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I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Old 10-07-2009, 01:16 PM   #16
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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I've seen progress moving the ball but like you said not in scoring which will lead to those wins. The toughest place to run any system is in the red zone and thats where I see our biggest problem and that is where the timing is most crucial. If they can improve on that then those losses we have had are wins.
Agreed. JC wasn't given the chance to get the team in the end zone twice against the rams, even though he'd moved the team down the field to get them in the red zone.

Just imagine this; v. Rams: Sellers & Thomas catch those td passes v. the rams they dropped AND Orakpo wasn't called for a personal foul which negated a fumble recovery at about the 15. The game is a blow out, not even counting the Hb option play & CP getting stuffed on 4th down.

Detroit: CP either gets in from the 1 or JC makes a play for a td. Different ballgame.

These are just a few plays, which is what games come down to. But if these plays had gone well, I bet many would say that the Tampa game was just a bad half for JC & the offense.

My point is that there has been progress made w/the offense, but due to a few bad plays (drops, questionable play calls, JC throwing in traffic) there's nothing to show for it. It seems to me that most of the problems are perhaps greater than just correcting technical flaws. This team is in need of inspiration & confidence, maybe the 2nd half of tampa gave it to them?
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Old 10-07-2009, 01:21 PM   #17
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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We all talk about Snyder not showing any patients but what are all the fans now doing? When Zorn was hired all the talk was it takes 2 years for the O to learn and get down the timing of the WCO. Joe T. and others said over and over again it takes 2 years and fans need to be patient. We are 4 weeks into the season not even close to having two years in the system and now everyone is jumping ship. Just a thought.

There's not a great deal of difference between the patience of Snyder and that of the FW fan. I've said it before, Snyder expects his HC to make bricks out of straw and won't even give him time to do that. An 8-8 finish for a first yr. head coach with a limited resume is not a horrible effort.

Rather than admit the team needs help in critical areas across the board, it's just so much easier to blame it on the coach. When things don't go well someone has to take the fall, right now the fall guy is Zorn, deserving or not.
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Old 10-07-2009, 01:33 PM   #18
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Staying the course wouldnt have saved the Titanic from sinking and it won't help this team. At some point, its time to abandon ship and get on another boat, so to speak. Whether that process starts after the bye week or at the end of the season, it doesnt change the fact that this ship is sinking under Zorns leadership. Hiring him as HC was one of the biggest mistakes this franchsise has made in its history. Staying the course any longer than necessary won't change that fact. Someone else will be coaching the skins in 2010. We can either start laying the groundwork for that now, or wait until the seasons over and "blow everything up." It needs to happen. Its going to happen. Staying the course is not an option.
So you want to compare a cruise ship to a football team? I would rather use the stock market. You don't want to sell too quickly. The football team will never sink and be lost forever, a ship is most likely gone if it sinks. A football team can come back after a shitty performance, a boat...not so much. A stock can be doing very poorly one day and come back strong for a long time. The team hasn't totally matured under the WCO and Zorn, its too soon to cut our loses. I think you have to give a coach at least 4 years (except for a very few like Gibbs and Belichick). Don't start rambling about Tomlin and Gruden, those were Cowher's and Dungee's teams. But hey, what do I know, I am just a fan on a fan site.

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Old 10-07-2009, 01:58 PM   #19
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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So you want to compare a cruise ship to a football team? I would rather use the stock market. You don't want to sell too quickly. The football team will never sink and be lost forever a ship is most likely gone if it sinks. A football teams can come back after a shitty performance, a boat...not so much. A stock can be doing very poorly one day and come back strong for a long time. The team hasn't totally matured under the WCO and Zorn, its too soon to cut our loses. I think you have to give a coach at least 4 years (except for a very few like Gibbs and Belichick). Don't start rambling about Tomlin and Gruden, those were Cowher's and Dungee's teams. But hey, what do I know, I am just a fan on a fan site.

I agree, but there's no way any coach is going to get four yrs. out of Snyder unless he get's the team to the payoffs each of those four yrs. and ultimately wins a championship. It matters less who the coach is, if the team does not make improvements coaches will just be a repeat performance.
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:02 PM   #20
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

In today's NFL, how many coaches anywhere would get more than 3-4 years to get at least a playoff game? I'm not positive, but I would guess on average it's 3 years...and we're above average
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:06 PM   #21
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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In today's NFL, how many coaches anywhere would get more than 3-4 years to get at least a playoff game? I'm not positive, but I would guess on average it's 3 years...and we're above average

LOL. I guess it's all how you look at it. Our perception may be that we are above average but our performance over the past 10 years would say otherwise.
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:15 PM   #22
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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In today's NFL, how many coaches anywhere would get more than 3-4 years to get at least a playoff game? I'm not positive, but I would guess on average it's 3 years...and we're above average

Not many, and it explains why coaches are fired all the time. Good coaches have good players, or at least the players make the coach look good. Have you ever seen a bad coach coaching a good/winning team? It's more often than not the other way around.
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:32 PM   #23
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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I think the true problem with us is before Lewis came on board yesterday who had experience in the WCO besides Zorn? I don't think anyone has therefore i'm not convinced all the coaches know what they are coaching. Other coaches bring in Cam Cameron, Dom Capers, Mike Nolan & etc. All previous coaches who had experience and know what they are doing.
Good point. I have seen others point that out as well. I don't think this means the end of Jim Zorn. Maybe they just brought Lewis in to get a fresh perspective on things and to help coach up the coaches.
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:35 PM   #24
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Staying the course wouldnt have saved the Titanic from sinking ...
Interesting note I once learned. If the Titanic had changed it's course one minute earlier, or one minute later, the ship would have survived. I think earlier and they would have missed the iceberg, later and they would have rammed the front compartment which was sealed and would not have flooded the whole ship.
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:50 PM   #25
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Interesting note I once learned. If the Titanic had changed it's course one minute earlier, or one minute later, the ship would have survived. I think earlier and they would have missed the iceberg, later and they would have rammed the front compartment which was sealed and would not have flooded the whole ship.
Not to get off the point but if they would have changed course later wouldn't they have already hit the iceberg?
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:54 PM   #26
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Not to get off the point but if they would have changed course later wouldn't they have already hit the iceberg?
Read what he wrote
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Old 10-07-2009, 02:58 PM   #27
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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I think that there has been progress. It just hasn't translated into points and wins yet. If the Skins stay the course, they can get there.
So are you saying the Skins are close?
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Old 10-07-2009, 03:10 PM   #28
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Read what he wrote
Well I have to take that 1 minute earlier would be one minute before they hit the iceberg and one minute later would have been one minute after they hit the iceberg. So what am I missing?
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Old 10-07-2009, 03:13 PM   #29
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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Well I have to take that 1 minute earlier would be one minute before they hit the iceberg and one minute later would have been one minute after they hit the iceberg. So what am I missing?
Like he said, read what he wrote.
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Old 10-07-2009, 03:16 PM   #30
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Re: I Thought It Takes 2 Years To Learn The WCO

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So are you saying the Skins are close?

If they can start scoring in the Redzone, then yes they are close.

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