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Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Old 11-07-2009, 08:28 AM   #61
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Originally Posted by atomicnixon View Post
Gibbs unquestionably left the team in better shape, considering what he had to work with. The problems began in the 2008 draft when you draft 2 under performing WR and a below-average TE in high rounds. Had they picked OL we would not be in this situation because they would have had plenty of playing time as fast as our line gets injured. Where is Pete Kendall? What about Fabini? There are a number of reliable back ups out there who could do a better job than Mike Williams or Will Montgomery. Just another example of the front office FAILING! At least when Joe Gibbs was here he could take an average group and make them competitive, now we have nothing.

I agree. Although at the time we were screaming for the 'skins to draft some wide receivers to push Santana Moss and Randel El. Unfortunately so far, we haven't seen this from Malcom Kelly, but Thomas appears to be doing a little more this year than last year (which isn't saying much.) But yes, other than the Derrick Dockery signing (which wasn't a big time signing) we haven't really addressed the offensive line like we should have. Of course, drafting players is a fine art. You have to balance needs verses drafting the best players who are available when your team is on the clock. This is where trading up or down becomes mightily important in order to draft the best players for your areas of need.
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Old 11-07-2009, 10:27 AM   #62
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Gibbs did hinder our future by drafting Carlos Rodgers over Aaron Rogers IMO.
you could also throw both of dallas' d ends in that group spears and ware, and roddy white was drafted right after campbell too, regardless of who was in charge our drafting over the past 10 years has been pretty terrible we need a reallygood talent evaluator, someone who will actually do that instead of hosting radio shows and playing racquetball
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Old 11-08-2009, 09:15 AM   #63
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Gibbs did hinder our future by drafting Carlos Rodgers over Aaron Rogers IMO.
Hindsight is 20/20. Do we even know if it was possible for us to get Aaron Rogers at the time and still be able to get a high draft pick CB?
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:09 AM   #64
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

Joe Gibbs cannot escape blame for some idiotic personnel moves when he was Team President. For anyone to imply that everything he did was golden is denying reality.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:32 AM   #65
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Joe Gibbs cannot escape blame for some idiotic personnel moves when he was Team President. For anyone to imply that everything he did was golden is denying reality.
I don't think anyone is implying that. What Gibbs did is bring back is winning and playoffs back to Washington. He brought back pride in being a Redskin. That is what makes him golden.
Winning football games is what it is all about.
Gibbs is gone and Snyderatto has been calling the shots the last two years and we are back to being a terrible team. So that ultimate blame goes to Snyderatto, if you believe otherwise you are denying reality.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:40 AM   #66
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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I don't think anyone is implying that. What Gibbs did is bring back is winning and playoffs back to Washington. He brought back pride in being a Redskin. That is what makes him golden.
Winning football games is what it is all about.
Gibbs is gone and Snyderatto has been calling the shots the last two years and we are back to being a terrible team. So that ultimate blame goes to Snyderatto, if you believe otherwise you are denying reality.
I beg to differ. Gibbs was here for four years and most definitely had say in personnel decisions and the direction of the organization. As far as I'm concerned, he's just as complicit as Snyderatto. That too is reality.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:50 AM   #67
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Originally Posted by Defensewins View Post
I don't think anyone is implying that. What Gibbs did is bring back is winning and playoffs back to Washington. He brought back pride in being a Redskin. That is what makes him golden.
Winning football games is what it is all about.
Gibbs is gone and Snyderatto has been calling the shots the last two years and we are back to being a terrible team. So that ultimate blame goes to Snyderatto, if you believe otherwise you are denying reality.
I want to add one more thing. Sometimes I get the impression that Skins fans are more concerned about style points than actually winning. Like you know, if Joe Gibbs comes back and we're still losers but he restores this sense of "pride", it somehow makes it all better. Hey we suck, but at least Gibbs is here. I couldn't care less who's here, I just want this team to win and I'm not convinced that Gibbs wouldn't end up being more of an impediment than actually moving the ball forward in a meaningful way.

I can tell you this, if Gibbs comes back, in any capacity, the pressure will be unbelievably high. The fans will expect instant results. No five or three year plan to right the ship. That's the downside to bringing Gibbs back, in my opinion.
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Old 11-08-2009, 11:00 AM   #68
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Originally Posted by 12thMan View Post
I want to add one more thing. Sometimes I get the impression that Skins fans are more concerned about style points than actually winning. Like you know, if Joe Gibbs comes back and we're still losers but he restores this sense of "pride", it somehow makes it all better. Hey we suck, but at least Gibbs is here. I couldn't care less who's here, I just want this team to win and I'm not convinced that Gibbs wouldn't end up being more of an impediment than actually moving the ball forward in a meaningful way.

