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Old 05-19-2011, 09:04 AM   #46
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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Originally Posted by skinsfan69 View Post
Great post. Sometimes I wonder if people around realize that it's the corners job to COVER first.
Agreed, but I think his inability to catch interceptions prevented him from being a top corner in the league. Rogers was a top ten pick, and I think you'd expect him to being a game changing corner if he's picked that high. He never became that type of player.

The bottom line is that he wants more money, and while he's been a solid corner, he probably is not worth the money he is looking for. Unfortunately, Rogers and Hall compliment each other, and unless we get a suitable replacement, our CB play will be affected greatly. For the cafeteria fans out there, I strongly believe that the same would happen if Hall were to leave and we didn't find a suitable replacement to compliment Rogers. But I'm sure the cafeteria fans won't care about this and be ready for a season of D. Hall bitching sessions.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:05 AM   #47
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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Originally Posted by skinsfan69 View Post
[/B]

Sometimes I wish the media would just leave this type of stuff alone. It's really no ones business what kind of financial shape the guy is in. If he brought it up then fine, but I don't think that was the case cause I remember an article on Post.com.

And whether he was broke or not, wouldn't most of us try and get as much $ as we could if we were in his shoes? Especially if you felt you were being low balled. I know I would. Bottom line is the guy is going to get a big raise and it's well deserved.
I get what you're saying I think, but if the media hadn't covered it then we would just think he was all about the money. It's understandable if someone makes a decision that gets their life back in order, living w/lots od debt isn't fun. So I agree it isn't any of our business, but at least by knowing this I'll have more empathy & understanding of his wanting to leave, assuming he really can make a lot more elsewhere.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:21 AM   #48
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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Originally Posted by skinsfan69 View Post
[/B]

Sometimes I wish the media would just leave this type of stuff alone. It's really no ones business what kind of financial shape the guy is in. If he brought it up then fine, but I don't think that was the case cause I remember an article on Post.com.

And whether he was broke or not, wouldn't most of us try and get as much $ as we could if we were in his shoes? Especially if you felt you were being low balled. I know I would. Bottom line is the guy is going to get a big raise and it's well deserved.
The media has left it alone. This is something the media knew about for months but never said it a word. And it's still not really ever brought up. When he attended a court hearing it was the first time the media did any sort of story on it. And it was just cut and dry info about the court hearing.

It would be interesting though if we simply never reported on the salaries these players make.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:32 AM   #49
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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I think that if Carlos leaves this board will be begging for his return before the first half of the season is over. There are some important issues to look at before shipping him away and calling him a bust.

1. Who will replace him? Kevin Barnes? No thanks. If we're able to get a top flight CB such as Asoughmaughausdhf then fine. Truth be told, I'd rather ship out D Hall for Asoughmaughausdhf than Rogers.
Why not Kevin Barnes? Why are we so quick to dismiss Barnes, yet it's a problem to say Rogers has disappointed in his time here

Quote:
2. People act as if CBs are supposed to win games. CBs rarely win games for you, however a CB can often lose a game for you giving up a big pass late. Go ahead and look back at who gave up more big plays for wins. Carlos or Hall. There's a reason Hall gets thrown on all day, because he constantly makes big mistakes. Minus the one game with 3 picks where I think Hall must have had the wrong color jersey on, he was mediocre at best. Fans are fickle, just because he catches the ball means he's an amazing player. I want my outside guys to first and foremost lock down receivers, and PICKS are nice. Let the FS be the ballhawk.
I don't have the number in front of me but I believe Los was targeted as many times as Hall, if not more. Though I may be mixing up years. But anyhow, the best corners do win games. And Rogers wants to be paid like one of the best

Quote:
3. Carlos should certainly catch some of the balls. I'm not saying that isn't his biggest weakness. However, I refuse to accept him being a bad or sub-par player because of that one issue. If he had better hands he'd be a top 10 CB in the NFL easy. As is, I think he's in the top 30 without question.
But he doesn't want top 30 money. If he did, I suppose he'd be totally happy with his salary

