Warpath  

Home | Forums | Salary Cap Info | Shop | Donate | Stay Connected




Go Back   Warpath > Redskins Forums > Redskins Locker Room


Our next coach??

Redskins Locker Room


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-11-2009, 10:29 AM   #721
‎\m/
 
Mattyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Age: 41
Posts: 79,442
Re: Our next coach??

Jauron won't have a problem getting another coordinator job, but he's done at HC.
__________________
Support The Warpath! | Warpath Shop
Mattyk is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisements
Old 12-11-2009, 10:29 AM   #722
Uncle Phil
 
SmootSmack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 44,484
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by freddyg12 View Post
Also, has Dennis Green considered coming back to the sideline?
He's coaching in the UFL isn't he? He reportedly has no interest in leaving the west coast.
__________________
You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You
SmootSmack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 10:31 AM   #723
Uncle Phil
 
SmootSmack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 44,484
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdr76 View Post
The front office in STL worked completely against each other (major infighting) during Martz's time. His head coaching record is outstanding and I was not his biggest fan but it is hard to argue with the results he produced. In each stop in Detroit and SF, his offense improved dramatically from the year prior to him.

If Lovie Smith stays in Chicago, I could see him helping his old friend out there as OC since Ron Turner is well, let's say not good.

I am just disgusted that this conversation even exists. I think Zorn has some faults but has shown signs of improvement given some of the garbage he was given by the front office. I still don't know what coach in their right mind would think the Redskins and the current front office structure is a great opportunity. Schottenheimer made some pretty good comments yesterday about Cerrato and it probably isn't a stretch to say more NFL people respect Marty than Cerrato but at least Snyder likes Cerrato. Right? Because that relationship has worked out so well for us. Right? Ha.
Yeah I remember Zygmunt and Martz had some major issues. I think Zygmunt may have been just as hated in St. Louis as VC here.
__________________
You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You
SmootSmack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 10:35 AM   #724
Playmaker
 
Paintrain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Age: 43
Posts: 4,878
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdr76 View Post
My very first post so I will try and not embarrass myself. In patrolling several boards and the topic of the next coach, there appears to be one name that continues to be missing.

While I think we can all agree that the front office is a complete farce and the general feeling is that Snyder wants a "name" coach, there seems to be a feeling that the name coaches are kind of saying "no thanks".....Cowher this week, Holmgren and the Hawks/Browns, Gruden and ESPN, etc, etc. The one successful coach that continues to be missing is Mike Martz. I lived in St. Louis when he was the OC and the head coach and the guy was crazy but an excellent coach that produced some very good teams. He turned in fairly successful stints as the OC in Detroit and San Francisco until Mike Singeltary decided on a different offense.

Martz clashed with the front office in STL because of the incompetence of some of the people there. Wilbon has stated several times that he believes Snyder will do one more hire before finally getting things right and getting the right front office structure in place. I personally would take the flier on Martz for his outstanding record as a head coach. Plus, I think he would put the screws to the front office and then finally, maybe, Snyder will realize his errors. Schottenheimer did it and he is the only coach, albeit for 1 season, that Snyder hired that had a .500 or better record with the Skins.
Nice initial post, keep it up!! I thought Martz would have been perfect in '08 when we were searching but purely from a football standpoint. He would be calling virtually the same offense we'd been running under Saunders, had success with undersized WR in the past, could have made Portis into more of a threat in the screen/passing game and could have developed Campbell to his strengths. Also, he had a strong relationship with Fletcher on the defensive side so he'd have credibility with the defensive players. I'd wonder how his ego would work with Snyder and Cerrato but on the field it would have been a great fit.

At this point however, I don't think that's a good move. We'd be changing offenses AGAIN, our personnel isn't suited to his style and the front office structure is still broken.
__________________
FREE RG3!
Paintrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 10:37 AM   #725
Playmaker
 
Paintrain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Age: 43
Posts: 4,878
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Well, I think Dick Jauron also struggled in Chicago. He's another guy who probably isn't seen at this moment as head coach material. Especially not in a major market like DC.
Talk about bad body language from a coach, he always looks like he just buried his best friend. I don't know if I've seen a smile ever cross his face or him get animated at anything.
__________________
FREE RG3!
Paintrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 10:49 AM   #726
Registered User
 
SBXVII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 7,766
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdr76 View Post
The front office in STL worked completely against each other (major infighting) during Martz's time. His head coaching record is outstanding and I was not his biggest fan but it is hard to argue with the results he produced. In each stop in Detroit and SF, his offense improved dramatically from the year prior to him.

If Lovie Smith stays in Chicago, I could see him helping his old friend out there as OC since Ron Turner is well, let's say not good.

