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Our next coach??

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Old 12-01-2009, 12:05 PM   #316
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Re: Our next coach??

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Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat View Post
i've also read that Williams didn't want Campbell, whom he viewed as a "coach killer." I give Williams credit for that. He was on the money, there.
I think Vinny is more of a coach killer right now than Campbell.
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Old 12-01-2009, 12:10 PM   #317
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Re: Our next coach??

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I think Vinny is more of a coach killer right now than Campbell.
in that sense, Williams was right on both points.
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Old 12-01-2009, 12:46 PM   #318
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Re: Our next coach??

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He was only joking about every play he called being a failure...but he did call the plays at the end of the game
Kevin actually asked Zorn about this on the Jim Zorn show today. Zorn said he called all the plays in the final drives of both halves.

From NFL.com - First Half

Washington Redskins at 00:49
1-10-WAS 35 (:42) (Shotgun) PENALTY on WAS-76-L.Jones, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at WAS 35 - No Play. FAIL

1-15-WAS 30 (:41) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short left to 31-R.Cartwright pushed ob at WAS 40 for 10 yards (52-T.White). PARTIAL SUCCESS

2-5-WAS 40 (:35) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short left to 11-D.Thomas to WAS 37 for -3 yards (24-S.Brown). FAIL

Timeout #2 by WAS at 00:28.
3-8-WAS 37 (:28) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short right intended for 11-D.Thomas INTERCEPTED by 22-A.Samuel [58-T.Cole] at WAS 45. 22-A.Samuel to WAS 28 for 17 yards (11-D.Thomas). FAIL


From NFL.com - Second Half

1-10-WAS 16 (1:44) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass incomplete short left to 11-D.Thomas [58-T.Cole]. FAIL

2-10-WAS 16 (1:39) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass incomplete deep middle to 86-F.Davis. FAIL

3-10-WAS 16 (1:33) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short middle to 82-A.Randle El to WAS 25 for 9 yards (35-V.Harris). FAIL

4-1-WAS 25 (1:09) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass incomplete short right to 89-S.Moss [75-J.Parker]. WAS-17-J.Campbell was injured during the play. His return is Doubtful. FAIL

So of the 8 plays that Zorn admitted to calling, 7 of them were complete failures. When you consider the goal of both drives was to score before the half expired, all 8 plays can be considered failures as they did not result in the redskins putting points on the board. Granted, Zorn only calls the plays - he doesn't execute them, but the fact remains that, for whatever reason, the team executed better when Zorn wasn't calling plays.

I would be interested in knowing how many of the plays/drives that have succeeded since Sherm took over the majority of the playcalling duties (and our offense started gelling) can be attributed to Zorn. I certainly doubt very many.
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Old 12-01-2009, 01:32 PM   #319
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Re: Our next coach??

That makes sense since Zorn calls the two-minute drills. A two-minute/4th down (Zorn) vs. passing plays (Sherman Lewis) vs. running plays (Sherman Smith) break-down would be interesting but would have so many caveats it'd be tough to pull off. Plus Lewis would have to factor into the running plays also because he tells Smith when to call a running play.

And a lot of people seem to be saying Chris Meidt is playing as critical a role as anyone in calling the offense.

This clearly tells me that our next head coach should be Jermis Zolesmidt
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Old 12-01-2009, 01:49 PM   #320
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Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat View Post
Kevin actually asked Zorn about this on the Jim Zorn show today. Zorn said he called all the plays in the final drives of both halves.

From NFL.com - First Half

Washington Redskins at 00:49
1-10-WAS 35 (:42) (Shotgun) PENALTY on WAS-76-L.Jones, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at WAS 35 - No Play. FAIL

1-15-WAS 30 (:41) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short left to 31-R.Cartwright pushed ob at WAS 40 for 10 yards (52-T.White). PARTIAL SUCCESS

2-5-WAS 40 (:35) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short left to 11-D.Thomas to WAS 37 for -3 yards (24-S.Brown). FAIL

