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Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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View Poll Results: Should the Redskins trade for Vincent Jackson?
Yes, but only if the price is right 103 74.64%
Yes, even if it means multiple high round picks 1 0.72%
No 34 24.64%
Voters: 138. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-30-2010, 10:55 AM   #61
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by Mattyk View Post
Perhaps the price was too high for Shanahan's liking with Marshall?

VJ is a heck of a WR, I'm not sure the drop off is very significant. He's led the league in avg YPC the past couple of seasons.
I don't put Jackson in the same category as Marshall. I think Miami gave Denver a 2nd rounder which IMO is a steal for Miami. I'm not giving up a 2nd rounder for Jackson. It's just too risky. 3rd rounder and Kelly then I'd make the deal.
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Old 06-30-2010, 10:56 AM   #62
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by 44Deezel View Post
Are they going to block and rush the QB? WRs are irrelevant. Brady won 3 SBs with a bunch of scrubs and the Steelers didn't have any all-world talent at WR when they won theirs recently and Brees could have won last year with our bum WRs. Yawn.
We've massively upgraded and reinforced the O-line also. Calm down, Debbie.
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Old 06-30-2010, 10:57 AM   #63
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

WRs are irrelevant? I wouldn't go that far.

The Steelers didn't exactly have scrubs in Hines Ward and Santonio Holmes.

The Saints have a great group of WRs.

The Patriots might have had some no-names but a guy like Troy Brown was very solid and underrated.
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Old 06-30-2010, 11:07 AM   #64
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by 44Deezel View Post
Are they going to block and rush the QB? WRs are irrelevant. Brady won 3 SBs with a bunch of scrubs and the Steelers didn't have any all-world talent at WR when they won theirs recently and Brees could have won last year with our bum WRs. Yawn.
I would say there is some truth to this theory. If you've got a great QB then you can win w/out stud wr's.
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Old 06-30-2010, 11:31 AM   #65
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

I wouldnt give Jackson top 5 WR money, I wouldnt consider him "elite." If we give up a 1st or 2nd and then sign him to crazy money...I would consider that the first possible major mistake of the Allen/Shanny era...
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Old 06-30-2010, 11:34 AM   #66
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

Why not TO and keep the draft picks to use on a legit young WR hand picked by shannynext year.

Also any news on bryant westbrook?
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:03 PM   #67
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

Jackson is probably the one acquisition in the NFL that could take us from borderline playoff contender to borderline super bowl contender.

He's not young for his experience level, necessarily, but he's just a 5th year player who is 27 years old. That gives him 2 or 3 more years as an elite, top five, NFL wide receiver, which means he's worth a first round pick plus in compensation.

If the Redskins are going to acquire him, however, they'll need to get really creative, because we can't afford to give up our first and our second rounder to get this guy. Haynesworth probably isn't worth much value to San Diego, but other players on our roster very well might be.

I'd try to send over a 2012 first rounder, and a couple of players, perhaps Chris Horton and Santana Moss, or Carlos Rogers and Devin Thomas. That might get it done, if only because Jackson is in such heavy contract limbo, and could be a UFA next year if the CBA allows for it.

Word of caution is that AJ Smith might be the one NFL GM who is willing to let a valuable player sit out rather than overpay him. In the future, more GMs will play hardass with their players, but Smith, I think, is going to get run out of town for being a little ahead of his time.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:07 PM   #68
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by 44Deezel View Post
Are they going to block and rush the QB? WRs are irrelevant. Brady won 3 SBs with a bunch of scrubs and the Steelers didn't have any all-world talent at WR when they won theirs recently and Brees could have won last year with our bum WRs. Yawn.
Obviously, the big defensive "momentum swings" happen around the line of scrimmage and not down the field, which means that you can play defense/ball control without any meaningful downfield help and win a bunch of games doing so. In which case, you can probably get away without an elite quarterback as well.

With regard to quarterbacks, the biggest difference in expected return is between the worst five starting quarterbacks and the next five. Kyle Orton is worth a lot more yards/wins over the course of a season to Derek Anderson than Tom Brady is worth over Carson Palmer. It's just the nature of the game.

Receivers are kind of the opposite. Vincent Jackson is worth a LOT more than someone like Chad Ochocinco in terms of points scored. But if you can have TJ Houshmadzadeh or you can have, uh, Nate Burleson, then no, the difference between those players probably doesn't have an effect on points/wins.

If you're going to outscore teams on the other hand, you're going to have to find someone to do the scoring.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:24 PM   #69
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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I don't put Jackson in the same category as Marshall. I think Miami gave Denver a 2nd rounder which IMO is a steal for Miami. I'm not giving up a 2nd rounder for Jackson. It's just too risky. 3rd rounder and Kelly then I'd make the deal.
Jackson averages 5 yards more per catch than Brandon Marshall and catches a higher percentage of passes thrown to him. Both in 2009 and over their careers.