I am just disgusted that this conversation even exists. I think Zorn has some faults but has shown signs of improvement given some of the garbage he was given by the front office. I still don't know what coach in their right mind would think the Redskins and the current front office structure is a great opportunity. Schottenheimer made some pretty good comments yesterday about Cerrato and it probably isn't a stretch to say more NFL people respect Marty than Cerrato but at least Snyder likes Cerrato. Right? Because that relationship has worked out so well for us. Right? Ha.
There is no doubt Zorn got rooked. No doubt Zorn was not able to bring in everyone he wanted to help coach. However he was able to bring in a few coach's who could help him with the task. Not that that solves everything. Now having said that keep in mind that whatever he has tried to occomplish has failed here. You simply can't at the end of the season say as an owner "Oh I made a mistake so I'm going to allow Zorn to fire anyone he wants and bring in whoever he needs as coach's and try to get this thing right." That doesn't happen. No matter how much DS knows he did Zorn wrong, Zorn will be the scape goat in order to handle it right this time around or so DS can try to get one of the big names.

Plus I don't feel too sorry for Zorn. His play calling has sucked. His plays were bland. All that has been taken away from him and we look better. Our only problem right now is our 2 min. drill for which Zorn still has control. If he showed marked improvement in the 2 min. drill and Red Zone I would be more inclined to say maybe he should stay as a figure head and keep Sherm Lewis as OC and next year maybe with "consistancy" this team will progress, but I don't see it. Zorn has been a failed science project. It's time to move on.
SBXVII is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 10:49 AM   #727
Camp Scrub
 
pdr76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 5
Re: Our next coach??

I have a feeling that no matter who the coach is, we will be watching another new offense. In the 10 years, oh how I love the continuity we see from this junk:

Norv's sort of running/downfield attack (which is what I prefer)
Marty's smashmouth
Spurriers whatever he ran
Gibbs outdated running/downfield attack (including the Saunders time)
Zorn's west coast.

One would think a smart front office would try to maintain some semblance of rationality. I am not the first to say it but square pegs, round holes.
pdr76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 10:53 AM   #728
Registered User
 
SBXVII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 7,766
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paintrain View Post
Nice initial post, keep it up!! I thought Martz would have been perfect in '08 when we were searching but purely from a football standpoint. He would be calling virtually the same offense we'd been running under Saunders, had success with undersized WR in the past, could have made Portis into more of a threat in the screen/passing game and could have developed Campbell to his strengths. Also, he had a strong relationship with Fletcher on the defensive side so he'd have credibility with the defensive players. I'd wonder how his ego would work with Snyder and Cerrato but on the field it would have been a great fit.

At this point however, I don't think that's a good move. We'd be changing offenses AGAIN, our personnel isn't suited to his style and the front office structure is still broken.


To tell you the truth I think you have it backwards. I don't think the players have bought into this whole WCO scheme and are having trouble with the terminology. I think most are used to the Gibbs/Saunders terminology issue better and to be honest our whole OL is set up for that style of offense. For the WCO to work we need smaller faster more agile OL which we don't have. If we blow this thing up I can only hope that if the next HC comes in and is utilizing the WCO he realizes he needs to drastically pick up OL for this scheme to work. Shanahan will have his work cut out for him.
SBXVII is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 11:03 AM   #729
Camp Scrub
 
pdr76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 5
Re: Our next coach??

I don't think it is hard to argue that no matter what offense will be run next year, the entire offensive line needs to be addressed. Fear not though, Cerrato and Dan are working on our next QB but since this isn't a thread on a QB (and I think we have obvious more pressing needs) I will not add to that. My biggest fear is that Cerrato and Dan see some offensive improvement and feel just another guy away from winning. I laugh.
pdr76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 11:05 AM   #730
Playmaker
 
Paintrain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Age: 43
Posts: 4,878
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by SBXVII View Post
[/B]

To tell you the truth I think you have it backwards. I don't think the players have bought into this whole WCO scheme and are having trouble with the terminology. I think most are used to the Gibbs/Saunders terminology issue better and to be honest our whole OL is set up for that style of offense. For the WCO to work we need smaller faster more agile OL which we don't have. If we blow this thing up I can only hope that if the next HC comes in and is utilizing the WCO he realizes he needs to drastically pick up OL for this scheme to work. Shanahan will have his work cut out for him.
See if it's Shanahan I think the transition will be minimal. The offense he runs is also an offshoot of the Walsh WCO that Zorn & Lewis run via Holmgren. The players I'm concerned with are the WR group (Thomas, Kelly, Mitchell) and Davis because they've learned one offense and would have to reset after just starting to show they're getting comfortable. We're probably looking at a new QB, new RB and a new RT after this season so there will be some learning curve.

