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Different Season, Same Trap

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Old 04-12-2010, 01:33 PM   #106
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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Originally Posted by Skinny Tee View Post
What I am more speaking about is fundamentals in scheme and not language of the WCO. The eagles offense relied heavily on short passes to a shifty RB coming out of the backfield. What he won't have here is the same offensive objectives of the short passes to pass catching RB's.

Brian Westbrook's Receptions vs. Clinton Portis's Receptions

2004 - 73 --------------------------> 2004 - 40
2005 - 61 --------------------------> 2005 - 30
2006 - 77 --------------------------> 2006 - 17* (8 games)
2007 - 90 --------------------------> 2007 - 47
2008 - 54 --------------------------> 2008 - 28

Shanahan's RB Receptions

2004 - Droughns & Griffin ----> 42
2005 - Bell & Anderson ------> 36
2006 - T. Bell & M. Bell ------> 44
2007 - Young & Sapp(FB) ---> 49
2008 - Hillis & Bell & Pittman -> 34


Doesn't matter what language you use, McNabb is adapting to a different focus in Shanahan's system. He's a veteran who will be equipped to do so, that's why Shanny wants him, but nevertheless he'll be dealing with a learning curve come time for training camp.
Often in Phillies offense the wanted to get the recievers vertical to utilize DM's arm. In many cases that took all but the backs out of the play resulting in them getting more balls than most. At the same time it substituted for the running game. The WCO is the WCO is the WCO. It is the same thing it will just be used a little differently.
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Old 04-12-2010, 01:39 PM   #107
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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Often in Phillies offense the wanted to get the recievers vertical to utilize DM's arm. In many cases that took all but the backs out of the play resulting in them getting more balls than most. At the same time it substituted for the running game. The WCO is the WCO is the WCO. It is the same thing it will just be used a little differently.
So Jim Zorn's is like Andy Reid's is like Mike Shanahan's?
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Old 04-12-2010, 01:50 PM   #108
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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So Jim Zorn's is like Andy Reid's is like Mike Shanahan's?
Considering that the playbook itself consists of the plays and how the play is described in words, they will probably have some overlap and most of the terminology will not be different, hence why I used a language analogy. Once the language is learned, learning new plays is not difficult at all since a word equates to something on the picture, such as a color represents a certain formation.

West Coast offense - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
At the bottom in the links section are multiple examples of WCO playbooks from years past.

Zorn being a lousy playcaller simply means that he doesn't understand how to pick the right ones from the book or choose an appropriate order to call the plays in. The plays themselves may be just fine, but when the plays are called and how well they are disguised are also factors contributing to the plays success. And the talent on the team matters too, as a mediocre QB and crappy o-line are bound to be less awesome at running the plays than a team that is better at both or either position.

Zorn was using what Holmgren was using in Seattle when he first came here.
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Old 04-12-2010, 01:53 PM   #109
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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So Jim Zorn's is like Andy Reid's is like Mike Shanahan's?
In general, that is not to say that there aren't slight variances. At their core they are all the same system with the same base principles. The WCO is just deployed differently by differnent teams based on player abilities.

Andy Reid had McNabb so he focused on the vertical passing aspect. Mike Shannahan had Terrell Davis, Clinton Portis and a host of other backs and liked to focus on the Zone running game. Zorn had one offensive lineman so he focused on running left and the 3 step sack.

When you break it down a QB of all 3 systems can tell you pretty much what "FB West Right Slot 372 'Y' Stick” means.
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Old 04-12-2010, 01:59 PM   #110
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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"FB West Right Slot 372 'Y' Stick” means.]
And BREAK!
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:24 PM   #111
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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When you break it down a QB of all 3 systems can tell you pretty much what "FB West Right Slot 372 'Y' Stick” means.
So what that means is that if you are on FaceBook while driving West, take the next Right, and park on the 3rd level #72, then take the girl and play "baseball". Am I close?
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:45 PM   #112
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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So what that means is that if you are on FaceBook while driving West, take the next Right, and park on the 3rd level #72, then take the girl and play "baseball". Am I close?
No, but then again you don't speak WCO, here, this might help.

http://www.centuryinter.net/midway/c...tcoast/wco.pdf
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:47 PM   #113
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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In general, that is not to say that there aren't slight variances. At their core they are all the same system with the same base principles. The WCO is just deployed differently by differnent teams based on player abilities.

