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Ongoing CBA discussions

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View Poll Results: Who do you blame for the CBA mess?
Owners 24 26.67%
Players 24 26.67%
Both 42 46.67%
Voters: 90. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-10-2011, 11:31 AM   #61
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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Originally Posted by Mattyk View Post
These things always go down to the final hour, I'm still holding out hope for a last minute deal to avoid a lockout.
NFL, union meet for 2-hour bargaining session - MyNorthwest.com
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Old 02-10-2011, 11:42 AM   #62
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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I am sure the Redskin's lack of success in the past century has fueled this feeling of "work" as well for me.
You guys are like me. I am 30 year Redskins fan, and most Decembers, it is like work watching this team. Geez!
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Old 02-10-2011, 11:54 AM   #63
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

why is 50-50 too much for the owners?
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Old 02-10-2011, 11:56 AM   #64
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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Originally Posted by diehardskin2982 View Post
why is 50-50 too much for the owners?
I would imagine the players would say because there are 32 ownership groups, and thousands of current and retired players.
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Old 02-10-2011, 12:58 PM   #65
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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I'm not missing that point at all, but at the end of the year do you want to see your team's starter (whoever that is in our case) or 3rd string qb? Increasing the roster size is essentially an admission that there will be more guys on IR or the PUP list.

I don't follow hockey, but it doesn't seem to have the extreme collision hits the nfl does, or the dangerous piling on leg injuries. Two more games is a big deal. As it is 16 games is too much. Before that the season was 14, before that 12, before that 10.

It's not just about injuries though, the NHL, NBA & major league baseball all have created a regular season product that even devoted fans can't or don't pay much attention to. The NFL IMO is pushing the limits on the demand for their product. There are already several 'meaningless' games at the end of the year, a longer schedule would increase that. And just like a preseason game, someone big like Brady or Manning, will get hurt in game 17 or 18 when their team has little to no mathematical chances of improving their playoff position.
1st point: Duely noted. But it doesn't mean it's a given players will get hurt. It just means teams will have more roster spots to keep back ups. Right now teams have to decide what position is more important to them and use those spots. Not to mention the 8 PS spots. If the league allowed 10 more active spots or 15 the teams could have more players to pick from if injuries occur.

2nd point: The meaningless games at the begining are usually set up to get starters in playing shape and evaluate prospects. The way I look at it... you either in the play offs which you can go back to starting a lot of rookies to give them playing time or your completely out which again give you the opportunity to play the rookies. The only teams to worry would be the teams who are on the bubble and are fighting to stay or get into the play offs.

I just don't see how 2 more games is going to make a huge difference with the players. Either they are healthy or they are not. If they are worried about injuries in game 17 or 18 then they should be worried about injuries in game 2 or 3 also. Maybe there should only be one game for each team and the winners move on to the playoffs. Then the SB. It all could be finished by Oct.
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Old 02-10-2011, 01:02 PM   #66
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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Originally Posted by diehardskin2982 View Post
why is 50-50 too much for the owners?
Owners say that such a ratio does not offer them the resources to invest in and grow the game, thus growing the financial pie that both owners and players draw from.

However, a cynic might say that the 50-50 ratio does not match up with owners' greed.
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Old 02-10-2011, 01:06 PM   #67
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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why is 50-50 too much for the owners?
This is what I don't get. Why not just split the money between owners and players 50/50. Instead the players have a 60/40 split. 50% can go to players salaries, the other 50% the owner can use however he likes... stadium, equipement, coach's, front office, whatever.
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Old 02-10-2011, 01:16 PM   #68
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

[QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;783768]I would imagine the players would say because there are 32 ownership groups, and thousands of current and retired players.[/QUOTE]

I maybe missing the point, but honestly, I could care less about the retired players. They chose that path. and... although the NFL nor the NFLPA has developed any type of retirement fund, I feel the players themselves had every opportunity to take a portion of their earnings and put it into an IRA or something. Instead they pissed it away. I just don't see how that should be placed on the owners and they be forced to solve the problem. How about the NFLPA step up and create a retirement fund and have the players give a % of their income to be put into a retirement fund for the future... kinda like the social security dept.

I also have felt that the insurance issue is BS also. Let the NFLPA act like any other corporation and find a decent HMO for all the players and again let the players pay for their own insurance and their families if they chose the family package. The more players that take the deal the lower the monthly costs.

Lastly, I'm not trying to sound one sided but all in all if the players are unhappy they can always take their talents to the CFL, UFL, or where ever. Fans will follow them just to see them. The owners have more invested and more to worry about in regards to this very thing happening.
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Old 02-10-2011, 01:20 PM   #69
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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Originally Posted by SBXVII View Post
1st point: Duely noted. But it doesn't mean it's a given players will get hurt. It just means teams will have more roster spots to keep back ups. Right now teams have to decide what position is more important to them and use those spots. Not to mention the 8 PS spots. If the league allowed 10 more active spots or 15 the teams could have more players to pick from if injuries occur.