Timeout #2 by WAS at 00:28.
3-8-WAS 37 (:28) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short right intended for 11-D.Thomas INTERCEPTED by 22-A.Samuel [58-T.Cole] at WAS 45. 22-A.Samuel to WAS 28 for 17 yards (11-D.Thomas). FAIL


From NFL.com - Second Half

1-10-WAS 16 (1:44) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass incomplete short left to 11-D.Thomas [58-T.Cole]. FAIL

2-10-WAS 16 (1:39) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass incomplete deep middle to 86-F.Davis. FAIL

3-10-WAS 16 (1:33) (Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass short middle to 82-A.Randle El to WAS 25 for 9 yards (35-V.Harris). FAIL

4-1-WAS 25 (1:09) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 17-J.Campbell pass incomplete short right to 89-S.Moss [75-J.Parker]. WAS-17-J.Campbell was injured during the play. His return is Doubtful. FAIL

So of the 8 plays that Zorn admitted to calling, 7 of them were complete failures. When you consider the goal of both drives was to score before the half expired, all 8 plays can be considered failures as they did not result in the redskins putting points on the board. Granted, Zorn only calls the plays - he doesn't execute them, but the fact remains that, for whatever reason, the team executed better when Zorn wasn't calling plays.

I would be interested in knowing how many of the plays/drives that have succeeded since Sherm took over the majority of the playcalling duties (and our offense started gelling) can be attributed to Zorn. I certainly doubt very many.
But this doesn't explain why those plays failed. My recollection is that most of them failed because there was little protection from the O-line. At some point, a coach has to rely on the line to provide adequate protection -- especially when it is a final drive with little time remaining and you're behind. I am not sure I would blame these failures on playcalling.
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Old 12-01-2009, 01:52 PM   #321
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Re: Our next coach??

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
That makes sense since Zorn calls the two-minute drills. A two-minute/4th down (Zorn) vs. passing plays (Sherman Lewis) vs. running plays (Sherman Smith) break-down would be interesting but would have so many caveats it'd be tough to pull off. Plus Lewis would have to factor into the running plays also because he tells Smith when to call a running play.

And a lot of people seem to be saying Chris Meidt is playing as critical a role as anyone in calling the offense.

This clearly tells me that our next head coach should be Jermis Zolesmidt
Who?
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:00 PM   #322
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Re: Our next coach??

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
That makes sense since Zorn calls the two-minute drills. A two-minute/4th down (Zorn) vs. passing plays (Sherman Lewis) vs. running plays (Sherman Smith) break-down would be interesting but would have so many caveats it'd be tough to pull off. Plus Lewis would have to factor into the running plays also because he tells Smith when to call a running play.

And a lot of people seem to be saying Chris Meidt is playing as critical a role as anyone in calling the offense.

This clearly tells me that our next head coach should be Jermis Zolesmidt
Hearing Cooley explain the process today he was almost laughing at one point.

I'm actually surprised that the process has gone as smoothly as it has, but honestly the fact that Sherman Lewis has little to no communication with Campbell is amazing to me.
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:03 PM   #323
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Re: Our next coach??

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Hearing Cooley explain the process today he was almost laughing at one point.

I'm actually surprised that the process has gone as smoothly as it has, but honestly the fact that Sherman Lewis has little to no communication with Campbell is amazing to me.
I think in a way it's good. You'd see and hear Zorn on the sidelines and it was like he spent most of his time coaching Campbell during the game. That's not what he should be doing as the head coach. Come game time let Campbell play the game, that's not the time to be working on technique and fundamentals, in my opinion.
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:08 PM   #324
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Re: Our next coach??

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I think in a way it's good. You'd see and hear Zorn on the sidelines and it was like he spent most of his time coaching Campbell during the game. That's not what he should be doing as the head coach. Come game time let Campbell play the game, that's not the time to be working on technique and fundamentals, in my opinion.
Yeah I see that point. My take is you would think that in order for everyone to be on the same page, there would be some level of face to face communication going on between the guy calling the plays, and the person who ultimately runs them.

I'm not saying it's necessary for Lewis to talk with JC during the game, but the fact they don't talk at all during the week during the installation of the game plan is just very odd to me.
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:19 PM   #325
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Re: Our next coach??