Quote:
4. Since day one people have been pretty critical of Carlos and don't realize his value. If I were treated like that, I'd probably want out too. I also don't understand why people are angry he wants to get paid. We all do it in our professional careers, why is it so wrong for players to do that. Your market price is what someone will pay. If another company offered me a decent raise and the other intangibles were there -- goodbye current company. I have to look out for my own best interests, my company isn't going to do that for me.
I don't begrudge him wanting to get money
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:53 AM   #50
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

Good point about Barnes SS. But do you really think he can replace Los? Barnes as a starting cb does worry me. He's a decent nickel guy, just don't think he's up to filling Los' shoes. I realize we haven't seen enough of him yet in that role yet. The coaches may have no choice.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:57 AM   #51
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

You know I usually defend player and have defended CR before but...

F....Carlos Rogers. See ya.
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:06 AM   #52
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Why not Kevin Barnes? Why are we so quick to dismiss Barnes, yet it's a problem to say Rogers has disappointed in his time here



I don't have the number in front of me but I believe Los was targeted as many times as Hall, if not more. Though I may be mixing up years. But anyhow, the best corners do win games. And Rogers wants to be paid like one of the best



But he doesn't want top 30 money. If he did, I suppose he'd be totally happy with his salary



I don't begrudge him wanting to get money
I don't dislike Kevin Barnes as an option, but as an every down starting CB I don't feel very comfortable going into the season with him opposite D Hall. I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again, but I think it's a major downgrade. I like Barnes in the nickle right now.

You talk about targets which is a clever way of avoiding the question. I'm asking when 'Los was beat where it was a big play costing the skins the game. Targets are one thing, but big completions are another. Most of the completions on Carlos are short and stopped quickly.

If he wants top CB money, then I understand letting him walk. I think his market price is much higher than fans here seem to think. I think he's a 15-20CB in my eyes. I understand if we let him go because of financial reasons, but I think we underestimate what he brings to the table.
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:14 AM   #53
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

Dont let the door hit you in the ass,, bye!,,,,
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:30 AM   #54
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

Carlos is the least of the skins worries.
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:32 AM   #55
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

I think Rogers should go out and test the market. It also depends on the need. Say there are two teams out there who need a good CB. Good I say. Then Rogers might get them in a bidding war for his services. On top of that it also depends on what players of equal stats are getting in his position.

Do I have a problem with Rogers? no. I look at it this way if you have a CB on one side who is a bit more of a risk taker and will try and jump the pass for an interception then you need another CB on the other side who is not a risk taker and plays the game safe. Because the FS will most likely need to roll towards the side with the risk taking CB to back him up in case he misses the interception. Otherwise you need to keep both Safeties back to help out the CB's if you have two risk takers.

The two glaring problems with Rogers is he fails to make interceptions (big whoop) and he is known to bite on the first move. Rogers has had his share of WR's faking him out and getting yards. So though he's not bad, I wouldn't label him top 10. Matter of fact going to NFL.com and looking up players by position stats you might be supprised to see that 4 other Washington players rank before Rogers for 2010. Hall at #4, Doughty at #5, Landry at #16, and K.Moore at #40. The have Rogers ranked #54.

Looking back Rogers rank for each yr:

2010- #54
2009- #76
2008- #48
2007- #93
2006- #20
2005- #58

These numbers however are not just CB's. It includes Safeties as well. Also I think part of the reason for the flux is because he might have been injured or was used differently. I don't mean to say he was used in a different position, I mean what he was asked to do in the GW, Blache, or Haslett's defense might be slightly different. In any event I see him as a middle of the road CB.

I could be wrong though... Bleacherreport has him listed #10.
Quote:
10. Carlos Rogers (WAS)

Carlos Rogers has the attitude and ability to become a top corner in the league consistently. Rogers is a hard working talent who can read plays extremely well.

His ability to break is often over-looked and his hitting comes and goes. He is so reliable to have however, because he is a corner that will always make a play on the ball.