2nd point: The meaningless games at the begining are usually set up to get starters in playing shape and evaluate prospects. The way I look at it... you either in the play offs which you can go back to starting a lot of rookies to give them playing time or your completely out which again give you the opportunity to play the rookies. The only teams to worry would be the teams who are on the bubble and are fighting to stay or get into the play offs.

I just don't see how 2 more games is going to make a huge difference with the players. Either they are healthy or they are not. If they are worried about injuries in game 17 or 18 then they should be worried about injuries in game 2 or 3 also. Maybe there should only be one game for each team and the winners move on to the playoffs. Then the SB. It all could be finished by Oct.
You assume players are "healthy or they are not." It's not just about what guys are inactive or out for the year. Every week guys are playing w/various ailments & are often not 100%. You seem to think that it's all or nothing, when players deal w/nagging injuries that only get worse the more they play. Often players delay surgery till after the season because they'd miss games otherwise.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:03 PM   #70
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
I would imagine the players would say because there are 32 ownership groups, and thousands of current and retired players.
I maybe missing the point, but honestly, I could care less about the retired players. They chose that path. and... although the NFL nor the NFLPA has developed any type of retirement fund, I feel the players themselves had every opportunity to take a portion of their earnings and put it into an IRA or something. Instead they pissed it away. I just don't see how that should be placed on the owners and they be forced to solve the problem. How about the NFLPA step up and create a retirement fund and have the players give a % of their income to be put into a retirement fund for the future... kinda like the social security dept.

I also have felt that the insurance issue is BS also. Let the NFLPA act like any other corporation and find a decent HMO for all the players and again let the players pay for their own insurance and their families if they chose the family package. The more players that take the deal the lower the monthly costs.

Lastly, I'm not trying to sound one sided but all in all if the players are unhappy they can always take their talents to the CFL, UFL, or where ever. Fans will follow them just to see them. The owners have more invested and more to worry about in regards to this very thing happening.
Well the NFLPA represents current players, retired players (atleast that's my understanding).

As for the NFLPA acting like a corporation, it is not, it is a Union, the NFL is the "corporation"- type entity, so your argument actually tends to back the players point

in the end I maintain both sides just need to set aside pettiness and "man up" at the negotiating table.
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Old 02-10-2011, 04:51 PM   #71
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

Report: CBA talks broke down after union proposed 50-50 split | ProFootballTalk
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Old 02-10-2011, 07:18 PM   #72
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The NFLPA suggested 50-50 split of ALL revenue intead of the 60 percent of "TOTAL FOOTBALLL REVENUE". The difference goes back to the nfl opening their books, which just isn't going to happen. The net difference in dollar values isn't that much but pat kirwan was very clear that we can't know exactly what the difference is because the books aren't open.

Again just bargaining points on each side
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Old 02-10-2011, 07:57 PM   #73
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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Honestly 16 weeks plus playoffs is enough for me. I am pretty much NFL burned out by this time of the year. By week 14 or so it starts feeling like your Sunday afternoon part time job. Maybe I am just at a stage in life where I have better things to do then waste 4 hours on a Sunday afternoon watching football, doesn't mean I am not a fan just means I have different priorities now.
This is exactly right. The difference between NFL and the other two sports leagues (NBA and MLB) is the NFL accidently stumbled upon the less is more reality. It is dumb luck that the NFL leaves their fans wanting more. The NBA and MLB are a joke and losing tons of money. Empty seats is a real problem for most but not all NBA and MLB teams. Nobody cares about game 1 in a 80 or 100+ game season.
The NFL owners are greedy and dumb. Why do they mess with a good thing?
I am starting to not like the NFL commissioner either, because it seems increasing the season is his baby. Boooooo
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Old 02-10-2011, 11:32 PM   #74
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

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No offense to Tucker or to Dan Steinberg here, but this was the point where I got off the wagon:

"Tucker then chimed in, thanking Gibbs for his comments on Snyder and saying that other owners around the league let the bottom line cloud their football decisions, unlike Snyder."
Dan Snyder is not focused on the bottom line? He has not let the bottom line cloud his decisions in the last decade?


Please...


Danny Boy - - as an NFL onwer - - is driven by his ego and his desire to make money hand over fist. Denying that makes everything else one might say of questionable validity...
Not hijacking the thread, but a link to that Washington Post article about Gibbs and the CBA was also an insert in this article.

Someone has something good to say about Dan Snyder | Rich Tandler's Real Redskins
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Last edited by Longtimefan; 02-11-2011 at 09:10 AM.
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Old 02-14-2011, 02:31 PM   #75
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Re: Ongoing CBA discussions

Good read on the differences on the NFLPA and NFL owners current rookie salary scale proposals by Andrew Brandt.

The Rookie Sacrifice: NFL, NFLPA proposals unveiled | National Football Post
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