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Drafting Mike Williams

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Old 12-28-2004, 07:46 PM   #1
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Drafting Mike Williams

Drafting Mike Williams
I'd like to have Mike Williams, but does anyone realize the kind of money we'd have to pay him? Andre Johnson signed a six-year contract worth almost $39 million, including a $13.5 million signing bonus. That was two years ago. Larry Fitzgerald netted over $40 million for a six year deal after last year's draft.

So we'd likely have to sign Williams to a deal that cost $7 million per year. Even when you consider that all deals are backloaded, Williams would carry a cap figure of close to $4 million his rookie season and he'd count about $6.5 million by the third year of his deal.

Forecast - Cap Storm Ahead
Given that Gibbs and Cerrato have both conceded that our cap woes will likely come to a head following next season, does anyone really think its a good idea to take sign a pick to a monstrous deal?

I know many people on this site think the salary cap doesn't really exist, that we can somehow evade it, that we need to sign an impact player at any cost, and we've gotten away with dangerous salary cap moves in the past. In response, I note: 1) there is a salary cap, 2) it is real, 3) you can't evade it (see Baltimore Ravens of 2001 and the 49ers of 2004), 4) and we haven't gotten away from our free-spending past.

We've taken huge hits because we signed guys like Bruce Smith, Dan Wilkinson, Jeremiah Trotter, and Mark Brunell who consistently bring cheers from the fans in the offseasons (that is until they are cut in the offseason), but their barks are much bigger than their bites.

This year we had over $10 million of dead space on the cap. Next year those cap hits will likely cost us around $9 million of cap room. Just so you know, that's as much as it will cost us to keep Jon Jansen, Laveranues Coles, and Clinton Portis on our roster in 2005.

Hasty Decisions
If we let people who want to cut Barrow, McCants, Morton, Samuels, Gardner and Brunell have their way, we'll be approaching $20 million of dead space. Umm, has anyone thought any of that through?

People want to cut guys at the drop of a hat and sign anyone who appeared on Jacked Up or on I, Max. I remember a lot of people calling for Spurrier to cut Antonio Pierce last season after he was flagged for faking the snap count in a Dallas game. That would've worked out well. A lot of people, if given the chance to play GM of the Chargers, would've cut Drew Brees last season. That would've been a great move.

Team Needs & The Draft
It's time to be patient, not call for the 'Skins front office to act like it's heading into an offseason on Madden 2005, and to make smart moves, not sexy, offseason-winning ones.

Trading down is the smartest thing to do. I know people love those highlight reels that Roy Williams produced in Detroit and want a guy like that in Mike Williams, but this ain't fantasy football. There is a salary cap, we have enough talent at our skill positions on offense, and we have serious holes on our lines. Trading down and drafting a center and a defensive lineman might not be sexy, but its the smart thing to do.

Last edited by Sheriff Gonna Getcha; 12-28-2004 at 08:01 PM.
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Old 12-28-2004, 08:23 PM   #2
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Trading down is the only way to go this season, thank's to contract's like Brunell, Portis, and Arrington, you will alway's have contracts that work and come that don't but those 3 contract's have a stranglehold on us, big mistakes, and hold on to your hat's because I think Arrington's is the worse of them all!
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Old 12-28-2004, 09:21 PM   #3
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I trust that Snyder will run the cap. How many years in a row have we been in "cap trouble" Ramseyfan? I hear it every offseason by the press. I agree our spending is getting a bit too vicious, but i think we'll have a lot of people renegotiate their deals, especially on the defensive side of the ball.

Mike WIlliams may not be as expensive as you think. The club could certainly use the fact that he's been inactive from football for a year and drop the price a bit with that. Not to mention he had a horrible 40 time at the combine (I don't put much faith in 40 times, but it may be arguable.)