On our '10 projected (as I see it) OL there will only be two Gibbs/Saunders holdovers in Rabach and Dockery. Levi Jones came from Cincy and Mike Williams came from Buffalo. Unless we completely reset by letting them all go, there's not going to be a true WCO line for a couple of years.
__________________
FREE RG3!
Paintrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 11:13 AM   #731
Registered User
 
BigHairedAristocrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,917
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paintrain View Post
See if it's Shanahan I think the transition will be minimal. The offense he runs is also an offshoot of the Walsh WCO that Zorn & Lewis run via Holmgren. The players I'm concerned with are the WR group (Thomas, Kelly, Mitchell) and Davis because they've learned one offense and would have to reset after just starting to show they're getting comfortable. We're probably looking at a new QB, new RB and a new RT after this season so there will be some learning curve.

On our '10 projected (as I see it) OL there will only be two Gibbs/Saunders holdovers in Rabach and Dockery. Levi Jones came from Cincy and Mike Williams came from Buffalo. Unless we completely reset by letting them all go, there's not going to be a true WCO line for a couple of years.
Pain, i agree with everything you say there. Shanahan is not my first (or second, third, or forth) choice to be our next HC, but that is the main positive I see with him taking over. If we go with anything other than a WCO style offense, then all the progress we've seen our receivers (and even Campbell) have made over the past two years will be for nothing. With Shanahan, we have a high probabilty of being competetive sooner - although i think there's a "lower ceiling" with Shanahan than there would be if we just blew the whole thing up and started building from scratch.

And while the offense could greatly benefit from Shanahan, our defense would no doubt suffer. If we went with a smaller name HC, he would be more inclined to to keep our defense in tact. Shanahan's likely going to bring in entirely new coaching staffs on BOTH sides of the ball. Given the relative success of our defense, perhaps Shanahan could be convinced to just promote Jerry Gray to DC, but I wouldnt count on it.
BigHairedAristocrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2009, 12:43 PM   #732
Registered User
 
SBXVII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 7,766
Re: Our next coach??

Pain, I understand what your saying. I agree with you. At this point the best we could do is keep a WCO because of terminology and consistancy. I was just pointing out that if we are going to "blow" this thing all up then changing won't matter. Especially if our OL is going to consist of mostly new players.

Shanahan is not my first choice. but what does intrege me is what he had in Denver with the OL. I always thought they had the best blocking scheme. If Shanahan can bring that with him then I'm somewhat ok with the decision. It always seemed like they could run on anyone. Plus I think his WCO style is more of a down field scheme (passing) vs some of the others we have seen.
SBXVII is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2009, 05:49 AM   #733
Playmaker
 
skins89moss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,126
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by SBXVII View Post
Pain, I understand what your saying. I agree with you. At this point the best we could do is keep a WCO because of terminology and consistancy. I was just pointing out that if we are going to "blow" this thing all up then changing won't matter. Especially if our OL is going to consist of mostly new players.

Shanahan is not my first choice. but what does intrege me is what he had in Denver with the OL. I always thought they had the best blocking scheme. If Shanahan can bring that with him then I'm somewhat ok with the decision. It always seemed like they could run on anyone. Plus I think his WCO style is more of a down field scheme (passing) vs some of the others we have seen.
That was because of the O-line coach Alex Gibbs. I think he now coaches in Atlanta.
__________________
www.islandstyleflowers.com Home of the Hawaiian Foam FlowersRedskins Fan Since 1972
skins89moss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2009, 07:16 AM   #734
Gamebreaker
 
tryfuhl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Waldorf, MD
Age: 30
Posts: 12,514
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
I've gone back and forth on Zorn all year, but I'm starting to firm up my view. I think he needs to go.

Going back to the 2nd half of last year is record right now is 5-15. Chew on that for a minute.

The offense only showed improvement when Sherm Lewis was brought in and his playcalling duties were stripped. The guy has no real power or clout in the locker room, it's been pretty clear through his tenure here that Vinny is calling most of the shots and the players know that. Zorn wasn't even able to assemble his own staff.

I love that the team has played their hearts out these last few weeks, but I'm not so sure how much of that credit can really go to Zorn. The players know Zorn is on his way out. Guys are playing hard because they know it's evaluation time for the next staff that comes in, or they are trying to spice up the resume for another team.
I agree with this and have argued for it on the same points. However I did read that after meeting the staff Zorn wanted to keep them and not bring in his own guys, well other than stump and smith of course

No need to have a HC that can't be a HC
tryfuhl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2009, 10:33 AM   #735
Registered User
 
SBXVII's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 7,766
Re: Our next coach??

Quote:
Originally Posted by skins89moss View Post
That was because of the O-line coach Alex Gibbs. I think he now coaches in Atlanta.
Oh my god you scared the hell out of me. No he's not with Atlanta. He's actually with Houston who is looking to possibly blow their team up at the end of the season. I guess it would be a plus if we get Shanahan here he could bring his son in from Houston and possibly Alex Gibbs.
SBXVII is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site is not officially affiliated with the Washington Redskins or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.58030 seconds with 9 queries

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC5

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25