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Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Old 09-03-2009, 01:32 PM   #151
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

I dont think they know JACK about the Salary Cap.

Theyre also speculating Anthony Montgommery could be cut to make room for Dixon. I hadnt thought about that, but i'd certainly hope we'd try to trade Monty before just cutting him. That said, Monty has always struggled with consistency and Dixon won't last 10 minutes on the practice squad. He's younger, has played very well for a rookie and the coaches are impressed with his work ethic. The more i think about it, the more i like the idea.

Fans calling in are speculating its Collins (which would be a good idea from a long-term perspective but completely moronic in the short term), Betts (too good in pass protection to cut for me), and Sellers (he's unhappy with his contract and getting up there in years... still, who could replace him?), and Todd Yoder (we could go with only two TEs) to make room for another player and keep a TE on the PS.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:35 PM   #152
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Originally Posted by Schneed10 View Post
DMV, just to warn you, you've stepped into a debate with probably the smartest guy on the site (GTripp), someone who is willing to debate till he's blue in the face (CRedskins), and easily the biggest asshole on the site (me).

Fair warning.

You've done nothing but make yourself look foolish here. You claimed that Rock's stats were terrible, I showed you that he is consistently among the best in kick returns, using incontrovertible facts. Then you dismiss statistics as dorky and irrelevant.

You've then indirectly compared Marcus Mason to Joshua Cribbs and Darren Sproles by suggesting that we choose between Rock and those elite return men. Needless to say this is idiotic, because those are Browns and Chargers, not Redskins. We are debating Mason vs Rock, not Rock vs the league.

Concurrent to this absurd analysis of yours, you continue to dismiss punt and kick coverage skills as a matter of importance. You also fail to answer my call to explain what skill set Mason adds to the team that does not already exist on the roster. So in addition to looking foolish, you appear to have little to no understanding of the NFL.

Umm first your foolish. because your really not that intelligent. Posting stats is not intelligence and I did not say they were irrelevant. I said, "STATS ARE IMPORTANT BUT NOT THE ONLY FACTOR" (sorry for the caps. I have to do this for the illiterate). Can you read that.

The comparison to Cribbs, Hester was to make a point. Just because you are 6th on the stats list doesn't mean you are the best player there ( I think Hester was 28th and Cribbs might have been 12th) as far as talent an potential. If you think Rock is better than Cribbs or Hester your a intelligence is questionable. That what the comparison was related to stats. If you think thomas couldn't take his place your not very smart either.

Dude are you drinking? I didn't say his stats were terrible. Please post where I said that. I just told you to post the stats. Like I couldn't go to NFL.com and get the stats myself or if I didn't know. Just wanted you to show that you just like to argue and that the only way you can do that is with stats not intelligent debate. You are putting words in my mouth. I think you are so self righteous you dont even bother to read other comments.

As far as the dorky comments. If the only thing you can do is post stats and say Rock is a good tackler on special teams. Yeah you are a dork. Because if Thomas, Moss or Betts had his return attempts I dont think they would do worse than him. Moss and Thomas I would put money on would do better. So to fabricate things..really does make you an ass and look like as dork.

I am not dismissing punt and kick coverage skills. But our ST suck. Another thing Rock doesn't make all the tackles every play.

Rock is almost 30 yrs old. He only plays one unit on the team. Hester plays WR and Cribbs does also. That was my comparison. Not that they are on our team. How did you pull that out your ass with your head fitting so snug. If we can keep him and keep another RB (whether Mason, Aldridge or Dorsey) it might be acceptable. If not he needs to be cut.

As far as your warning. Who gives a flying ___!!
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:37 PM   #153
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Did they really say ARE was a roster cut possibility? How do some of these people even have jobs? As you pointed out it's not at all possible because of the salary cap ramifications so why would they even say it?
We cut Jason Taylor didn't we and took a cap hit? Why not ARE?
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:38 PM   #154
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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We cut Jason Taylor didn't we and took a cap hit? Why not ARE?
Do you really need an answer to this question?
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:40 PM   #155
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Do you really need an answer to this question?
Have Vinny answer that question he's the one that does the cuts, not me.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:41 PM   #156
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Do you really need an answer to this question?
I think he's being sarcastic. [EDIT].... Nevermind. Lol
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:44 PM   #157
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN View Post
Have Vinny answer that question he's the one that does the cuts, not me.
We had the space to cut Taylor, but we don't have much space left and the cap hit for ARE would be huge this year. It's just not possible.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:45 PM   #158
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

