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Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Old 12-07-2009, 02:36 PM   #1246
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by skinsfan69 View Post
JC played very well until the game was really on the line. He had some outstanding stick throws yesterday. But again he had a chance to drive us down the field and win the game. Brees delivered, JC didn't. Until he does he's just going to be a middle of the pack QB. He needs to be able to take over when we need him the most. So far he hasn't done it.
Yeah, that's the way I'm looking at it too. Campbell is the kind of QB who will have a great game every once in awhile. But he won't do it consistently, week after week.

That said, there's still a part of me that wants him to come back, (due mainly to the fact that the free agent QBs on the market next year all suck) and see if one more season of putting the pieces in place around him can propel him to the next level. Maybe we've got some of those pieces coming together with Thomas, Davis and Kelly.
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Old 12-07-2009, 02:38 PM   #1247
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Simple and valid explanation...we're comparing the 3 QBs we could have had and how they are performing this season. If we had Sanchez or Cutler, we would be suffering through their insane number of INTs and lack of accuracy right now instead of the Jets or Bears.

Could Sanchez develop into a capable QB later in his career? I don't think he will, but it IS possible. However, Jason is performing the best this season (what we're comparing here) and I believe in the long run will also be the best of the three. Cutler just seems to have some kind of mental block that doesn't allow him to throw to his own team...not quite as bad as Ryan Leaf...but pretty bad!

What do you expect me to do? Take Cutler's numbers this year and then wait 3 years and compare Sanchez' numbers in 2012 to Campbell's 2009 to see if we made the right choice? It could be the fair way to compare apples to apples, but that also proves the point that if we had dumped Campbell for Sanchez, we could have been setting the team's future back another 3+ years. I believed Jason was the best option both short- and long-term for the team and he's proving me correct. This is why I started tracking the 3 possible QBs in the first place, it was a hot debate where people here were in the camps of all three QBs. Earlier in the season, the Campbell detractors maintained a "I told you so, we should have gotten _______!" Being a stats nerd, I wanted to track all three QBs over the season to see if we ended up with the best of the three and if I was right about JC, to have the solid facts to back up my choice. Also, during the team's struggles, I wanted the blame to be on Jason if he was truly playing horribly, but also wanted people to be able to see that he may not be the problem and reason for the team's losses if he was in fact playing well. It's easy to blame quarterbacks for team's losses, but it's NOT always their fault. I knew if we were winning or losing, the Jason Campbell detractors would be hesitant with crediting him but would go out of their way to place all of the blame on him, without even looking at the stats and facts.

He's one of the few bright spots in this disastrous season and he should be around to enjoy the future success of the team (can't sink any lower than this year, right?)
Are you seriously calling his season a "bright spot?" I wouldn't call it that. He's been an average NFL QB. We need him to be better than average. As I said in my last post we need him to be able to win games for us. So far he hasn't been able to do it.
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Old 12-07-2009, 02:51 PM   #1248
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Are you seriously calling his season a "bright spot?" I wouldn't call it that. He's been an average NFL QB. We need him to be better than average. As I said in my last post we need him to be able to win games for us. So far he hasn't been able to do it.
As one of Campbell's strongest critics on the site tell me, has Campbell fallen below, met or exceeded your preseason expectations of him?

An argument can be made that all any one player can do is put his team in position to win games, no one player can do it alone. He did that in each of the last 3 games, would you not agree?
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Old 12-07-2009, 02:57 PM   #1249
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Are you seriously calling his season a "bright spot?" I wouldn't call it that. He's been an average NFL QB. We need him to be better than average. As I said in my last post we need him to be able to win games for us. So far he hasn't been able to do it.
Since Sherman Lewis took over the play calling he has been a very good NFL quarterback. Where Buster errs is in the fact that he thought he was a very good NFL quarterback even before that change. That was not the case. Even against Detroit, when he put up big numbers, he played poorly in the second half, held the ball too long, and did not make stick throws. Given the dramatic difference in his play since the change in play caller, I'm thinking that Zorn played a bigger role in that than I had thought. If you wanted to be positive about the thing, you could say that part of his development in the previous weeks might be due to the fact that Zorn can now devote more attention to coaching the quarterbacks both in-game and during the week.

