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Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Old 02-02-2011, 11:31 PM   #91
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

Wow, take a moment to read Donovan's letter to the Washington City Paper ownership. Snyder and company really think it's them vs. the world. These guys are so out of touch with reality and so far up their own rears to realize they are only propagating more negative perception, spin, articles, opinion etc. by sending that letter. They are creating the exact thing they think they are preventing by a potential lawsuit.

It is so ironic it is sad.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:33 PM   #92
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon View Post
I am not a lawyer and I never played one on TV. So, I defer to others with legal competencies here.

I also defer to SmootSmack as a person closely involved in sports journalism when it comes to the concepts of libel/slander/defamation.

With those disclaimers, the saga unfolding here will change dramatically the instant Dan Snyder sues City Paper and/or the author for libel/slander/defamation. Because the instant he does that, the argument changes entirely from the tone of the disucussion ongoing here.

In court, it will have nothing to do with whether or not Danny Boy has changed his ways or has stepped back from football operations or his good intentions for the team and the fans. It will have to do with the legal standards for libel/slander/defamation. And here are two things that are involved in those legal standards:
1. Truth is an absolute/unassailable defense. If the article had accused Danny Boy of torturing kittens every other night for the last ten years to satisfy some sadistic urges that he cannot control, he could win a lawsuit over those charges - - UNLESS - - those charges happen to be true. A reporter can make any statements/accusations about anyone at any time with absolute immunity - - - if the statements/accusations are true.

2. Danny Boy is a "public figure" - - not just your average guy on the street. That has nothing to do with his bank account; it has to do with his being well known and well recognized by the public because of his actions in his life. For public figures, the legal standards also include a showing in a libel/slander/defamation action that the author or the publication had to have malicious intent in publishing the stuff.
Remember, I am not a lawyer. Having said that, for a public figure to win such a lawsuit is no simple matter.

There are folks out there who say they know the author and that he withheld stuff from that article that he could not verify. Let me be clear, I do NOT know the author and I have no idea if those statements are true. However, if the statements of those supporters are correct, that would imply an awful lot of fact-checking on his part prior to publication. A lawsuit would determine just how much fact-checking was done here...

Reports also say that Snyder's lawyers have informed the Washington Post to preserve any and all e-mails between the author here and Post columnist Dan Steinberg. I have no idea if that is an important element of this matter or if this is just a threat to make it seem as if the Snyder lawyers are out for blood. But I will suggest the following:

If Danny Boy drags the Washington Post into a lawsuit and thre is no basis for doing so, he will have violated an old precept of public relations:
Never pick a fight with someone who buys newsprint by the carload and ink by the barrel.
This has the potential to get very interesting...

I wonder if the author and or City Paper will file a counter-suit saying that any action filed by Danny Boy was a frivolous and capricious action? That might be fun too...

In legal proceedings there is a process called, "Discovery". Just a hunch here, but neither side would enjoy jumping through the "Discovery" hoops the other side will construct.
Might bring out a lot of files that the Skins wouldn't want out as well. Who knows what could be subpoenaed and hit the public.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:36 PM   #93
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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When Abe Pollin employed Wes Unseld year after year after year as his head coach/general manager and the team repeatedly failed to make the playoffs and had a piss poor scouting dept and no presence in Europe, and Unseld even said I probably don't deserve this job; everyone was all "wow, Pollin is such a loyal guy good for him" Snyder employs Cerrato and it's all "racquetball butt buddies" Why? Because people just dont care in DC as much about the Wizards as they do the Redskins. I have Wizards season tix, I have been to hundreds more Wizards games than any other team. I don't carevabout them half as much as I do the Skins.
Partially yes. Also first impressions are paramount. We all know that from our workplace to our personal relationships. Snyder's actions and record the first few seasons have left a horrible taste in all of the fans' mouths. That view may not every change for some, but the only way to try to turn things around is hard work, stronger attempts to change and distancing yourself from past actions. I don't think this whole "effort" from the Skins camp is helping.

Wouldn't you agree?
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:38 PM   #94
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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A lot of the information is either simply not true or misleading.

http://www.thewarpath.net/760520-post45.html (Chainsaw Dan Snyder)
I'm not trying to be a punk but some of the stuff you're correcting is kind of nitpicking. Like the Brian Mitchell thing.. you didn't refute that's what happened, just said that he apologized and whatnot. That's not really an inaccuracy at all. With the Sherman Smith/Jim Zorn thing who's to say that Snyder/Cerrato didn't bring him into the picture for Gibbs? The Cerrato radio deal, yeah that's all true, it's not being refuted because another GM has a radio show.

