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6 WEEKS AGO: Trade Ramsey, Bench/trade Gardner

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Old 09-20-2004, 09:34 AM   #1
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6 WEEKS AGO: Trade Ramsey, Bench/trade Gardner

I got a LOT of flak early in the preseason for advocating a trade of Ramsey for a quality DL. I said trade him WHILE HE STILL HAS SOME VALUE. It is certainly too late now. He stunk it up consistently in the preseason, and continues to stink it up.

All the same holds true for Gardner, except he may have to be held onto for emergency backup. That is all he has ever been worth.

Don't sweat Portis - this was not even close to a typical performance for him. It was for the other two. Gibbs will get this straightened out. As I said on this board many times, Gardner will be on the bench by week 4. And I really believe Hasselbeck has to be promoted to #2 QB behind Brunell - possibly even get a shot at #1 now.
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Old 09-20-2004, 09:58 AM   #2
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I agree Hogskin. Hasselback is a firecracker of a QB. Tim has something that Trent had when he played for the Skins, TENACITY!!! That is something you do not learn, it's what defines Ryan Leaf from Peyton Manning or Drew Bledsoe from Tom Brady.

Brunell had it once, but looks to have lost that spark in the twi of his career. Tenacity is the one thing Tim has that will enable him to propel this passing game in the latter stages of this season. Ramsey, although a talent still has not fully recovered from the mental punishment he endured last season. I don't know if he will ever recover....?

Gibbs will absolutely look for a QB come this off season. I'm thinking he will look to a proven vet, like in prev seasons. A player who has ridden the bench, a stud in the making. Look to his track record & you'll see he has created a system for his QB, not created a QB for a system. He will fix this problem, but I'm not sure it's going to be this season...?

I know I'm saying this early, but I know the skins well enough to know that this is something the other clubs are going to exploit, & exploit BIG!

Gibbs is not a huge experiementor, but this is a new era of football & he needs to jump start this team fast. There's some talent here that can help us win, but we need to play to their strengths. Players I'm naming are... Cole finding the zone breakdowns, Mccants jumping for passes, Portis on the cutbacks, anybody at TE blocking, the 'D' (thank you Greg Williams), & above all Joe Gibbs!
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Old 09-20-2004, 10:11 AM   #3
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Hogskin, I remember you suggesting we trade Ramsey last year and I agreed 100%. I didn't see it then and I don't see it now what everybody including Coach Gibbs sees in this erratic player. It will be very difficult to get him or Gardner traded on the off season. When teams look at their numbers they will pass on these damaged goods. The sad thing about Ramsey is he's talented but not focused. He hasn't focused on the fundamentals as a QB in the NFL. It's time to move Hasselbeck up to 2#. The man plays with passion and he has better footwork than both of them combined. Look to see him promoted. The real thing that ticks me off is we always seem to go comatose before playing Dallas. Get McCants off of the active list. Get McCants off of the active list. Get McCants..... Find somebody else to put on the inactive list.
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Old 09-20-2004, 10:17 AM   #4
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What the hell is wrong with Ramsey and his fascination with fumbling the ball? The Center always seems to make a mistake when Ramsey is in the game. Man, Ramsey is a head case. For all of you who said how smart Ramsey was last year should be reminded that no QB in the league for 2 years makes the kind of mistakes he made yesterday. He should have been working on his techinque in training camp rather than complaining about not being the starting QB. Ramsey's a real loser.
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Old 09-20-2004, 10:53 AM   #5
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You have to consider the circumstances by which Ramsey entered the game. We were down 13 points, and the passing game had not really done anything all day. He comes in and was expected to air it out in the Meadowlands. I expected it and I'm sure the rest of you guys expected it (as did the Giants). His mistakes were not because a lack of talent; they were from a lack of game experience in an NFL system. They can be fixed, and I believe that with experience, Gibbs as the coach, and Brunell as the mentor, they will be.
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Old 09-20-2004, 10:57 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SUNRA
What the hell is wrong with Ramsey and his fascination with fumbling the ball? The Center always seems to make a mistake when Ramsey is in the game. Man, Ramsey is a head case. For all of you who said how smart Ramsey was last year should be reminded that no QB in the league for 2 years makes the kind of mistakes he made yesterday. He should have been working on his techinque in training camp rather than complaining about not being the starting QB. Ramsey's a real loser.
Amen Sunra! Although loser is a bit to strong.
Ramsey is still playing like a rookie. He has not developed one bit, he has regressed.
I never understood how some Ramsey fan's were calling him the next Bret Farve, future pro bowl, awesome player, etc. etc.
He has had four or five great games, that is it! He has also had just as many or more bad games. His great games were against some weak defenses. Colts (his first win), Jets, etc.
When he plays the big boys he wilts. I think it is great to root for your favorite players. But when Hasselback is brought into the conversation Ramsey fans talk like Ramsey is head and shoulders above Hasselback. They are both inexperienced unproven players. Ramsey is not a sure thing!
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:03 AM   #7
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This is our team, Ramsey is going to be our qb of the future and we're not going to be out looking for a qb this offseason. Somebody needs to get Chris Samuels head out of his ass, I only saw the last few minutes of the game, but Samuels was just standing around on the last play of the game and then gave a token effort after his guy beat Portis for the game ending sack.

It's week 2, no need to panic as of yet. And as I read various posts I see a lot of panicking. Brunell is the guy so let's stop all this talk about Gibbs going to get a qb in the offseason. If Gibbs can win with Mark Rypien, then he can win with Mark Brunell. This shouldn't even be a topic of discussion, you don't give a guy $8 million to sign and then go out the next season to find someone else.

