The Worst of Vinny

celts32 · 12-22-2009, 02:00 PM

It was easily the trade of a 2nd and a 6th for Jason Taylor. That was typical Snyderatto that summed up everything Vinny was all about.

2nd place for me would be the Malcom Kelly pick...after already picking 2 pass catchers you would think he could have used 1 of the #2 picks on a lineman even if they were not the next player on their board.

Frost · 12-22-2009, 02:04 PM

i think trading for brandon Lloyd was even worst than the jason taylor, in fact it was the worst move.

davy · 12-22-2009, 02:26 PM

I hate having to stand up for Vinny, but somebody has to.

Most of what people consider the worst recent moves fall squarely on the shoulders of Joe Gibbs.

LLoyd, Archuletta, El, Duckett, all arrived when he was calling the shots.

I loved Gibbs first time around but let's put the blame where it should be.

tryfuhl · 12-22-2009, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Re-read the original post

Oh whoops; I'd probably say Taylor, sure a lot of people agreed with it, but we're not GM's either. We were looking to replace a non-freelance spot with a guy who was known as a run stopper with a freelancing small pass rusher. After that I'd say the overdrafting of LBs, especially Glenn. I'd say that because we're likely to never see the guy start anywhere and we will with Kelly I believe.

rbanerjee23 · 12-22-2009, 02:28 PM

For me its a tossup between Adam Archuleta and Brandon Lloyd all in the same year

SmootSmack · 12-22-2009, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

In his 2 years as Executive Vice President, what do you think was Vinny's single worst player-roster move?

Try to be specific, not just "he didn't address the line"

Was it trading a 2nd and a 6th for Jason Taylor?

Was it drafting Malcolm Kelly after we had just drafted Devin Thomas and Fred Davis?

Was it not re-signing Marcus Washington?

Was it drafting a punter?

So just to recap here, Vinny's player-roster moves since January 2008 until November 2009. The time that he was EVP of the team. So I don't think Adam Archuleta really counts. or Brandon Lloyd...unless you think cutting Lloyd was Vinny's worst move as EVP

warpaint · 12-22-2009, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by over the mountain

overpaying for d hall. especially considering all the guaranteed money.

i think d hall's agent played vinny and got d hall top dollar by not accepting vinny's offers, waiting until FA began and used the interest of the patriots to scare vinny into caving in to d hall's contract demands.

with the d hall signing, i think vinny didnt hold his ground and got out maneuvered in negotiation tactics.

So what about Tampa barely breaking 80 mil to get Albert and they where the runners up in that whole Haynesworth sweepstakes. So what was that conversation like? I THINK MAYBE A LITTLE LIKE.....

DS: Well it looks like we can get him for 80 mil total.

VC: Why dont we go 92 mil thats the number he will wear.

DS: Thats more like it honey Oh Uh I mean Vinny

VC: Thanks I bet the press will just go crazy over this

DS: How about I one up you, do you remember member the amount of jerseys we sold when we made Adam Archuleta the highest payed safty in league history?

VC: I like were you are going with this Danny!

DS: Aha I've got it! 100million that would make him the highest payed Defenseive player in league history.

VC: Lets do it! You really are a Business Guru.

DS: You dont think he would talk to the press about the way we might possible miss use him? You remember Adam did.

VC: Never, just like the way I have an eye for evaluating coaching and player talent. My other eye is for evaluating personality why do you think they look like this.

DS: Alright.

VC: Besides what can go wrong. This year is a lock, I feel a Dynasty now you and I are running things.

DS: You are right now lets get DeANGELO'S agent on the line.

VC: Now this right here is going to be like taking candy from a baby!

over the mountain · 12-22-2009, 02:34 PM

davy - yeah i gotta agree with you there. i remember the year before we signed lloyd and ARE our passing game lacked any vertical movement which was they most glaring complaint and need for the team at the time. gibbs had brought in stop-gap guys like reche caldwell and irving friar b/c we had noone so the next year we signed lloyd and ARE. (am i right on irving friar that year or was that earlier?)

but i guess the decision to tear up lloyds contract with 1 year remaining and giving him a new lucatrive one before you even saw him in burgundy and gold was on vinny. why not let him audition for a year then asses his contract value? of course im taking an educated guess that vinny was the one in control of lloyds contract decision.