The "he needs to win games despite any other factors" metric that you have set up is useless (as is the straight statistical analysis quite frankly). Look at the film, evaluate the performance, look at the speed of decision making, the willingness to make throws into tight windows, accuracy, footwork and ball speed. Campbell has been very good in all areas, especially the last three weeks. He is playing at a high level right now and the reason the team has lost is not attributable to him. I can see how you could look at the INT late and say, "same old story," but really what you are saying right now is anything short of perfection is not good enough. You want a superhuman performance, rather than simply looking at an individual who is performing at a very high - if perhaps not quite elite - level.
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:02 PM   #1250
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

Chris Meidt should be credited then, because Campbell has referred to him as his QB coach and the guy who has worked most closely with him.
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:07 PM   #1251
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

Because I like how Campbell has developed, and how he handled the off-season garbage, I really wanted him to excel this year. I think he shows a lot in the games. BUT, then he goes and throws an INT when we need a drive, not only to win, but maybe give Suisham a chance to redeem himself. That is the frustrating thing. Is it Campbell's fault we lost, not in the least. But did he step up to the plate in the last 2 minutes, game on the line time? No, he did not. I wish he had.
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:09 PM   #1252
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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I'm not blaming the refs. Nor am I blaming JC. He played very well against a beat up secondary. He should've played well yesterday!!! All I'm saying is when the game really needs to be won he needs to take over. On that last drive he needed to take us down the field and win the game. Instead he threw a horrible INT. But let's not blame the refs. We all know they're terrible and most of the time it evens out.
Actually it seems that is DOESN'T even out for us...we are constantly getting hosed.
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:11 PM   #1253
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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I must have missed that game.
Lucky you, it would've taken some time off the end of your life.

Read over the gameday thread if you don't believe me.
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:29 PM   #1254
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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I must have missed that game.
You and me both
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Old 12-07-2009, 03:45 PM   #1255
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

You know being one of Jason's biggest critics here I must say first as I did in the game thread yesterday that he played on hell of a game. During Regulation I saw some other guy playing because that wasn't the Jason Campbell I knew. Didn't get rattled at the sight of a blitzing defender. Made quick sound decisions with the football and by god the man found his deep ball. DID YOU HEAR ME PEOPLE? HE FOUND HIS DEEP BALL !!!!

It was simply a beautiful performance by him and I agree that since Sherm Lewis/Smith have been the main playcallers that his team as well as the teams performance has improved greatly.

A game like this is tough for me to judge him on because while he had a great game when the money was on the line he reverted to the guy that I bash. His footwork was off, he rushed his throw, and the result was a pick. Not all his fault; but had he drove them to a score I wouldn't have given credit to anyone else but him. I still think he should go because he's had his chance IMO and I think that it has been a fair one at that. We can scream on the line and not having receivers that are proven but I call Bullshit on that one because he has had enough to entrench himself as "The Guy" here. Also, if he had shown himself to be the guy to anyone else in the league then we would've been raped for this baller QB for a discounted price. He's still here so I guess we pretty much know what the deal is. His numbers didn't lie when it comes to the game yesterday because if I'm going to place blame on anyone for that loss it would be Carlos' stop and go parter Laron.

Is he playing like this because there is no pressure on him ? Don't know, had I never read him saying that the pressure is off and now we can go play then I wouldn't feel that's the case. He did play a good game though, actually I'd say hella good !
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Old 12-07-2009, 10:01 PM   #1256
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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As one of Campbell's strongest critics on the site tell me, has Campbell fallen below, met or exceeded your preseason expectations of him?

An argument can be made that all any one player can do is put his team in position to win games, no one player can do it alone. He did that in each of the last 3 games, would you not agree?
He hasn't met my expectations. He's been in position to take us down the field in the Dallas game and this past game. Both games he's turned the ball over when we need him the most. Now with that being said he's certainly playing better and I want us to bring him back next year.
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Old 12-07-2009, 10:14 PM   #1257
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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He hasn't met my expectations. He's been in position to take us down the field in the Dallas game and this past game. Both games he's turned the ball over when we need him the most. Now with that being said he's certainly playing better and I want us to bring him back next year.
Why do you want to bring him back?
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Old 12-07-2009, 11:16 PM   #1258
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Is he playing like this because there is no pressure on him ? Don't know, had I never read him saying that the pressure is off and now we can go play then I wouldn't feel that's the case. He did play a good game though, actually I'd say hella good !
What a difference pass protection makes.
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Old 12-07-2009, 11:23 PM   #1259
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Originally Posted by Paintrain View Post
As one of Campbell's strongest critics on the site tell me, has Campbell fallen below, met or exceeded your preseason expectations of him?

An argument can be made that all any one player can do is put his team in position to win games, no one player can do it alone. He did that in each of the last 3 games, would you not agree?
Not sure if scoring 6 points is considered putting a team in position to win as a QB.
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Old 12-07-2009, 11:27 PM   #1260
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Re: Campbell's numbers dont lie

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Not sure if scoring 6 points is considered putting a team in position to win as a QB.
If your team has the lead late in the 4th quarter=putting your team in a position to win.
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