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Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Old 10-05-2009, 05:19 PM   #631
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
Agreed there is no "holy grail" QB out there. However JC's play over the last two games (in snaps that the opposing D wasn't playing basically a prevent) isn't acceptable of a "game manager" or average QB. As I mentioned before he single-handedly could've been the cause of 8 turnovers in 2 games. As it is he caused 5.
I think the fumbles are totally unacceptable. But I have a question. I might have missed something. Were the Bucs playing prevent in the 3rd quarter?

The other games when they said he scored during garbage time this applies. But as far as the last game (Buc) this doesn't really apply.

Do you mean the games against the Rams and Lions?
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Old 10-05-2009, 05:26 PM   #632
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

Jason, tough game yesterday, and I know you're not long for this town. But wherever you go, and however it ends up, be safe in this game. I wish you nothing but the very best.
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Old 10-05-2009, 05:46 PM   #633
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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I think the fumbles are totally unacceptable. But I have a question. I might have missed something. Were the Bucs playing prevent in the 3rd quarter?

The other games when they said he scored during garbage time this applies. But as far as the last game (Buc) this doesn't really apply.

Do you mean the games against the Rams and Lions?
I'm just speaking of the last two games. No Bucs prevent from that I saw. The late 4th qtr drive against the Lions (where JC improved his QB rating drastically for the game), they were in a soft Cover 4 the whole drive.

Outside of the two TD throws Sunday (which were very good and on consecutive plays), even on the TD drive JC didn't look good at all. On the two TD throws we don't know if it was a case of two great reads and plays by JC or if Zorn/Smith saw something in the D and dialed up great playcalls where JC just had to set and deliver, not read. A game manager or average QB cannot account for 3 TDs and 5 turnovers (again, lucky it wasn't 8) in two games.

EDIT: Also, I don't want anything I'm saying to be mistaken. I like JC, he's a quality young man and a good lead-by-example guy. I want him to be successful here, if he's not, based on what's likely available this off-season we're in trouble at the QB position.
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Old 10-05-2009, 08:15 PM   #634
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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In the thread referenced I actually did not compare him to Leftwich. I was responding to a comment about Leftwich and said that he is someone else who actually had (to that point) put up good statistical numbers but was not a very good quarterback and lacked a refined sense of timing and anticipation. If you read what I actually wrote it is quite clear and does not differ in tone from your characterization above.

Also, I am not sure how you can characterize Garrard as a "runner" or say that his "running" makes a comparison between he and Campbell inaccurate. In 2008 Garrard had the most rushing yards he has ever had as a professional (322). Campbell had 258. Garrard scrambles around because he does not get a clear picture at the snap or play with great timing. That is exactly the same reason that Campbell was moving so much in the pocket yesterday.
Let me preface this by saying that I'm not the kind of guy who will change my opinion of a player in the middle of a season. I'll re-evaluate Campbell given his whole body of work at the end of the season, and if I am in agreement that he's hit a developmental wall thanks to maxing out the extent at which he can process information and speed up his reads, then he'll always just be mediocre. That will be obvious at the end of the year if it's true. You'll hear it here first.

Now, when you brought up a Garrard comparison in the other thread, that struck me as interesting. Because you alluded to the flaws that Jason shared with David Garrard. But you never really built the anti-Garrard case. What if a stats guy like me watches Garrard on Sunday against the Titans and says, "this is a well above average quarterback with mobility." And then your comparison kind of falls apart.

