another year only ensures we let campbell go without compensation and sets us back another year when it comes to finding a long term solution at quarterback.

sticking to jc another year is no different than mopping the decks on the titanic. weve invested too much him already. its time to "abandon ship"
Look, this is his make or break season for JC. It's important that he shows the FO and us that he's progressing and he's a starting QB in the league. If he doesn't have a great season then yeah I'd probably cut my ties if i find a better option, but he's had to deal with 3 systems in 4yrs which is tough for a guy who might not be able to pick up everything as fast as someone else. He's all we have coming into the season with unless you bring a shady character like Cutler. The bottom line is JC has to prove he's our starting QB and if not, he should go.
vallin21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2009, 03:26 PM   #255
Registered User
 
BigHairedAristocrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,917
Re: Seems like Cutler might be available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
Just ran a very simple regression equation on Campbell using only his prior stats, and of course, assuming 16 starts.

Campbell 09 - 350/557, 3790 yds, 17 TDs, 9 INTs

Yards per Attempt = 6.8
Completion Pecentage = 62.8%

Sacks taken = 31
QB Rating = 86.2

This, of course, assumes the quality of offense around him is on par with the average offense he's had over the past 3 years, which is to say, very sucky.

Abandon ship!
is that enough for you?

1td and 2 sacks per game and a meager 86.2 qb rating?

if you factor out his freakish uncharacteristic run of no tds in the first part of the season, he'd be averaging almost as many INTs as touchdowns.

jay cutler was a better qb his 2nd year than campbell will likely be in his fifth. jc, who will likely never be more than an average qb improved dramatically under zorns tutelage. now imagine what zorn could do with someone like cutler. the ceiling is low with campbell. with cutler, the skys the limit.
BigHairedAristocrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site is not officially affiliated with the Washington Redskins or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.56656 seconds with 9 queries

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC5

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25