This may have been posted already

Redskins Insider - Making a Case for Rock Cartwright
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:45 PM   #159
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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I'll be honest with you. It doesn't even have to be Mason so long as they have a young talent to bring up through the ranks. but I do take exception to people saying blatently ...Mason sucks. If he did the team would not have gone to the lengths they have to get him back. However since stats are important to some please locate Mason and Cartwright on this stat board which I feel is more accurate;

NFL Stats: by Player Category

I'll save you some time. Mason is 33rd on the list of rushers and Cartwright is 99th.

or try this one...

NFL Stats: by Player Category

The highest Skin on the Return list is Thomas at 23 and Cartwright is 68. My point is stats can be manipulated for whatever purpose. Since Rock has not been used as much this preseason in order to look at others lets look at last yrs stats....

NFL Stats: by Player Category

Rock was 225 on the list of Rushers for last yr. Obviously his leadership skills and tackling are carrying over to his rushing yrds. If he's such a good tackler why doesn't he fill in as Safety. I mean the team definitly needs a sure tackler in the back field.

Rock may have been 6th on ESPN's total yrds for the 08 season as a KR but NFL.com has him tied at 23 for average yrds 25.6 yrds average for every KR.

NFL Stats: by Player Category

Another post related to stats..
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:46 PM   #160
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Have Vinny answer that question he's the one that does the cuts, not me.
The answer is that we can't afford it. It isn't happening. It's not even financially possible. I guess it is possible if we also cut 2 or 3 other guys that count only a base salary against the cap.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:47 PM   #161
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Umm first your foolish. because your really not taht intelligent. Posting stats is not intelligence and I did not say they were irrelevant. I said, "STATS ARE IMPORTANT BUT NOT THE ONLY FACTOR" (sorry for the caps. I have to do this for the illiterate). Can you read that.

The comparison to Cribbs, Hester was to make a point. Just because you are 6th on the stats list doesn't mean you are the best player there ( I think Hester was 28th and Cribbs might have been 12th) is as far as talent an potential. If you think Rock is better than Cribbs or Hester your a crack head. That what the comparison was related to stats

Dude are you drinking. I didn't say his stats were terrible. Please post where I said that. I just told you to post the stats. Liek I couldn't go to NFL.com and get the stats myself or if I didn't know. Just wanted you to show that you jsut like to argue and that the only way you can do that is with stats not intelligent debate. You are putting words in my mouth. I think you are so self righteous you dont even bother to read other comments.

As far as the dorky comments. If the only thing you can do is post stats and say Rock is a good tackler on special teams. Yeah you are a dork. Because if Thomas, Moss or Betts had his return attempts I dont think they would do worse than him. Moss and Thomas I would put money on would do better. So to fabricate things..really does make you an ass and look like as dork.

I am not dismissing punt and kick coverage skills. But our ST suck. Another thing Rock doesn't make all the tackles every play.

Further more if I had a pocket full of f---s. I wouldn't give you one..

*Concurrent to this absurd analysis of yours - OOO someone got a dictionary. lol. Your so smart!!!

Dude we are on a football board not a tech geek forum. I could use "big words" all day. But that doesn't prove your intelligence. Just makes you look like a dork.
Betts was our kick returner, and he didn't do as well as Rock. He wasn't a bad KR though, and could probably be adequately forced into duty again.

People who take your attitude towards things tend not to last very long on here. It's not like they usually get banned, they just tend to find that no one really likes to engage them and then they stop showing up on the boards. The thing you haven't gotten yet, but you will, is that not everyone in this thread has yet to prove themselves as a valuable member of this community of diverse opinions, but you do fall into that category.

In other words, coming from someone else, maybe the notion that we could do without Rock would be met with more respect. Is that fair? Probably not. But when you are met with people who disagree strongly with your idea, by responding the way you have, all you are doing is confirming what they originally thought about you. Maybe that's not right, but the more you write, the more we know about you. That's not always a good thing.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:50 PM   #162
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Betts was our kick returner, and he didn't do as well as Rock. He wasn't a bad KR though, and could probably be adequately forced into duty again.