So while I'm kinda intrigued by your angle, I wish you would have built your case better so I have something to respond to/watch for.
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Old 10-05-2009, 08:18 PM   #635
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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It was when we lost to, let me remind you again, the WINLESS Detroit Lions, that I said that we are not going anywhere this season. You really think that the light at the end of the tunnel will get brighter for us, when the second half of our season is going to be a lot tougher than the first half of our season. I want you, Ruhskins, to tell me how you think this team will finish this year. I say 7-9. Middle of the pack. You and a few other people on this thread think that we're going to the super bowl or something, like you think a miracle will happen. I hope that the skins prove me wrong and go to the playoffs, thats when I dont mind being proven wrong. But I know and I'm still gonna say, that we will not make the playoffs. So again Ruhskins and everyone else bashing me on this particular thread, to respond and tell me right now, how you think we the redskins will finish this year, whats going to be their final record.
Since I was among the first to call you out on your thin fandom, I'll answer. At the beginning of the year, I thought they were a 10 win team. At this point, I believe they are a 6 win team based on what I've seen. Now that being said, every Redskins game I am going to be parked in my seat rooting them to win each and every time they step onto the field. I will agonize their losses and celebrate their wins just like any other time. Regardless of my expectations, I would NEVER root against my teams and players in the hopes of a "better draft pick", especially this early.
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Old 10-05-2009, 08:45 PM   #636
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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It was when we lost to, let me remind you again, the WINLESS Detroit Lions, that I said that we are not going anywhere this season. You really think that the light at the end of the tunnel will get brighter for us, when the second half of our season is going to be a lot tougher than the first half of our season. I want you, Ruhskins, to tell me how you think this team will finish this year. I say 7-9. Middle of the pack. You and a few other people on this thread think that we're going to the super bowl or something, like you think a miracle will happen. I hope that the skins prove me wrong and go to the playoffs, thats when I dont mind being proven wrong. But I know and I'm still gonna say, that we will not make the playoffs. So again Ruhskins and everyone else bashing me on this particular thread, to respond and tell me right now, how you think we the redskins will finish this year, whats going to be their final record.
I haven't been bashing you but I think you need to be straigtened out a little on your "thinking". How I or anyone else "thinks" we're going to finish has little to do with how we WILL finish. I think we've all been fooled before. I still think we could turn this thing around play our best ball when it counts the most. I would rather finish strong than start out strong (See last year). You NEVER pull against your team to win....certainly not this early.
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Old 10-05-2009, 10:20 PM   #637
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by CultBrennan59 View Post
It was when we lost to, let me remind you again, the WINLESS Detroit Lions, that I said that we are not going anywhere this season. You really think that the light at the end of the tunnel will get brighter for us, when the second half of our season is going to be a lot tougher than the first half of our season. I want you, Ruhskins, to tell me how you think this team will finish this year. I say 7-9. Middle of the pack. You and a few other people on this thread think that we're going to the super bowl or something, like you think a miracle will happen. I hope that the skins prove me wrong and go to the playoffs, thats when I dont mind being proven wrong. But I know and I'm still gonna say, that we will not make the playoffs. So again Ruhskins and everyone else bashing me on this particular thread, to respond and tell me right now, how you think we the redskins will finish this year, whats going to be their final record.
Unlike you I don't say dumb things such as "I want my team to suck this year so we can draft a QB and replace the current QB who I hate so much, I am willing to root against my own team." And never have I said (seriously) that we are going to the superbowl or that some miracle will happen. Does the team have issues? Yes. Is it a stretch to say that we're going to the playoffs? Of course. But we've only gone a quarter of the season.

If we go run of the mill 7-9 or less, this team needs to be blown up and start from scratch. And not just with the QB, since in case you haven't notice, we have issues with the o-line as well, an aging RB, and some past questionable FO decisions. But, we'll cross that bridge when we get there. So far, we're 2-2 with a lot of football to play. Unlike you, I'm not giving up on the team.

If you continue to say that you'll root against your own team, well be prepared to be bashed by a lot of people here.
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Old 10-05-2009, 10:54 PM   #638
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
Anyone who has read my posts knows I've supported JC in a big way throughout last year and prior to the Lions game. However the mistakes he's made in the last two games have me very concerned. I've still got to look at the 4th quarter of the game....but so far it appears JC is either regressing, or after a couple of games of film teams have figured out how to mess up JC and he's struggling.
I'll be more concerned if the mistakes continue. Right now I'm just pleased to see that he's being trusted to go out and make mistakes. For too long it seems like he wasn't trusted to do anything.

