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Old 04-27-2009, 09:11 PM   #91
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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Originally Posted by Superman13732 View Post
You honestly think that Dan and Vinny are in their right mind?
yes I do, even though I may not agree with every pick. Imagine that.

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A few examples of why they are NOT, Adam Archuletta, we made him the highest paid Safety in the league. He started/played in how many games for us? T.J. Ducket, Jason Taylor, the list goes on and on.
It's been said many times, many ways - your examples are old, (except JT, and nearly everyone on the board at the time at least understood the move, it was not the same as AA, but we did pay too much). The FO has filled 3 of 4 areas of need very effectively (GTripp I am not counting Hall). LB -good prospects (especially if Wilson can switch to SLB at all), DL - bowing to GTripp again, assuming the scheme and players are used well, the FO has acquired what would appear to be top notch talent that should be here for 3-6 years. Yes the OL is a need, the offseason is not over, but Dockery was a passible start. STs - I love Hunter, and the late rounders all "look" to be aggressive, and maybe one will be a standout.

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And, did anyone see what Zorn said about the draft? Apparently the reason we drafted 4 defensive players first in this draft is because we drafted 4 offensive player first last year. Great logic?
Um context is good, we drafted Offense last year, so rather than throwing out last year's 3rd round prospect for the 5th rounder you apparently have so much faith in, they are going to keep developing our guys (isn't this called building through the draft? or are all late rounders supposed to be starters in the 2nd year? I must have missed that lesson)
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Please, sir, our FO ranks towards the bottom when it comes to brains.
we have found Superman13732's green kryptonite, it is JC, it causes him to go weak in his arguments
and his red kryptonite is the FO, who knows how that will affect him each time.
There is a cure for this kryptonite though. Knowledge, and lack of impatience, and perhaps Superman CAN Return!!!
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Old 04-27-2009, 10:09 PM   #92
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
yes I do, even though I may not agree with every pick. Imagine that.


It's been said many times, many ways - your examples are old, (except JT, and nearly everyone on the board at the time at least understood the move, it was not the same as AA, but we did pay too much). The FO has filled 3 of 4 areas of need very effectively (GTripp I am not counting Hall). LB -good prospects (especially if Wilson can switch to SLB at all), DL - bowing to GTripp again, assuming the scheme and players are used well, the FO has acquired what would appear to be top notch talent that should be here for 3-6 years. Yes the OL is a need, the offseason is not over, but Dockery was a passible start. STs - I love Hunter, and the late rounders all "look" to be aggressive, and maybe one will be a standout.

they may be old, but they are valid. JT was 34 years old, we gave up to much, and payed too much for him. And what do you attribute our second half demise to last year? our defense? Thats where our "holes" have been filled. Last time i checked they were ranked 4th in the league. Ok, well, then how do you miss the playoffs with the 4th overall defense?

Um context is good, we drafted Offense last year, so rather than throwing out last year's 3rd round prospect for the 5th rounder you apparently have so much faith in, they are going to keep developing our guys (isn't this called building through the draft? or are all late rounders supposed to be starters in the 2nd year? I must have missed that lesson)

Ok, here's the thing. Where were they last year? Kelly was on IR with his DEGENERATIVE knee condition. what does degenerative mean? It means he has the knees of an 80 year old man, according to doctors anyways, google it. Thomas has the most potential out of that draft, and as for Davis, well, I hope he does turn out good, then we can draft him for a 2nd rounder we can use. Yes, i guess i am in the minority here when I say I am like Cooley as a receiving TE and Yoder as a blocking TE? But, let's not worry about these issues yet, they aren't our pressing needs (that was defense right?).

I will EVEN go as far as ignoring Jason Campbell's obvious flaws as QB (Even the respected FO doubts him). I believe, as does every expert in the modern world, that our second half collapse can be attributed to our OL. Yes, I know, i am showing my weakness here by saying I wish we have addressed our real weakness, but I just can't help myself. Dockery was nice. But last time I checked, the right side of our line is still how old? (Jansen and Thomas are both 33)And last time I checked, they weren't the most durable players. But hey, I don't know anything. What was I missing? Oh right! The defense and our special teams was our main issue, since that is what we addressed in this draft.


we have found Superman13732's green kryptonite, it is JC, it causes him to go weak in his arguments
and his red kryptonite is the FO, who knows how that will affect him each time.
There is a cure for this kryptonite though. Knowledge, and lack of impatience, and perhaps Superman CAN Return!!!
And the only thing I am growing impatient with, is waiting for players to develop (i.e. Campbell, going on 5 years, our entire draft last year played how many snaps?) At the rate we are developing players, we are going to develop our All-stars (Portis, Samuels, Moss) into retirement. You can keep the patience, I personally believe someone needs to light a fire under the FO's ass.
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Old 04-27-2009, 10:11 PM   #93
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

I'm still learning how to use this chat box, i said a lot of things in the quoted section lol. Oh well.
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Old 04-27-2009, 10:35 PM   #94
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

Only the losers of the NFL preach patience.

Ask Robert Kraft, Bill Belichick, or Mike Tomlin how patient they expect their fans to be. How about Bill Polian? Does anyone think his success in Buffalo, Carolina, or Indianapolis was based on sitting through years and years of 8-8 seasons asking everyone to be "patient" ??

No. This league is about winning, and winning right F'ing now. We've had 10 years under this regime. They're good at building mediocrity. They're good at developing teams to win 6 to 9 games a year -- maybe 10 games if everything falls right into place.

The league is designed to make winners out of anybody, and for anybody to do it in relatively short fashion.