Andy Reid had McNabb so he focused on the vertical passing aspect. Mike Shannahan had Terrell Davis, Clinton Portis and a host of other backs and liked to focus on the Zone running game. Zorn had one offensive lineman so he focused on running left and the 3 step sack.

When you break it down a QB of all 3 systems can tell you pretty much what "FB West Right Slot 372 'Y' Stick” means.
Lol.

Like I said McNabb can understand the language all he wants but playing with different personnel means that our focus will be different than what it was in philly.

Right now he has the same line Zorn had last year, sans Chris Samuels. Going downfield probably won't work too well with our line. And running a Zone Blocking scheme necessitates actual blockers.

As of now I can't tell you what our strong suit is that McNabb would have to adapt to. Whatever it is though he'll need time to get acclimated to it.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:06 PM   #114
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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I was going to say something similar. It's still the WCO, just a slightly different version that focuses on the running game. The verbage is only slightly different like if an American and an Englishman were to engage in a conversation. There might be a couple of words that mean something else, but for the most part they would understand each other.

Example: If an Englishman said that he wanted to blow a fag, the American might be taken back by that statement. Later the American will learn that blowing a fag is slang for smoking a cigarette...McNabb will be fine.

Well said. McNabb is no dumby he'll be fine.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:45 PM   #115
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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Well said. McNabb is no dumby he'll be fine.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:55 PM   #116
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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Lol.

Like I said McNabb can understand the language all he wants but playing with different personnel means that our focus will be different than what it was in philly.

Right now he has the same line Zorn had last year, sans Chris Samuels. Going downfield probably won't work too well with our line. And running a Zone Blocking scheme necessitates actual blockers.

As of now I can't tell you what our strong suit is that McNabb would have to adapt to. Whatever it is though he'll need time to get acclimated to it.
its not like the oline is gonna be the same when we play our first game. shanny and allen will probly pick up 2 or 3 possible staters in the draft
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Old 04-12-2010, 04:00 PM   #117
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

Quote:
Originally Posted by Angry
When you break it down a QB of all 3 systems can tell you pretty much what "FB West Right Slot 372 'Y' Stick” means.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
So what that means is that if you are on FaceBook while driving West, take the next Right, and park on the 3rd level #72, then take the girl and play "baseball". Am I close?


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Old 04-12-2010, 04:36 PM   #118
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
So what that means is that if you are on FaceBook while driving West, take the next Right, and park on the 3rd level #72, then take the girl and play "baseball". Am I close?
So you think you've cracked the West Coast Offense huh? Alright well translate this play call

Spread Right Eagle Right 2-Jet E Drive Z Post Alert Black 200 Jet Smoke
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Old 04-12-2010, 04:57 PM   #119
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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Originally Posted by Dirtbag359 View Post
So you think you've cracked the West Coast Offense huh? Alright well translate this play call

Spread Right Eagle Right 2-Jet E Drive Z Post Alert Black 200 Jet Smoke
Now definitely advanced, with misdirection, but here goes my best guess:



Black 200 = 2am
2 EZ Spread eagle smoke = 2 easy women(hookers) smoking
Jet and Double Rights = Fast to the Double R inn.

but of course the misdirection comes in the Jet, Post Alert which says they are cops.

Put it all together and you get:
At 2am, the 2 easy women smoking are looking to go fast to the Double R for some action but they are actually cops so get out of there fast.
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Old 04-12-2010, 07:24 PM   #120
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Re: Different Season, Same Trap

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its not like the oline is gonna be the same when we play our first game. shanny and allen will probly pick up 2 or 3 possible staters in the draft
The line will be better but has any team ever had 3 rookie starters on the Line? Especially when they didn't have a 2nd or 3rd rounder? We may pick up some extra picks but if not we're talking a 1st and a 4th rounder at minimum starting? Doubt that.
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