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
That makes sense since Zorn calls the two-minute drills. A two-minute/4th down (Zorn) vs. passing plays (Sherman Lewis) vs. running plays (Sherman Smith) break-down would be interesting but would have so many caveats it'd be tough to pull off. Plus Lewis would have to factor into the running plays also because he tells Smith when to call a running play.

And a lot of people seem to be saying Chris Meidt is playing as critical a role as anyone in calling the offense.

This clearly tells me that our next head coach should be Jermis Zolesmidt
lol! ive heard thet same thing about Chris. If we keep a WCO and don't hire Shanahan, perhaps the new coach would consider keeping chris around. If not, i'm sure he'll find work elsewhere. he plays a crucial role in managing a chaotic playcalling setup...

my main feeling is that there are too many people involved in the process. I understand that Zorn likes to call plays and this is probably the last chance he'll ever have to do it, but i'd bet we'd have better success (and perhaps even won the past 2 games... keeping us alive in the wildcard hunt) if Zorn didn't interject himself in the process. It no doubt breaks whatever flow the other playcallers have going.
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:41 PM   #326
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Re: Our next coach??

what if chris meidt is being groomed to be the next OC/play caller? I think Zorn could be a HC, he has kept this team performing, but his playcalling skills seem inadequate. I like Sherm Lewis, but he most certainly is a stop gap solution, so if we end up not blowing it up, but instead giving one more year with a pledge of really fixing the OL through draft/FA, maybe Meidt becomes OC/ and the Sherms are the sacrificial lambs on the offensive side of the ball. With Blache retiring our staff would look like this:
HC - Zorn
OC - Meidt - Full play calling duties
DC - Gray
ST - Smith

With a FO where VC is reduced and Marty or Holmgren are brought in as GM.

I am not sure how this would work, but I think I would see this positively.
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:52 PM   #327
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Re: Our next coach??

I can't think of many GM/President candidates who would be willing to come in and generally keep the status quo. You're probably talking about reaching for someone like Steve Mariucci (but that's a big reach). Or promoting someone from within.

Meidt might stay but overall I think if Zorn goes (and Vinny goes) there will be some serious housecleaning
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Old 12-01-2009, 03:00 PM   #328
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Re: Our next coach??

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what if chris meidt is being groomed to be the next OC/play caller? I think Zorn could be a HC, he has kept this team performing, but his playcalling skills seem inadequate. I like Sherm Lewis, but he most certainly is a stop gap solution, so if we end up not blowing it up, but instead giving one more year with a pledge of really fixing the OL through draft/FA, maybe Meidt becomes OC/ and the Sherms are the sacrificial lambs on the offensive side of the ball. With Blache retiring our staff would look like this:
HC - Zorn
OC - Meidt - Full play calling duties
DC - Gray
ST - Smith

With a FO where VC is reduced and Marty or Holmgren are brought in as GM.

I am not sure how this would work, but I think I would see this positively.
IF - and only IF - all the big names rebuff Snyder, I can see something like this happening, especially if the offense continues to show improvement as the season winds down. However, I think equally as likely in that scenario would be:

HC - Gray
OC/QB coach - Meidt - Full play calling duties
DC - Blache (or, if he retires Kirk Olivadotti or John Palemro)
ST - Smith

I also think its possible that if Snyder can't land a big name coach, Gregg Williams would be one of the candidates he interviews and seriously considers hiring.
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Old 12-01-2009, 03:03 PM   #329
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Re: Our next coach??

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Yeah I see that point. My take is you would think that in order for everyone to be on the same page, there would be some level of face to face communication going on between the guy calling the plays, and the person who ultimately runs them.

I'm not saying it's necessary for Lewis to talk with JC during the game, but the fact they don't talk at all during the week during the installation of the game plan is just very odd to me.
Yeah it's peculiar

Cooley describes play-calling process | Washington Examiner
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Old 12-01-2009, 03:09 PM   #330
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Re: Our next coach??

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It's a hot mess if you ask me.

I really don't know how the offense has managed to improve under these circumstances, and with all the injuries to boot.
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