He has some of the best man-to-man coverage skills, but I haven't really been impressed with his zone coverage.

Rogers' awareness and ability to break on most balls makes him such a dangerous defender, but he does give up big plays from time to time (usually not touchdowns, however).
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:42 AM   #56
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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Originally Posted by Daseal View Post
I think that if Carlos leaves this board will be begging for his return before the first half of the season is over. There are some important issues to look at before shipping him away and calling him a bust.

1. Who will replace him? Kevin Barnes? No thanks. If we're able to get a top flight CB such as Asoughmaughausdhf then fine. Truth be told, I'd rather ship out D Hall for Asoughmaughausdhf than Rogers.

2. People act as if CBs are supposed to win games. CBs rarely win games for you, however a CB can often lose a game for you giving up a big pass late. Go ahead and look back at who gave up more big plays for wins. Carlos or Hall. There's a reason Hall gets thrown on all day, because he constantly makes big mistakes. Minus the one game with 3 picks where I think Hall must have had the wrong color jersey on, he was mediocre at best. Fans are fickle, just because he catches the ball means he's an amazing player. I want my outside guys to first and foremost lock down receivers, and PICKS are nice. Let the FS be the ballhawk.

3. Carlos should certainly catch some of the balls. I'm not saying that isn't his biggest weakness. However, I refuse to accept him being a bad or sub-par player because of that one issue. If he had better hands he'd be a top 10 CB in the NFL easy. As is, I think he's in the top 30 without question.

4. Since day one people have been pretty critical of Carlos and don't realize his value. If I were treated like that, I'd probably want out too. I also don't understand why people are angry he wants to get paid. We all do it in our professional careers, why is it so wrong for players to do that. Your market price is what someone will pay. If another company offered me a decent raise and the other intangibles were there -- goodbye current company. I have to look out for my own best interests, my company isn't going to do that for me.
I completely agree too. I would go as far as to say he would be a top 5 corner if he made 8/10 or so of the interception oppertunies hes had over the last 2 years.
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:44 AM   #57
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

Carlos takes a swipe at Hall.......
Carlos Rogers takes a swipe at DeAngelo Hall | ProFootballTalk

Quote:
Rogers elaborated via text message to Chris Russell of ESPN 980. I wasnt the corner that gave up the most TDs or yards or first downs, Rogers said, but Im the corner that is looked at [as] the 2nd corner, [that] I need to be replaced.
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:47 AM   #58
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

I guess Rogers is yet another player who really doesn't get it. No one is trying to replace him. He can stay all he wants. But I'm betting he's going to ask for a mint and he's not worth it. Now if he's willing to sign another contract about the range of what he's making now then fine, but as other have said he's thinking payday and I'm guessing he might get a little humbled in the end. But that depends on the need at CB by other teams.
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Old 05-19-2011, 11:02 AM   #59
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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I completely agree too. I would go as far as to say he would be a top 5 corner if he made 8/10 or so of the interception oppertunies hes had over the last 2 years.
But he doesn't, so he's not
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Old 05-19-2011, 11:03 AM   #60
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Re: Rogers Ready to Move On

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So though he's not bad, I wouldn't label him top 10. Matter of fact going to NFL.com and looking up players by position stats you might be supprised to see that 4 other Washington players rank before Rogers for 2010. Hall at #4, Doughty at #5, Landry at #16, and K.Moore at #40. The have Rogers ranked #54.

Looking back Rogers rank for each yr:

2010- #54
2009- #76
2008- #48
2007- #93
2006- #20
2005- #58
What stats are you using? D. Hall has never been a top ranked CB, in fact, he's been one of the worst ranked CBs in the NFL for many years now. I've shown those numbers repeatedly. The numbers I showed actually had Carlos (in one of the years) ranked really high in terms of his position. We aren't talking about "Hype" rankings here, we are talking about actual productivity. Or in the case of CBs, the lack of production (against you) is the key.
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