If you can't get it done in ten years with the same people running the show, it's not going to get done.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:11 PM   #95
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Only the losers of the NFL preach patience.

Ask Robert Kraft, Bill Belichick, or Mike Tomlin how patient they expect their fans to be. How about Bill Polian? Does anyone think his success in Buffalo, Carolina, or Indianapolis was based on sitting through years and years of 8-8 seasons asking everyone to be "patient" ??

No. This league is about winning, and winning right F'ing now. We've had 10 years under this regime. They're good at building mediocrity. They're good at developing teams to win 6 to 9 games a year -- maybe 10 games if everything falls right into place.

The league is designed to make winners out of anybody, and for anybody to do it in relatively short fashion.

If you can't get it done in ten years with the same people running the show, it's not going to get done.
But we haven't necessarily had the same people running the show

2000-Snyder
2001-Marty
2002-2003-Spurrier
2004-2007-Gibbs
2008-Present-Cerrato
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:24 PM   #96
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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Originally Posted by Beemnseven View Post
Only the losers of the NFL preach patience.

Ask Robert Kraft, Bill Belichick, or Mike Tomlin how patient they expect their fans to be. How about Bill Polian? Does anyone think his success in Buffalo, Carolina, or Indianapolis was based on sitting through years and years of 8-8 seasons asking everyone to be "patient" ??

No. This league is about winning, and winning right F'ing now. We've had 10 years under this regime. They're good at building mediocrity. They're good at developing teams to win 6 to 9 games a year -- maybe 10 games if everything falls right into place.

The league is designed to make winners out of anybody, and for anybody to do it in relatively short fashion.

If you can't get it done in ten years with the same people running the show, it's not going to get done.
As SS pointed out, the only one we've had for 10 years is Danny Boy, and we likely are stuck with him for another 25 years.

If you look at the successes of Polian and Belichick, one ingredient they have is stability. They don't panic and impatiently change things.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:26 PM   #97
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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But we haven't necessarily had the same people running the show

2000-Snyder
2001-Marty
2002-2003-Spurrier
2004-2007-Gibbs
2008-Present-Cerrato
No, its been Dan and Vinny the whole time. Let's not kid ourselves. Marty wanted to do his own thing, but they got tired of that after... one year, then was Spurrier, who was Dan's lap dog, just like Vinny. Gibbs... eh, thats arguable, he ran the show some of the time, but pick ups like Lloyd, Archuletta, and Duckett, they smelled like Dan ad Vinny had thier fingers in it.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:26 PM   #98
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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Originally Posted by Superman13732 View Post
And the only thing I am growing impatient with, is waiting for players to develop (i.e. Campbell, going on 5 years, our entire draft last year played how many snaps?) At the rate we are developing players, we are going to develop our All-stars (Portis, Samuels, Moss) into retirement. You can keep the patience, I personally believe someone needs to light a fire under the FO's ass.
We've talked about this before. 5 years ago JC was a junior at Auburn. Please re-adjust your time line.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:31 PM   #99
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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As SS pointed out, the only one we've had for 10 years is Danny Boy, and we likely are stuck with him for another 25 years.

If you look at the successes of Polian and Belichick, one ingredient they have is stability. They don't panic and impatiently change things.
Haha, but you are forgetting the main factor. Polian and Belichek know how to evaluate talent. That is one thing our FO has never been able to do. I mean there were a couple blatantly obvious ones with our safties (Taylor RIP, and Landry). But other than that? mediocrity. So I'll gain patience when the FO learns to evaluate talent. Deal?
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:35 PM   #100
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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We've talked about this before. 5 years ago JC was a junior at Auburn. Please re-adjust your time line.
My time line?!?!? check your stats, i dont know how the hell this is discussable, he has been on our team for 4 years. Going on 5.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:43 PM   #101
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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We've talked about this before. 5 years ago JC was a junior at Auburn. Please re-adjust your time line.
Jason Campbell Stats, News, Photos - Washington Redskins - ESPN

Look at the experience tab...
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:49 PM   #102
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

This guy is 410 pounds and out of the league for 3 years. I figured he sustained an injury and was now ready to play. I thought why in hell would the Redskins take this on. Then I read that he lives with Dockery and his wife and thought to myself that maybe, this was part of Dockery signing here. What do you guys think. Just makes no sense.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:50 PM   #103
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

Your "experience tab" means that he is going into his 5th year.

Let's do math: It is now April 2009. 5 years ago was April 2004.

JC was drafted in April 2005.

Therefore, in April 2004 or 5 years ago, JC was junior at Auburn.

But I'll tell you what: In order to have 5 NFL years under his belt, JC would have had to play the 2004 season. Find me his NFL stats from 2004 and I'll change my mind. If you cannot find those stats then please change your time line.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:50 PM   #104
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
But we haven't necessarily had the same people running the show

2000-Snyder
2001-Marty
2002-2003-Spurrier
2004-2007-Gibbs
2008-Present-Cerrato
Fine. I'll subtract the 8-8 season under Marty.

Steve Spurrier was hardly running the show during 2002-03. Under Gibbs, Cerrato was still player personnel director, and Lil' Danny held the purse strings.

Either way you slice it, Lil' Danny has been here for the last ten years doing the hiring. In any business, the one who's doing the hiring is the one who gets the blame. And he's got a 68-76 record to show for it.

You know and I know those numbers show he's not getting it done.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:52 PM   #105
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re: Skins Sign O-Lineman Mike Williams

At first when we picked eddie Williams of Idaho I thought the card person messed up and meant this guy...
Also I think he's a better pick than most of our second day picks
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