warpaint - it has been rumored the giants offered more than the skins, somthing like 103 to 108 mil. i personally like how the AH contract is set up assuming next year is uncapped and 20+ mil of the guaranteed money he is set to get next year actually gets done and off the books going forward after next year.

birdz4gibbs · 12-22-2009, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maroonandblack30

1. Cutting/getting rid of Bmitch (might have been a Dan move)
2. Not resiging Ryan Clark and replacing him with Archuleta
3. Not Resigning Pierce
4. Trading at 3rd rounder for TJ Ducket
5. Trading 2 picks for Jason Taylor

and the list goes on for me so the only thing i would add to that is
we need to do just the opposite trade a few of what we have for picks so
we can begin the process and do it the right way.

cousin vinny did a awesome job didn,t he,lol

Longtimefan · 12-22-2009, 02:37 PM

IMO to find the very worst of Vinny I have to go back prior to the last two yrs. Within that two yr. framework for me clearly his worst move was the JT trade. What was worse than the trade itself was the reason he gave for making it.

Schneed10 · 12-22-2009, 02:40 PM

I think it was the Jason Taylor move. It showed how little understanding Vinny had of Blache's scheme. At the time Blache was running a scheme where DEs weren't set free to rush the passer, they defended the run first and foremost. That was Taylor's huge weakness in his game.

That trade was as if Vinny didn't have the slightest inkling of how Blache runs things.

tryfuhl · 12-22-2009, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warpaint

DS: You dont think he would talk to the press about the way we might possible miss use him? You remember Adam did.

heh

Hey, hey, hey — Albert has something to say*|*Warpath Confidential

Quote:

“It’s very frustrating coming from Tennessee, going 10-0 [where] I kinda had the freedom to rush and get upfield and to pressure the quarterback,” said Haynesworth at his locker after the Giants loss. “It’s totally different than what I thought here. If they’d let us loose, it’d be a whole lot better. [At Tennessee] I just rushed and they let me go and we won a bunch of games and we was up there in the top two or three on defense and sacks. Maybe we need to try that here.”

Maybe they need to try a lot of things here, he said.

“I don’t think this team is that bad,” Haynesworth said. “Players ain’t that bad. The score, the record say that we’re horrible, but I’ve been around these guys a lot. I think they know how to play football. I just think we’re all going in different directions and we need somebody to lead us in the right direction. You can take that however you want to.”

birdz4gibbs · 12-22-2009, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davy

I hate having to stand up for Vinny, but somebody has to.

Most of what people consider the worst recent moves fall squarely on the shoulders of Joe Gibbs.

LLoyd, Archuletta, El, Duckett, all arrived when he was calling the shots.

I loved Gibbs first time around but let's put the blame where it should be.

they all should be accountable to me. gibbs 2.0 would have had something going for it if we hired bruce allen then instead of vinny but they all should be held accountable.. i love gibbs the first time around and for the second coming it didn,t workout but the effort was there and it wasn,t there after he left again but your right.
we must move on from here with bruce allen and whoever he brings in as coach..maybe then they will trade a few to get back some draft picks cause we need them now.

warpaint · 12-22-2009, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by over the mountain

warpaint - it has been rumored the giants offered more than the skins, somthing like 103 to 108 mil. i personally like how the AH contract is set up assuming next year is uncapped and 20+ mil of the guaranteed money he is set to get next year actually gets done and off the books going forward after next year.

What would his contract look like after next year uncapped.So if I got this right next year if it is uncapped we can pay the majority of any undesirable contracts with out penalty and renegotate.

What i mean is next year we owe a guy like 75 million and he has 5 years left. We can pay 70 mil next year and split the remainder equally with out penalty or am I way off.

Could you explain.

Defensewins · 12-22-2009, 03:03 PM

Talent Evaluation
Plain and simple what has been our biggest failure is our inability to fill our roster enough with quality players. From our QB to our last Special Team player, finding a quality of player at each slot.
I know Smootsmack is looking for a particular player decision or two.
But IMO what really sunk our team is talent evaluation and how that caused the lack of number(s) on our roster.
We usually did fine with high 1st round picks but we failed everywhere else and in FA.
A real good measure is looking at what undrafted rookie players we have been able to unearth over the years. Those undrafted steals that can fill out your roster and can become a Joe Jacoby. Our Joe Jacoby was Stephen Heyer.