Gibbs will likely be ending his contract come the projected-hell for salary cap, but we need to figure out who we want to keep around now, and who we don't. Mold the team to them.
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Old 12-28-2004, 10:46 PM   #4
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some of this stuff isnt making sense.

since we dont keep out top pick because of the money involved, does that mean we dont sign smoot either? you cant have it both ways. you can say lets not get involved in a monsterous deal and then sign smoot to top 10 CB money.

what about pierce(RFA)? do we offer a first round pick money and let another team take him for the pick in the 2006 draft or do we match the monsterous offer?

like it or not, we are either going to have to start dumping good players are have to pay large salaries to keep players and picks.

here is what i think the redskins need to do.
brunell: do anything to let the guy go, oven if they ahve to take a major cap hit. i hate looking at him on the sidelines.

gardner: let him finish out his final year of his contract, typically players like this have tremendous years and make huge money and go to another team. so its a bad idea to cut someone in the final year of the contract.

barrow/pierce: you can only keep one. there is no room in an nfl roster for a high price reserve except at QB. pierce is a Restricted free agent. we offer him the first round tender, let another team sign him to an offer sheet, we then either match or take a draft pick in 2006. if pierce is gone, we have to keep barrow. Keep in mind barrow has been hurt, so its a bad move to let pierce go if barrow cant play anymore, but its a great move if barrow plays like he did with the giants.

morton: if we had him last week, we wouldnt have lost .
its hard to play a special teamer a few million. if we are going to keep him, he has to be our 3rd down back.

Jansen: if he passes the physical, sign him.

McCants: Use him. he has good hands, good size and decent speed. use him in the slot, have him catch those short patterns over the middle. use him for jump balls(yes joe, please add the jumpball throws into the playbook). I'm upset that gibbs let gardner get away with all those dropped balls, mccants should have replaced him for atleast a half a game.

samuels: i cant tell you how much i hate the guy. but there isnt much we can do with the guy. he makes too much money to cut and i doubt that he would restructure. god i hate the guy.

the O LINE: rebuild that son of a bitch. get some bad mother fuckers with a mean streak so atleast we can get a push on 3rd and short. raymer is a backup, dockery is a back up, cant blame brown because he was at home a week before the season started. get some guys with heart and testicles not some bitch like samuels who doesnt fight when he plays against guys like KGB(i cant spell his name) or Alex brown.

we dont need mike williams if joe gibbs is going to keep his receivers running comeback routes(thats like using a bentley to deliver mail).

trade down and get two good picks for linemen, D or O line. in the 3rd round, draft a basketball player to play tightend.

pick up former junkie/prisoner bam morris for minimum salary. he is a big 3rd down back.


but most importanly, dont restructure S.taylors contract when he holds out. if you do, he will hold out every year.
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Old 12-28-2004, 11:03 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daseal
I trust that Snyder will run the cap. How many years in a row have we been in "cap trouble" Ramseyfan? I hear it every offseason by the press. I agree our spending is getting a bit too vicious, but i think we'll have a lot of people renegotiate their deals, especially on the defensive side of the ball.

Mike WIlliams may not be as expensive as you think. The club could certainly use the fact that he's been inactive from football for a year and drop the price a bit with that. Not to mention he had a horrible 40 time at the combine (I don't put much faith in 40 times, but it may be arguable.)

Gibbs will likely be ending his contract come the projected-hell for salary cap, but we need to figure out who we want to keep around now, and who we don't. Mold the team to them.
First, $10 million in dead money isn't something to scoff at.

Second, even Gibbs and Cerrato have conceded that there will be a need for some rebuilding/restructuring of the roster after next season.