The article didn't really bring anything new to the table we hadn't all heard of. It's not like he came out of nowhere and claimed something that had us all aghast.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:56 PM   #95
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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I'm not trying to be a punk but some of the stuff you're correcting is kind of nitpicking. Like the Brian Mitchell thing.. you didn't refute that's what happened, just said that he apologized and whatnot. That's not really an inaccuracy at all. With the Sherman Smith/Jim Zorn thing who's to say that Snyder/Cerrato didn't bring him into the picture for Gibbs? The Cerrato radio deal, yeah that's all true, it's not being refuted because another GM has a radio show.

The article didn't really bring anything new to the table we hadn't all heard of. It's not like he came out of nowhere and claimed something that had us all aghast.
Well some things are simply not true, like the Herzog situation. Some things didn't start with Snyder, like the questionable waiting list.

But my point with some of the other stuff is McKenna's just piling stuff on to show what a terrible owner Snyder is, but failing to acknowledge what became of certain situations, what corrections occurred, and failing to acknowledge that in some cases other successful teams have done the same. If I was his editor I would have said just focus on some things and drill down on them. I mean I get it, he was putting together a list and to do that he count get too detailed but a recurring theme is Snyder never learns, but in several examples he did learn. You wouldn't know it from the article though.

I don't see in the lawsuit where specifically he's calling for McKenna to be fired, though I suspect he certainly would be if he is shown to have deliberately falsely accused Snyder of some of the more egregious (felony) issues here.

I have no idea what you're talking about with the Zorn, smith thing.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:15 AM   #96
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Well in all fairness to Napoleon that story was kind of blown up by the media. The women that was losing her home was going to lose it anyway, regardless of whether or not they Redskins sued her.
Reallly? *sarcasm alert* Stop and read what you just posted. Seriously, don't try defending that one. It's just not going to work out.
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Old 02-03-2011, 12:52 AM   #97
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

When will the anti-semitic Dan Snyder Devil pic be available as an avatar?

I can't see this turning out well for Dan. The City Paper? Really? Whats next, will he sue the publisher of the Super Saver coupon insert in the Sunday paper. 97% of people would have never read this thing if it were not for this suit. Now, the article is the #2 page that comes up when you google Dan Snyder...in a couple of days it will rank higher than his Wikipedia page.

So, if there is a lawsuit....will the City Paper be able to subpoena records related to the Peanuts, the trees....that can't be good.

Come to think of it....this could be good....I would love a televized hearing where the City Paper calls Zorn, Cerrato, Sherm Lewis, Jeff George, Norv Turner, Bruce Smith and Brian Mitchell to the stand....they can run it on the NFL network.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:22 AM   #98
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Originally Posted by wilsowilso View Post
Why is SmootSmack putting this much time and effort into supporting Dan Snyder aka Montgomery Burns?

I read your post explaining what you thought was inaccurate about the City Paper article then and now and it was mostly insignificant IMO.

No disrespect as I feel you are an invaluable influence around here, but you are treading a fine line as a professional insider and MOD.

The current owner of the Washington Redskins has done some really sketchy stuff. Period.
What fine line am I treading exactly? And I only cited some things because I was trying to make a general point, not do a line item refutal.

Also, I've also tried to make the point here (and previously) that my maun issue with the piece is that the frivolous stuff and the stuff that isn't true, in my opinion, takes away from the legit stuff and the focus of criticism on Snyder should be on what's accurate.

I don't know Snyder, I have no association with him or the team so my opinion is my opinion. It's not clouded by any "insiderness"
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:51 AM   #99
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

This lawsuit is probably just a big mistake. If Snyder hadn't sued, everybody and their mothers would have forgotten about the article. I mean who reads the City Paper anyway? I've barely heard of it before this came along. Sure the article was mean and everything, and I'm guessing and might be wrong on this, but who reads the City Paper? Even if the article did cause a stir when it came out everybody has long since forgotten about it by now, and by suing them Snyder is just serving a reminder that he's still thin-skinned after all this time. Nobody is going to be the winner in this one.
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:07 AM   #100
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

Redskins owner Dan Snyder's face-off with City Paper gets uglier
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:13 AM   #101
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

Mooby, I definitely agree. From a legal standpoint it may be legit on Snyder's part. But PR wise, he could take a major hit especially if he wins. The big guy bullying tge little guy, killing freedom of the press, etc. Not a smart decision in my opinion. Sometimes you just have to chin up and walk away.