12-22-2009, 02:00 PM	#31
celts32 Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Hackettstown NJ Age: 43 Posts: 2,656	Re: The Worst of Vinny It was easily the trade of a 2nd and a 6th for Jason Taylor. That was typical Snyderatto that summed up everything Vinny was all about. 2nd place for me would be the Malcom Kelly pick...after already picking 2 pass catchers you would think he could have used 1 of the #2 picks on a lineman even if they were not the next player on their board. __________________ Section 115 Row 23 “Goal line, goal line. I-left, tight wing, 70 chip on white.” http://victorybeer.com/

12-22-2009, 02:04 PM	#32
Frost Special Teams Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Burke, VA Age: 31 Posts: 270	Re: The Worst of Vinny i think trading for brandon Lloyd was even worst than the jason taylor, in fact it was the worst move. __________________ "He can run like Jerry Rice and hit like Night Train Lane" 21

12-22-2009, 02:26 PM	#33
davy Impact Rookie Join Date: May 2004 Location: England Posts: 691	Re: The Worst of Vinny I hate having to stand up for Vinny, but somebody has to. Most of what people consider the worst recent moves fall squarely on the shoulders of Joe Gibbs. LLoyd, Archuletta, El, Duckett, all arrived when he was calling the shots. I loved Gibbs first time around but let's put the blame where it should be. __________________ “Don't ask me what I think of you, I might not give the answer that you want me to.”

12-22-2009, 02:28 PM	#35
rbanerjee23 The Starter Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 2,341	Re: The Worst of Vinny For me its a tossup between Adam Archuleta and Brandon Lloyd all in the same year __________________ "Tough times don't last but tough people do" -Mike Shanahan HTTR

12-22-2009, 02:34 PM	#38
over the mountain Playmaker Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: baltimore Posts: 3,195	Re: The Worst of Vinny davy - yeah i gotta agree with you there. i remember the year before we signed lloyd and ARE our passing game lacked any vertical movement which was they most glaring complaint and need for the team at the time. gibbs had brought in stop-gap guys like reche caldwell and irving friar b/c we had noone so the next year we signed lloyd and ARE. (am i right on irving friar that year or was that earlier?) but i guess the decision to tear up lloyds contract with 1 year remaining and giving him a new lucatrive one before you even saw him in burgundy and gold was on vinny. why not let him audition for a year then asses his contract value? of course im taking an educated guess that vinny was the one in control of lloyds contract decision. warpaint - it has been rumored the giants offered more than the skins, somthing like 103 to 108 mil. i personally like how the AH contract is set up assuming next year is uncapped and 20+ mil of the guaranteed money he is set to get next year actually gets done and off the books going forward after next year.

12-22-2009, 02:37 PM	#40
Longtimefan Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Germantown, Md. Posts: 4,832	Re: The Worst of Vinny IMO to find the very worst of Vinny I have to go back prior to the last two yrs. Within that two yr. framework for me clearly his worst move was the JT trade. What was worse than the trade itself was the reason he gave for making it.

12-22-2009, 02:40 PM	#41
Schneed10 RG Glee Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Newtown Square, PA Age: 34 Posts: 8,279	Re: The Worst of Vinny I think it was the Jason Taylor move. It showed how little understanding Vinny had of Blache's scheme. At the time Blache was running a scheme where DEs weren't set free to rush the passer, they defended the run first and foremost. That was Taylor's huge weakness in his game. That trade was as if Vinny didn't have the slightest inkling of how Blache runs things. __________________ Redskins Salary Cap Status \| CrazyCanuck's Cap Figures by Player \| Salary Cap 101

12-22-2009, 03:03 PM	#45
Defensewins Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 2,839	Re: The Worst of Vinny Talent Evaluation Plain and simple what has been our biggest failure is our inability to fill our roster enough with quality players. From our QB to our last Special Team player, finding a quality of player at each slot. I know Smootsmack is looking for a particular player decision or two. But IMO what really sunk our team is talent evaluation and how that caused the lack of number(s) on our roster. We usually did fine with high 1st round picks but we failed everywhere else and in FA. A real good measure is looking at what undrafted rookie players we have been able to unearth over the years. Those undrafted steals that can fill out your roster and can become a Joe Jacoby. Our Joe Jacoby was Stephen Heyer.

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The Worst of Vinny

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