I think Rivers is better than Cutler/Orton, of course, but not THAT much better. It's not even close.
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:40 PM   #70
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by 44Deezel View Post
Are they going to block and rush the QB? WRs are irrelevant. Brady won 3 SBs with a bunch of scrubs and the Steelers didn't have any all-world talent at WR when they won theirs recently and Brees could have won last year with our bum WRs. Yawn.
When I read what 'skinsfaninok' read about Jackson, Thomas, Moss, Cooley and Davis making us SB contenders, I figured he was being sarcastic.

As you mentioned, I think WRs are probably one of the least worrisome problems on a SB team. You only really need an above average corp. to be super successful so I don't think we are Vincent Jackson away from being SB contenders.

I say we stick with our group - see whether the improved O-line and QB upgrade brings out any servicable production.

Save the picks -- we still have a lot of needs:
1. Offensive Line: Rabach is getting old, Hicks is a journeyman, BMW is not a long-term answer.
2. QB: McNabb is only good for what 2, maybe 3 more years? We need to draft a QB and have him sit for a few years. The ideal scenario would be a Favre-Rodgers scenario. Say what you want but Favre constantly coming back was a boon for Rodgers who got to sit and learn for a few years and is now lighting up the league. Way better than the Alex Smith situation...
3. LB: Fletcher is incredible, can't say enough about him but we need to inject some youth behind the defensive line. Most of our LBs (with the exception of Orakpo, Carter, and Wilson) are only OK

And you can never have too much talent all over the field so good draft picks for corners, tailbacks etc. can only be good for our team
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Old 06-30-2010, 12:59 PM   #71
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by 44Deezel View Post
Are they going to block and rush the QB? WRs are irrelevant. Brady won 3 SBs with a bunch of scrubs and the Steelers didn't have any all-world talent at WR when they won theirs recently and Brees could have won last year with our bum WRs. Yawn.
Great post! I wish Snyder and Cerrato had figured this out 10 years ago.
We should NOT give up any draft picks for any players this year. As someone else stated, we are not one player away from winning a SB, so do not mortgage the future.
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Old 06-30-2010, 01:03 PM   #72
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

I'd get him if the price is a 2nd rounder plus some late round pick (5th/6th/7th).
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Old 06-30-2010, 01:05 PM   #73
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

Anyone else getting the feeling that McNabb's window of time left before he starts to noticeably decline (2-3 years) is the window allen and shanny want to win a SB?

Just seems like we are in a win now or next year mode.

top 10 defense? check
Getting a franchise qb? check
Getting a LT and RT? check
Getting a true no. 1 receiver to reap the benefits of having a franchise qb and competent O line? TBD.
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Old 06-30-2010, 01:10 PM   #74
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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Originally Posted by GTripp0012 View Post
Jackson is probably the one acquisition in the NFL that could take us from borderline playoff contender to borderline super bowl contender.

He's not young for his experience level, necessarily, but he's just a 5th year player who is 27 years old. That gives him 2 or 3 more years as an elite, top five, NFL wide receiver, which means he's worth a first round pick plus in compensation.


If the Redskins are going to acquire him, however, they'll need to get really creative, because we can't afford to give up our first and our second rounder to get this guy. Haynesworth probably isn't worth much value to San Diego, but other players on our roster very well might be.

I'd try to send over a 2012 first rounder, and a couple of players, perhaps Chris Horton and Santana Moss, or Carlos Rogers and Devin Thomas. That might get it done, if only because Jackson is in such heavy contract limbo, and could be a UFA next year if the CBA allows for it.

Word of caution is that AJ Smith might be the one NFL GM who is willing to let a valuable player sit out rather than overpay him. In the future, more GMs will play hardass with their players, but Smith, I think, is going to get run out of town for being a little ahead of his time.

I disagree that he's a top 5 WR (although physically I think he's probably a top 2 or 3 WR). He was 30th in the league in catches last year and has never topped the 70 catch mark. I think his best seasons are probably still in front of him though (depending on where he's playing). Brandon Marshall is a year younger and already has 3 100+ catch, 1100+ yard seasons in lesser offenses with lesser QBs than VJ. IMO Jackson's avg yards/catch still doesn't trump those numbers.

Plus there's the whole looming suspension thing.
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Old 06-30-2010, 01:13 PM   #75
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Re: Report: Redskins are pursuing Vincent Jackson

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I'd get him if the price is a 2nd rounder plus some late round pick (5th/6th/7th).
IMO that should be the price range. Miami gave up two second rounders for Brandon Marshall who is younger and statistically pretty dominant over VJ. No way we should give more than Miami did.
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