Question for those who would know personally, is the devil caricature anti-semitic or just offensive?
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:41 AM   #102
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
When Abe Pollin employed Wes Unseld year after year after year as his head coach/general manager and the team repeatedly failed to make the playoffs and had a piss poor scouting dept and no presence in Europe, and Unseld even said I probably don't deserve this job; everyone was all "wow, Pollin is such a loyal guy good for him" Snyder employs Cerrato and it's all "racquetball butt buddies" Why? Because people just dont care in DC as much about the Wizards as they do the Redskins. I have Wizards season tix, I have been to hundreds more Wizards games than any other team. I don't carevabout them half as much as I do the Skins.
Two TOTALLY different situations. Unseld helped bring a championship and winning basketball to this city. He was a GREAT NBA center at 6'7. There was a respect factor there and that's why Polin got somewhat of a pass. Polin considered Unseld like family, just like Snyder thinks of Joe Gibbs. Cerrato was hated from the start, when he was hiding out in a Dulles airport hotel room trying to get in Redskin Park while John Cooke and Casserly were still there. Plus his not wanting veterans around. I could go on and on about why people hate Vinny. What did he do for anyone to like him? People DO care here about the Wizards, and if they can get a couple more strong draft picks to go along with Wall, they will come very close to being the main draw here. DC will always be a Redskin town cause of the rich tradition, but with a new generation of fans seeing nothing but losing, and a shitty game day experience at Fed Ex, the Redskins certainly are not what they use to be.

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Old 02-03-2011, 08:58 AM   #103
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Mooby, I definitely agree. From a legal standpoint it may be legit on Snyder's part. But PR wise, he could take a major hit especially if he wins. The big guy bullying tge little guy, killing freedom of the press, etc. Not a smart decision in my opinion. Sometimes you just have to chin up and walk away.

Question for those who would know personally, is the devil caricature anti-semitic or just offensive?
None of this will do anything to salvage the reputation of an owner that has been consistently vilified since assuming ownership of the Redskins. I agree with Mooby, the only winner here is whomever stands to benefit from any litigated compensation in the event there is a damage award ruling favoring the owner. The results won't do much to sway the overwhelmingly negative opinion shared by so many in the Redskin community, if anything, it may only serve to magnify the negativity.
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:02 AM   #104
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Wow, take a moment to read Donovan's letter to the Washington City Paper ownership. Snyder and company really think it's them vs. the world. These guys are so out of touch with reality and so far up their own rears to realize they are only propagating more negative perception, spin, articles, opinion etc. by sending that letter. They are creating the exact thing they think they are preventing by a potential lawsuit.

It is so ironic it is sad.
This is the one thing that I do not like about the guy. He NEVER says anything. He hides behind Gibbs, he hides behind Vinny, he hides behind his lawyers. I'm not saying he has to come out and talk whenever someone bashes him. But the real negative stuff that gives the team real bad press, he should come out and talk about it. Instead, he gets Donavan to talk for him. Be a man about it and if it really bothers you enough to sue then respond. Instead, just like he did when the bad press came out about suing season ticket holders, he pushes Donavan out there.
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:03 AM   #105
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Re: Snyder Camp Upset!!

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Two TOTALLY different situations. Unseld helped bring a championship and winning basketball to this city. He was a GREAT NBA center at 6'7. There was a respect factor there and that's why Polin got somewhat of a pass. Polin considered Unseld like family, just like Snyder thinks of Joe Gibbs. Cerrato was hated from the start, when he was hiding out in a Dulles airport hotel room trying to get in Redskin Park while John Cooke and Casserly were still there. Plus his not wanting veterans around. I could go on and on about why people hate Vinny. What did he do for anyone to like him? People DO care here about the Wizards, and if they can get a couple more strong draft picks to go along with Wall, they will come very close to being the main draw here. DC will always be a Redskin town cause of the rich tradition, but with a new generation of fans seeing nothing but losing, and a shitty game day experience at Fed Ex, the Redskins certainly are what they use to be.
Well what Unseld did as a player shouldn't have anything to do with him being a general manager. But whatever, beyond that we can just agree to disagree. I'm done with this topic. I've said what I have to say (and apparently crossed some sort of line) and I'm ready to move on
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