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I don't see this as an OL issue, for the most part he has time. I'm not buying the "WRs completely suck" argument either. I do see some playcalling issues in the run game (been saying that for 4 weeks), and there also may be some playcalling issues in the pass-game this week (still looking at that, damn I wish I had a full field view).
I'm not sure he has quite enough time. But then again, if I recall correctly, Roethlisberger didn't have much time many times last year but still made things happen

Quote:
IMO right now the best thing to do is nothing. We must find out if JC can improve and stabilize, or if he's not going to make it. If we come into the Bye week and JC is still having the same issues he's had over the last two weeks with no improvement, we need to make a decision based on our record. If we still have a realistic shot at the playoffs (5-2 or 4-3) then Collins should go in. If we're out of it (2-5 or 3-4) based on the remaining 9 games, which are no joke, then we need to take a look at Woodson and start planning for life after JC.
Wow, could you imagine if Woodson is the answer? I lean toward Campbell not being here in 2010. In fact, I wouldn't be all that stunned if neither Campbell nor Rogers are here, which would make the 2005 draft pretty dreadful. Here comes the Shanahan-Leinart era, or the Cowher-Skelton era, or the Holmgren-Snead era, or the Gruden-Clausen/Robinson era...
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Old 10-05-2009, 11:22 PM   #639
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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I'll be more concerned if the mistakes continue. Right now I'm just pleased to see that he's being trusted to go out and make mistakes. For too long it seems like he wasn't trusted to do anything.
I'm almost done with the review and it ain't pretty for JC. I'm also looking (as best I can without full field film, you're welcome at any point to step up and sneak some out for me LOL) at the routes that are being called, just to see if this is also a Zorn issue. At first look it appears this is mostly a JC issue.

P.S. Clausen needs to stay at ND for 2010 and get a BCS championship with a healthy M. Floyd it's possible.
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Old 10-05-2009, 11:28 PM   #640
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
I'm almost done with the review and it ain't pretty for JC. I'm also looking (as best I can without full field film, you're welcome at any point to step up and sneak some out for me LOL) at the routes that are being called, just to see if this is also a Zorn issue. At first look it appears this is mostly a JC issue.

P.S. Clausen needs to stay at ND for 2010 and get a BCS championship with a healthy M. Floyd it's possible.
We should have never cut Chase

Sneak out film for you? You must be crazy
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Old 10-05-2009, 11:32 PM   #641
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
I'm almost done with the review and it ain't pretty for JC. I'm also looking (as best I can without full field film, you're welcome at any point to step up and sneak some out for me LOL) at the routes that are being called, just to see if this is also a Zorn issue. At first look it appears this is mostly a JC issue.

P.S. Clausen needs to stay at ND for 2010 and get a BCS championship with a healthy M. Floyd it's possible.
Guess on the strength of this review that we should start looking for another QB huh?

I think Bradford would have been the best bet before he got hurt. Clausen is good but I think he should stay another year. Woud like to see more big game action from him.
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Old 10-06-2009, 12:09 AM   #642
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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-Flacco has 3 formidable RBs and a great defense

Flacco might turn out to be the best of three. On NFL Network they were actually comparing Ryan to Brady when they played the other game. I was like WTF?
Flacco has ok WR's and 3 pretty good RB's and a rebuilt OL, which make him even more formidable. Actually the guy that should get the credit for his development is Cam Cameron. To me, I would love to see him be our coach someday.
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Old 10-06-2009, 07:39 AM   #643
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
I'm almost done with the review and it ain't pretty for JC. I'm also looking (as best I can without full field film, you're welcome at any point to step up and sneak some out for me LOL) at the routes that are being called, just to see if this is also a Zorn issue. At first look it appears this is mostly a JC issue.

P.S. Clausen needs to stay at ND for 2010 and get a BCS championship with a healthy M. Floyd it's possible.
Watched again this morning, the line definitely gave him more time than I had originally given him credit for. Campbell's timing look off on his drops, I'll bet it comes out later that he's been playing with a more serious injury than anyone suspects.
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Old 10-06-2009, 08:25 AM   #644
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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I'll be more concerned if the mistakes continue. Right now I'm just pleased to see that he's being trusted to go out and make mistakes. For too long it seems like he wasn't trusted to do anything.
I agree. Maybe the pressure got to him or he's hurt worse than we're being told. Either way he kept fighting and pulled out a win. I was very happy to see he didn't quit.
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:02 AM   #645
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Flacco has ok WR's and 3 pretty good RB's and a rebuilt OL, which make him even more formidable. Actually the guy that should get the credit for his development is Cam Cameron. To me, I would love to see him be our coach someday.
I agree 100%
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