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Defense = Disappointment

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Old 09-15-2009, 09:31 AM   #136
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Originally Posted by sandtrapjack View Post
Laugh all you want, but nothing takes away from the fact that Haynesworth got the biggest contract in history in the off season. And in his regular season debut he got only 4 tackles. Which ranks him at #178 of all defense players in the NFL.

I am not saying AH sucks, I am not saying he's not that good. To the contrary he is a force in the middle.

But I am saying that by week 6, if he is STILL averaging only 4 tackles per game the Redskins could have gotten that production for much less money is all.

As much as I read forum members here complaining about over paying players in the past like Deion Sanders, Brandon Jacobs, Antwan Randle El etc etc I would think that you would understand my meaning.
I don't understand what you are trying to do here, other than stretch an overused criticism of our team. Last year Brandon Jacobs ran all over us, he was a non-factor this year. We did get pressure on Eli, he threw a pick and coughed up the ball.

The key is that the rest of the defense played poorly (secondary), the team made stupid mistakes (personal fouls), the play calling was terrible, and our offense fizzled again.

If AH is not there, the Giants would have blown us out on the ground and in the air.
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Old 09-15-2009, 09:42 AM   #137
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Originally Posted by sandtrapjack View Post
Laugh all you want, but nothing takes away from the fact that Haynesworth got the biggest contract in history in the off season. And in his regular season debut he got only 4 tackles. Which ranks him at #178 of all defense players in the NFL.

I am not saying AH sucks, I am not saying he's not that good. To the contrary he is a force in the middle.

But I am saying that by week 6, if he is STILL averaging only 4 tackles per game the Redskins could have gotten that production for much less money is all.

As much as I read forum members here complaining about over paying players in the past like Deion Sanders, Brandon Jacobs, Antwan Randle El etc etc I would think that you would understand my meaning.
Haynesworth's value isn't going to be measured by tackles, he typically only gets 3-4 a game anyway. Teams simply don't run his way.
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Old 09-15-2009, 09:47 AM   #138
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Ratliff was a 7th rounder and did not get a 100 million dollar contract with 41 Mill garaunteed. And he has been to just as many pro bowls as the 100 milllion dollar Haynesworth.

Oh and you forgot to add a 34-21 victory.

Just saying you could have gotten the same production for less cap money is all.

Comparing playing against Tampa Bay and The Giants is just ridiculous. Just saying...
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Old 09-15-2009, 09:48 AM   #139
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Uh he already HAS handled him all by himself. The result....Haynesworth suspended.....Gurode Pro Bowl.



I think we ALL know who got "handled" in that matchup.
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Old 09-15-2009, 09:56 AM   #140
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Originally Posted by sandtrapjack View Post
Laugh all you want, but nothing takes away from the fact that Haynesworth got the biggest contract in history in the off season. And in his regular season debut he got only 4 tackles. Which ranks him at #178 of all defense players in the NFL.

I am not saying AH sucks, I am not saying he's not that good. To the contrary he is a force in the middle.

But I am saying that by week 6, if he is STILL averaging only 4 tackles per game the Redskins could have gotten that production for much less money is all.

As much as I read forum members here complaining about over paying players in the past like Deion Sanders, Brandon Jacobs, Antwan Randle El etc etc I would think that you would understand my meaning.
Warren Sapp never averaged more than 3 tackles a game, per season, in his career. In fact, he often only averaged 2 tackles a game. Was he an overpaid bust too?

You don't measure dominate DT's by their tackle totals... that's just ridiculous.




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Old 09-15-2009, 09:56 AM   #141
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

Haynesworth is already making his presence felt. Around the 5th game or so he'll be even more dominant. Even he has said they haven't gelled yet. I think you could say that about alot of defenses at this point in the season. Tampa Bays unheralded offense looked pretty damn good for awhile there, they just blew too many opportunities. There will be no regrets about signing Haynesworth.
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Old 09-15-2009, 10:18 AM   #142
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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His job isn't necessarily tackles. His job is to take up 2 or three linemen when he is in. The better judgement will be if our DE's and LBs are getting in to make plays quicker, and are we getting more tackles for loss as a team. If we are judging value by his stat line alone, I doubt he would ever be worth it.

Another way to say it, Brandon Jacobs ran effectively against us both games last season(we all remember his off tackle run where he bowled over LL). This game he didn't and so they had to switch to an outside runner whose goal, I think they admitted this, was to tire AH out. If opposing teams are changing their game to focus on AH then he is worth it, because as much as I like our DT's from last year, let's be honest, no team gameplanned around the interior of our line.