I can tell you this, if Gibbs comes back, in any capacity, the pressure will be unbelievably high. The fans will expect instant results. No five or three year plan to right the ship. That's the downside to bringing Gibbs back, in my opinion.
I think that you are right about that.
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Old 11-08-2009, 12:39 PM   #69
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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I beg to differ. Gibbs was here for four years and most definitely had say in personnel decisions and the direction of the organization. As far as I'm concerned, he's just as complicit as Snyderatto. That too is reality.
Did you even read my post. First sentence I said "I don't think anyone is implying that." In reply to Beenseven post, " Joe Gibbs cannot escape blame for some idiotic personnel moves when he was Team President. For anyone to imply that everything he did was golden is denying reality."

I was saying (YES!) Gibbs cannot escape part of the blame for some of the really bad personnel moves. You are so bent on your rant to blame Gibbs you did not even notice I was agreeing with part blaming Gibbs for our mess. Wipe the steam from your glasses man.
My point was Gibbs brought back winning, playoffs and respect to the Redskins. That is all.
Snyderatto in less than two years since Gibbs left has crashed us into the ground. Personnel issues is not the only thing to blame here, it is also the leadership of our FO and the coaching mess that was created AFTER GIBBS LEFT. You know, the hiring a offensive coordinator first before hiring a HC. Then giving Zorn the HC position after the best candidates passed on the job, then later stripping Zorn of his man-hood. Talk about style points that takes the cake. Not to mention all the other stuff Snyderatto has done this year that do not need to be repeated.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:58 PM   #70
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

I only wish that Gibbs had stood up for Gregg Williams when Vinny was throwing dirt on GW. As President of Football Operations, Joe's opinion would have carried greater credence with Snyder than Vinny's. If Gibbs does come back, I want it in more of a CEO role, where he puts the best GM in place, and leaves it to that guy to help select the coach and the future personnel. Gibbs 2.0 personnel record was spotty at best. Sean Taylor, and Chris Cooley from his first draft were home runs, but much that came thereafter in FA and the draft has vastly underachieved.
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Old 11-08-2009, 08:52 PM   #71
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Originally Posted by 12thMan View Post
I want to add one more thing. Sometimes I get the impression that Skins fans are more concerned about style points than actually winning. Like you know, if Joe Gibbs comes back and we're still losers but he restores this sense of "pride", it somehow makes it all better. Hey we suck, but at least Gibbs is here. I couldn't care less who's here, I just want this team to win and I'm not convinced that Gibbs wouldn't end up being more of an impediment than actually moving the ball forward in a meaningful way.

I can tell you this, if Gibbs comes back, in any capacity, the pressure will be unbelievably high. The fans will expect instant results. No five or three year plan to right the ship. That's the downside to bringing Gibbs back, in my opinion.
I don't believe anybody actually feels that way about Joe Gibbs like you suggest, but that we understand the fact that if Gibbs does come back, Snyder will listen to him and no Vinny Cerrato....which is a good thing for the team. I'm not saying everything Gibbs touches turns to gold by any stretch, but comparing what he did while he was here to what happened before his second tenure and after his second tenure is worlds better.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:07 PM   #72
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

Hey we dont need Gibbs back. He was a great coach, and thats al i am going to say about that. If Gibbs comes back that will probably be a license to keep all the idiots that we have now. Like VC and much of the coaching staff. We need a GM that is well thought of, that will clean house and start over.
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Old 11-08-2009, 11:12 PM   #73
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

Just curious, what has anyone heard recently about JG returning anyway? No offense to the author of this thread, but isn't it time to move on and bury any notion of JG coming back? Besides, he'd be nuts to come back to this wreck.
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Old 11-09-2009, 09:28 AM   #74
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

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Originally Posted by SouperMeister View Post
I only wish that Gibbs had stood up for Gregg Williams when Vinny was throwing dirt on GW. As President of Football Operations, Joe's opinion would have carried greater credence with Snyder than Vinny's. If Gibbs does come back, I want it in more of a CEO role, where he puts the best GM in place, and leaves it to that guy to help select the coach and the future personnel. Gibbs 2.0 personnel record was spotty at best. Sean Taylor, and Chris Cooley from his first draft were home runs, but much that came thereafter in FA and the draft has vastly underachieved.
Gibbs had already stepped down at that point. That's why we were looking for a new HC to begin with.
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Old 11-09-2009, 03:10 PM   #75
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Re: Return of Joe Gibbs - - Update

Joe apparently did not want Vinny when he came back and it was at Danny's insistance that he accepted him. He also said that his choice for his successor was Greg Williams as that was the first thing he did (went to Buffalo on Snyder's plane) when he became the coach of the Redskins in 2004. Gibbs has a pretty good idea of how to build an organization, I only wish Danny had not thrown it all away!
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