People who take your attitude towards things tend not to last very long on here. It's not like they usually get banned, they just tend to find that no one really likes to engage them and then they stop showing up on the boards. The thing you haven't gotten yet, but you will, is that not everyone in this thread has yet to prove themselves as a valuable member of this community of diverse opinions, but you do fall into that category.

In other words, coming from someone else, maybe the notion that we could do without Rock would be met with more respect. Is that fair? Probably not. But when you are met with people who disagree strongly with your idea, by responding the way you have, all you are doing is confirming what they originally thought about you. Maybe that's not right, but the more you write, the more we know about you. That's not always a good thing.
Pretty well said.

DMV, the self-contradicting points you are making are further undermining your credibility here at the Warpath. I doubt anyone is taking you seriously at this point, I certainly am not.

I'd rather discuss something intelligently with someone capable of doing so. Peace out, I'm done with you.
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Old 09-03-2009, 01:56 PM   #163
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Too much player versus player rather than roles we need filled in this discussion. I'd like to talk about things this team needs and if we can get some of those things out of the people who are currently on our roster or if we need to go outside of the organization and pick up or trade for some new players to fill those roles. The following list of roles is not necessarily in order of importance to the success of the team.

Offensive Tackle - Frankly, I just can't fathom how Vinny can believe that we're OK at that position. It's a near certainty that Chris Samuels is going to miss some time with his bad knee and right now it looks like they're counting on Mike Williams and Jeremy Bridges as the backups at OT. Bad move. I don't think Williams is ready to play yet and Bridges is really a G. We need to make a trade, if possible, or pick up a veteran OT for insurance.
I think a veteran o-lineman can be picked up once things shake up after roster cuts. Although other than trading a current player, I would not really trade any draft picks for a back up lineman. I'm sure once teams trim down their rosters, we can pick up a lineman for depth.

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Third String QB - Really, who the hell cares? We're not going to be counting on either of these guys, so choose your favorite or we can pick up someone else.

I feel pretty good about the rest of the roles on the team.
Agreed!!
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Old 09-03-2009, 02:09 PM   #164
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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I have this nagging fear that Fletch will be afflicted with Cris Dishman Syndrome (Dishman, you may not recall, was one of the league's premiere corners in 1997 and then just dropped in 1998)
Interesting. My only remote recollection of Dishman as a player is from his post-Washington years, in KC and Minnesota. So I PFR'ed him and found some similarities with him and Fletch.

Both posted near-career highs in AV (approximate value) in year n, but I think what seperates Dishman from Fletcher is that his performance in that one year (1997) appears to have been completely out of line with the rest of his career. When he did fall, it was just a little bit past (age-adjusted?) his former productivity. Probably felt like he just got worse overnight, but I imagine that part of that was his unexpected improvement in 1997.

On the other side, one of Fletcher's top comparables through 11 NFL seasons just happens to be Michael Barrow--the year he signed in Washington. Though its worth saying that Fletcher has been a better player throughout his career.
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Old 09-03-2009, 02:25 PM   #165
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Re: Vinny tips his hand on the final 53

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Ultimately what worries me isn't depth. Really no other teams in the entire league have significantly more depth than we do. My problem is that Blache just doesn't seem to embrace the concept of utilizing players based on their strengths. He has a scheme and he wants everyone to run it. No changing things up to fit personnel. You can see it during games and in general. How often do we get trampled on for an entire quarter or more before he finally makes an adjustment. It's like he has decided that the scheme comes above all else. And the adjustmenst usually work but he's so damn stubborn. It's clear that he thinks that players just need to do better executing his scheme rather than him trying to make it easier for them to execute. I like Blache but he does have some drawbacks.
You read my mind. With the FO acquiring AH and Orakpo I think they have shown a desire to increase pressure on the QB which may force Blache to start showing some flexability. At least with the front four or seven. He did send MW on a lot of passing downs as I think he will Orakpo. I wonder though if Blache has intentionally left his corners in certain situations just to see how they handle it. This is something he has done in preseason since he was DC in Chicago. Hopefully once the season starts he will make adjustments before we get trampled for a full quarter. But he does seem stubborn and at times appears to make adjustments only after it has been repeatedly shown that what he's trying to do is not working.
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