It was an awful game, you give the ball away 7 times and you deserve to lose. And yet we still had a chance late in the game. How about we let the season play out and see how the team develops. Gibbs wasn't going to come back in and hit the ground running, it's a process. He's a smart guy, he'll figure it out.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:09 AM   #8
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This is our team, Ramsey is going to be our qb of the future and we're not going to be out looking for a qb this offseason. Somebody needs to get Chris Samuels head out of his ass, I only saw the last few minutes of the game, but Samuels was just standing around on the last play of the game and then gave a token effort after his guy beat Portis for the game ending sack.

It's week 2, no need to panic as of yet. And as I read various posts I see a lot of panicking. Brunell is the guy so let's stop all this talk about Gibbs going to get a qb in the offseason. If Gibbs can win with Mark Rypien, then he can win with Mark Brunell. This shouldn't even be a topic of discussion, you don't give a guy $8 million to sign and then go out the next season to find someone else.

It was an awful game, you give the ball away 7 times and you deserve to lose. And yet we still had a chance late in the game. How about we let the season play out and see how the team develops. Gibbs wasn't going to come back in and hit the ground running, it's a process. He's a smart guy, he'll figure it out.
Finally, a voice of reason.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:24 AM   #9
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Guys, the sky is not falling despite what happened yesterday.

I'll make a few 'bold' predictions:

-Ramsey is not going to be traded. He has too much talent and it's just ridiculous to give up on a 3rd year QB so quickly.

-Hasselbeck is not the answer and he will not see any playing time this season unless we have another body bag game. I'll never understand the fascination with TH who is a marginal NFL player at best.

-Gardner isn't going anywhere either, this year at least. His contract is up after this season so unless he gets his butt in gear he'll be gone. He had some drops but so did nearly everyone yesterday.

My final point is this, we've got to give this thing time guys. It's not going to happen overnight. If you expected Gibbs to swoop in and instantly turn the Skins in to winners then your expectations were very unreasonable.

We have a new coaching staff, new systems on both sides of the ball and a lot of roster turnover. Basically the same old story with this team. Fact is we have to be patient. Rome wasn't built in a day, and the Redskins won't be winners overnight either.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:31 AM   #10
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At least you are consistent matty.

I don't see how the skins could trade PR even if they wanted to. Right now he is not a very good NFL QB. Sure he has a strong arm but so does Jeff George. It takes more than a strong arm to make it in the NFL. I hope for the teams sake PR and/or MB find a way to get it done or else it will be another long season.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:34 AM   #11
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Matty what makes Ramsey so talented? Give Tim a chance Rypien was a marginal NFL player too. If TH makes plays give him a chance Ramsey has had plenty of chances we dont have Ramsey is our QB of the future etched in stone. This is the NFL and I think TH if given time with coach Gibbs could be an NFL QB. Ramsey does not have unlimited chances thats how the NFL works you get your chance and if you throw 3INTS in the 4th quarter in the redzone you dont get many more. We dont have time to baby PR.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:46 AM   #12
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I think you guys are taking PR's ability for granted. No, he hasn't torched the world, but he has only started ~15 games. I can guarantee that teams like SD, Dallas, Miami, SF, and others would kill to have PR on their team. He has the ability and the desire to be a better QB in this league. Give him time and a chance.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:46 AM   #13
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LOL this board is utterly ridiculous today

Let me see if I have this straight, Ramsey is garbage. Even though he's a 3rd year QB who's a bright guy with a strong arm, he clearly can't win in this league (why Gibbs doesn't know this is beyond me).

Let's forget the fact he was rushed in to starting as a rookie and played in a flawed system with not much of a running game or protection.

I can't believe he hasn't picked up Gibbs' system already, a system that Joe Theismann admits took him an entire season before he felt comfortable. Let's also overlook the fact that Mark Brunell, an 11 year vet, is also struggling in picking up the system. Ramsey is clearly not going to ever amount to anything. He's had his chance, we should move on, right? I mean c'mon, he's had 16 starts, that's enough, time to hand it over to third string Tim Hasselbeck who at this time last year was sitting at home like us. We should just bench Brunell now, trade Ramsey and start TH. I really don't know what Gibbs is thinking.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:49 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattyk72
.........
-Hasselbeck is not the answer and he will not see any playing time this season unless we have another body bag game. I'll never understand the fascination with TH who is a marginal NFL player at best.

-.
The same thing can be said about Ramsey, what is the fascination with Ramsey?
I am not sure I understand the obsession with Ramsey. Ramsey has had 4 or 5 really good games. That is it. Not an entire year or even half a year.
Ramsey is not a sure thing, he has flashed some great potential in between some really awful playing. In fact his playing ability has regressed since his great play from the first four games of last year.
Don't confuse potential with confirmed ability. As of today (not the past) Ramsey and TH are on the same level... they are both developing players whose weakness' overshadow their strengths.
I seem to remember Gibbs praising TH during the preseason. I would not rule out TH this year.
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Old 09-20-2004, 11:49 AM   #15
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The Giants have a new head coach, 2 new QBs, a new defensive line ( except Strahan),a new offensive line, 2 new CB's and they still beat us. I think that's a new system with new problems. But we didn't lose because of new players or a new system. We lost because of 3 INTS in the 2 half of this game. The Giants offense scored only 10 points. We had 20 first downs. That's a good system wouldn't you say? Afterall, Brunelll did move us down the field on the most successful drive this year. Believe me the offense understands what Gibbs system. I said it once, I'll say it again, there is no consistent execution by our starters. A drop, a catch, a completion , an interception is not going to get it done in anybody's system.

What happeneded in that 3rd and 4th quarter will go down in my mind as the most embarrassing performance for a 3 year future "franchise player" I've seen. It was horrendous, even sickening. No more excuses for Ramsey about his lack of NFL experience. He should have gone to NFL Europe over the summer. He's had enough time to know to throw an incompletion rather than a interception.
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