Third, you can't negotiate the salaries of top 10 picks - they're pretty much set at x percent above the salary for the last year's pick.
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Old 12-28-2004, 11:09 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamf
some of this stuff isnt making sense.

since we dont keep out top pick because of the money involved, does that mean we dont sign smoot either? you cant have it both ways. you can say lets not get involved in a monsterous deal and then sign smoot to top 10 CB money.

what about pierce(RFA)? do we offer a first round pick money and let another team take him for the pick in the 2006 draft or do we match the monsterous offer?

like it or not, we are either going to have to start dumping good players are have to pay large salaries to keep players and picks.

here is what i think the redskins need to do.
brunell: do anything to let the guy go, oven if they ahve to take a major cap hit. i hate looking at him on the sidelines.

gardner: let him finish out his final year of his contract, typically players like this have tremendous years and make huge money and go to another team. so its a bad idea to cut someone in the final year of the contract.

barrow/pierce: you can only keep one. there is no room in an nfl roster for a high price reserve except at QB. pierce is a Restricted free agent. we offer him the first round tender, let another team sign him to an offer sheet, we then either match or take a draft pick in 2006. if pierce is gone, we have to keep barrow. Keep in mind barrow has been hurt, so its a bad move to let pierce go if barrow cant play anymore, but its a great move if barrow plays like he did with the giants.

morton: if we had him last week, we wouldnt have lost .
its hard to play a special teamer a few million. if we are going to keep him, he has to be our 3rd down back.

Jansen: if he passes the physical, sign him.

McCants: Use him. he has good hands, good size and decent speed. use him in the slot, have him catch those short patterns over the middle. use him for jump balls(yes joe, please add the jumpball throws into the playbook). I'm upset that gibbs let gardner get away with all those dropped balls, mccants should have replaced him for atleast a half a game.

samuels: i cant tell you how much i hate the guy. but there isnt much we can do with the guy. he makes too much money to cut and i doubt that he would restructure. god i hate the guy.

the O LINE: rebuild that son of a bitch. get some bad mother fuckers with a mean streak so atleast we can get a push on 3rd and short. raymer is a backup, dockery is a back up, cant blame brown because he was at home a week before the season started. get some guys with heart and testicles not some bitch like samuels who doesnt fight when he plays against guys like KGB(i cant spell his name) or Alex brown.

we dont need mike williams if joe gibbs is going to keep his receivers running comeback routes(thats like using a bentley to deliver mail).

trade down and get two good picks for linemen, D or O line. in the 3rd round, draft a basketball player to play tightend.

pick up former junkie/prisoner bam morris for minimum salary. he is a big 3rd down back.


but most importanly, dont restructure S.taylors contract when he holds out. if you do, he will hold out every year.
First, Smoot is not going to get $14 million SB on a $40+ million deal.

Second, Barrow doesn't have a high figure (about $2 million) so your contention that we can't have a highly paid reserve MLB is wrong.

Third, we don't need to resign Jansen so I'm not sure how that's even an issue.

Fourth, if we cut Barrow and Brunell, we're going to have about $15 million in dead cap space next season. Unlike Madden, you don't get to wipe out the dead cap space with the click of a button.
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Old 12-28-2004, 11:13 PM   #7
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We don't need a Mike Willams. Coles will do as #1. and he is only 26. If you want to draft a #2, I can understand.
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Old 12-29-2004, 12:37 AM   #8
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I like the point someone said about Gardner being in the final year of his contract. I dont know what the cap number is on him for 2005, but if its not big, I do think we should hang onto him for the very reason that guys tend to have huge years in the final year of their contract. Its pure speculation, and it cant be a sure thing, but It's somthing to think about.
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Old 12-29-2004, 08:28 AM   #9
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See, this is my problem. The main guys in contention: Barrow, Gardner, Brunell and McCants almost certainly have their roster spots dictated by their cap effect.

Can't cut Brunnell or McCants b/c of the cap hit (Brunnell's would be huge, McCants just big).

Barrow costs as much to keep as to cut; He is undoubtedly better than any back-up we could sign for Pierce, so why cut and pay for (by way of cap hit) Barrow and the new back-up.

Gardner - last year of his contract, Westbrookian in his contribution. A wash for the money paid him.