Finally, we are talking about the Giants Oline, which has been a very effective line for 2 1/2 years now. Let's see how well some other teams handle it before we write off the AH effect.
Good post, excellent arguement.
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Old 09-15-2009, 11:44 AM   #143
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

haynesworth shouldn't be the focus where disappointment is concerned. It's playing orakpo at linebacker and the secondary's play. If you're talking about defensive production, linebacker's the position that needs to produce and orakpo just didn't produce. He needs to either be limited at linebacker or completely be a defensive end. Because right now, he just isn't ready at linebacker and that's going to kill the redskins all year long if he continues to start there (lb).

The secondary needs to start playing together. Defensive backs are going to get beat on every team in every game, that usually is a given. But what separates the good secondaries from the bad ones is playing together and providing some help when a teammate needs it. That's why I said before the giants game, landry is going to need to step up his game this season.

And when landry stepped up his game - the result was an interception that put the redskins offense in good position.
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Old 09-15-2009, 12:08 PM   #144
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Do you think there is growing animosity between the offense and defense, or has it not gotten to that point?
To be honest the Skins have some pretty high character guys in the locker room, I dont think it will get to that point. I think Blache would kick someone's ass if they even hinted at it. That is one thing Snyder has done in the FO is get players who are not problems or have character issues which is a positive unlike the Cowgirls or Bengals.
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Old 09-16-2009, 02:15 PM   #145
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

I hope they are going to do this alot through out 4 quarters, not just few selective plays..

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Old 09-16-2009, 05:55 PM   #146
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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Well, okay, I guess you have an turnover-related argument as far as costing us a winnable game. But if you take out ALL of the offensive contributions, yards, points, turnovers, and just look at the defensive contributions, you have two big plays mixed in with a completely uncompetitive game.

In reality, we only lost by 6. If I had just gone through the defensive plays only, I would have assumed a 14-17 point loss. And isn't that the real measuring stick here?


Absolutely not! There you go wanting to play the game in your head based upon statistical breakdowns. I am sure in your world Michael Crabtree is doing the right thing holding out for money he should have gotten if the Raiders would have done the right thing. GTripp are you advising Crabtree? That is the line that your logic takes us down. No thanks.
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Old 09-16-2009, 06:02 PM   #147
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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[/u]

Absolutely not! There you go wanting to play the game in your head based upon statistical breakdowns. I am sure in your world Michael Crabtree is doing the right thing holding out for money he should have gotten if the Raiders would have done the right thing. GTripp are you advising Crabtree? That is the line that your logic takes us down. No thanks.
You don't really make any sense when you post.
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Old 09-16-2009, 07:01 PM   #148
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

how would advising Crabtree not to play make any statistical sense?
It's a pretty linear regression saying that every week he holds out, he loses a game check. And the slotting process for rookies is pretty linear. you would have to be a complete imbecile and very bad with math, to try and show Crabtree should hold out from a purely analytical basis.

Not that it has any bearing on how our defense played or didn't play.
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Old 09-16-2009, 07:38 PM   #149
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

and to add this to the arguement with the cowgirl up there. Haynesworth was instrumental in that goal line stop and also in forcing the Giants to kick a field goal. So if anyone played solid on the line he did. As far as the DE's that's a different story.

We definitely need to put Orakpo on the front line. People are saying stopping the run is his issue. But the starters look even more suspect and they are seasoned vets. I think his speed woul dbe crucial on the edge. Not just to get to QBs. But also to stop running backs running to the outside.

I think our LBs played pretty well besides him.
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Old 09-16-2009, 07:53 PM   #150
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Re: Defense = Disappointment

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and to add this to the arguement with the cowgirl up there. Haynesworth was instrumental in that goal line stop and also in forcing the Giants to kick a field goal. So if anyone played solid on the line he did. As far as the DE's that's a different story.

We definitely need to put Orakpo on the front line. People are saying stopping the run is his issue. But the starters look even more suspect and they are seasoned vets. I think his speed woul dbe crucial on the edge. Not just to get to QBs. But also to stop running backs running to the outside.

I think our LBs played pretty well besides him.
It was first game and he's a rookie.. We should expect to see something like this, especially when he played as DE in Texas.. I'm pretty sure coaches know what to do, they said that they are impressed with him.. He's just learning; if they think that they should let Orakpo move back to DE, then they would do it..

However, I'm advocating for coaches to let him move back to DE next year when we have a chance to draft 1st or 2nd rounder LB to takeover the position..
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