The players we have are basically the players we are stuck with. Do what it takes to resign Smoot, Pierce. Extend/Restructure Samuels. Hope Brunell restructures (but with the signing bonus given him - not sure any restructuring will help). Trade down and draft well. Of course, the early word on the draft is that there really aren't any players worth the money given the top 5 slots and that the best place to be in this draft is in the 12-20 slots, so finding someone who will want a top ten pick is going to be difficult.

Don't know. Feeling very pessimistic about next year. Hope I am wrong.
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Old 12-29-2004, 08:29 AM   #10
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Let's not forget the cap will be going up quite a bit with the new TV money.
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Old 12-29-2004, 08:31 AM   #11
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i think we should cut brunell take the hit, if pierce wants to become an unrestricted fa let him go. I love pierce to death but we can't used up the money on the mlb position. we desperately need to make our o-line the best in the league to let cp take us to the promiseland along with protecting ramsey. In the draft we need a pass rusher on the line with griffin and our blitz packages. Mr. James would be a nice fit out of wisconsin (he even looks like a redskin) in the second round look at the og from miami, michigan(baas i think). i love mike williams but we are a smash mouth team who would rather run than throw so i think that kind of money should not be wasted on a wr but rather a de or the awful o-line. Also, samuels isn't the bad he has made the pro bowl for like two years in a row.
CP is the best back in the game. Sean T is the best safety in the game(E.Reed)
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Old 12-29-2004, 08:48 AM   #12
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I agree. Trade down, get a center and a d-lineman. Maybe another TE to compliment Cooley. Draft or steal a big third down back. Keep our receivers, if they are allowed to open up, they have plenty of talent.

There is not much of a need to make big changes to either side of the ball. If we can generate 1 more TD a game, we win most of our games. 21 points a game (minimum) needs to be an offesive goal. If you look back at our games this year, a big nasty center and a big nasty back that can power through for a yard would have made the difference between field goals and touchdowns way to many times.

To really assess what we need, we need to evaluate exactly what stopped our drives and what kept points off the board in our current system. Don't forget, even though we don't open it up a lot, our system keeps our defense off the field by using methodical long drives that eat up and control the clock. Thats part of why the defense is ranked where they are.

Keep the system, tweek it to exploit the defensive pass interference, and add power to the o-line and backfield.
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Old 12-29-2004, 08:49 AM   #13
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You never trade down for cap reasosn. As soon as you start letting the cap dictate who you draft you are in trouble. In any given draft there are 4 or 5 major impact players who can come in and play at a high level early in their careers. There may be another 20-25 guys who will develop into quality players. The rest range anywhere from one or two year decent starters to quality backups to not even making the team. If you have a chance to get a guy who is an imediate impact guy like Williams you DO NOT pass it up. You do what it takes to make it work. That being said...WR are generally never impact players thye usually take a couple seaons to become impact guys.
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Old 12-29-2004, 09:07 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FRPLG
You never trade down for cap reasosn. As soon as you start letting the cap dictate who you draft you are in trouble. In any given draft there are 4 or 5 major impact players who can come in and play at a high level early in their careers. There may be another 20-25 guys who will develop into quality players. The rest range anywhere from one or two year decent starters to quality backups to not even making the team. If you have a chance to get a guy who is an imediate impact guy like Williams you DO NOT pass it up. You do what it takes to make it work. That being said...WR are generally never impact players thye usually take a couple seaons to become impact guys.
I tend to agree with you on not letting the cap dictate your draft strategy.
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Old 12-29-2004, 10:12 AM   #15
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What other receivers are out there. Larry Fitzgerald and Roy Williams were the top two taken but look at the other guys in that list. Clayton had an amazing year. Lee Evans is becoming a threat. That guy for Carolina filled in with all their injury. I think Woods, the 49ers pick, was one of the only ones that didnt do well and most of them have very small contracts. Mike Williams is probably a waste of money, expecially since he didnt play last year.

We should trade down, draft the end from Wisconsin, pick up an extra pick and go from there.

As always, we have to wait and see how many of our picks we trade away.
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